Hawaii Set To Take Up Gay Marriage In...

Hawaii Set To Take Up Gay Marriage In Special Session Monday

There are 223 comments on the WGBH story from Oct 27, 2013, titled Hawaii Set To Take Up Gay Marriage In Special Session Monday. In it, WGBH reports that:

Hawaii's Gov. Neil Abercrombie announced the special session on gay marriage at the Hawaii Capitol in Honolulu in September.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at WGBH.

“Together for 24, legal for 5”

Since: Sep 07

Littleton, NH

#201 Nov 11, 2013
I'm just curious how many people like Jo Jordan are convinced that the legislature has usurped the right of the people to Democratic rule. How many see the protests for what they were: The well-orchestrated interference of a particular religious sect into secular policy. Will the latter be as offended by the events as the former? Which group is bigger? Will it bring backlash not against gays, but rather against religious zealotry?

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#202 Nov 11, 2013
District 1 wrote:
<quoted text>Put it to a popular vote then.
" ... The very purpose of a Bill of Rights was to withdraw certain subjects from the vicissitudes of political controversy, to place them beyond the reach of majorities and officials and to establish them as legal principles to be applied by the courts. One's right to life, liberty, and property, to free speech, a free press, freedom of worship and assembly, and other fundamental rights may not be submitted to vote; they depend on the outcome of no elections ... "

(West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette 1943)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Virginia_St...

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#203 Nov 11, 2013
District 1 wrote:
<quoted text>Certainly, the rule of law is one of representative politics, but ultimately, the People decide in majority rule.
You don't apparently understand the subtleties of American politics, seeing as how you appear to be a one-dimensional pundit relegated to a single issue.
And Majority Rule with all it's injustices and instabilities is precisely what our founders designed our system to preclude.
District 1

Kailua Kona, HI

#205 Nov 11, 2013
snyper wrote:
<quoted text>
And Majority Rule with all it's injustices and instabilities is precisely what our founders designed our system to preclude.
So now you're a Constitutional Law expert?
How do you know the mind of the Founders?
I am SURE that none of them possessed the prognosticating power to anticipate a future redefining of marriage as it is now being redefined.
Heck, many of them owned slaves, although they fully understood it went against the core philosophy of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. If slavery was subordinated to the need for a unified Colonial Congress, how far down the list would endorsing buggery have been?
Try again, this time in not such a Pollyannaishly and anachronistic fashion, please.

http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/126...
District 1

Kailua Kona, HI

#206 Nov 12, 2013
nhjeff wrote:
I'm just curious how many people like Jo Jordan are convinced that the legislature has usurped the right of the people to Democratic rule. How many see the protests for what they were: The well-orchestrated interference of a particular religious sect into secular policy. Will the latter be as offended by the events as the former? Which group is bigger? Will it bring backlash not against gays, but rather against religious zealotry?
No. it's likely to galvanize the Religious Right in the 2014 elections.
Watch for a GOP Governor in Hawaii, and a Republican White House.
The more LGBTs make this about damaging religion, the less you will ultimately gain.
You will have Gay Marriage in Hawaii this time tomorrow, so cool it with the openly in-your-face Gay displays like "Pride" parades, and demanding to be included in Sex Ed as a viable and legitimate form of love.
Rubbing "their" noses in it will not play out well. Just as same-sex love is part of humanity, so is religion--probably even more prevalent, so it's pure numbers. Take the win graciously.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#208 Nov 12, 2013
District 1 wrote:
<quoted text>So now you're a Constitutional Law expert?
How do you know the mind of the Founders?
I am SURE that none of them possessed the prognosticating power to anticipate a future redefining of marriage as it is now being redefined.
Heck, many of them owned slaves, although they fully understood it went against the core philosophy of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. If slavery was subordinated to the need for a unified Colonial Congress, how far down the list would endorsing buggery have been?
Try again, this time in not such a Pollyannaishly and anachronistic fashion, please.
http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/126...
Cut the Reification Fallacy.

And now a word from our sponsors ...

&fe ature=related

“THE JOURNEY OF A 1000 MILES”

Since: Aug 08

BEGINS WITH JUST ONE STEP:-)

#209 Nov 12, 2013
District 1 wrote:
<quoted text>No. it's likely to galvanize the Religious Right in the 2014 elections.
Watch for a GOP Governor in Hawaii, and a Republican White House.
The more LGBTs make this about damaging religion, the less you will ultimately gain.
You will have Gay Marriage in Hawaii this time tomorrow, so cool it with the openly in-your-face Gay displays like "Pride" parades, and demanding to be included in Sex Ed as a viable and legitimate form of love.
Rubbing "their" noses in it will not play out well. Just as same-sex love is part of humanity, so is religion--probably even more prevalent, so it's pure numbers. Take the win graciously.
I don't believe the Republicans will gain much of anything at the mid-term elections election in 2014 and the likelihood of a Republican in the White House in 2016 is pretty slim to none chance in my opinion.......hell, the Republican Party doesn't have a chance with the candidates they probably will be parading with.

The Republicans gained control in the House in 2010, but when they held this Country hostage in October of this year......they basically sealed their fate.......but again that's just my opinion and knowing there are idiots like you who are blind to exactly what the Republicans have done.....WON'T surprise me if you continue to vote that direction........besides UNTIL this Country gets away from the 2 party political system......we will NEVER have any REAL change!!!

We are a Republic style of Government.....NOT a Theocracy.......plain and simple!!!

“Smart@ss”

Since: Dec 07

Location hidden

#210 Nov 12, 2013
nhjeff wrote:
I'm just curious how many people like Jo Jordan are convinced that the legislature has usurped the right of the people to Democratic rule. How many see the protests for what they were: The well-orchestrated interference of a particular religious sect into secular policy. Will the latter be as offended by the events as the former? Which group is bigger? Will it bring backlash not against gays, but rather against religious zealotry?
I hope this will help to clear the air about some of your questions.

A lot of religious people in Hawaii are simply afraid. At first glance of the bill that was being presented it could be fairly easy to understand their fear after the rather insidious effort of some of their church leaders to misinform their flock on the facts of the issues.

Most of the people that showed up are being told that churches would be forced to hold marriages against their will. Which is false.

They are bring told that people will be targeted for discrimination for their religious beliefs if they refuse services. Which is false. One can't force someone to provide a service that is against their religious beliefs. that would be like going into a practicing Hindu Indian restaurant with a prime beef steak and demand them to cook it for you.

They are being told that their children will be forced to attend Sex education classes that explain homosexual safe sex. As if such a thing even exists, sex is sex.

I remember my classes in school and they covered all forms of sex in an asexual manner and of course there is the wavier to opt your children out of the sex education classes all together. So another falsehood.

They are being told that their young children will be taught by homosexual teachers with children books teaching them about homosexuality. Which is laughably false.

These are real fears of many people, driven by false claims. You could call those that showed up at the hearings as organized, but you can't call it staged. You can't say they staged the fear they feel and the concern that was showed in them.

Which leads me to Hawaii's culture of Aloha. Secularism and Religion isn't a real conflict here like it is on continent, law makers aren't passing the bill because they believe in secularism, it's because they believe it's the right thing to do to grant equality to those that are denied it.

To hear someone talk about secularism being a driver is rather comical. There are still opening prayers being conducted at the state house before sessions. Don't get me wrong, I believe in the strong separation between church and state.

There will be very little if any backlash of any type against religious people for showing up at the hearings. The vast majority understand why they did it, even the majority of Hawaii's LBGT community, after all, those that showed up were family and friends.

Which again is cultural. Unlike the rest of America, the majority of families in Hawaii (yes even the deeply religious ones, only God can judge anyone) don't reject their family members for being homosexual, it is rare to hear of anyone kicking their family out of their homes and restrict them from their lives for being gay.

In my own family, my sister is a lesbian and my brother is gay and is currently in the early stages of a sex change.

But they are both loved deeply and welcome at all times, at any time. They are trusted to babysit often for their numerous nephews and nieces with their partners often helping them.

The children know that their Uncle talks and dresses differently than their fathers, he tells them it's a costume for fun. That their Auntie's friend is also their Auntie. My brother and sister know and understand that explaining such adult things can wait, let the kids be kids.

Unless you live here, it's hard to explain. Ohana (family) is everything in the end. You don't turn away family and friends for their flaws and short comings in any aspect of their lives. You love them.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#211 Nov 12, 2013
NorCal Native wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't believe the Republicans will gain much of anything at the mid-term elections election in 2014 and the likelihood of a Republican in the White House in 2016 is pretty slim to none chance in my opinion.......hell, the Republican Party doesn't have a chance with the candidates they probably will be parading with.
The Republicans gained control in the House in 2010, but when they held this Country hostage in October of this year......they basically sealed their fate.......but again that's just my opinion and knowing there are idiots like you who are blind to exactly what the Republicans have done.....WON'T surprise me if you continue to vote that direction........besides UNTIL this Country gets away from the 2 party political system......we will NEVER have any REAL change!!!
We are a Republic style of Government.....NOT a Theocracy.......plain and simple!!!
Don't get blind-sided like in 2008. And THAT was in CALI, fergossakes!

“Headed toward the cliff”

Since: Nov 07

Tawas City, Michigan

#212 Nov 12, 2013
District 1 wrote:
<quoted text>No. it's likely to galvanize the Religious Right in the 2014 elections.
Watch for a GOP Governor in Hawaii, and a Republican White House.
The more LGBTs make this about damaging religion, the less you will ultimately gain.
You will have Gay Marriage in Hawaii this time tomorrow, so cool it with the openly in-your-face Gay displays like "Pride" parades, and demanding to be included in Sex Ed as a viable and legitimate form of love.
Rubbing "their" noses in it will not play out well. Just as same-sex love is part of humanity, so is religion--probably even more prevalent, so it's pure numbers. Take the win graciously.
Actually if you look at any of the other states with marriage equality, we HAVE taken our wins very graciously- aside from some bragging on anonymous sites like Topix.

“THE JOURNEY OF A 1000 MILES”

Since: Aug 08

BEGINS WITH JUST ONE STEP:-)

#213 Nov 12, 2013
snyper wrote:
<quoted text>
Don't get blind-sided like in 2008. And THAT was in CALI, fergossakes!
Not blind-sided at all......just stating a mere opinion!

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#214 Nov 12, 2013
NorCal Native wrote:
<quoted text>
Not blind-sided at all......just stating a mere opinion!
Well, I want some mere.

“THE JOURNEY OF A 1000 MILES”

Since: Aug 08

BEGINS WITH JUST ONE STEP:-)

#215 Nov 12, 2013
snyper wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, I want some mere.
Okay......lol!!!
District 1

Kailua Kona, HI

#216 Nov 12, 2013
NorCal Native wrote:
<quoted text>
NOT a Theocracy.......plain and simple!!!
Indeed, but who will vote more, the angered or the complacent?
Obama's shine has tarnished, and the Bi-Partisan Bickerer mantle belongs to Democrats as much as Republicans.
Partisanship as you so clearly display is the real enemy.
Good job.
District 1

Kailua Kona, HI

#217 Nov 12, 2013
WeTheSheeple wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually if you look at any of the other states with marriage equality, we HAVE taken our wins very graciously- aside from some bragging on anonymous sites like Topix.
Indeed.
District 1

Kailua Kona, HI

#218 Nov 12, 2013
snyper wrote:
<quoted text>
Cut the Reification Fallacy.
And now a word from our sponsors ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =EBnk2aKsIQAXX&feature=rel ated
A "Fallacy fallacy?"
Would that be a truth?
BTW a picture maybe worth a thousand words and a video maybe worth a thousand pictures, but YouTube is not a reliable source fer learnin' faktualities.

“THE JOURNEY OF A 1000 MILES”

Since: Aug 08

BEGINS WITH JUST ONE STEP:-)

#219 Nov 12, 2013
District 1 wrote:
<quoted text>Indeed, but who will vote more, the angered or the complacent?
Obama's shine has tarnished, and the Bi-Partisan Bickerer mantle belongs to Democrats as much as Republicans.
Partisanship as you so clearly display is the real enemy.
Good job.
I guess we will have to wait and see as the tarnish is off of the Tea Baggers and the GOP have NO one of real interest to look at!!!

“VOTE GOP 2016 ”

Since: Mar 09

MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN!!

#220 Nov 12, 2013
Same sex marriage & Obama Care = GOP controlled Congress and WH

“THE JOURNEY OF A 1000 MILES”

Since: Aug 08

BEGINS WITH JUST ONE STEP:-)

#221 Nov 12, 2013
American_Infidel wrote:
Same sex marriage & Obama Care = GOP controlled Congress and WH
Sorry, but you're having a NIGHTMARE.......lol!!!

My guess is that Hillary will win the White House in 2016 and the Senate will probably remain in Control of the Democrats and the House just might remain under Republican control, but if it does......then all it proves is that people can be lemmings especially after all the garbage the Republicans have dished out and holding our Country hostage for 16 days just because they didn't get their way regarding the Affordable Health Care Act.

Anyways, will you rant some more if your predication is wrong?

“VOTE GOP 2016 ”

Since: Mar 09

MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN!!

#222 Nov 12, 2013
NorCal Native wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry, but you're having a NIGHTMARE.......lol!!!
My guess is that Hillary will win the White House in 2016 and the Senate will probably remain in Control of the Democrats and the House just might remain under Republican control, but if it does......then all it proves is that people can be lemmings especially after all the garbage the Republicans have dished out and holding our Country hostage for 16 days just because they didn't get their way regarding the Affordable Health Care Act.
Anyways, will you rant some more if your predication is wrong?
Nope, after ObamaCare and "legalization" of same sex marriage in corrupt liberal states.....it'll be a loooong time before you Democrats win anything. Hopefully this will cause the implosion of your party.

Oh yeah......

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