Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News 559,659
The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ. Full Story
LTM

Fort Frances, Canada

#435279 Apr 24, 2013
CONT

Assumption 1: God has never healed an amputee. Who is to say that in the history of the world, God has never caused a limb to regenerate? To say, "I have no empirical evidence that limbs can regenerate; therefore, no amputee has ever been healed in the history of the world" is akin to saying "I have no empirical evidence that rabbits live in my yard; therefore, no rabbit has ever lived on this ground in the history of the world." Itís a conclusion that simply cannot be drawn. Besides, we have the historical record of Jesus healing lepers, some of whom we may assume had lost digits or facial features. In each case, the lepers were restored whole (Mark 1:40-42; Luke 17:12-14). Also, there is the case of the man with the shriveled hand (Matthew 12:9-13), and the restoration of Malchus's severed ear (Luke 22:50-51), not to mention the fact that Jesus raised the dead (Matthew 11:5; John 11), which would undeniably be even more difficult than healing an amputee.

Assumption 2: Godís goodness and love require Him to heal everyone. Illness, suffering, and pain are the result of our living in a cursed worldócursed because of our sin (Genesis 3:16-19; Romans 8:20-22). Godís goodness and love moved Him to provide a Savior to redeem us from the curse (1 John 4:9-10), but our ultimate redemption will not be realized until God has made a final end of sin in the world. Until that time, we are still subject to physical death.

If Godís love required Him to heal every disease and infirmity, then no one would ever dieóbecause "love" would maintain everyone in perfect health. The biblical definition of love is "a sacrificial seeking what is best for the loved one." What is best for us is not always physical wholeness. Paul the apostle prayed to have his "thorn in the flesh" removed, but God said, "No," because He wanted Paul to understand he didnít need to be physically whole to experience the sustaining grace of God. Through the experience, Paul grew in humility and in the understanding of Godís mercy and power (2 Corinthians 12:7-10).

CONT
LTM

Fort Frances, Canada

#435280 Apr 24, 2013
CONT

The testimony of Joni Eareckson Tada provides a modern example of what God can do through physical tragedy. As a teenager, Joni suffered a diving accident that left her a quadriplegic. In her book Joni, she relates how she visited faith healers many times and prayed desperately for the healing which never came. Finally, she accepted her condition as Godís will, and she writes, "The more I think about it, the more Iím convinced that God doesnít want everyone well. He uses our problems for His glory and our good" (p. 190).

Assumption 3: God still performs miracles today just as He did in the past. In the thousands of years of history covered by the Bible, we find just four short periods in which miracles were widely performed (the period of the Exodus, the time of the prophets Elijah and Elisha, the ministry of Jesus, and the time of the apostles). While miracles occurred throughout the Bible, it was only during these four periods that miracles were "common."

The time of the apostles ended with the writing of Revelation and the death of John. That means that now, once again, miracles are rare. Any ministry which claims to be led by a new breed of apostle or claims to possess the ability to heal is deceiving people. "Faith healers" play upon emotion and use the power of suggestion to produce unverifiable "healings." This is not to say that God does not heal people todayówe believe He doesóbut not in the numbers or in the way that some people claim.

We turn again to the story of Joni Eareckson Tada, who at one time sought the help of faith healers. On the subject of modern-day miracles, she says, "Manís dealing with God in our day and culture is based on His Word rather than Ďsigns and wondersí" (op cit., p. 190). His grace is sufficient, and His Word is sure.

CONT
LTM

Fort Frances, Canada

#435281 Apr 24, 2013
CONT
Assumption 4: God is bound to say "yes" to any prayer offered in faith. Jesus said, "I am going to the Father. And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father. You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it" (John 14:12-14). Some have tried to interpret this passage as Jesus agreeing to whatever we ask. But this is misreading Jesusí intent. Notice, first, that Jesus is speaking to His apostles, and the promise is for them. After Jesusí ascension, the apostles were given power to perform miracles as they spread the gospel (Acts 5:12). Second, Jesus twice uses the phrase "in My name." This indicates the basis for the apostlesí prayers, but it also implies that whatever they prayed for should be consonant with Jesusí will. A selfish prayer, for example, or one motivated by greed, cannot be said to be prayed in Jesusí name.

We pray in faith, but faith means that we trust God. We trust Him to do what is best and to know what is best. When we consider all the Bibleís teaching on prayer (not just the promise given to the apostles), we learn that God may exercise His power in response to our prayer, or He may surprise us with a different course of action. In His wisdom He always does what is best (Romans 8:28).

Assumption 5: Godís future healing (at the resurrection) cannot compensate for earthly suffering. The truth is, "our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us" (Romans 8:18). When a believer loses a limb, he has Godís promise of future wholeness, and faith is "being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" (Hebrews 11:4). Jesus said, "It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire" (Matthew 18:8). His words confirm the relative unimportance of our physical condition in this world, as compared to our eternal state. To enter life maimed (and then to be made whole) is infinitely better than to enter hell whole (to suffer for eternity).

Assumption 6: Godís plan is subject to manís approval. One of the contentions of the "why wonít God heal amputees" argument is that God just isnít "fair" to amputees. Yet, Scripture is clear that God is perfectly just (Psalm 11:7; 2 Thessalonians 1:5-6) and in His sovereignty answers to no one (Romans 9:20-21). A believer has faith in Godís goodness, even when circumstances make it difficult and reason seems to falter.

Assumption 7: God does not exist. This is the underlying assumption on which the whole "why wonít God heal amputees" argument is based. Those who champion the "why wonít God heal amputees" argument start with the assumption that God does not exist and then proceed to buttress their idea as best they can. For them, "religion is a myth" is a foregone conclusion, presented as a logical deduction but which is, in reality, foundational to the argument.

In one sense, the question of why God doesnít heal amputees is a trick question, comparable to "Can God make a rock too big for Him to lift?" and is designed not to seek for truth but to discredit faith. In another sense, it can be a valid question with a biblical answer. That answer, in short, would be something like this: "God can heal amputees and will heal every one of them who trusts Christ as Savior. The healing will come, not as the result of our demanding it now, but in Godís own time, possibly in this life, but definitely in heaven. Until that time, we walk by faith, trusting the God who redeems us in Christ and promises the resurrection of the body."

CONT
LTM

Fort Frances, Canada

#435282 Apr 24, 2013
A personal testimony:
Our first son was born missing bones in his lower legs and in his feet and he only had two toes. Two days after his first birthday he had both feet amputated. We are now considering adopting a child from China who would require a similar surgery as he has similar issues. I feel God chose me to be a very special mother to these special children, and I had no idea until seeing the topic about why doesn't God heal amputees that people used this as a reason to doubt the existence of God. As the mother of one child with no feet and the potential mother of another child that will be missing some of his lower limbs as well, I've never seen it in that light. Rather, I have seen His calling me to be a special mother as a way to teach others of the blessings of God. He is also calling me to give these children the opportunity to be added to a Christian family that will teach them to love the Lord in their special way and to understand that we can overcome all things all things through Christ. Some might find it to be a stumbling block; we find it to be a learning experience and challenge. We also thank Him for giving someone the knowledge to perform the necessary surgeries and make the necessary prostheses that allow my son, and hopefully our next son, to be able to walk, run, jump, and live to glorify God in all things.ďAnd we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purposeĒ(Romans 8:28).

Since: Sep 09

New Hazelton, Canada

#435283 Apr 24, 2013
Religion - A Delusion wrote:
Let's ALL ask Jesus to appear...
Spirit can appear all over the world at the same time.

That's how the hierarchy spread the room-er that Jesus was in all of their confessionals 24 hrs a day ... while his Jewish father was searching all over for him in the synagogues.

It was a terrible way to treat Jesus' father, but the Catholics didn't care.

:)

Since: Sep 09

New Hazelton, Canada

#435284 Apr 24, 2013
LTM wrote:
"Does God love me?"
Whose opinion do you want?

:)

Since: Apr 13

Location hidden

#435285 Apr 24, 2013
Doctrinal rightness and rightness of ecclesiastical position are important, but only as a starting point to go on into a living relationship - and not as ends in themselves
Francis Shaeffer
OldJG

Rockford, IL

#435286 Apr 24, 2013
More from the Roman Catholics.....

"We teach,...We declare that the Roman Church by the Providence of God holds the primacy of ordinary power over all others, and that this power of jurisdiction of the Roman Pontiff, which is truly episcopal, is immediate. Toward it, the pastors and the faithful of whatever rite and dignity, both individually and collectively, are bound by the duty of hierarchical subordination and true obedience, not only in matters which pertain to faith and morals, but also in those which concern the discipline and government of the Church spread throughout the whole world, in such a way that once the unity of communion and the profession of the same Faith has been preserved with the Roman Pontiff, there is one flock of the Church of Christ under one supreme shepherd. This is the teaching of the Catholic truth from which no one can depart without loss of faith and salvation." Pope Pius XII, Ad Apostolorum Principis (On Communism And The Church In China), Encyclical Promulgated on June 29, 1958,#46.
OldJG

Rockford, IL

#435287 Apr 24, 2013
John Chrysostom???? Another Roman Catholic!


"Do not hold aloof from the Church; for nothing is stronger than the Church. The Church is thy hope, thy salvation, thy refuge." St. John Chrysostom, Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers, Series I, Vol. IX, Introduction to the Two Homilies on Eutropius, Homily II.
OldJG

Rockford, IL

#435288 Apr 24, 2013
The Roman Catholic "Mary"

"Thus there is a mediation: Mary places herself between her Son and mankind in the reality of their wants, needs and sufferings. She puts herself 'in the middle,' that is to say she acts as a mediatrix not as an outsider, but in her position as mother." Pope John Paul II, in Redemptoris Mater (On the Blessed Virgin Mary in the Life of the Pilgrim Church), Encyclical promulgated on March 25, 1987,#21.

"...we only have access to the Father by means of the Son, who is the Mediator of justice, so we only have access to the Son by means of the Mother, who is mediator of grace, and who obtains for us, by her intercession, the gifts which Jesus Christ has merited for us....you cannot come to God except by means of Jesus Christ, nor can you come to Christ except by means of his Mother." St. Alphonsus Ligouri, The Great Means of Salvation and of Perfection (The Necessity and Power of Prayer), Chapter 1, The Necessity of Prayer, Section 4 "The Intercession of the Blessed Virgin".

"With equal truth may it be also affirmed that, by the will of God, Mary is the intermediary through whom is distributed unto us this immense treasure of mercies gathered by God, for mercy and truth were created by Jesus Christ. Thus as no man goeth to the Father but by the Son, so no man goeth to Christ but by His Mother....Mary is this glorious intermediary..." Pope Leo XIII, in Octobri Mense (On the Rosary), Encyclical promulgated on September 22, 1891,# 4.

"God chose her to be the treasurer, the administrator and the dispenser of all his graces, so that all his graces and gifts pass through her hands. Such is the power that she has received from him that, according to St Bernardine, she gives the graces of the eternal Father, the virtues of Jesus Christ, and the gifts of the Holy Spirit to whom she wills, as and when she wills, and as much as she wills.....
"We must never go to our Lord except through Mary, using her intercession and good standing with him. We must never be without her when praying to Jesus.....
"Beware, chosen soul, of thinking that it is more perfect to direct your work and intention straight to Jesus or straight to God. Without Mary, your work and your intention will be of little value. But if you go to God through Mary, your work will become Mary's work, and consequently will be most noble and most worthy of God.." St. Louis Marie de Montfort, in The Secret of Mary,#10, 48, 50.

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#435289 Apr 24, 2013
266
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
My apologies Answered the wrong post...
Glad to hear from you......I will dismantle my munitions I gathered for a serious tete-a-tete..
truth

Perth, Australia

#435290 Apr 24, 2013
Remember this planet can be less then child marble..its looks like that ones upon time when somebody watch me.Did i describe perfectly?
hojo

Saint Paul, MN

#435291 Apr 24, 2013
June VanDerMark wrote:
It's not fair that the good-god gets all the fresh air and sunshine, and the devil gets to eat dirt.
Some things just aren't fair at all.
:)
So true June! And you just keep "eating crow" with every one of your editorial "opinionated "relative truth" nonsense"!!!
hojo

Saint Paul, MN

#435292 Apr 24, 2013
Oxbow wrote:
249
<quoted text>
That does not answer: Why do Catholics allow tradition to trump the Bible???
And why do "bible only" (so-called Christians) continue to distort,deceive and lie about what the Catholic Church actually teaches and believes. Answer: because they have absolutely "nothing" to base ANY of their own Protestant beliefs and doctrine of faith upon. The ONLY THING that can rely upon is spreading lies, heresy, hostility and vindictive hate against over 2000 years, of the historically and biblically PROVEN TRUE Gospel of Jesus Christ and His One (and only one) True Apostolic Catholic Church.
truth

Perth, Australia

#435293 Apr 24, 2013
you traveling there without any money or paying ticket or anybody recomend you..no..its not..its your inner prayers..now

simple you flying on wing of love eye up to eye up to eye planet by planet by planet ..ah good by if take you there..did you see any city..no not at all..your planet become less then child marble.
by
truth

Perth, Australia

#435294 Apr 24, 2013
where are you looking ..there and there, here and here whereeeeee..oh
i am within you..you are within me.

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#435295 Apr 24, 2013
292
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
And why do "bible only" (so-called Christians) continue to distort,deceive and lie about what the Catholic Church actually teaches and believes. Answer: because they have absolutely "nothing" to base ANY of their own Protestant beliefs and doctrine of faith upon. The ONLY THING that can rely upon is spreading lies, heresy, hostility and vindictive hate against over 2000 years, of the historically and biblically PROVEN TRUE Gospel of Jesus Christ and His One (and only one) True Apostolic Catholic Church.
It is evident that I am in contact with an expert on the subject.

Please list ten (10) distorted, deceiving lies, about what the Catholic Church teaches that we "bible only" so-called Christians (to use your erroneous wording)lie about.

Please list ten lies, heresy, hostility and vindictive hate
that we for over 2000 years, have spread against the historically and biblically PROVEN TRUE Gospel of Jesus Christ and His One (and only one) True Apostolic Catholic Church ((to use your words).

Since: Apr 13

Location hidden

#435296 Apr 24, 2013
June VanDerMark wrote:
<quoted text>
Your arrogance is so thick it could be cut with a knife.
----------
June VanSnarly quotes my post thusly:
God uses holy people as channels of His grace to others.

In the measure of our own union with Him, He will communicate to those we teach the light and strength they need to live the Christian faith. GOD USES HUMBLE PEOPLE TO GIVE OTHERS THE GIFT OF HUMILITY. He uses chaste people as conduits of His grace of chastity; patient people to inspire patience; prayerful people to make others prayerful. If we live our faith, we become instruments of divine faith to everyone whose life we touch. This, we may say, is the law of spiritual generation. Sanctity is reproductive; holiness is procreative.(4 hrs ago | post #435256)

VAN SNARLY'S AMPUTATION OF MY POST TO MAKE A POINT ARGUES AGAINST GIVING HER OTHER POSTS CREDIBILITY SORRY
truth

Perth, Australia

#435299 Apr 24, 2013
no sorry..we have have deference language sorry=sori is mean distract..i hope you can understood..one way or deference way..because..make decision is not very easy with someone who simple not prepare..oh i can recognize some point offer..but ..preparation is better way..is Jesus coming as thief or helper?
humility..oh in this world we have that every day non-stop..is that your story ..o does meter its so visible from svemir.
Are you for sure God way is not in hide?

Humility is part of lesson..we don't need hide that ..its visible.
hojo

Saint Paul, MN

#435300 Apr 25, 2013
Oxbow wrote:
292
<quoted text>
It is evident that I am in contact with an expert on the subject.
Please list ten (10) distorted, deceiving lies, about what the Catholic Church teaches that we "bible only" so-called Christians (to use your erroneous wording)lie about.
Please list ten lies, heresy, hostility and vindictive hate
that we for over 2000 years, have spread against the historically and biblically PROVEN TRUE Gospel of Jesus Christ and His One (and only one) True Apostolic Catholic Church ((to use your words).
Lets begin (1) with your own words: 1. Catholic tradition "trumping the bible" 2. Catholics worship idols 3. Catholics worship Mary 4. The Eucharist is not the true body and blood of Christ 5. Catholics don't preach, follow or proclaim Jesus Christ a Lord and Savior 6. Catholics aren't Christian 7. Catholics believe in "works only" 8. The Pope interprets the bible for Catholics 9. Catholics are told not to read or interpret the bible 10.Catholics don't have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ----"these 10 are just for starters Ox!!! Want more??? Just ask me, an ex-Protestant who came into "true Salvation", the "fullness of the faith" and the "fullness of the truth" in Jesus Christ---in and through HIS One (and only one) True Apostolic Catholic Church!!!---the bride of Christ!!!!

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