Roman Catholic church only true churc...

Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

There are 603438 comments on the CBC News story from Jul 10, 2007, titled Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican. In it, CBC News reports that:

The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at CBC News.

Regina

Long Branch, NJ

#442051 May 17, 2013
256 St. Gregory of Nazianzus, also called "the Theologian", entrusts this summary of Trinitarian faith to the catechumens of Constantinople:

Above all guard for me this great deposit of faith for which I live and fight, which I want to take with me as a companion, and which makes me bear all evils and despise all pleasures: I mean the profession of faith in the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. I entrust it to you today. By it I am soon going to plunge you into water and raise you up from it. I give it to you as the companion and patron of your whole life. I give you but one divinity and power, existing one in three, and containing the three in a distinct way. Divinity without disparity of substance or nature, without superior degree that raises up or inferior degree that casts down... the infinite co-naturality of three infinites. Each person considered in himself is entirely God... the three considered together... I have not even begun to think of unity when the Trinity bathes me in its splendor. I have not even begun to think of the Trinity when unity grasps me...92

92 St. Gregory of Nazianzus, Oratio 40,41: PG 36,417.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442052 May 17, 2013
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
<quoted text>
That would be a sad day. The Catholic Church did a lot to patron the arts. Think of all the music, architecture and art we would not have without the Catholic Church. What would great thinkers like Leonardo da Vinci have done without funding from the Catholic church? I think we would be living in a more primitive world if church had not existed as a gathering place and thinktank. True the church was selective with which thinkers it endorsed, but a great deal of good was funded by the church.
The church funded Da Vinci?
LTM

Fort Frances, Canada

#442054 May 17, 2013
jethro8 wrote:
<quoted text>a great deal of sadness has come from the church also, architecture and art,pagan statues and paintings all over vatican city,how does that benefit the world? da vinci would of found money somewhere else if the church did not support him,he was a man way ahead of his time,music,rock&roll became popular the church called it devils music,now that they realize it's not going to go away they opened a recording studio and sell rock&roll oriented religious music,they are now into the dating game, christians.com ,they tried to suppress science for decades,even throwing Galileo into prison,because it did not agree with his fact that the earth is not the center of the universe,they suppress more that would benefit life than encourage it,did you read my news article i posted, a woman died at a catholic hospital after three days of begging to abort her child because she was miscarrying and she died from blood poisoning,and their reason was for not helping her " the consultant said it was the law, that this is a Catholic country." it is not the law, it is perfectly legal when a persons life is at stake.they believed in slavery,and now they are trying to build catholic churches all around Africa, Muslims are burning them down. The Catholic Church has in fact changed a vast number of beliefs over the years:
It used to believe those who translated the Bible into English should be killed, but doesn't think this any more.
It used to believe unbaptized babies go to hell, or limbo, but doesn't think this any more.
It used to believe atheists and heretics should be executed, but doesn't think this any more.It used to believe priests could marry, but doesn't think this any more.
It used to believe the sun goes round the earth, but doesn't think this any more.
It used to believe the world is a few thousand years old, but doesn't think this any more.
It used to believe humans have no animal ancestry, but doesn't think this any more.
It used to believe in the blood libel against the Jews, and it even canonised "saints" who were supposed victims of "ritual murder" by the Jews, but apparently it doesn't believe this any more.
IF the catholic church was the true church it would not change it's beliefs so much,they would have knowledge of all the answers because the pope is suppose to be the vicar of Christ.
Amen Jethro

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442055 May 17, 2013
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
For starters, you might want to read some of the writings from the fathers of the Church. They are much less vague than I.
What I can tell you is that they all held the Catholic faith. None of them held the protestant evangelical faith.
Well DUH...Your rhetoric is good, but that is all so far.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442056 May 17, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
I know - they let Tom Hanks in there....*winks*....
Well- only cuz he got's "chocolates"!
Regina

Long Branch, NJ

#442057 May 17, 2013
The Church Fathers

In this section we shall show that the doctrine of the Blessed Trinity has from the earliest times been taught by the Catholic Church and professed by her members. As none deny this for any period subsequent to the Arian and Macedonian controversies, it will be sufficient if we here consider the faith of the first four centuries only. An argument of very great weight is provided in the liturgical forms of the Church. The highest probative force must necessarily attach to these, since they express not the private opinion of a single individual, but the public belief of the whole body of the faithful. Nor can it be objected that the notions of Christians on the subject were vague and confused, and that their liturgical forms reflect this frame of mind. On such a point vagueness was impossible. Any Christian might be called on to seal with his blood his belief that there is but One God. The answer of Saint Maximus (c. A.D. 250) to the command of the proconsul that he should sacrifice to the gods, "I offer no sacrifice save to the One True God," is typical of many such replies in the Acts of the martyrs. It is out of the question to suppose that men who were prepared to give their lives on behalf of this fundamental truth were in point of fact in so great confusion in regard to it that they were unaware whether their creed was monotheistic, ditheistic, or tritheistic. Moreover, we know that their instruction regarding the doctrines of their religion was solid. The writers of that age bear witness that even the unlettered were thoroughly familiar with the truths of faith (cf. Justin, First Apology 60; Irenaeus, Against Heresies III.4.2).
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/15047a.htm

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442058 May 17, 2013
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
<quoted text>
Not necessarily on this forum, but among denominations.
I'm not sure how you could determine who believes in only "a portion of what Jesus taught" because it is debated who, where, what, and when Christ taught. I believe that a lot of people only know about or study a small portion of what Jesus taught, but I still consider them "Christians."
To me, a "Christian" is someone who professes faith in the saving power of Christ's atonement and acts on it.
I think God is an inclusive God, and I don't think He would want us trying to exclude people from his fold....even if they may seem to be on the outer fringes.
IOW, You don't have to even read the bible or go any church...just blindly accept Jesus as you savior and that is it HUH?
If you say you are it -you are it-YER SAVED!

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahh! <SNORT> Hahahahahahahahahahh!

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442059 May 17, 2013
jethro8 wrote:
<quoted text>the "true church" would not have to change it's beliefs,like i said the pope is considered the vicar of christ by the church,he has all the answers,he is god on earth.and since they do change their beliefs,there is no way it can be the true church.
Ya wanna know the name of the "original" true [organized] "church" of Jesus?

It was called-the "Church if God of Jerusalem".

Anyone who can find an "earlier" organized church of Jesus is free to put it up and I will recant.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442060 May 17, 2013
jethro8 wrote:
What else will the Catholic Church change in the future? It is obvious that in the future, the church will change its position on contraception, homosexuality, women priests and married priests. It will forget that it ever opposed them, and the fact that it ever did will just become the humorous answer to a trivia question: "The church once opposed contraception - oddly enough!"
I dunno...maybe Mary will become fully "divine" and it will be known as the "Quadraplipity"...wh o knows...it ain't like they ain't done it before.

Might take some bloody fights between them bishop fellas, but that ain't nuth'n new neither...is it?
Disciple

Temecula, CA

#442061 May 17, 2013
Religion A Delusion wrote:
<quoted text>
We can see CO2. We can predict what it will do. We can test it, measure it, and even weight it.
We can measure exactly what a CO2 molecule does to light energy.
Not one member of the National Academy of Science disputes what C)2 does.
So no, not imaginary like your god.
Why would a so called Christian be in denial in order to support excess anyhow? I don't understand?
Which is to promote plant growth not global warming.
Who's in denial? Who is imagining things?
I say you.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#442062 May 17, 2013
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
<quoted text>
Not necessarily on this forum, but among denominations.
I'm not sure how you could determine who believes in only "a portion of what Jesus taught" because it is debated who, where, what, and when Christ taught. I believe that a lot of people only know about or study a small portion of what Jesus taught, but I still consider them "Christians."
To me, a "Christian" is someone who professes faith in the saving power of Christ's atonement and acts on it.
I think God is an inclusive God, and I don't think He would want us trying to exclude people from his fold....even if they may seem to be on the outer fringes.
Thanks for responding.

"To me, a "Christian" is someone who professes faith in the saving power of Christ's atonement and acts on it."
- not a bad definition - one could also say the exact same thing occurs with the Self.
- but if you really dig deeper into your definition, you've actually stated something directly related to a choice an individual makes, which really has nothing to do with Jesus at all. Which is accurately described as Self.

So you are correct that no religion is required to become a follower of anybody - Jesus, Buddha, Krishna, Quetzalcoatl.

Thanks for providing yet another 'different' definition of a "Christian", I'll add it to the many others, that people have expressed.

*sighs* You bummed me out though. Want to know why? Well, your definition doesn't include the following:

"is someone who professes faith in the saving power of Christ's atonement and acts on it."
- just because one professes and acts upon this "saving power" - through "faith", you didn't describe how much faith is required.
- you didn't mention nothing on the Spirit, unless you are implying that the "saving power of Christ" is this Spirit. Is it?

Cheers!

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442063 May 17, 2013
jethro8 wrote:
ancient aliens is on,the history channel2,very interesting show.
Don't believe every thing you hear in their "show". A lot of it is is incorrect.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#442064 May 17, 2013
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:

The Catholic Church did a lot to patron the arts. Think of all the music, architecture and art we would not have without the Catholic Church.

New Age writes:
Poetry and the troubadours of the 11th and 12th centuries played a big role as well. Laying claim to solely the CCis arrogant. People still had imaginations and personal talents without any relationship to that organization.

Since: Sep 12

Location hidden

#442065 May 17, 2013
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text>
The church funded Da Vinci?
Yes, it commissioned some work from him. http://www.leonardoda-vinci.org/biography.htm...

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442066 May 17, 2013
Regina wrote:
The doctrine of the Trinity is encapsulated in Matthew 28:19, where Jesus instructs the apostles: "Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit."
The parallelism of the Father, the Son, and the Spirit is not unique to Matthew’s Gospel, but appears elsewhere in the New Testament (e.g., 2 Cor. 13:14, Heb. 9:14), as well as in the writings of the earliest Christians, who clearly understood them in the sense that we do today—that the Father, the Son, and the Spirit are three divine persons who are one divine being (God).
The Didache
"After the foregoing instructions, baptize in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, in living [running] water.... If you have neither, pour water three times on the head, in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit" (Didache 7:1 [A.D. 70]).
Ignatius of Antioch
"[T]o the Church at Ephesus in Asia ... chosen through true suffering by the will of the Father in Jesus Christ our God" (Letter to the Ephesians 1 [A.D. 110]).
"For our God, Jesus Christ, was conceived by Mary in accord with God’s plan: of the seed of David, it is true, but also of the Holy Spirit" (ibid., 18:2).
http://www.catholic.com/tracts/the-trinity
One questoin...Does it say anywhere in Matthew..."Jesus of Nazareth"?

BTW "waters" was the "abyss"(nun) spoken of in the "Old Kingdom" of Egypt.

BTW- If "lineage" was determined by "male" succession(as was everyone preceding), then Jesus born of "Mary" was totally out of the picture of succession of lineage.

Since: Sep 12

Location hidden

#442068 May 17, 2013
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text>
IOW, You don't have to even read the bible or go any church...just blindly accept Jesus as you savior and that is it HUH?
If you say you are it -you are it-YER SAVED!
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahh! <SNORT> Hahahahahahahahahahh!
Being a Christian and being "saved" are different things.

I don't understand what is so funny. What do you mean by "blindly accept Jesus"?

Being a Christian is much more than simply saying it, as I mentioned before, it implies action.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#442069 May 17, 2013
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text>
That is not the question. The question is...are the gospels accurate to the sayings and events at all.
Early writings provide evidence that they are "elaborated" "highly"...and with an agenda of the "universal church".
...and symbolism - a simple way to explain something when you have illiterate peeps, or when you are trying to teach something.

It was very commonplace then and before that time.

Using symbols as a way to communicate has been found all over the world in forms of petroglyphs and hieroglyphs.

Jesus used parables to communicate.

Christianity takes it to another extreme by twisting the tales to its liking, instead of earnestly seeking out the true meanings.

Since: Sep 12

Location hidden

#442070 May 17, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>

*sighs* You bummed me out though. Want to know why? Well, your definition doesn't include the following:
"is someone who professes faith in the saving power of Christ's atonement and acts on it."
- just because one professes and acts upon this "saving power" - through "faith", you didn't describe how much faith is required.
- you didn't mention nothing on the Spirit, unless you are implying that the "saving power of Christ" is this Spirit. Is it?
Cheers!
You bring up some good points. However, how do you quantify how much "faith" is required? That is between you and God,and we can't hold up a "faith meter" to measure how "Christian" some one is.

As far as the Spirit, that was implied in my definition. If you profess faith and act on it, you will follow Christ and repent, be baptized, receive the Holy Ghost from authorized ministers of Christ's gospel, and you will continue to follow Christ by following what the Holy Spirit tells you.

Basically five major steps:
-Faith
-Repentance
-Baptism
-Receive the Holy Ghost
-Endure

I'd consider some one a Christian no matter where they are on "steps" I listed...as long as they have faith and are progressing towards the later steps, which will happen in they are acting on true faith.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#442071 May 17, 2013
Regina wrote:
Justin Martyr
"We will prove that we worship him reasonably; for we have learned that he is the Son of the true God himself, that he holds a second place, and the Spirit of prophecy a third. For this they accuse us of madness, saying that we attribute to a crucified man a place second to the unchangeable and eternal God, the Creator of all things; but they are ignorant of the mystery which lies therein" (First Apology 13:5–6 [A.D. 151]).
Theophilus of Antioch
"It is the attribute of God, of the most high and almighty and of the living God, not only to be everywhere, but also to see and hear all; for he can in no way be contained in a place.... The three days before the luminaries were created are types of the Trinity: God, his Word, and his Wisdom" (To Autolycus 2:15 [A.D. 181]).
Irenaeus
"For the Church, although dispersed throughout the whole world even to the ends of the earth, has received from the apostles and from their disciples the faith in one God, the Father Almighty ... and in one Jesus Christ, the Son of God, who became flesh for our salvation; and in the Holy Spirit" (Against Heresies 1:10:1 [A.D. 189]).
Tertullian
"We do indeed believe that there is only one God, but we believe that under this dispensation, or, as we say, oikonomia, there is also a Son of this one only God, his Word, who proceeded from him and through whom all things were made and without whom nothing was made.... We believe he was sent down by the Father, in accord with his own promise, the Holy Spirit, the Paraclete, the sanctifier of the faith of those who believe in the Father and the Son, and in the Holy Spirit.... This rule of faith has been present since the beginning of the gospel, before even the earlier heretics" (Against Praxeas 2 [A.D. 216]).
"And at the same time the mystery of the oikonomia is safeguarded, for the unity is distributed in a Trinity. Placed in order, the three are the Father, Son, and Spirit. They are three, however, not in condition, but in degree; not in being, but in form; not in power, but in kind; of one being, however, and one condition and one power, because he is one God of whom degrees and forms and kinds are taken into account in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit" (ibid.).
"Keep always in mind the rule of faith which I profess and by which I bear witness that the Father and the Son and the Spirit are inseparable from each other, and then you will understand what is meant by it. Observe now that I say the Father is other [distinct], the Son is other, and the Spirit is other. This statement is wrongly understood by every uneducated or perversely disposed individual, as if it meant diversity and implied by that diversity a separation of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit" (ibid., 9).
"Thus the connection of the Father in the Son, and of the Son in the Paraclete, produces three coherent persons, who are yet distinct one from another. These three are, one essence, not one person, as it is said,‘I and my Father are one’[John 10:30], in respect of unity of being not singularity of number" (ibid., 25).
All written against the heresies...that of the "Roman" elite.

Why don't you supply the history and reasons for these cherrypicked eludes to all that transpired?
Of course if you are just "picking" them from an apologetic Bias site, I could understand the omission.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#442072 May 17, 2013
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text>
Hahahah!
It is true though.
My worst experience was when school began, and I learned the cruelty of other humans... and I became brutal(just like them) to survive and stand up for others like me, or others less capable...but I never forgot what I learned from my "friends".
Brutality is learned and unnatural.
Oh BT, I'm not disputing you, I just find in interesting.

It just goes to show what is seen through a child's eye, versus what we adults live. I sometimes wish I was a child again, but many times, I don't. So I compromised. I now collect action figures, comic books, and Hot wheels!
- "the one with the most toys wins!"

:o)

I sometimes dream of being able to sit with animals in their homes, but after having and raising ferrets for 10 yrs, I chose not to anymore.

:o)

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