When Lying To Women Is Mandated Care: Informed Consent, Abortion, and the Justice Kennedy's Role

Jul 26, 2012 Full story: Daily Kos 20

The Eighth Circuit Court of Appeals gave constitutional protection to misleading women seeking abortion care.

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“Reality is better than truth.”

Since: Nov 09

Indianapolis

#1 Jul 26, 2012
Is there something in the law that forbids a doctor from telling the women this crap and keeping them from making a disclaimer that the state requires him to say it but he does not agree nor does any medical authority?

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

#2 Jul 27, 2012
cpeter1313 wrote:
Is there something in the law that forbids a doctor from telling the women this crap and keeping them from making a disclaimer that the state requires him to say it but he does not agree nor does any medical authority?
Funny how they claim to want "protection" for women but yet find no concern with catholic hospitals that will not allow abortion to save the mothers life.
Ocean56

AOL

#3 Jul 27, 2012
Morgana 9 wrote:
Funny how they claim to want "protection" for women but yet find no concern with catholic hospitals that will not allow abortion to save the mothers life.
They want "protection for women" on THEIR terms, obviously, not for the women who DON'T want to be pregnant.

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

#4 Jul 28, 2012
Ocean56 wrote:
<quoted text>
They want "protection for women" on THEIR terms, obviously, not for the women who DON'T want to be pregnant.
Yeah Ocean....they only want protection for women when forcing them to do their "duty" and the only reason for their existence.

Why can't they just admit that they view women as brood mares?

All these excuses and pretend respect just muddy the debate.

Since: Feb 07

Location hidden

#5 Jul 28, 2012
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah Ocean....they only want protection for women when forcing them to do their "duty" and the only reason for their existence.
Why can't they just admit that they view women as brood mares?
All these excuses and pretend respect just muddy the debate.
You proaborts are a funny group. You come up with a lot of demeaning titles for pregnant women.

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

#6 Jul 28, 2012
Susanm wrote:
<quoted text>
You proaborts are a funny group. You come up with a lot of demeaning titles for pregnant women.
Nothing demeaning when considering the truth aspect.

What do you anti women /anti choicers call a a woman/girl who you wish to force gestation and child birth on against their will?

I will wait patiently for your response.

Since: Feb 07

Location hidden

#7 Jul 28, 2012
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
Nothing demeaning when considering the truth aspect.
What do you anti women /anti choicers call a a woman/girl who you wish to force gestation and child birth on against their will?
I will wait patiently for your response.
1) I am not antiwomen
2) I am not antichoice, just anti"one"choice
3) I call her a pregnant woman
4) There are ways to prevent pregnancy

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

#8 Jul 28, 2012
Susanm wrote:
<quoted text>
1) I am not antiwomen
2) I am not antichoice, just anti"one"choice
3) I call her a pregnant woman
4) There are ways to prevent pregnancy
Susanm wrote:
<quoted text>
1) I am not antiwomen
You are not anti women as long as they agree to be a broodmare.
Susanm wrote:
<quoted text>
2) I am not antichoice, just anti"one"choice
The choice to be other than a broodmare?

Thank you!

You have confirmed my point.

Since: Feb 07

Location hidden

#9 Jul 28, 2012
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
You are not anti women as long as they agree to be a broodmare.
<quoted text>
The choice to be other than a broodmare?
Thank you!
You have confirmed my point.
Again with the names? Why do you demean women?

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

#10 Jul 28, 2012
Susanm wrote:
<quoted text>
Again with the names? Why do you demean women?
You demean women/girls by mandating they be broodmares.

No escaping it, dodge all you like.

Since: Feb 07

Location hidden

#11 Jul 28, 2012
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
You demean women/girls by mandating they be broodmares.
No escaping it, dodge all you like.
Nope, never. I never impregnanted them against their will or artifically, I have never choosen who they they have sex with, I have never aborted their offspring if they were not the sex that I desired, I have never sold them when they could no longer get pregnant. All these things happen to broodmares. Why DO you insist on comparing pregnant women to them?

“Reality is better than truth.”

Since: Nov 09

Indianapolis

#12 Jul 28, 2012
When a woman is denied her reproductive choices on the basis of the fetus's (non-existent) rights, then the woman i being used as an unwilling carrier because someone else thinks she is no longer intelligent--human--enough to make her own choices. Like it or not, you are treating these women like dumb animals whose existence pivots around their pregnancy and nothing else. That is dehumanizing.

There are ways of avoiding pregnancy; mistakes happen. There are also ways of minding your own business and not telling women how THEY need to think and feel about THEIR pregnancy; you should try it sometime.
Susanm wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope, never. I never impregnanted them against their will or artifically, I have never choosen who they they have sex with, I have never aborted their offspring if they were not the sex that I desired, I have never sold them when they could no longer get pregnant. All these things happen to broodmares. Why DO you insist on comparing pregnant women to them?

Since: Feb 07

Location hidden

#13 Jul 28, 2012
cpeter1313 wrote:
When a woman is denied her reproductive choices on the basis of the fetus's (non-existent) rights, then the woman i being used as an unwilling carrier because someone else thinks she is no longer intelligent--human--enough to make her own choices. Like it or not, you are treating these women like dumb animals whose existence pivots around their pregnancy and nothing else. That is dehumanizing.
There are ways of avoiding pregnancy; mistakes happen. There are also ways of minding your own business and not telling women how THEY need to think and feel about THEIR pregnancy; you should try it sometime.
<quoted text>
Says the person who thinks that no one has the right to offer women alternatives to abortion.

Since: Feb 07

Location hidden

#14 Jul 28, 2012
cpeter1313 wrote:
When a woman is denied her reproductive choices on the basis of the fetus's (non-existent) rights, then the woman i being used as an unwilling carrier because someone else thinks she is no longer intelligent--human--enough to make her own choices. Like it or not, you are treating these women like dumb animals whose existence pivots around their pregnancy and nothing else. That is dehumanizing.
There are ways of avoiding pregnancy; mistakes happen. There are also ways of minding your own business and not telling women how THEY need to think and feel about THEIR pregnancy; you should try it sometime.
<quoted text>
Wrong again. I treat women as people who are smart enough to not get pregnant when they don't want to be and strong enough to rise above killing as the answer to their problem when it happens.

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

#15 Jul 28, 2012
Susanm wrote:
<quoted text>
Says the person who thinks that no one has the right to offer women alternatives to abortion.
Offer all the alternatives you like including abortion.

The problem is, you do not want to offer any choice unless it leads to a full term pregnancy and child birth. Eliminating that choice leads to nothing more than broodmare.

“Reality is better than truth.”

Since: Nov 09

Indianapolis

#16 Jul 28, 2012
Feel free to link to the post in which I said that.
Susanm wrote:
<quoted text>
Says the person who thinks that no one has the right to offer women alternatives to abortion.

“Reality is better than truth.”

Since: Nov 09

Indianapolis

#17 Jul 28, 2012
Women get to choose if they are "above killing" or not, since there is more than one viewpoint on fetuses. And no, you want to get rid of abortion; that is not allowing the woman to "rise above" anything.
Susanm wrote:
<quoted text>
Wrong again. I treat women as people who are smart enough to not get pregnant when they don't want to be and strong enough to rise above killing as the answer to their problem when it happens.
Ocean56

AOL

#18 Jul 29, 2012
Morgana 9 wrote:
Yeah Ocean....they only want protection for women when forcing them to do their "duty" and the only reason for their existence.
Why can't they just admit that they view women as brood mares?
That's an easy one, Morgana. Right-wing faith-based kooks can't admit that openly because it makes them look like the backward-thinking imbeciles they truly are. They have to use deceptive language that works on those who believe such nonsense.

Too bad for them that women are now "too educated," huh? lol
Ocean56

AOL

#19 Jul 29, 2012
Morgana 9 wrote:
Offer all the alternatives you like INCLUDING abortion.
The problem is, you do not want to offer any choice unless it leads to a full term pregnancy and child birth. Eliminating that choice leads to nothing more than broodmare.
Exactly. Funny how the anti-choicers always manage to overlook -- or ignore -- that uncomfortable little fact.
Ocean56

AOL

#20 Jul 29, 2012
Susanm wrote:
You proaborts are a funny group. You come up with a lot of demeaning titles for pregnant women.
Okay, how about mindless baby factories, is that better? That's exactly what a woman is if she's forbidden to use all forms of contraception to PREVENT unwanted pregnancy and is forced to remain pregnant against her will.

Motherhood is OPTIONAL, not required, even if a pregnancy happens for whatever reason. Thank goodness for that.

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