Congress wavers on killing tax cuts

Congress wavers on killing tax cuts

There are 60 comments on the DispatchPolitics story from Sep 7, 2010, titled Congress wavers on killing tax cuts. In it, DispatchPolitics reports that:

Rep. Tim Ryan hails from the blue-collar, Democratic stronghold of the Mahoning Valley, but the Niles Democrat is a good example why President Barack Obama might fail to persuade Congress to go along with not extending tax cuts for the most-affluent Americans.

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Civics101

Columbus, OH

#42 Sep 7, 2010
Make targeted tax cuts that will spur job creation and incentive for hiring. A little extra in the pocket of a millionaire trickles down very little, if at all, and only contributes to the deficit. It is an inefficient use of assets where small percentage controls much of the wealth. can' possibly spend it all and it isn't necessarily spent domestically in a manner that spurs econmoic development.

These tax cuts work to help get companies hiring:
* Giving employers targeted tax cuts for employing people by reducing payroll taxes for new hires.
* Targeted industry tax cuts like cash for clunkers or enery conservation. Figure out what industries will actually produce jobs for next decade and target tax writeoffs for them.

Since: Jan 10

Westerville, OH

#43 Sep 7, 2010
DeductiveReasoning wrote:
Let's do an inventory and connect some dots:
<<lots of half-a$$ed "logic" snipped>>
Buy a clue, DR. First off, the whole surplus/deficit thing is crap. Every budget calculation in the past 60 years has been a work of fiction. The fed's bookkeeping is so abysmal that they would be shut down by the FTC and SEC if they were held to the same standards as private companies.

Second, 9/11 happened as the result of 100 years of foreign policy failures and 60 years of security oversights. That makes it just as much the fault of the Dems as the Reps.

Third, a whole lot of Dems voted to give Georgie permission to invade Iraq because they failed to do their due diligence in the days before the invasion. You can blame Georgie for crashing the bus, but you have to blame the Dems for helping him fuel it up and get it started.

Fourth, there are lots of big-money Dems (including the unions) who benefited from all of the bailouts.
dave chappelle

Grove City, OH

#44 Sep 7, 2010
DeductiveReasoning wrote:
Let's do an inventory and connect some dots:
1980s working class America votes for republican propaganda thinking they'll get themselves out of ****.
Reagan digs a deeper hole by over spending and deregulating everything in sight like US law does not apply to white collar criminals.
1990s voters turn back to democrats in disgust.
Democrats balance the budget,
Democrats create a record surplus,
Democrats have plans that republicans oppose on immigration and tax reform and economic growth and social security and medicare and new jobs that leads to republican gridlock.
Voters allow republicans to steal an election in Florida to be polite and then stack the court for a rerun.
That stolen election leads to Republicans being attacked on 9/11 by known offshore terrorists republicans ignored that killed mostly innocent working class Americans who were bystanders that had nothing to do with republican policies leading up to the attack's intended targets.
So Working Class America unifies behind the intended republican targets and:
A... Republicans then start the longest war in American history on false pretenses against a 3rd country who was not involved in the attack but had lot's of oil.
B... Republicans Then both blow multiple chances to capture the real terrorists and ignore the country where the terrorists are based because it's too hilly and remote for them and there's no oil there.
But republicans are willing to create more wedge issues with religious and POW abuse in Iraq and Cuba That Enrage 75% OF THE REST OF THE WORLD while they ignore the real terrorists.
C... Republicans start up a plan to pull all of America's economic surplus off of the corporate side of the national economic table like they did in 1929 to create a meltdown that they can then blame on democrats after their 2nd stolen election in Ohio.
If you are still following this inventory you know the rest.
They Stole the Money,
They Got You To Pay For The Bailouts To Cover Their Losses,
They Paid Themselves Bonuses,
Now They want MORE Tax Breaks For The Rich AGAIN
Who Stole The Wall Street Money Tax Free?
Who Accepted The Bail Outs Tax Free?
Who Lied About The War?
Who Got Tax Breaks That You Did NOT Get?
And Who Wants More Tax Breaks From YOU?
Connect The Dots Folks
It's NOT Rocket Science
"1990s voters turn back to democrats in disgust.
Democrats balance the budget,
Democrats create a record surplus,"

Nice pack of lies, there idiot. Republicans controlled both chambers of Congress from January 1995 until January of 2007. And when did everything go to hell? That's right, when Pelosi and Reid took control.
Civics101

Columbus, OH

#45 Sep 7, 2010
ChrisS wrote:
The current tax system is a joke. We need complete reform of the tax code. Do you know that our founding fathers never put in a way for our federal govt to tax at all?
They believed that giving the federal govt the ability to tax was giving them TOO MUCH POWER. Look at what is going on now and you will realize that they were right.
As to the tax cut, since we cannot do a complete reform, leave them in place. Raising them right ow would possibly be the most idiotic thing any politician could ever do. Punishing the very people that create the jobs in this country is really a good idea isn't it? NOT!! Anyone that thinks otherwise is an idiot.
Sort of true under the Articles of Confederation, adopted in 1781 since had a fear of central government and left the power to the states. HOWEVER, when the Constitution was adopted in 1789, the Founding Fathers granted the authority for Federal Government to raise taxes since couldn't function without resources.

Washington, Adams, and Hamilton were all Federalists, which advocated a strong government with a sound fiscal base. Alexander Hamilton recommended system of centralized tax collection, banking, and securities exchange.

Thomas Jefferson quotes on topic:

"Many of the opposition [to the new Federal Constitution] wish to
take from Congress the power of internal taxation. Calculation
has convinced me that this would be very mischievous." --Thomas
Jefferson to William Carmichael, 1788.

"Taxes should be proportioned to what may be annually spared by
the individual." --Thomas Jefferson to James Madison, 1784.

"Another means of silently lessening the inequality of property is
to exempt all from taxation below a certain point, and to tax the
higher portions of property in geometrical progression as they
rise." --Thomas Jefferson to James Madison, 1785.

Thoms Paine wanted an estate tax to pay for widows, orphans, and elderly. Kind of sounds like Social Security.

Since: Jan 10

Westerville, OH

#46 Sep 7, 2010
Civics101 wrote:
It is an inefficient use of assets where small percentage controls much of the wealth.
Here's Civics 102 for you:

The above statement implies that increasing the amount of resources controlled by the collective (i.e. the federal government) will increase the efficient use of said resources. Taken to the logical conclusion, it follows that if all of a nation's material and financial assets either belong to the government or are under the direct control of said government, we will reach a state of maximum efficiency. Enter Exhibit A, the Soviet Union, which shows conclusively that this theory is an absolute failure.

According to the Constitution of the United States, the federal government is not responsible for assuring that assets are used efficiently, and therefore does not have the authority to even attempt to assure that they are used efficiently. Any laws that attempt to force efficiency or to "redistribute wealth" more equitably are therefore in violation of the Constitution (no to mention morally bereft).

Since: Jan 10

Westerville, OH

#47 Sep 7, 2010
dave chappelle wrote:
Nice pack of lies, there idiot. Republicans controlled both chambers of Congress from January 1995 until January of 2007. And when did everything go to hell? That's right, when Pelosi and Reid took control.
Thanks, Dave. Forgot about that part.

BTW, apologies to all for the double post above. Topix said the first one failed because Java and cookies weren't enabled. I posted it again and somehow both versions appeared.
the truth

Greenbrier, AR

#48 Sep 7, 2010
My Opinion wrote:
If you think that by keeping the rich richer you'll keep your job, your an idiot. The rich doesn't give that money to their working employees they keep it for themselves. Why should I be the rich man's SLAVE. The rich will also "OUT SOURCE" jobs to other countries so they don't have to pay our people, taxes, etc. Screw the rich. Tax the crap out of them. I'm tired of paying my share and theirs. The rich will never be for the working man and for those of you that believe it your stupid. Look at wallstreet, do you see any of them helping us now since they got their bail outs. NO!!! The CEO got their pay outs and their gone. NONE OF THEM TOOK ANY RESPONSIBILITY. This is GOP crap your being fed because a lot of these people are rich and want to keep it that way. If your rich you can afford to pay. PAY UP.
Move to cuba loser we have no use for yo marxist here and your slave master the marxist racist muslim ground zero hero of his brother OSama the man child is a lame duck to be impeached and you should leave while you can before being sent to gitmo with him.
Where is Filthroy

Chillicothe, OH

#49 Sep 7, 2010
Where is MJ Filthroy in this debate? I mean she never holds a town hall meeting that is open to the entire public. Or her telephone town halls seem to ring up only the union scum. If one asks her a question in public she runs as if the light was just turned on. So does anybody know where Filthroy is?
Frank Mikat

Columbus, OH

#50 Sep 7, 2010
I have tried over and over again to speak with my Rep ... Mary Jo Kilroy. I have called her office and sent emails during her entire term in office. I am told that when she is in town, she has "town hall" meetings. WHAT A JOKE! They are all closed to the public she represents. Closed to the people she should be listening to. Closed to anyone who might disagree with her views. Closed. Closed. Closed. I have heard it 50 times!

Shame on Mary Jo Kilroy! You clearly want to decide who you represent and who you don't. This is America. We can vote you in and we can vote you out!

I WILL WORK HARD TO GET YOU VOTED OUT!!!! Not because I disagree with your views, but because you are a hiding from your record to the people you should represent! Step out of the shadows and talk to the people (all the people) you represent.

PLEASE VOTE MARY JO KILLROY OUT OF OFFICE!!!!!
Civics101

Dublin, OH

#51 Sep 7, 2010
Rupert wrote:
The top 5% pays for the majority of taxes in this country while the bottom 50%(yes half of this country) pays nearly nothing. What percent do you think is fair for the rich to pay? Just curious, since according to many people here they aren't paying enough. if you were smart, you would hope more people would become rich (instead of being slaves to the government) so tax revenues would continue to increase. There's not some fixed amount of money available and when someone makes more than you it means you get less. Money is created!!! Here are some FACTS in case those still mean anything to anyone...
From the Internal Revenue Service in 2005. The share of total income taxes paid by the top 1% of wage earners rose to 34.27% from 33.71% in 2002. Their income share (not just wages) rose from 16.12% to 16.77%. However, their average tax rate actually dropped from 27.25% down to 24.31%
*Data covers calendar year 2003, not fiscal year 2003
- and includes all income, not just wages, excluding Social Security
Think of it this way: less than 3-1/2 dollars out of every $100 paid in income taxes in the United States is paid by someone in the bottom 50% of wage earners. The top 50% were those individuals or couples filing jointly who earned $29,019 and up in 2003.(The top 1% earned $295,495-plus.) Here are the wage earners in each category and the percentages they pay:
The top 1% pay over a third, 34.27% of all income taxes.(Up from 2003: 33.71%)
The top 5% pay 54.36% of all income taxes (Up from 2002: 53.80%).
The top 10% pay 65.84%(Up from 2002: 65.73%).
The top 25% pay 83.88%(Down from 2002: 83.90%).
The top 50% pay 96.54%(Up from 2002: 96.50%).
The bottom 50%? They pay a paltry 3.46% of all income taxes (Down from 2002: 3.50%).
The top 1% is paying nearly ten times the federal income taxes than the bottom 50%!
And who earns what? The top 1% earns 16.77% of all income (2002: 16.12%).
The top 5% earns 31.18% of all the income (2002: 30.55%).
The top 10% earns 42.36% of all the income (2002: 41.77%); the top 25% earns 64.86% of all the income (2002: 64.37%), and the top 50% earns 86.01%(2002: 85.77%) of all the income.
who benefits the most from having a military that defends border, a government that has a system of backing banks and enforces property rights and contracts? who has more at risk if government isn't there to keep the common folk in line?

trickle down doesn't work. while the richest 1% received nearly of all the growth, middle class shrunk and real wages stagnated.

in 1913 income tax was a modest tax on the richest 1% and 99% of the country didn't pay it. there is a difference between income and wealth also. The people that hold the land and resources have shifted more of the burden of government onto the backs of common man.

the highest tax rates were in 1944 and 1945 to pay for a war. GOP wanted to have its cake and eat it too by fighting two wars and having a tax cut which insanely increased the deficits. They have financed these tax cuts by selling cheap debt to china and raiding the working class social security savings. now we are in a recession, government spending contributes to the macro economy and cushions the swings until private sector starts hiring. It is time to pay the piper so to speak and so pay up or run the risk of inflmaming the masses.
Civics101

Dublin, OH

#52 Sep 7, 2010
elric wrote:
<quoted text>
Here's Civics 102 for you:
The above statement implies that increasing the amount of resources controlled by the collective (i.e. the federal government) will increase the efficient use of said resources. Taken to the logical conclusion, it follows that if all of a nation's material and financial assets either belong to the government or are under the direct control of said government, we will reach a state of maximum efficiency. Enter Exhibit A, the Soviet Union, which shows conclusively that this theory is an absolute failure.
According to the Constitution of the United States, the federal government is not responsible for assuring that assets are used efficiently, and therefore does not have the authority to even attempt to assure that they are used efficiently. Any laws that attempt to force efficiency or to "redistribute wealth" more equitably are therefore in violation of the Constitution (no to mention morally bereft).
any concept taken to the point of absurbity will become absurd. If you take free market to the extreme, should be able to buy or sell anything that one person person values and another is willing to sell. your land, your car, your child, your life no matter what if you want to sell me I can buy it? Plus, no friction in the market by "govenement interference" so if I poison all my customers they should just stop buying and I'll eventually go out of business from my bad business model.

I'm talking balance of power not marxism.
Guy Average

Columbus, OH

#53 Sep 7, 2010
They have already put the next several generations in debt with their "stimulus" and "mandatory forced health insurance", so whether they renew the Bush tax cuts for a year or not doesn't mean anything except giving them something to put in campaign ads; either way the government still ends up in control without a miracle occurring.
rockettraveller

Ravenna, OH

#54 Sep 8, 2010
They better change direction fast. There killing us with taxes. Anyone who runs a business knows whats going on. Enough already. Nov 2nd cant come fast enough.
Seesall

United States

#55 Sep 8, 2010
Glasnos wrote:
It is embarrassing to read some of these posts and see what passes for "intelligent thought" ... The progressive school system and progressive media has spread their ideology like an infection. Many here talk like all money earned in this country belongs to the government ... and they graciously allow us to keep a part of it. But I bet if I ask you who makes better decisions to spend money, you or the government, you would unanimously say you do. Look what Obama is doing with billions more added to his budget ... he props up states like California and their bloated budgets, rather than force them to make cuts, which will have to be made ... He can't continue to bail them out year after year ... so it is wasted.
"When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic." Benjamin Franklin
We are very near that tipping point ....
Great, great post!! Finally someone here along with just a few others hit the nail on the head. Everyone else is quoting statistics either for or against one of the two major parties, while these stats they quote, come from the lies of the major parties. The politicians are causing just what they want their puppets and lackies to do and that is argue among themselves about which party is better. This keeps the focus off solving the real problem and it is so simple as only a few other people on this forum have figured out. STOP the federal, state and local government waste and overspending which will in turn force them to pass huge tax reductions for everyone and this will stimulate the economy 100% better than any government program.
Civics101

Columbus, OH

#56 Sep 8, 2010
Seesall wrote:
<quoted text>Great, great post!! Finally someone here along with just a few others hit the nail on the head. Everyone else is quoting statistics either for or against one of the two major parties, while these stats they quote, come from the lies of the major parties. The politicians are causing just what they want their puppets and lackies to do and that is argue among themselves about which party is better. This keeps the focus off solving the real problem and it is so simple as only a few other people on this forum have figured out. STOP the federal, state and local government waste and overspending which will in turn force them to pass huge tax reductions for everyone and this will stimulate the economy 100% better than any government program.
dont start wars you don't want to pay for.
Jeez

United States

#57 Sep 8, 2010
Civics101 wrote:
Make targeted tax cuts that will spur job creation and incentive for hiring. A little extra in the pocket of a millionaire trickles down very little, if at all, and only contributes to the deficit. It is an inefficient use of assets where small percentage controls much of the wealth. can' possibly spend it all and it isn't necessarily spent domestically in a manner that spurs econmoic development.
These tax cuts work to help get companies hiring:
* Giving employers targeted tax cuts for employing people by reducing payroll taxes for new hires.
* Targeted industry tax cuts like cash for clunkers or enery conservation. Figure out what industries will actually produce jobs for next decade and target tax writeoffs for them.
Right on!

These Bush tax cuts for the rich need to be
gone. Should have been gone to pay for there war machine years ago. Pay as you go!

All the wingnuts say "but these are the people that create jobs" Bullcrap.... well where are they?

the truth

Greenbrier, AR

#58 Sep 8, 2010
The headline should read " the dems run for cover".
the truth

Greenbrier, AR

#59 Sep 8, 2010
Jeez wrote:
<quoted text>
Right on!
These Bush tax cuts for the rich need to be
gone. Should have been gone to pay for there war machine years ago. Pay as you go!
All the wingnuts say "but these are the people that create jobs" Bullcrap.... well where are they?
Ok why are your dems that have all three branchs and votes not slaming this down our rear ends like Obama deathcare and the other atni American bills? Lie away baby you are cooked like your brain.

Obama lies Americans die
Libs lie Freedom dies
DNC lies grandma dies
cap and tax lies US jobs die
Ted lies Ohio jobs die
Jeez

United States

#60 Sep 8, 2010
Jeez

United States

#61 Sep 8, 2010
the truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Ok why are your dems that have all three branchs and votes not slaming this down our rear ends like Obama deathcare and the other atni American bills?
My only guess is - All politicians are owned by the corporate elite.

Same goes for why we are still blowing billions away in the middle east.

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