Scotland, England disunited -- 300 years on

Full story: CNN

With barely the raising of a glass, Scotland is preparing to mark 300 years since accepting the Treaty of Union with England -- which bound two countries together and gave the world Great Britain.

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monsterman34

Canada

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#1
Jan 13, 2007
 

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This treaty can and will be undone and at the moment there is a wellspring of Scottish nationalism," said Murray Ritchie, former political editor of The Herald newspaper and convener of the Scottish Independence Convention. "What we need is a referendum to settle the issue of independence."

many countries have went out on their own. soviet union, czechslovakia, baltic countries, why not scotland on their own. I think its great scotland want to be their own country. There has been even talk of california leaving and also alaska from the usa. they just want to live their own lives.
Trevor Swistchew

Teddington, UK

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#3
Apr 16, 2010
 

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monsterman34 wrote:
This treaty can and will be undone and at the moment there is a wellspring of Scottish nationalism," said Murray Ritchie, former political editor of The Herald newspaper and convener of the Scottish Independence Convention. "What we need is a referendum to settle the issue of independence."
many countries have went out on their own. soviet union, czechslovakia, baltic countries, why not scotland on their own. I think its great scotland want to be their own country. There has been even talk of california leaving and also alaska from the usa. they just want to live their own lives.
Let freedom awake in the folk
Trevor Chewtwists

Brecon, UK

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#4
Apr 16, 2010
 

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Trevor Swistchew wrote:
<quoted text>Let freedom awake in the folk
when they awake in a police cell the next morning.
pommy bastard

Perth, Australia

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#5
Apr 17, 2010
 

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If scotland wishes to save itself from englands fantastic multicultarism they better hurry up and leave.
weirworn

UK

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#6
May 2, 2010
 

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It would be interesting to see where the money would come from to pay for everything they enjoy today.

I just wish this bunch of cretins running this country would stop paying countries that took independence from the Commonwealth.

“Dimitri at the races in Russia”

Since: Jan 10

Loved everywhere

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#7
May 2, 2010
 

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We hear, them Scots want to dance alone, without any limeys looking under their kilts.
We have got to get away, the place is full of smoked chaps, they said.

Since: Apr 10

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#8
May 2, 2010
 

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Then again, the kilt they wear today was designed by an Englishman.(Rawlinson from Newcastle).

Whisky from Ireland and Bagpipes from India.

“Dimitri at the races in Russia”

Since: Jan 10

Loved everywhere

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#9
May 2, 2010
 

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oh boy, do those Scots have anything left ?
is there any reason to separate then ?

Since: Apr 10

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#10
May 2, 2010
 

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The problem for the Scots are that the stuff they had, they gave away. If only they knew how to get a license on things years ago,

Tarmacadam, penicillin, kilts. Although designed by Rawlinson,(it was done for his iron foundry people in Glen Etive to save them from stripping off naked as they had to with the great kilt)
Tartan, Steam engines to name but a few. Forget the television as that system of Logie Baird's was never used to that extent.

The oil was explored by the English.

I don't think it would be worth while splitting the UK up. Would the taxes collected cover everything? It would be great for Scotland if it did, but would it, or would they lose too much? It would be no use putting a tax on visitors. They would simply go elsewhere.

“Fly low, fly fast.”

Since: Apr 07

East Midlands, UK

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#11
May 3, 2010
 

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It would save Englands tax payers a lot of money.
I say go for it Scotland, oh and take the Welsh with you too.
Hoots awa the noo

Brecon, UK

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#12
May 3, 2010
 

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weirworn wrote:
The problem for the Scots are that the stuff they had, they gave away. If only they knew how to get a license on things years ago,
Tarmacadam, penicillin, kilts. Although designed by Rawlinson,(it was done for his iron foundry people in Glen Etive to save them from stripping off naked as they had to with the great kilt)
Tartan, Steam engines to name but a few. Forget the television as that system of Logie Baird's was never used to that extent.
The oil was explored by the English.
I don't think it would be worth while splitting the UK up. Would the taxes collected cover everything? It would be great for Scotland if it did, but would it, or would they lose too much? It would be no use putting a tax on visitors. They would simply go elsewhere.
steam engines? I suppose Trevithick was a Jock? the modern tartans , kilts, tammies etc were invented by the Prince Regent, his tailor, the writer Sir Walter Scott, and some other Edinburgh tailors. In 1820 you could have any tartan you wanted done to your design.

Since: Apr 10

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#13
May 3, 2010
 

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James Watt. He invented the stationary steam engine. On wheels it becomes a steam locomotive. Trevithick was Cornish. It was him that put Watts invention onto wheels, the first being a bus that was too clumsy for the road.

The Prince Regent turned up wearing flesh coloured tights under his kilt for a show. Okay, it may have been him that advertised the small kilt, but he had nothing to do with the design of it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Rawlinson .
Sir Walter Scott (Scottish)was the inspiration for the tartan. Edinburgh (Scotland). What people do not realise is that kilts of many colours could be seen in one family. It all depended on the plants growing at the time when they dyed the cloth. Only modern dyes got round that.

But going back to the argument, I don't think it would be economically viable for Scotland oor Wales to stand alone. The cost of road repairs, railways, health treatment and other bits, the toatal cost of their parliament as well would be too costly for the ammount of taxes coming in to cover everything. No, before the people who want to split up the UK keep rambling on then they should think carefully. It is a shame that we never had it before, then we would not be suffering the Blair and Brown dynasties.

And yes, I am annoyed that we pay taxes to allow others to have free education, health care, and feee nursing care for the old whereas all the parties will not let us have it in England. I find this Labour party very racist and Brown is the bigotted person (agaisnt the English). And where do the Tories think I am getting 8000 from for their scheme? I would have to sell my house for that. I should have been less prudent and squandered all my money like a lot of people I know have.
William McIntosh

Australia

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#14
May 8, 2010
 

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I must confess I have never understood 'Scottish Nationalism', it makes no sense. Why people believe a bunch of scottish corrupt morons (politicians) are better than the ones found in Westminster, evades me. Having served in the British military, I can tell you one thing, Britain is at its best when it is united. The fact is what we need in Britain is less politicians and more democracy. I would love to live in a Britain where real democracy existed, i.e. the people directly vote on all issues. Surely in the 21st century, an island like Britain, with a highly literate population and an advanced infrastructure could devise a system of direct voting. I believe that an ordinary person living in either Edinburgh, London or Cardiff have basically the same desires for freedom and control over their lives as all freedom loving people do,. There is more to unite us than divide us.
EdSed

Southport, UK

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#15
May 8, 2010
 

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I agree. And there are so many families that are both Scottish and English. Its not that it wouldn't work. It is that there is more to lose than to gain.

One problem is that the SNP policies make more sense than the Labour ones, Scotland is better off with devolution in my view. We still need to fix Westminster policies, but as an "independent country" we would have less influence there instead of being statistically over-represented.

Independence is a relative term anyway. We can never be entirely independent of Europe, even if we left the EU, let alone of the rest of Britain. Independence is only a matter of degree. Even if Scotland were to prosper far more than England, the English would simply come and over-populate Scotland, presumably. Or do we put up border controls on the Eng-Scot border and count people crossing those too? And could that stop immigration? Even if Scotland did "gain independence", I think most Brits would start working for another union because it makes so much sense. The question will never go away, or have a final solution.

Globalisation is one phenomenon and European integration is another. Nations serve a practical purpose and are a historical inheritance, not an ideal.

Lets face it, we're stuck with each other!:-) Personally, I welcome that and am not nationalistic. Nationalism is not a force for good. In fact, I would happily abolish England, Scotland and Wales as political nations altogether. I think they are better thought of as regions.

We all share an island. We should share it together, not separately. Look to a modern united future, not nationalistic divisiveness.
Pro Ukraine UG

Emsworth, UK

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#16
May 10, 2010
 

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Pesky army wrote:
We hear, them Scots want to dance alone, without any limeys looking under their kilts.
We have got to get away, the place is full of smoked chaps, they said.
Pissy what are you doing on here?, the people on the Ukraine forum are really missing all your stories about your cows and goats.
Pro Ukraine UG

Emsworth, UK

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#17
May 10, 2010
 

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I say give Scotland their independance if they want it, I certainly wouldn't shed ant tears if they got it. Their culture is different, they have there own parliament, laws and holidays and most of then are always slagging the English off, I can't understand why they want to be ruled from London.

“Fly low, fly fast.”

Since: Apr 07

East Midlands, UK

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#18
May 10, 2010
 

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Pro Ukraine UG wrote:
I say give Scotland their independance if they want it, I certainly wouldn't shed ant tears if they got it. Their culture is different, they have there own parliament, laws and holidays and most of then are always slagging the English off, I can't understand why they want to be ruled from London.
Agreed, but the Scots (and I am proud of my Scottish heritage BTW) will lose out on English money.
witchwood

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#19
Jun 5, 2010
 

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Ignorance and Fantasism to you lot. I would give up my life for Scottish independence and if england were not bothered then why are they so bloody worried and pettied about our independence. We as a nation send more to your country than youd ever know, thats why we are such a huge asset and Alex Salmond is a man of truth and one the Westminster establishment are afraid of. I for one would rather be stuck to a cows arse, and splattered out as fart than be part of a corrupt Saxon nation and call myself british. A more bloodstained flag in the world we could never find, or is the union of jackasses flag not nicknamed the Butchers apron... I can pride myself on many things and one of thems definately not being british. Im Scottish with Irish parents by the way whose grandparents were forcibly bribed to change their religion in order to survive and to anglicanise their surname.. Beware england everything turns around and your downfall is nigh... Slainte x
witchwood

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#20
Jun 5, 2010
 

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We have our forestry our fishing our tourism our oil not to mention the many english people who in late have come up here to purchase land and homes and feel very happy here, some even joining th Scottish National Party and may I add even seed of the gael, of whom they will know who I mean. So dont act as a nation of hypocrites and remember we in your history were a threat to you, mainly the highlanders and the Irish... whom named our country incidentally and you tried to change our way of life to yours, change our language, our way of highland dress, our religion,our way of life. Today it would be Ethnic cleansing... Sorry it didnt take us all,We survive and the seed is much stronger than you would comprehend
Trevor Swistchew

Chessington, UK

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#21
Jun 10, 2010
 

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Independence will happen.No matter who says no for it is the way that Scotland will go only because it must.The Union has failed to equalise the nation.Scotland awaken.it is your nation.

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