Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News 574,075
The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ. Full Story

Since: Sep 09

Fraser Lake, Canada

#486591 Oct 30, 2013
The attitude of marriage depended on the culture and the era ... but it was ordained by men and had nothing in common with supposed gods in the sky.
>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>

From the book, Eunuchs for the Kingdom of Heaven … Uta Ranke-Heinemann

How did marriages take place in the old days? Many people did get married in church with the priest to bless them and a wreath and veil for the bride. But for many others things happened something like this: They went for a walk, and he said to her: I love you, you’re my wife, and she said Yes. As far as Roman law was concerned (on which the Church based her own law), they were married (“the will to be married constitutes marriage”). The only witness was the moon, if that. Such marriages were called clandestine, but nobody questioned that they were proper marriages. Starting in 1215 the Church called for publications of the banns, but many did not comply with this.

Since: Sep 09

Fraser Lake, Canada

#486592 Oct 30, 2013
From the book, Eunuchs for the Kingdom of Heaven … Uta Ranke-Heinemann

In 1563 through the decree Tametsi (“Although”) it introduced the so-called formal obligation: Although there was no doubt that secret marriages were valid, from now on a specific form for contracting marriage had to be observed, namely a wedding dress in the presence of one’s own pastor and at least two witnesses—otherwise the marriage is invalid.

Since: Feb 12

Location hidden

#486593 Oct 30, 2013
ReginaM wrote:
<quoted text>
Here we go again with the nonsense. You're fooling yourself if you think what you're saying about me isn't sinful, rose. It would really be good if you people would stop lying about me for a nice change of pace. I did NOT read her post, I had no idea about any of it, nor do I care. I don't read all the posts here, especially hers.
I refuse to argue with you. You do seem to enjoy it, though. Why is beyond me.
Now that we have the truth of the matter out in the open...IVF typically involves fetal selection. That means the killing of human life. Close your eyes to it if it makes you feel better, but your opinions are tragically uninformed.
You knew about my daughters ivf cuz I told you back then..and we all know you love reading nicks and my posts because as soon as I post your name you appeared...I also purposely posted the IVF info so you would reappear...I missed you..

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#486594 Oct 30, 2013
Liam wrote:
<quoted text>
"Bulgarian Orthodox Church slams In vitro fertilization, surrogacy"
'The Holy Synod of Bulgarian Orthodox Church has declared reservations about IVF and surrogacy, viewing them as "human interference that is counter to God's will in the existential foundation of life"
"the much desired parenthood is turning into a goal in itself, that replaces the primary cause of the closeness between a man and woman. At present, over 4,000,000 'redundant' human embryos are awaiting their adaption and birth. Thus, cyro preservation is encouraging the trading with human beings, and such globalized commercialization....."
www.novinite.com/view_news.php...
With you saying this, seems to mean that you object to "God's plan" and what "He" has put into place.

Why? Don't you think "God" knows what "He" is doing?

Who are you to question "God's plan" anyhow?

UNLESSSS......there is no "God's plan" at all, and all of this is just a mental ruse for gullible people.

Your choice.

Self.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#486595 Oct 30, 2013
June VanDerMark wrote:
<quoted text>
Signed by Catholics ONLY.
No signature ... no words to be read in the handwriting of a man named Jesus ... anywhere on earth!
Even the story is silly. A Jew comes to earth, sent by his Jewish father to give a message that Jews won't be saved unless they become of the Christian faith.
It's so silly that only fools would buy the blarney.
And yet you did - except for 4 years ago.

DOH!!

Since: Sep 09

Fraser Lake, Canada

#486596 Oct 30, 2013
[QUOTE who="Seraphima One girl had 4 miscarriages ... the other woman had 3 miscarriage [/QUOTE]

Do you see what I mean about "GOD" murdering the cells of those fetuses in the womb???

How dare he judge women who want to have abortions? He has SOME nerve!!!

Tongue in cheek
ReginaM

Toms River, NJ

#486597 Oct 30, 2013
Hermeneutics Smutics wrote:
<quoted text>
We had our Priest,the sisters Monastery of the Theotokos, and the sisters of the Transfiguration Monastery praying for our grandchild who was an IVF baby. From talking with us they knew this was Christ's child as well, IVF or not.We learned interutero that the child had part of his brain missing. We continued to pray. He is now 2 years old and the therapists and doctors have determined he is an intellectually lifted child. Economia!!!!!! Praise Christ Who surpasses our human intellect and our arrogance declaring what we think He wants.7114
Nick, no one said he isn't Christ's child, neither the Church nor I nor anyone else here. I had no idea he was an ivf baby until just now. Unfortunately, many people are unaware of what the process really entails. He sounds like a little doll and I wish him only the very best life has to offer. May Christ keep him close to His Most Sacred Heart now and forever.
Liam

Saint Paul, MN

#486598 Oct 30, 2013
Hermeneutics Smutics wrote:
I am very much aware that Vatican 2 and afterward softened the idea that procreation is the only purpose of marriage.
In my initial post I was cautious not to say that the Church said procreation was the ONLY purpose.
Nevertheless I present the Church's longstanding teaching on this.
You are spinning out of control. I don't think the Church has ever said that procreation is the ONLY purpose of marriage. There is obviously plenty of work to do after procreation (and before)
And they never 'soffened' their teaching on it either. Every time they make a statement on something, people frantically search for the headline that'll embarrass them or show them contradicting themselves. Remember "the Pope endorses condoms" headlines??

You guys are so hell bent on disagreeing with Catholics while trying to disassociate yourselves with us, that you accept teachings that no Orthodox Bishop would agree with.
Liam

Saint Paul, MN

#486601 Oct 30, 2013
Hermeneutics Smutics wrote:
<quoted text>==========
(Sofia Echo)- The Bulgarian Orthodox Church’s governing body, the Holy Synod, does not oppose in vitro fertilisation – in contrast to a December 2011 statement that it did; the misconception was a result of a clerical error in the initial statement.
This is according to Lovech Metropolitan Gavril who, however, underlined that the statement was correct in saying that the church opposed surrogate motherhood.
The initial statement caused outrage among various groups and the Bulgarian Orthodox Church, already caught up in a series of other recent controversies, came under fire for taking a stance against in vitro in a country in a demographic crisis with a birthrate that has been falling, overall, for several years.
According to statistics quoted in a recent report by Bulgarian-language mass-circulation daily 24 Chassa, in 2011 about 700 babies were born in Bulgaria as a result of in vitro fertilisation. The previous year the number was 688.
The success rate for conception through in vitro in Bulgaria was about 26 to 30 per cent, according to the report.
Gavril said that like the Orthodox Christian churches of Russia and of Greece, Bulgaria’s Holy Synod accepted in vitro fertilisation on condition that the biological material came from legal spouses and the cells were fertilised for implantation so that there was no destruction of eggs.
"Under these conditions, the church accepts in vitro. This is what the Holy Synod said and there is nothing more that I can say," Gavril said.
And Also...
That really sounds like the Bulgarians Holy Synod condemned IVF at one point, then everyone in Bulgaria got ticked off about it, so they retracted. It also sounds like they are ok'ing it, as long as no eggs get destroyed. Now I'm no expert on this by any means, but aren't the destruction of eggs inevitable?

Since: Feb 12

Location hidden

#486602 Oct 30, 2013
Liam wrote:
<quoted text>
You jumped on the bash the Catholic bandwagon this morning about contraception. I thought i would remind you that your position is outside of your own Church's teachings. Its ok to have your own views. Every Catholic has their own opinions too. Its natural.
I did not jump on bash the catholic bandwagon. I stated from the beginning this morning that it was MY opinion only about birth control and not my churches. What I do disagree with is Huskers, and lets not take the focus off her saying that's it ok for catholic priest to swear.Thats what I was disagreeing with HER Not the catholic churches view.MY views on birth control and IVF is my own personal views period Not the Orthodox churches views and I never claimed they were and never will....Again..let me make this perfectly clear to you,I did not bash your church I stood up for it when Huskers was making your church look bad and I told her to choose her words more carefully. I again asked why no other Catholic said anything to her. I guess its ok if a Catholic makes your church look bad but heaven help us if the non Catholics do right?I also said I wasn't going to bash your church again but you guys make it hard to keep that promise for me when you misquote things that I say.

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#486603 Oct 30, 2013
ReginaM wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm sorry but you're not very much aware of anything that has to do with the Catholic Church nor do you have a clue as to what her teachings are either before or after Vatican II. Her teachings are very deep and multi-layered. A document here or there doesn't even begin to scratch the surface, either about marital intimacy or any other subject. All the 'research' in the world does not take the place of actually being in the Church.
Therefore, the Church has never taught that procreation is the only purpose of marital relations.
----------

I find this argument "you have to be in the Catholic Church to say anything true about the church" worthy of Orwell's 1984.I guess noone who is not Catholic can examine your Church? ok

"You have to be in the Catholic Church to say anything true about the church"- Your Post

Here are few more quotes you can use from George Orwell's 1984

“You are a slow learner, Winston."
"How can I help it? How can I help but see what is in front of my eyes? Two and two are four."
"Sometimes, Winston. Sometimes they are five. Sometimes they are three. Sometimes they are all of them at once. You must try harder. It is not easy to become sane.”
&#8213; George Orwell, 1984

“The best books... are those that tell you what you know already.”
&#8213; George Orwell, 1984

“Doublethink means the power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them.”
&#8213; George Orwell, 1984

“Until they became conscious they will never rebel, and until after they have rebelled they cannot become conscious.”
&#8213; George Orwell, 1984

“Big Brother is Watching You.”
&#8213; George Orwell, 1984

“It's a beautiful thing, the destruction of words.”
&#8213; George Orwell, 1984

“Power is in tearing human minds to pieces and putting them together again in new shapes of your own choosing.”
&#8213; George Orwell, 1984
Jumper The Wise

Owensboro, KY

#486604 Oct 30, 2013
June VanDerMark wrote:
<quoted text>
You forgot about all those other hells, where evil-beings are lusting to burn your Christians "soul" for eternity.
I can hardly wait until we enjoy the view from down below. I'll be able to see Jerry Falwell's "soul" preaching at Jehovah how to behave in a Christian manner suited to Jerry's tastes.
Next scene ... Jerry lands in Judaism's fiery pit of Gehenhna.
:)
Can't be no worse than this 'Coco offee' I mixed up to save money.
You ever experiment with food when your low on cash?

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#486605 Oct 30, 2013
Liam wrote:
<quoted text>
You are spinning out of control. I don't think the Church has ever said that procreation is the ONLY purpose of marriage. There is obviously plenty of work to do after procreation (and before)
And they never 'soffened' their teaching on it either. Every time they make a statement on something, people frantically search for the headline that'll embarrass them or show them contradicting themselves. Remember "the Pope endorses condoms" headlines??
You guys are so hell bent on disagreeing with Catholics while trying to disassociate yourselves with us, that you accept teachings that no Orthodox Bishop would agree with.
I did type wrong and meant to say a main purpose rather than the only purpose. I am not wrong about the history. You can read it yourself and so can everyone else.he history was placing most of the spotlight on procreation. And V2 and after it was softened. The reason it was softened was that the good Catholics who cared about their church spoke up.
ReginaM

Toms River, NJ

#486606 Oct 30, 2013
Liam wrote:
<quoted text>
You are spinning out of control. I don't think the Church has ever said that procreation is the ONLY purpose of marriage. There is obviously plenty of work to do after procreation (and before)
And they never 'soffened' their teaching on it either. Every time they make a statement on something, people frantically search for the headline that'll embarrass them or show them contradicting themselves. Remember "the Pope endorses condoms" headlines??
You guys are so hell bent on disagreeing with Catholics while trying to disassociate yourselves with us, that you accept teachings that no Orthodox Bishop would agree with.
You're absolutely right, Liam. They would sell their souls to the devil first. Faithful Catholics and Orthodox understand the reasoning behind the teaching against contraception, abortion, IVF, etc. Our personal opinions should not take the place of Church teaching. If they do, then we are Catholic (or Orthodox) in name only. I am so sick to death of these people and their game playing, not to mention their personal insults every time a Catholic posts. All this baloney about who knew what before and who posted what after and blah, blah, blaaaaaahhh. They seem to thrive on turmoil. I'm outta here. Can't stand all this drama and lying. Too childish for my blood. Have a good one.

Since: Sep 09

Fraser Lake, Canada

#486607 Oct 30, 2013
Those of you who preach religion as being based on absolute truth have in turn believed the words taught to you by your preferential theologians.

When you preach, you are imitating those theologians.

I suggest that you might be spreading only lies in the name of truth.

You have been warned more than once that the words you preach as truth, might, and probably do, cause harm to others, as did the words preached by the ancient theologians who encouraged others to be bullies and murderers in the name of gods.

It's your choice to keep on with your foolishness ... or to admit that you are not fortune tellers and you do not know what remains to this day as mysteries.

“HAVE A BLESSED ”

Since: Aug 08

New Year

#486608 Oct 30, 2013
ReginaM wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually I have a lot of compassion for women who've had an abortion. Many if not most suffer tremendous psychological and emotional damage, not to mention the physical consequences. I don't know why you equate presenting facts with being judgmental. For some women, that was the only child they were able to conceive. That's but one horror story. Why aren't we sufficiently appalled to bring a stop to this outrage? Why are we more concerned with being politically correct and not hurting people's feelings?
On that we agree ..yet some people never can understand a woman brought to desperation ..And throw,that in heir faces ..

Their babies are with God ..they ate,hurt inside ..no.mater what pro choicest,want to think....it can affect them deeply..some are pro choice even though they regret what they did ..some just won't talk about it ..And it affects their whole life ..depression and worse .

Anyone who.has,never been in desperation this,way .. cannot know,the pain that many feel ..

Overhead stories on those websites ..have a friend whose life is,messed
Up.big time ...She won't even talk about it .to anyone she knows.
FINALLY..getting a really nice Christian counsellor .

Any one who conjectured women as I've seen done brutally ..IMO.has no heart .

I'm really glad you have empathy .

There is a beautiful story ..fiction..called TILLY..a book and ,DVD..
Will bring tears ...

Since: Sep 09

Fraser Lake, Canada

#486609 Oct 30, 2013
Liam wrote:
<quoted text>
You are spinning out of control. I don't think the Church has ever said that procreation is the ONLY purpose of marriage.
Of course the men stated that exact sentiment.

I've posted it again and again ... but:

Those convinced against their will, are of the same opinion still.

Dale Carnegie

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#486610 Oct 30, 2013
ReginaM wrote:
<quoted text>
Nick, no one said he isn't Christ's child, neither the Church nor I nor anyone else here. I had no idea he was an ivf baby until just now. Unfortunately, many people are unaware of what the process really entails. He sounds like a little doll and I wish him only the very best life has to offer. May Christ keep him close to His Most Sacred Heart now and forever.
Thank you truly Regina. I am sure we will continue this time wasting tradition of posting against each other but I do accept your thoughts re our grandchild. Bless you

Since: Feb 12

Location hidden

#486611 Oct 30, 2013
Liam wrote:
<quoted text>
You are spinning out of control. I don't think the Church has ever said that procreation is the ONLY purpose of marriage. There is obviously plenty of work to do after procreation (and before)
And they never 'soffened' their teaching on it either. Every time they make a statement on something, people frantically search for the headline that'll embarrass them or show them contradicting themselves. Remember "the Pope endorses condoms" headlines??
You guys are so hell bent on disagreeing with Catholics while trying to disassociate yourselves with us, that you accept teachings that no Orthodox Bishop would agree with.
Now you have turned this into a catholic/ orthodox thing again...it started out all over HUSKERS POSTING ON THIS FORUM ABOUT ROSES GIVING UP HER SON FOR ADOPTION which she purposely did to attack and humlitate Rose. Then she posted that its ok for catholic priest to swear the BS word in full form and you now divert everything into a catholic/otherdox we believe the same thing and nick and I are the outlaws....I DEFENDED YOUR CHURCH....how disgusting is this. I was not hell bent on disagreeing with catholics..I was hell bent on stopping Husker from continuely making your church look bad from what she was posting.I was trying to be fair honestly....the personality conflicts with some here that will never get along for personal reason but that should not be an excuse to hide behind their church and use it as a shield or weapon. Christ would never have approved of such behavior in the name of his church

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#486612 Oct 30, 2013
Liam wrote:
<quoted text>
That really sounds like the Bulgarians Holy Synod condemned IVF at one point, then everyone in Bulgaria got ticked off about it, so they retracted. It also sounds like they are ok'ing it, as long as no eggs get destroyed. Now I'm no expert on this by any means, but aren't the destruction of eggs inevitable?
Clay. You are an intelligent guy.Why not just say I made a mistake. This will take nothing from of you. I admitted to the last series of posts.

As far as the eggs go my granddaughter is going back for the other 2 eggs. No destruction.

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