Redefining the Abortion Debate

There are 20 comments on the Aug 28, 2012, www.newyorker.com story titled Redefining the Abortion Debate . In it, www.newyorker.com reports that:

But true freedom is not freedom to ask permission—it’s freedom to make a decision.

It’s understandable why Democrats want to use Todd Akin as a proxy for Republicans’ views about abortion. The Missouri congressman opposes the right of rape victims to obtain abortions because (a) these victims can unconsciously control whether they become pregnant and (b) only “legitimate” rapes count. Both concepts are imbecilic. More importantly, from the Democrats’ perspective, they’re unpopular.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at www.newyorker.com.

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Since: Nov 08

Location hidden

#1 Aug 28, 2012
Planned Parenthood's abuse of the abortion law to kill unwanted females because of their gender is Obama's idea of justice for females.
Why did people vote for him?????
robert

Hollywood, FL

#2 Aug 28, 2012
The bible thumpers need to give it a rest, it is settled law and nobody is going to change their mind. If you get a constitutional person hood amendment through then you can talk about it.

Abortions are legal and they are going to remain legal unless there is a change in the constitution which is not going to happen because as the article noted more than 80% of people believe abortion should be legal in at least some circumstances, this includes both major party presidential contenders.

We should be talking about the things we need to do that can and will have to chance to move this country forward in a state of employment.
Gravediggers

United States

#3 Aug 28, 2012
Biased and Slanted ='Mr Bill'

1. Economy
2. Jobs
3. Dependence on Foreign Oil
4. High Price of gas
5. High Price of Food
Sheik Yerbouti

Pennington, NJ

#4 Aug 28, 2012
Gravediggers wrote:
Biased and Slanted ='Mr Bill'
1. Economy
2. Jobs
3. Dependence on Foreign Oil
4. High Price of gas
5. High Price of Food
Obviously you did not read the topic of this thread. You have posted the same moronic bullshit on just about every thread.

“A person is a person no matter”

Since: Sep 07

how small.

#5 Aug 28, 2012
Eighthman wrote:
Planned Parenthood's abuse of the abortion law to kill unwanted females because of their gender is Obama's idea of justice for females.
Why did people vote for him?????
I for the life of me cannot figure that one out. Maybe they are sadistic.

“A person is a person no matter”

Since: Sep 07

how small.

#6 Aug 28, 2012
robert wrote:
The bible thumpers need to give it a rest, it is settled law and nobody is going to change their mind. If you get a constitutional person hood amendment through then you can talk about it.
Abortions are legal and they are going to remain legal unless there is a change in the constitution which is not going to happen because as the article noted more than 80% of people believe abortion should be legal in at least some circumstances, this includes both major party presidential contenders.
We should be talking about the things we need to do that can and will have to chance to move this country forward in a state of employment.
except people do change their minds, some people have gone to abortion mills to get an abortion and leave there planning to keep their child.
furthur, peopleminds are changing percentages you speak of are changing, that is why polls are still being taken, and the numbers are gradually moving to a much more pro-life stance.

Also the constitution does not protect a a right to kill unborn children. In fact many other documents dispute that claim.

“It's a Brand New Day”

Since: Feb 06

New Rochelle

#7 Aug 28, 2012
marysaidyes2life wrote:
<quoted text>except people do change their minds, some people have gone to abortion mills to get an abortion and leave there planning to keep their child.
furthur, peopleminds are changing percentages you speak of are changing, that is why polls are still being taken, and the numbers are gradually moving to a much more pro-life stance.
Also the constitution does not protect a a right to kill unborn children. In fact many other documents dispute that claim.
Your first sentence supports a woman's choice.

Your second in nonsense.

Your third makes no sense. The US Constitution does no concern itself with abortion. It is allowable under the Constitution; and there is no such thig as an "unborn child."

I truly hope tha you are never in a position where you or someone you love have to have an abortion. I have seen that often it is the very loudest freedom opposers who end up in that sort of trouble.

And, HOW ABOUT BIRTH CONTROL?
Isn't that next, if you abort abortions?

“Old 16th Graveyard hole”

Since: Nov 11

Philadelphia, PA

#8 Aug 28, 2012
Bottom line is that in this day and age, if you are raped, if you report said rape and go to the hospital for a "rape kit" exam, you will be given the choice of taking the "Morning after" pill that will prevent contraception. End of story. If you are raped and don't report it and become pregnant, you should have the choice to abort or give up for adoption, BUT, bottom line, if you take care of business in the beginning, there will be no need for an abortion later.

“Old 16th Graveyard hole”

Since: Nov 11

Philadelphia, PA

#9 Aug 28, 2012
robert wrote:
The bible thumpers need to give it a rest, it is settled law and nobody is going to change their mind. If you get a constitutional person hood amendment through then you can talk about it.
Abortions are legal and they are going to remain legal unless there is a change in the constitution which is not going to happen because as the article noted more than 80% of people believe abortion should be legal in at least some circumstances, this includes both major party presidential contenders.
We should be talking about the things we need to do that can and will have to chance to move this country forward in a state of employment.
Yes we should, but the Democrat party is a one issue party these days. Abortion is #1 on their list and abortion on demand up to and including the day of birth is the radical idea of way too many democrats. Most of America is settled with abortion, but the majority of America wants limits. You know you don't want that baby the minute you find out your pregnant, why wait 6 months or even 6 weeks? Any abortion after 3 months should only be for the health of the mother and later term abortion should be outlawed.

“Blessed Be”

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#10 Aug 28, 2012
marysaidyes2life wrote:
<quoted text>except people do change their minds, some people have gone to abortion mills to get an abortion and leave there planning to keep their child.
furthur, peopleminds are changing percentages you speak of are changing, that is why polls are still being taken, and the numbers are gradually moving to a much more pro-life stance.
Also the constitution does not protect a a right to kill unborn children. In fact many other documents dispute that claim.
No, the percentages the are not changing.

The Constitution doesn't deal with fetuses at all. It never has. It DOES, however, grant us the right to privacy which includes medical decisions.
robert

Hollywood, FL

#11 Aug 28, 2012
marysaidyes2life wrote:
<quoted text>except people do change their minds, some people have gone to abortion mills to get an abortion and leave there planning to keep their child.
furthur, peopleminds are changing percentages you speak of are changing, that is why polls are still being taken, and the numbers are gradually moving to a much more pro-life stance.
Also the constitution does not protect a a right to kill unborn children. In fact many other documents dispute that claim.
The constitution and its defining decisions say nothing about it being ok to kill unborn children. A fertilized egg is a fertilized egg not an unborn child. To listen to the anti choice people you would think all abortions were done the day before a child was due to be born by doctors with horns coming out of their head in an abortion miss that won't let you turn around once you enter the door.
robert

Hollywood, FL

#12 Aug 28, 2012
Ballybunion wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes we should, but the Democrat party is a one issue party these days. Abortion is #1 on their list and abortion on demand up to and including the day of birth is the radical idea of way too many democrats. Most of America is settled with abortion, but the majority of America wants limits. You know you don't want that baby the minute you find out your pregnant, why wait 6 months or even 6 weeks? Any abortion after 3 months should only be for the health of the mother and later term abortion should be outlawed.
The official republican party stance (which is an optional plank of the platform) is that of support of a person hood amendment which does not allow for abortions and would even ban some birth control methods. I believe your might be mis quoting the democratic stance, I am no democrat but I believe the official party platform is for abortion laws consistent with roe v wade and that they would like to make abortions more rare not more dangerous. That does not include abortion on demand up to the day of birth as you said.
a voter

Saint Augustine, FL

#13 Aug 28, 2012
Ballybunion wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes we should, but the Democrat party is a one issue party these days. Abortion is #1 on their list and abortion on demand up to and including the day of birth is the radical idea of way too many democrats. Most of America is settled with abortion, but the majority of America wants limits. You know you don't want that baby the minute you find out your pregnant, why wait 6 months or even 6 weeks? Any abortion after 3 months should only be for the health of the mother and later term abortion should be outlawed.
All of this is your opinion, so that's great, make your decisions according to your opinion. For many others, abortion at many different times is ethical.

A mother who's fetus has died inside her should be allowed medical help to remove it. A mother who's child will be born into horrific pain and will know no quality of life, shouldn't be forced to watch the child die that way if there's a more humane way. If you don't like late term abortions, don't have one. To make laws against procedures, opens the door for these people to be victimized by the often solely religious views of others and would sentence them to greater suffering and sometimes even death.
Gravediggers

United States

#14 Aug 28, 2012
Abortion?!?!?

It's the ECONOMY
It's JOBS
It's our DEPENDENCE on FOREIGN OIL
It's the HIGH COST OF GAS
It's the HIGH COST OF FOOD

nothing moronic on this subject matter!

Since: May 11

Location hidden

#15 Aug 28, 2012
Gravediggers wrote:
Abortion?!?!?
It's the ECONOMY
It's JOBS
It's our DEPENDENCE on FOREIGN OIL
It's the HIGH COST OF GAS
It's the HIGH COST OF FOOD
nothing moronic on this subject matter!
Maybe you should get a job.

“I'd rather be snowmobiling”

Since: Oct 07

8120'

#16 Aug 28, 2012
GOP, wiling to throw yet another election to social issues.
It's the economy, stupid.
a voter

Saint Augustine, FL

#17 Aug 28, 2012
Gravediggers wrote:
Abortion?!?!?
It's the ECONOMY
It's JOBS
It's our DEPENDENCE on FOREIGN OIL
It's the HIGH COST OF GAS
It's the HIGH COST OF FOOD
nothing moronic on this subject matter!
This wouldn't be an issue in the election if the Republicans hadn't chosen it as their party platform for the election and tried to introduce so much legislation involving women's reproductive issues. That point should be to them.

“Old 16th Graveyard hole”

Since: Nov 11

Philadelphia, PA

#18 Aug 28, 2012
a voter wrote:
<quoted text>

.
"A mother who's fetus has died inside her should be allowed medical help to remove it." That is not an abortion, that is removal of dead tissue, not a child to be.

" A mother who's child will be born into horrific pain and will know no quality of life, shouldn't be forced to watch the child die that way if there's a more humane way." This is an example of compassionate care for the mother, not the common reason for an abortion.

" If you don't like late term abortions, don't have one. To make laws against procedures, opens the door for these people to be victimized by the often solely religious views of others and would sentence them to greater suffering and sometimes even death"

I know many doctors, many OB/GYN'S, and not one of them could come up with, within all their patients and all the problems associated with childbirth, NOT ONE could give me an example of why what's termed "Late term Abortion" would be needed. Can you? Can you live with yourself, having just announced that late term abortions are just hunky dory with you, knowing that the child of a late term abortion is VIABLE, and may be born alive only to be let die, in pain, alone and cold? Really? Unless you can list even one good reason why a perfectly viable baby be killed in the womb just for the convenience of the woman, late term abortions should not ever be on the table. Both my children were born around the time of late term abortions, 4 and 5 weeks early, both LIVED AND THRIVED very well, the idea of bashing in their brains and pulling them out of the womb to die is totally unthinkable and any human being who things otherwise perhaps should have undergone that procedure themselves, thus saving us the sanctimonious arguments for such a barbaric procedure. If the woman waits until 8 months pregnant to decide she doesn't want the baby after all, just have it and give it to someone who WILL love it. This is not rocket science Lady!

“Old 16th Graveyard hole”

Since: Nov 11

Philadelphia, PA

#19 Aug 28, 2012
robert wrote:
<quoted text>
The official republican party stance (which is an optional plank of the platform) is that of support of a person hood amendment which does not allow for abortions and would even ban some birth control methods. I believe your might be mis quoting the democratic stance, I am no democrat but I believe the official party platform is for abortion laws consistent with roe v wade and that they would like to make abortions more rare not more dangerous. That does not include abortion on demand up to the day of birth as you said.
I suggest you listen to the roster of women as they give their talks at the Democrat convention, there is a vast line up of pro abortion zealots, who do indeed, advocate for abortion on demand, citing the woman's (I will not call these people mothers - that would be an insult to real women) right to choose, whenever and however, no matter the thoughts of the father who may want the child. Then get back to me. Thanks.
a voter

Saint Augustine, FL

#20 Aug 28, 2012
Ballybunion wrote:
<quoted text>
"A mother who's fetus has died inside her should be allowed medical help to remove it." That is not an abortion, that is removal of dead tissue, not a child to be.
" A mother who's child will be born into horrific pain and will know no quality of life, shouldn't be forced to watch the child die that way if there's a more humane way." This is an example of compassionate care for the mother, not the common reason for an abortion.
" If you don't like late term abortions, don't have one. To make laws against procedures, opens the door for these people to be victimized by the often solely religious views of others and would sentence them to greater suffering and sometimes even death"
I know many doctors, many OB/GYN'S, and not one of them could come up with, within all their patients and all the problems associated with childbirth, NOT ONE could give me an example of why what's termed "Late term Abortion" would be needed. Can you? Can you live with yourself, having just announced that late term abortions are just hunky dory with you, knowing that the child of a late term abortion is VIABLE, and may be born alive only to be let die, in pain, alone and cold? Really? Unless you can list even one good reason why a perfectly viable baby be killed in the womb just for the convenience of the woman, late term abortions should not ever be on the table. Both my children were born around the time of late term abortions, 4 and 5 weeks early, both LIVED AND THRIVED very well, the idea of bashing in their brains and pulling them out of the womb to die is totally unthinkable and any human being who things otherwise perhaps should have undergone that procedure themselves, thus saving us the sanctimonious arguments for such a barbaric procedure. If the woman waits until 8 months pregnant to decide she doesn't want the baby after all, just have it and give it to someone who WILL love it. This is not rocket science Lady!
Upon studying WHY women have late term abortions, I found these reasons women had them: fetus to be born with entrails outside of body, fetus with heart defect and severe brain deformity to be scheduled for surgery attempts to save life(doctor's overriding parent's wishes for natural death) while it would live in a vegetative state, and finally fetuses which will never make it to term or wasn't likely to live through any form of delivery b/c of said deformity. So can I live with it, Thank the Lord, I never had to make the choice. I CAN NOT IMAGINE. So in my yesteryear, of being anti-late term abortion, I realized I was being judgemental and sitting in judgement of people who are grappling with great loss. Their acts were to give that child a death with some sort of dignity, it was the most merciful decision they could find. Can I live with that? They had to live with the loss, I guess I can live with not judging them.

BTW, late term abortions account for 1.7% of all abortion and only a small percentage of them will be partial-birth.

But even in my distaste for abortions that result from irresponsibility or carelessness, I'll never vote to take that choice out of the hands of the woman. We don't know the cases in which they make their decisions and some stranger or politician shouldn't have the power to take that choice away.

You never know who you are making suffer when you make broad brush strokes. You might be sentencing a woman to death when the baby isn't even going to make it birth. You might be forcing a raped woman who can't carry any more babies to leave her other children motherless. I'd like them to have a chance for their lives to matter more than the embryo or fetus they carry inside them.

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