Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News 568,669
The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ. Full Story

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442040 May 17, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
But for those who are taking notes....like I said - "This is still a mystery to me," - "I don't know".
I can only reiterate-[Maat]-the practice of truth, justice, and fairness.
With that comes understanding and respect for persons and all that you may know(of).
Regina

Long Branch, NJ

#442041 May 17, 2013
The doctrine of the Trinity is encapsulated in Matthew 28:19, where Jesus instructs the apostles: "Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit."

The parallelism of the Father, the Son, and the Spirit is not unique to Matthew’s Gospel, but appears elsewhere in the New Testament (e.g., 2 Cor. 13:14, Heb. 9:14), as well as in the writings of the earliest Christians, who clearly understood them in the sense that we do today—that the Father, the Son, and the Spirit are three divine persons who are one divine being (God).



The Didache

"After the foregoing instructions, baptize in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, in living [running] water.... If you have neither, pour water three times on the head, in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit" (Didache 7:1 [A.D. 70]).



Ignatius of Antioch

"[T]o the Church at Ephesus in Asia ... chosen through true suffering by the will of the Father in Jesus Christ our God" (Letter to the Ephesians 1 [A.D. 110]).

"For our God, Jesus Christ, was conceived by Mary in accord with God’s plan: of the seed of David, it is true, but also of the Holy Spirit" (ibid., 18:2).
http://www.catholic.com/tracts/the-trinity
Regina

Long Branch, NJ

#442042 May 17, 2013
Justin Martyr

"We will prove that we worship him reasonably; for we have learned that he is the Son of the true God himself, that he holds a second place, and the Spirit of prophecy a third. For this they accuse us of madness, saying that we attribute to a crucified man a place second to the unchangeable and eternal God, the Creator of all things; but they are ignorant of the mystery which lies therein" (First Apology 13:5–6 [A.D. 151]).



Theophilus of Antioch

"It is the attribute of God, of the most high and almighty and of the living God, not only to be everywhere, but also to see and hear all; for he can in no way be contained in a place.... The three days before the luminaries were created are types of the Trinity: God, his Word, and his Wisdom" (To Autolycus 2:15 [A.D. 181]).



Irenaeus

"For the Church, although dispersed throughout the whole world even to the ends of the earth, has received from the apostles and from their disciples the faith in one God, the Father Almighty ... and in one Jesus Christ, the Son of God, who became flesh for our salvation; and in the Holy Spirit" (Against Heresies 1:10:1 [A.D. 189]).



Tertullian

"We do indeed believe that there is only one God, but we believe that under this dispensation, or, as we say, oikonomia, there is also a Son of this one only God, his Word, who proceeded from him and through whom all things were made and without whom nothing was made.... We believe he was sent down by the Father, in accord with his own promise, the Holy Spirit, the Paraclete, the sanctifier of the faith of those who believe in the Father and the Son, and in the Holy Spirit.... This rule of faith has been present since the beginning of the gospel, before even the earlier heretics" (Against Praxeas 2 [A.D. 216]).

"And at the same time the mystery of the oikonomia is safeguarded, for the unity is distributed in a Trinity. Placed in order, the three are the Father, Son, and Spirit. They are three, however, not in condition, but in degree; not in being, but in form; not in power, but in kind; of one being, however, and one condition and one power, because he is one God of whom degrees and forms and kinds are taken into account in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit" (ibid.).

"Keep always in mind the rule of faith which I profess and by which I bear witness that the Father and the Son and the Spirit are inseparable from each other, and then you will understand what is meant by it. Observe now that I say the Father is other [distinct], the Son is other, and the Spirit is other. This statement is wrongly understood by every uneducated or perversely disposed individual, as if it meant diversity and implied by that diversity a separation of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit" (ibid., 9).

"Thus the connection of the Father in the Son, and of the Son in the Paraclete, produces three coherent persons, who are yet distinct one from another. These three are, one essence, not one person, as it is said,‘I and my Father are one’[John 10:30], in respect of unity of being not singularity of number" (ibid., 25).

Religion A Delusion

Titusville, FL

#442043 May 17, 2013
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
<quoted text>
I think we have plenty of documentation of Christ. Not everyone looks at all the sources. Cannot be proven in a court of law? How many witnesses does someone need in a court of law?
God provides the resources required for an inductive argument for his existence. To see if there is persuasive evidence that something exists; one might search for eye witnesses. Such is the case for our search for evidence of God. The Old Testament, New Testament, Book of Mormon, and Doctrine and Covenants contain numerous eye witness accounts of God. In the Old Testament we read that “the Lord spake unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend.”(Exodus 33:11) In the New Testament Stephen said “I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.”(Acts 7:56) In the Book of Mormon, speaking of God, Nephi says “my brother, Jacob, also has seen him as I have seen him.”(2 Nephi 11:3) People have seen God in times past and He appeared to many in ancient times. Evidence that God still exists is found in Doctrine and Covenants. Joseph Smith Junior and Sydney Rigdon wrote in 1832,“And now, after the many testimonies which have been given of him, this is the testimony, last of all, which we give of him: That he lives! For we saw him, even on the right hand of God; and we heard the voice bearing record that he is the Only Begotten of the Father.”(D&C 76:23) It is reasonable to conclude from these witnesses that God has existed in the past and He continues to exist today.
Sixty-six books in the Bible, 15 books in the Book of Mormon, 138 sections in the Doctrine and Covenants, and two books in the Pearl of Great Price individually report and provide evidence that God exists. These witnesses are from different geographic, cultural, and linguistic backgrounds and span from the time of Moses all the way to the present day. All of these witnesses are, in a way, verifiable. Jacob’s vision of God in Genesis (Gen 32:30) is verified by Moses, Moses’ vision is verified by Isaiah, Isaiah’s vision is verified by Stephen and so on until we arrive at the present day where we have modern day witnesses of God; called Apostles, which testify that God did live in ancient times as was spoken of in scripture, and that he currently lives. The witness of so many gives us persuasive, but not convincing evidence, that God does exist.
For persuasive evidence we are left with the Holy Ghost, yet again, another “witness” that God exists, to give us an individual witness.(John 15: 26) To reach beyond the realm of evidence given by witnesses we must keep the commandments of God and follow Him in heart and in action. God tells us to “seek the face of the Lord”(D&C 101:38) and Christ said “If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.”(John 14:23) Once we have been tried and found worthy, we can receive the ultimate proof and evidence that God exists; seeing God. Therefore, the existence of God cannot be proven to the common man in the “look there and see” sense of the word “prove.” However, if we follow the gospel of Jesus Christ we can know for ourselves and receive the proof of His existence. Hence under certain circumstances, an individual can receive empirical knowledge by means of observation that God does exist.
I didn't say we have no evidence. But for a God to come as man for 32 years, you might expect much more. Something like a contemporary account would have been nice.

32 years of god-man and we only have scant evidence of 2 years.

But in his wisdom, God left us with the Holy Spirit and UFOs, which should probably be plenty for me. But it's not.

Don't be upset, because we agree on 95% of the world's religious dogma, it's all baloney. All except yours.
Regina

Long Branch, NJ

#442044 May 17, 2013
Origen

"For we do not hold that which the heretics imagine: that some part of the being of God was converted into the Son, or that the Son was procreated by the Father from non-existent substances, that is, from a being outside himself, so that there was a time when he [the Son] did not exist" (The Fundamental Doctrines 4:4:1 [A.D. 225]).

"No, rejecting every suggestion of corporeality, we hold that the Word and the Wisdom was begotten out of the invisible and incorporeal God, without anything corporal being acted upon ... the expression which we employ, however that there was never a time when he did not exist is to be taken with a certain allowance. For these very words ‘when’ and ‘never’ are terms of temporal significance, while whatever is said of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, is to be understood as transcending all time, all ages" (ibid.).

"For it is the Trinity alone which exceeds every sense in which not only temporal but even eternal may be understood. It is all other things, indeed, which are outside the Trinity, which are to be measured by time and ages" (ibid.).



Hippolytus

"The Word alone of this God is from God himself, wherefore also the Word is God, being the being of God. Now the world was made from nothing, wherefore it is not God" (Refutation of All Heresies 10:29 [A.D. 228]).



Novatian

"For Scripture as much announces Christ as also God, as it announces God himself as man. It has as much described Jesus Christ to be man, as moreover it has also described Christ the Lord to be God. Because it does not set forth him to be the Son of God only, but also the son of man; nor does it only say, the son of man, but it has also been accustomed to speak of him as the Son of God. So that being of both, he is both, lest if he should be one only, he could not be the other. For as nature itself has prescribed that he must be believed to be a man who is of man, so the same nature prescribes also that he must be believed to be God who is of God.... Let them, therefore, who read that Jesus Christ the son of man is man, read also that this same Jesus is called also God and the Son of God" (Treatise on the Trinity 11 [A.D. 235]).

----------

There's more..........

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442045 May 17, 2013
jethro8 wrote:
<quoted text>I have colorectal cancer since 2006,i did the i.v. chemo and it didn't work i developed another small tumor right in the same area as the first one,but it was in a non-vital area,so it was easily removed,did more chemo,again failure, a tumor showed up right next to my kidney,it could not be removed,unless they take my kidney,so i have a stent in my kidney to help it drain out completely,they managed to kill the tumor using radiation treatments,and now i'm on a chemotherapy pill called xeloda, have been on it for about 2 yrs now and I've been cancer free since.very thankful for modern medicine.
BINGO Jethro!
You should stay as close to "detoxified" as possible also. I'm sure you know that...but just in case you didn't... It might help if you also intake only "distilled" water...simple steps to help you stay that way. Your doc will help with a better diet to that end also.
I hope you stay that way!
Regina

Long Branch, NJ

#442046 May 17, 2013
240 Jesus revealed that God is Father in an unheard-of sense: he is Father not only in being Creator; he is eternally Father in relation to his only Son, who is eternally Son only in relation to his Father: "No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and any one to whom the Son chooses to reveal him."64

241 For this reason the apostles confess Jesus to be the Word: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God"; as "the image of the invisible God"; as the "radiance of the glory of God and the very stamp of his nature".65

242 Following this apostolic tradition, the Church confessed at the first ecumenical council at Nicaea (325) that the Son is "consubstantial" with the Father, that is, one only God with him.66 The second ecumenical council, held at Constantinople in 381, kept this expression in its formulation of the Nicene Creed and confessed "the only-begotten Son of God, eternally begotten of the Father, light from light, true God from true God, begotten not made, consubstantial with the Father".67
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive...

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442047 May 17, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
You can repeat it all day long, but in the end, they will only continue to object and refute it, because they want to believe what men have told them.
Its that fear thing. It's hard for them to shake. Shoot - it took June 70 years.
Ya I was lucky to not have been subject to that.
My People taught me different.

Since: Sep 12

Location hidden

#442048 May 17, 2013
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text>
So a 2000 year old book is your only witness?
Where exactly is that "empirical"(Adjectiv e
Based on, concerned with, or verifiable by observation or experience rather than theory or pure logic) evidence?
Nope, you didn't read all of what I wrote.

From the time of Moses down to the current time...we have had consistent witnesses, each witness verifying previous ones, that God exists.(hence empirical evidence, because previous visions have been verified) The Bible says (I gave quotes) that you can have the privilege of seeing God.
LTM

Fort Frances, Canada

#442049 May 17, 2013
Religion A Delusion wrote:
<quoted text>
I didn't say we have no evidence. But for a God to come as man for 32 years, you might expect much more. Something like a contemporary account would have been nice.
32 years of god-man and we only have scant evidence of 2 years.
But in his wisdom, God left us with the Holy Spirit and UFOs, which should probably be plenty for me. But it's not.
Don't be upset, because we agree on 95% of the world's religious dogma, it's all baloney. All except yours.
Why are you surprise, up till the time Jesus started to preach the Kingdom of God people thought He was just the son of a carpenter.
When He was born Mary and Joseph had to hid with Him people were trying to kill Him.
It was only after His baptism, and His 40 days and night in the wilderness, did His ministry start.
His brothers and sisters didn't even know He was the Messiah.
There was much written about Him before he was born, He fulfilled all prophecy about Him.
The 12 disciples , wrote much about Him in the N.T. as did Paul.
The is a book written about Him Its Called the Holy Bible.
You just choose to not believe what is written.
The Quran' believes in the virgin birth they honor Mary but to them Jesus is just a Prophet like Muhammad.

Since: Sep 12

Location hidden

#442050 May 17, 2013
jethro8 wrote:
<quoted text>the "true church" would not have to change it's beliefs,like i said the pope is considered the vicar of christ by the church,he has all the answers,he is god on earth.and since they do change their beliefs,there is no way it can be the true church.
Ok, I don't follow the "standing as God on earth" idea... but what is wrong with changing beliefs as more truth is revealed?
Regina

Long Branch, NJ

#442051 May 17, 2013
256 St. Gregory of Nazianzus, also called "the Theologian", entrusts this summary of Trinitarian faith to the catechumens of Constantinople:

Above all guard for me this great deposit of faith for which I live and fight, which I want to take with me as a companion, and which makes me bear all evils and despise all pleasures: I mean the profession of faith in the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. I entrust it to you today. By it I am soon going to plunge you into water and raise you up from it. I give it to you as the companion and patron of your whole life. I give you but one divinity and power, existing one in three, and containing the three in a distinct way. Divinity without disparity of substance or nature, without superior degree that raises up or inferior degree that casts down... the infinite co-naturality of three infinites. Each person considered in himself is entirely God... the three considered together... I have not even begun to think of unity when the Trinity bathes me in its splendor. I have not even begun to think of the Trinity when unity grasps me...92

92 St. Gregory of Nazianzus, Oratio 40,41: PG 36,417.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442052 May 17, 2013
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
<quoted text>
That would be a sad day. The Catholic Church did a lot to patron the arts. Think of all the music, architecture and art we would not have without the Catholic Church. What would great thinkers like Leonardo da Vinci have done without funding from the Catholic church? I think we would be living in a more primitive world if church had not existed as a gathering place and thinktank. True the church was selective with which thinkers it endorsed, but a great deal of good was funded by the church.
The church funded Da Vinci?
LTM

Fort Frances, Canada

#442054 May 17, 2013
jethro8 wrote:
<quoted text>a great deal of sadness has come from the church also, architecture and art,pagan statues and paintings all over vatican city,how does that benefit the world? da vinci would of found money somewhere else if the church did not support him,he was a man way ahead of his time,music,rock&roll became popular the church called it devils music,now that they realize it's not going to go away they opened a recording studio and sell rock&roll oriented religious music,they are now into the dating game, christians.com ,they tried to suppress science for decades,even throwing Galileo into prison,because it did not agree with his fact that the earth is not the center of the universe,they suppress more that would benefit life than encourage it,did you read my news article i posted, a woman died at a catholic hospital after three days of begging to abort her child because she was miscarrying and she died from blood poisoning,and their reason was for not helping her " the consultant said it was the law, that this is a Catholic country." it is not the law, it is perfectly legal when a persons life is at stake.they believed in slavery,and now they are trying to build catholic churches all around Africa, Muslims are burning them down. The Catholic Church has in fact changed a vast number of beliefs over the years:
It used to believe those who translated the Bible into English should be killed, but doesn't think this any more.
It used to believe unbaptized babies go to hell, or limbo, but doesn't think this any more.
It used to believe atheists and heretics should be executed, but doesn't think this any more.It used to believe priests could marry, but doesn't think this any more.
It used to believe the sun goes round the earth, but doesn't think this any more.
It used to believe the world is a few thousand years old, but doesn't think this any more.
It used to believe humans have no animal ancestry, but doesn't think this any more.
It used to believe in the blood libel against the Jews, and it even canonised "saints" who were supposed victims of "ritual murder" by the Jews, but apparently it doesn't believe this any more.
IF the catholic church was the true church it would not change it's beliefs so much,they would have knowledge of all the answers because the pope is suppose to be the vicar of Christ.
Amen Jethro

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442055 May 17, 2013
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
For starters, you might want to read some of the writings from the fathers of the Church. They are much less vague than I.
What I can tell you is that they all held the Catholic faith. None of them held the protestant evangelical faith.
Well DUH...Your rhetoric is good, but that is all so far.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442056 May 17, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
I know - they let Tom Hanks in there....*winks*....
Well- only cuz he got's "chocolates"!
Regina

Long Branch, NJ

#442057 May 17, 2013
The Church Fathers

In this section we shall show that the doctrine of the Blessed Trinity has from the earliest times been taught by the Catholic Church and professed by her members. As none deny this for any period subsequent to the Arian and Macedonian controversies, it will be sufficient if we here consider the faith of the first four centuries only. An argument of very great weight is provided in the liturgical forms of the Church. The highest probative force must necessarily attach to these, since they express not the private opinion of a single individual, but the public belief of the whole body of the faithful. Nor can it be objected that the notions of Christians on the subject were vague and confused, and that their liturgical forms reflect this frame of mind. On such a point vagueness was impossible. Any Christian might be called on to seal with his blood his belief that there is but One God. The answer of Saint Maximus (c. A.D. 250) to the command of the proconsul that he should sacrifice to the gods, "I offer no sacrifice save to the One True God," is typical of many such replies in the Acts of the martyrs. It is out of the question to suppose that men who were prepared to give their lives on behalf of this fundamental truth were in point of fact in so great confusion in regard to it that they were unaware whether their creed was monotheistic, ditheistic, or tritheistic. Moreover, we know that their instruction regarding the doctrines of their religion was solid. The writers of that age bear witness that even the unlettered were thoroughly familiar with the truths of faith (cf. Justin, First Apology 60; Irenaeus, Against Heresies III.4.2).
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/15047a.htm

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442058 May 17, 2013
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
<quoted text>
Not necessarily on this forum, but among denominations.
I'm not sure how you could determine who believes in only "a portion of what Jesus taught" because it is debated who, where, what, and when Christ taught. I believe that a lot of people only know about or study a small portion of what Jesus taught, but I still consider them "Christians."
To me, a "Christian" is someone who professes faith in the saving power of Christ's atonement and acts on it.
I think God is an inclusive God, and I don't think He would want us trying to exclude people from his fold....even if they may seem to be on the outer fringes.
IOW, You don't have to even read the bible or go any church...just blindly accept Jesus as you savior and that is it HUH?
If you say you are it -you are it-YER SAVED!

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahh! <SNORT> Hahahahahahahahahahh!

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442059 May 17, 2013
jethro8 wrote:
<quoted text>the "true church" would not have to change it's beliefs,like i said the pope is considered the vicar of christ by the church,he has all the answers,he is god on earth.and since they do change their beliefs,there is no way it can be the true church.
Ya wanna know the name of the "original" true [organized] "church" of Jesus?

It was called-the "Church if God of Jerusalem".

Anyone who can find an "earlier" organized church of Jesus is free to put it up and I will recant.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442060 May 17, 2013
jethro8 wrote:
What else will the Catholic Church change in the future? It is obvious that in the future, the church will change its position on contraception, homosexuality, women priests and married priests. It will forget that it ever opposed them, and the fact that it ever did will just become the humorous answer to a trivia question: "The church once opposed contraception - oddly enough!"
I dunno...maybe Mary will become fully "divine" and it will be known as the "Quadraplipity"...wh o knows...it ain't like they ain't done it before.

Might take some bloody fights between them bishop fellas, but that ain't nuth'n new neither...is it?

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