Liberty Counsel Threatens to Sue if C...

Liberty Counsel Threatens to Sue if California's Governor Brown Signs Ban on 'Ex-gay' Therapy

There are 80 comments on the Fire Dog Lake story from Sep 3, 2012, titled Liberty Counsel Threatens to Sue if California's Governor Brown Signs Ban on 'Ex-gay' Therapy. In it, Fire Dog Lake reports that:

Mat Staver and these charlatans are only looking for attention. I can't fathom that they want to take on the merits of conversion/reparative therapy - long discredited - to "pray away the gay" to court.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Fire Dog Lake.

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Mona Lott

Brooklyn, NY

#68 Sep 7, 2012
NoQ wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry to disappoint you Queer Mona, but I have all the education I need. That's Right Bitc,h.
Except education of self, OBVIOUSLY.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#69 Sep 7, 2012
Mona Lott wrote:
<quoted text>Except education of self, OBVIOUSLY.
I would have said "regarding", but yours works, too.

“Even an Ice Princess can melt.”

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#71 Sep 7, 2012
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
So teaching them that breeding and having babies is excessively is important does not bother you, but teaching them that some people are unique does.
I have no views on breeding and as far as teaching of idividuality. Im all for it. Its just not our place to do it to someone ELSES child.

“Even an Ice Princess can melt.”

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#72 Sep 7, 2012
snyper wrote:
<quoted text>
How hard is it to understand, "Sometimes a boy is born into a girl's body. Sometimes the other way, too. We didn't used to understand these things, and sometimes some people were very mean to them. Some still are because they don't want to understand, and sometimes mean people are afraid of people who are different and get angry. But WE want to understand all kinds of people, and be nice when we meet them, and be friends, don't we?"
There. How hard was that? A preschooler can grasp that language.
Would you be ok with someone forcing your child to learn about christianity?

Thats how I see my forcing someones child to learn about transexuality.

Its kind of I wouldnt want it done to me so why would I do it to someone else.
Mona Lott

Brooklyn, NY

#73 Sep 7, 2012
Roisia wrote:
<quoted text>
Would you be ok with someone forcing your child to learn about christianity?
Thats how I see my forcing someones child to learn about transexuality.
Its kind of I wouldnt want it done to me so why would I do it to someone else.
Honey, it never hurts to teach a child about reality, and christianity has NOTHING to do with reality.

And comparing religion, a CHOICE, to sexual orientation, NOT a choice is really, really stupid.

“Post-religious”

Since: Apr 08

Location hidden

#74 Sep 7, 2012
Roisia wrote:
<quoted text>
Would you be ok with someone forcing your child to learn about christianity?
Thats how I see my forcing someones child to learn about transexuality.
Its kind of I wouldnt want it done to me so why would I do it to someone else.
Guess what? If you live in California, public school children have to learn about christianity, as well as other religions. It's in the California History Social Science Standards.

I teach 11th grade US History, and an entire standard (out of 11 for that grade level) is devoted to the topic of religion in US history.

Can't get away from it... kids have to learn about christianity. And this atheist is fine with teaching it.

http://www.cde.ca.gov/be/st/ss/documents/hist...

“Post-religious”

Since: Apr 08

Location hidden

#75 Sep 7, 2012
Mona Lott wrote:
<quoted text>
Honey, it never hurts to teach a child about reality, and christianity has NOTHING to do with reality....
The existence of christianity is real. I have no problem teaching kids that.

I don't have to teach them that the core theistic beliefs of christianity are true, since there is no evidence that they are.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#76 Sep 8, 2012
Roisia wrote:
<quoted text>
Would you be ok with someone forcing your child to learn about christianity?
Thats how I see my forcing someones child to learn about transexuality.
Its kind of I wouldnt want it done to me so why would I do it to someone else.
They WILL encounter transsexuals. It's best that when they do, they don't think it's ok to be mean to them. No?

A close reread of my suggested PARENTAL response to any such subject is truly fine. It focuses upon what children can understand and value, and upon what is essential to good Citizenship, civility and politeness.

Kids know what meanness, fear and anger are. They know what it feels like to not understand, and how it feels to make mistakes. They also know what sameness and difference are, and usually like both unless someone teaches them not to. Kids also understand social values and have an innate sense of fairness.

Have you ever read "All I Really Need to Know I Learned in Kindergarten" by the Rev. Robert Fulghum ?

(and now for the required YouTube)

Mona Lott

Hoboken, NJ

#77 Sep 8, 2012
Jerald wrote:
<quoted text>
The existence of christianity is real. I have no problem teaching kids that.
I don't have to teach them that the core theistic beliefs of christianity are true, since there is no evidence that they are.
Public school is NOT the place to teach religion.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#79 Sep 9, 2012
Roisia wrote:
<quoted text>
Would you be ok with someone forcing your child to learn about christianity?
Thats how I see my forcing someones child to learn about transexuality.
Its kind of I wouldnt want it done to me so why would I do it to someone else.
Kids will be exposed to it, would you rather they learn about it from an uneducated hick with nothing but stereotypes and mythology?

I'm an atheist, and I want christianity taught in schools "as is," and I am fine with this, also teach it along with Judaism, Egyptian, Greece, and all other religions.

If you don't teach kids reality, they'll make up a religion to fill in the blanks.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#80 Sep 9, 2012
Mona Lott wrote:
<quoted text>
Public school is NOT the place to teach religion.
Actually it is, if taught "as is" with no preaching. Preaching ignores the "dark" parts, that's why most christians have no idea what the bible says. A well rounded world understanding is what helps students, protecting them from parts just because some parents might disagree only sets them up to become failures.
TheTroll Stopper

Christiansburg, VA

#81 Sep 9, 2012
Liberty Counsel? Isn't that the legal organization that's now facing a RICO suit for having enabled the kidnapping of a Vermont lesbian's child? Guess ol' Matt Staver had do all the suing he still can before that RICO suit ends up getting him disbarred and his law school stripped of its accreditation, no?
Mona Lott

Hoboken, NJ

#82 Sep 9, 2012
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually it is, if taught "as is" with no preaching. Preaching ignores the "dark" parts, that's why most christians have no idea what the bible says. A well rounded world understanding is what helps students, protecting them from parts just because some parents might disagree only sets them up to become failures.
Very few children will be able to approach comparative religion studies with an open mind. Most have been indoctrinated since birth.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#83 Sep 9, 2012
Mona Lott wrote:
<quoted text>
Very few children will be able to approach comparative religion studies with an open mind. Most have been indoctrinated since birth.
Yes, but sometimes you just throw a lot of noodles at the wall and hope some of them stick, and some of them will. If you throw information about the world at a child they will absorb it, and most children love to learn if given the correct method of teaching. Education is not for those who know already, and teaching a balance of religious studies is for those who are not getting enough information from their parents.

“Even an Ice Princess can melt.”

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#84 Sep 9, 2012
Jerald wrote:
<quoted text>
Guess what? If you live in California, public school children have to learn about christianity, as well as other religions. It's in the California History Social Science Standards.
I teach 11th grade US History, and an entire standard (out of 11 for that grade level) is devoted to the topic of religion in US history.
Can't get away from it... kids have to learn about christianity. And this atheist is fine with teaching it.
http://www.cde.ca.gov/be/st/ss/documents/hist...
I grew up in California. We learned about all religions. All im saying is we should be better than those who would oppress us.

“Even an Ice Princess can melt.”

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#85 Sep 9, 2012
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
Kids will be exposed to it, would you rather they learn about it from an uneducated hick with nothing but stereotypes and mythology?
I'm an atheist, and I want christianity taught in schools "as is," and I am fine with this, also teach it along with Judaism, Egyptian, Greece, and all other religions.
If you don't teach kids reality, they'll make up a religion to fill in the blanks.
What I would prefer and what I think is the right thing isn't always the same thing. Sometimes the right decision is the hard one. In this case dealing with the hatred of others. In order not to do to them what they do to us.

“Even an Ice Princess can melt.”

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#86 Sep 9, 2012
snyper wrote:
<quoted text>
They WILL encounter transsexuals. It's best that when they do, they don't think it's ok to be mean to them. No?
A close reread of my suggested PARENTAL response to any such subject is truly fine. It focuses upon what children can understand and value, and upon what is essential to good Citizenship, civility and politeness.
Kids know what meanness, fear and anger are. They know what it feels like to not understand, and how it feels to make mistakes. They also know what sameness and difference are, and usually like both unless someone teaches them not to. Kids also understand social values and have an innate sense of fairness.
Have you ever read "All I Really Need to Know I Learned in Kindergarten" by the Rev. Robert Fulghum ?
(and now for the required YouTube)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =_neYusreXzEXX
Ok if you feel its ok to press our beliefs on others who am I to disagree. I wont do it. but go right ahead.
If we force this upon the children of others then we are no better then those who would do it to us

“Even an Ice Princess can melt.”

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#87 Sep 9, 2012
Well it seems what I feel is wrong. I wish the best of luck to all of you. However even if my beliefs are wrong I cant change them. They are part of me.
Mona Lott

Hoboken, NJ

#88 Sep 9, 2012
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, but sometimes you just throw a lot of noodles at the wall and hope some of them stick, and some of them will. If you throw information about the world at a child they will absorb it, and most children love to learn if given the correct method of teaching. Education is not for those who know already, and teaching a balance of religious studies is for those who are not getting enough information from their parents.
Perhaps. I believe comparative religion is a subject best tackled at university. Young children are too dependent on their parents to be objective.

Since: Mar 11

Location hidden

#89 Sep 9, 2012
fr snyper:

>They WILL encounter transsexuals. It's best that when they do, they don't think it's ok to be mean to them. No?
A close reread of my suggested PARENTAL response to any such subject is truly fine. It focuses upon what children can understand and value, and upon what is essential to good Citizenship, civility and politeness.
Kids know what meanness, fear and anger are. They know what it feels like to not understand, and how it feels to make mistakes. They also know what sameness and difference are, and usually like both unless someone teaches them not to. Kids also understand social values and have an innate sense of fairness.
Have you ever read "All I Really Need to Know I Learned in Kindergarten" by the Rev. Robert Fulghum ?...<

Yep, read it and loved it! GREAT book!

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