Dial M for Mazatlan: the magic of Mexico

There are 10 comments on the The Tribune story from Apr 16, 2012, titled Dial M for Mazatlan: the magic of Mexico. In it, The Tribune reports that:

But when you're young enough, that first encounter with our southern neighbor's warmth and charm - the smell of roasting corn drifting from the sidewalk vendor's grill, the red and pink flowers drooping over adobe walls, vegetables piled high on tarps laid over the ground and women in multi-colored shawls carrying jars on their heads - changed my ... (more)

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colima47

Hubbard, OR

#1 Apr 16, 2012
This story is really a fairy tale. Last year we drove south from Washington state and because of construction we were detoured on a dirt road to the backside of Mazatlan. What a sight! I have not often seen such poverty and depravity. One needs to look much further than the tourist district to get a full impact of Mexico.

And it is nonsensical to think that the violence in Mexico would go away if Americans would stop buying drugs. The non-drug related murder rate in Mexico is three times that of the USA which also has a very high homicide rate in relation to western Europe or Japan. Eight taxi drivers were recently killed in Monterrey, Mexico. This had nothing to do with the drug trade, but with extortion.
Concerned

Mexico

#2 Apr 16, 2012
colima47 wrote:
This story is really a fairy tale. Last year we drove south from Washington state and because of construction we were detoured on a dirt road to the backside of Mazatlan. What a sight! I have not often seen such poverty and depravity. One needs to look much further than the tourist district to get a full impact of Mexico.
And it is nonsensical to think that the violence in Mexico would go away if Americans would stop buying drugs. The non-drug related murder rate in Mexico is three times that of the USA which also has a very high homicide rate in relation to western Europe or Japan. Eight taxi drivers were recently killed in Monterrey, Mexico. This had nothing to do with the drug trade, but with extortion.
I agree with you. Extortion and kidnapping are epidemic here and will rise if the biggest source of their income disappears. They steal Pemex oil trucks and sell the fuel. They break into the pipelines and steal oil.

Human smuggling of immigrants and sex slaves in on the rise.

A new one in the last month is to stop loaded diesel transport trucks, steal the merchandise, kidnap the driver and remove his organs to be sold for medical uses. The drivers body is then is left at times at the families doors minus their organs.

The list goes on and on. You see they are not opposed by the police very much, and many of the police are involved with the criminals. These guys do what ever they want whenever they want and do it in the open.

It is not about drugs. It is about money and greed. IF the drugs are become legal as an instance. Not only do you sell drugs but part of your business is to Kidnap and extort and rob banks. So take away the drug money. How would you replace that money if you were a criminal and did not care how you got it. Just like any business you expand the other parts to make up for it. This is my thinking and many other people here in Mexico.

They have professional think tanks and other Government research groups that say different. But did not the best of these groups predict things to be different in Iraq and Afghanistan and Vietnam. It seems the people at the ground level that are living the experience are the people who seem to have their finger on the pulse as to what might happen.

You must also realize that these economies are run off drug money down here. Take away that money and you have more poor people that will become criminals because there is no more drug money. I have been reading that the poorest people and areas have the highest rate of crime, right. That is true anywhere in the world. Take away 50 billion dollars of income and see what happens down here.

Do not paint the people of the USA as the reason for all this. The drugs are used just as much down here and throughout the world. I would end my own life before I could even possibly think of taking out innocent men, Women and Children. Banks are all over and not every poor person is a bank robber. I guess it is the banks fault they exist and not the fault of the robbers?

“Facts”

Since: May 08

Mexico

#3 Apr 16, 2012
colima47 wrote:
This story is really a fairy tale. Last year we drove south from Washington state and because of construction we were detoured on a dirt road to the backside of Mazatlan. What a sight! I have not often seen such poverty and depravity. One needs to look much further than the tourist district to get a full impact of Mexico.

And it is nonsensical to think that the violence in Mexico would go away if Americans would stop buying drugs. The non-drug related murder rate in Mexico is three times that of the USA which also has a very high homicide rate in relation to western Europe or Japan. Eight taxi drivers were recently killed in Monterrey, Mexico. This had nothing to do with the drug trade, but with extortion.
the non drug related murder rate is half that of the USA

The last non drug related murder here in Vallarta was years ago and we have 500k people here

Show me a city in the USA with 500k people with a crime rate as low as Vallarta
colima47

Salem, OR

#4 Apr 16, 2012
Here Is One wrote:
<quoted text>
the non drug related murder rate is half that of the USA
The last non drug related murder here in Vallarta was years ago and we have 500k people here
Show me a city in the USA with 500k people with a crime rate as low as Vallarta
There are 255 thousand people in Vallarta-56 murders last year-murder rate of 21.96 per 100,000. About the same as some American cities of similar size, less and more for some other cities. The last statistic that I remember for Mexican homicide per annum is 13,000; about the same as the USA. Since the USA has three times as many people, the murder rate in Mexico is three times as high. The Mexican figure does not include drug-related murders whereas the US figure does.

“Facts”

Since: May 08

Tepatitlan, Mexico

#5 Apr 16, 2012
colima47 wrote:
<quoted text>There are 255 thousand people in Vallarta-56 murders last year-murder rate of 21.96 per 100,000. About the same as some American cities of similar size, less and more for some other cities. The last statistic that I remember for Mexican homicide per annum is 13,000; about the same as the USA. Since the USA has three times as many people, the murder rate in Mexico is three times as high. The Mexican figure does not include drug-related murders whereas the US figure does.
wrong as that number does not include people like me living here full time on a fm3
And there are over 200k of us
Concerned

Mexico

#6 Apr 16, 2012
Here Is One wrote:
<quoted text>
the non drug related murder rate is half that of the USA
The last non drug related murder here in Vallarta was years ago and we have 500k people here
Show me a city in the USA with 500k people with a crime rate as low as Vallarta
You mean murder rate, or crime rate?
colima47

Salem, OR

#7 Apr 16, 2012
Here Is One wrote:
<quoted text>
wrong as that number does not include people like me living here full time on a fm3
And there are over 200k of us
You know it's really difficult dealing with people like you. I spent six years in Mexico on an FM3. 200,000 is a small percentage of 300+million and wouldn't change the equation very much. There are many good things about Mexico and I won't argue them, but your facts are not correct.

“Facts”

Since: May 08

Santiago Ixcuintla, Mexico

#8 Apr 16, 2012
Concerned wrote:
<quoted text>You mean murder rate, or crime rate?
both

“Facts”

Since: May 08

Santiago Ixcuintla, Mexico

#9 Apr 16, 2012
colima47 wrote:
<quoted text>You know it's really difficult dealing with people like you. I spent six years in Mexico on an FM3. 200,000 is a small percentage of 300+million and wouldn't change the equation very much. There are many good things about Mexico and I won't argue them, but your facts are not correct.
the census does not count people on a fm3 or fm2 They are not in your figure

According to AMPI there are 200k gringo living in the bay

Plus I was counting from Punta De Mita south to Boca so the number is over 500k
pinchejuan

Fort Worth, TX

#10 Apr 17, 2012
Concerned wrote:
<quoted text>
I agree with you. Extortion and kidnapping are epidemic here and will rise if the biggest source of their income disappears. They steal Pemex oil trucks and sell the fuel. They break into the pipelines and steal oil.
Human smuggling of immigrants and sex slaves in on the rise.
A new one in the last month is to stop loaded diesel transport trucks, steal the merchandise, kidnap the driver and remove his organs to be sold for medical uses. The driv ers body is then is left at times at the families doors min us their organs.
The list goes on and on. You see they are not opposed by the police very much, and many of the police are involved with the criminals. These guys do what ever they want whenever they want and do it in the open.
It is not about drugs. It is about money and greed. IF the drugs are become legal as an instance. Not only do you sell drugs but part of your business is to Kidnap and extort and rob banks. So take away the drug money. How would you replace that money if you were a criminal and did not care how you got it. Just like any business you expa nd the other parts to make up for it. This is my thinking and many other people here in Mexico.
They have professional think tanks and other Government research groups that say different. But did not the best of these groups predict things to be different in Iraq and Afghanistan and Vietnam. It seems the people at the ground level that are living the experience are the people who seem to have their finger on the pulse as to what might happen.
You must also realize that these economies are run off drug money down here. Take away that money and you have more poor people that will become criminals because there is no more drug money. I have been reading that the poorest people and areas have the highest rate of crime, right. That is true anywhere in the world. Take away 50 billion dollars of income and see what happens down here.
Do not paint the people of the USA as the reason for all this. The drugs are used just as much down here and throughout the world. I would end my own life before I could even possibly think of taking out innocent men, Women and Children. Banks are all over and not every poor person is a bank robber. I guess it is the banks fault they exist and not the fault of the robbers?
There are more complexities than you think. All parties know the value of tourism and expat dollars. So when the Zetas started kidnapping innocents, the Somalia cartel organized the MataZetas and left a fresh pile of bodies.
When FDR took office, poverty was rampant. How could the economy take the removal of the bootleggers' bucks? Easy. Tax the legal suppliers. Duh.

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