Decision On House Bill 3393 On Tulsa Union School Board's Agenda

The Tulsa Union School board will consider whether to ignore a state law at their meeting on Monday evening concerning scholarships for special needs students. Full Story
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WMCOL

Tulsa, OK

#1 Oct 11, 2010
Why not just obey the law. There is nothing immoral about the law, and we don't get to pick and choose the laws we obey. Jenks and Union are setting bad examples for the children. There are legal ways to deal with laws with which we disagree.

Since: Nov 08

Location hidden

#2 Oct 11, 2010
WMCOL wrote:
Why not just obey the law. There is nothing immoral about the law, and we don't get to pick and choose the laws we obey. Jenks and Union are setting bad examples for the children. There are legal ways to deal with laws with which we disagree.
Exactly, this is not about obeying the law, but it would be nice if the school set the example for the students, but it is about dollars not the students. The big question, is the union some how involved to try to push back a foothold for vouchers?
BeP

Broken Arrow, OK

#3 Oct 11, 2010
It's not about setting an example it's about disregarding an order that's unconstitutional. Districts would be in violation of other constitutionally sound laws governing education and funding that currently exist if they started cutting checks to pay for kids to go to private schools.

BA has already fired the first salvo last week when Dr. Mendenhall said no we won't obey this law.
soonergeezer

Bixby, OK

#4 Oct 11, 2010
The State should withhold funding to any district that refuses to comply with state law. If you don't like a law get it changed but NO ONE has the right to ignore the law with out consiquences.
andy

Broken Arrow, OK

#5 Oct 11, 2010
More evidence of what happens when government gets to much power.
top hat

Sand Springs, OK

#6 Oct 11, 2010
then im not going to do the speed limit in this state .or im not going to pay my toll fee on the turnpike . and the list goes on the law is the law and no one is above it no one . NO ONE . have a nice day .
top hat

Sand Springs, OK

#7 Oct 11, 2010
oh one more thing MOVE TO ANOTHER STATE .
bean counter

Tulsa, OK

#8 Oct 11, 2010
This is all about money. The public schools don't want to compete for dollars. Yes they lose money, but they don't have to fund the special education for those students. I venture that the parents will pay more than the state funding to attend a private school. I agree with others, set an example of good citizenship by abiding by the law and if you don't like the law work to get it changed by legal means. We have a system for change, use it.
Jackson Brown

Tulsa, OK

#9 Oct 11, 2010
So it's a state law, but the school boards are deciding if they are going to obey it. Isn't that called anarchy? Here in the land that is supposed to be under rule of law, a group picking and choosing which laws it wants to adhere to is a dangerous slippery slope. If they want the law changed, they need to do it constitutionally. They are setting a VERY bad example for their students.

Since: Nov 08

Location hidden

#10 Oct 11, 2010
BeP wrote:
It's not about setting an example it's about disregarding an order that's unconstitutional. Districts would be in violation of other constitutionally sound laws governing education and funding that currently exist if they started cutting checks to pay for kids to go to private schools.
BA has already fired the first salvo last week when Dr. Mendenhall said no we won't obey this law.
Can you cite the laws and where they are on the books that will back up your comment?
hmmm

Tulsa, OK

#11 Oct 11, 2010
Le Jimbo - State of OK Constitution banning public funds to a private institution as well as public education money going to religious schools; IDEA, a federal law covering the education of special needs students and last, but certainly not least - the Supremacy Clause of the US Constitution which basically says that Federal laws pre-empt state laws. But as our legislature has put on a state question allowing us to opt out of Obamacare, they obviously aren't that familier with the Supremacy Clause.
pzzed

Wichita, KS

#12 Oct 11, 2010
NO JUDGE has ruled this law unconstitutial. This is the opinion of a small amount (7-11 on board) of people who feel that they know better than the over 100 elected officials who voted for this bill. Local Schools boards are put in place to be an extension of the STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION which implemented the law. The schools boards are overstepping their authority and duty and need to get over the fact that they are pissed off about releasing control to the parents and taxpayers....oh the horror.
Dave

Jenks, OK

#13 Oct 11, 2010
Cool, so does that mean we can ignore 744 if it passes???

Since: Feb 10

Jenks, OK

#14 Oct 11, 2010
Yeah for Jenks,Union,and Broken Arrow for standing up for what is right!!!!! I believe ALL kids are important, not just "special needs" kids!!!
cml

Purcell, OK

#15 Oct 11, 2010
My grandchild is a special needs child. In spite of excellent teachers (at a Union elementary), he is struggling very badly, He could benefit from a school structured for kids with his limitations.
I believe the school districts get a great deal of money for "special needs kids" with an IEP. The districts don't want to lose the funding.
But, children like my grandchild may need more than the school can offer.
My hope is that he will grow up to be a contibuting member of society.
I hope the objections the school boards have are about the children, Unfortunatley I really don't believe that to be true.
Pockets

Owasso, OK

#16 Oct 11, 2010
What is wrong with going through the normal legal channels to stop this law if it is unconstitutional?

Why simply just decide to ignore it instead? Do they not have means to challenge it?
Amazing

Broken Arrow, OK

#17 Oct 11, 2010
Anyone who actually thought their child's school would PAY for their kid to go to a private school is a little dense. No wonder their kid is in "special classes". The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
psst

Tulsa, OK

#18 Oct 11, 2010
Schools get money for MY special needs child....This law allowed the money to follow the child. They only got the money when my kid enrolled and guess what they loose it when my kid leaves....what is so hard to undertand about that. They do not own the dollars that come with each child. In addition, they have no authority to DEFY a STATE LAW...I hope everyone is ready for the lawsuits that follow and the amount of money the districts are going to be loosing when they have to pay the legal expenses of all these special needs kids. This simply is insane....
School Laws of Oklahoma

Broken Arrow, OK

#19 Oct 11, 2010
Section 924. Use of Public Money or Property for Religious Purposes Prohibited.
No public money or property shall ever be appropriated, applied, donated, or used, directly or indirectly, for the use, benefit, or support of any sect, church, denomination, or system of religion, or for the use, benefit, or support of any priest, preacher, minister, or other religious teacher or dignitary, or sectarian institution as such.(Art. 2, 5, Okla. Const.)
State Board of Vocational and Technical Education cannot contract with private sectarian educational institution for such institution to offer a vocational training program. January 28, 1981 (AG Op. No. 80-196)
Special personnel and instructors and books and equipment paid for or purchased with public funds cannot be furnished students in private or parochial schools unless such students are enrolled in the public schools. AG Op. September 16, 1965
Transportation in a school district program approved under Title 1 of the Elementary and Secondary Education Act of 1965 cannot be used by pupils enrolled in private or parochial schools. AG Op. September 16, 1965
School personnel cannot be paid with public funds and furnished to parochial schools. AG Op. September 16, 1965
Use of public school buses for transporting parochial school pupils was forbidden under Constitution which prohibits use of pubic money or property for sectarian purposes. Transportation could not be justified on theory of public welfare. Board of Education for ISD No. 52 v. Antone, 384 P.2d 911 (Okla. 1963)
MinnieMouse

Broken Arrow, OK

#20 Oct 12, 2010
This makes me sick! I have a child who is disabled but get's NOTHING because I made something of myself and I by God pay for it ALL. She doesn't deserve to be rejected from anything because I am not sponging off the government NORTH Tulsa. Yeah all you low wearing pants with your cool limp cause let me guess you got shot for being in the wrong GANG! This state makes me SICK. I pay taxes and work hard to make sure she is provided for because by gosh even though she is DISABLED from birth she gets NOTHING from my tax paid dollars! Givew help and benedfitas to people who deserve it not USE it for personal gain!!!!!!!!!! Oh how I wish I had bever mover here!

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