Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News 574,369
The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ. Full Story

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#430069 Mar 27, 2013
055
Tiger Lily wrote:
<quoted text>
Me too. Everything I have quoted from is that Bible.
Yet you remain stubborn.
Jesus never went to Heaven for another 40 days after His Resurrection.
Can you tell me from scripture where it says Jesus went to Heaven at the moment He died?
Did it take a resurrection to allow Him an ascension?
Is that not the way we are to follow?
What about Judgement Day? When we all have been judged already?
What for? And why a resurrection if we are already in Heaven?
You don't have a logical or biblical response, do you?
Your "me to" is totally wrong....Your previous words prove it. You do not see the Bible as being infallible...you can't do so and support our erroneous beliefs.

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#430070 Mar 27, 2013
058
Tiger Lily wrote:
<quoted text>
I am a rational being. I do not take anything as truth blindly.
Which version of the Bible (and there are many) do you hold to be infallible?
The best Bible version I know of is the KJV but I know for a fact that other vesions are different.
Some have been blatantly added to or altered to reinforce some false doctrine held by the "translator".
How is it that I may not be a Christian if I understand differently from you even though it is not in ignorance?
I have never known a Christian who views the Sacred Word of God as being wrong...fallible..that is not the views expressed by any one who follows the teaching of Jesus..
marge

Ames, IA

#430071 Mar 27, 2013
Tiger Lily wrote:
<quoted text>
I believe in God the Father, Jesus, God's only begotten Son and the Holy Spirit.
Jesus prayed to God and that would be senseless if they were one and the same.
Clay we know you are in the world's biggest cult so don't accuse me of anything you know nothing of.
The Bible is not yours. No "church" established it.
I am not dictating, I merely point out gross error with scriptutre and logic.
You ignore the reasoning entirely that Jesus was in the tomb until Sunday morning and NOT IN HEAVEN with the thief.
I SUSPECT YOU ARE UNABLE TO GRASP THAT SO STOP YOUR ARROGANCE NOW!
Once believers are 'in Jesus', they remain there forever, the Bible says the believers that die are asleep in Jesus.

On the Last Day, we get our new bodies and go to Heaven, those who have died and those alive at that time, at the same time we go to Heaven.

I love you too T.
Tiger Lily

New Zealand

#430072 Mar 27, 2013
Oxbow wrote:
055
<quoted text>
Your "me to" is totally wrong....Your previous words prove it. You do not see the Bible as being infallible...you can't do so and support our erroneous beliefs.
Sorry... Me too.
Which version is infallible then?
You have not disproven the fact that Jesus was in His tomb on Good Friday, Sabbth and the first day of the week, not in Paradise with the thief.

Until you do so all the slings and arrows are worthless.

If you believe we live a conscious life before we are resurrected, you have fallen into gross error yourself.

Death is a sleep and there are many passages which positively state that.

Jesus followed the path we will all take: Life - death - sleep - resurrection. SIMPLE yet so hard for you to see that in all the Bible.

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

#430073 Mar 27, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Then why do you reject his teachings in GoThomas, if what you say above is your mantra.
Are you calling Jesus a liar by utilizing "Paul" and the other five possible Apostles?
Please don't say I never told you otherwise, because then you would be calling me a liar and not being very honest with yourself.
~~~
I don't know why I bother to respond to your post...mostly attempting to be civil I guess.

Jesus gave gifts to the Church and apprehended Saul of Tarsus whom we know as the Apostle Paul was evidently one of them...and sent him forth. as and ambassador to represent the kingdom of God...

Whom He sends he equips..

Act 9:10 And there was a certain disciple at Damascus, named Ananias; and to him said the Lord in a vision, Ananias. And he said, Behold, I am here, Lord.

Act 9:11 And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the street which is called Straight, and enquire in the house of Judas for one called Saul, of Tarsus: for, behold, he prayeth
,
Act 9:12 And hath seen in a vision a man named Ananias coming in, and putting his hand on him, that he might receive his sight.

Act 9:13 Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he hath done to thy saints at Jerusalem:

Act 9:14 And here he hath authority from the chief priests to bind all that call on thy name.

Act 9:15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way:

===>for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:

Act 9:16 For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name's sake.<===

Act 9:17 And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost.

Act 9:18 And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized.

Act 9:19 And when he had received meat, he was strengthened. Then was Saul certain days with the disciples which were at Damascus.

Act 9:20 And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God.

~~~~~~~~~~

Eph 4:8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.

Eph 4:9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?

Eph 4:10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)

Eph 4:11 ==> And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;<==

Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Eph 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;

Eph 4:15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:

Eph 4:16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

The Apostle Paul was one of THE FIVE FOLD MINISTRY GIFTS

THAT GOD SENT TO THE GENTILES

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#430074 Mar 27, 2013
Tiger Lily wrote:
<quoted text>
SHALL indicates some time in the FUTURE.
The Kingdom of Heaven is our reward AFTER the resurrection.
John 11:25 Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life. The one who believes in me will live, even though they die; and whoever lives by believing in me will never die. Do you believe this?"
We have to be made immortal to never die. We put on immortality AFTER the resurrection.
This is what follows after a resurrection. After not before.
"The Kingdom of Heaven is our reward AFTER the resurrection."

Lu 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

You are saying that Christ got it wrong...that He can't do that!!!!
I am not surprised!!!!
Tiger Lily

New Zealand

#430075 Mar 27, 2013
http://www.preparingforeternity.com/dead.htm

Where Are The Dead?

If the fact then is that the body returns to the ground and the breath of life returns to God, then where are the dead?

When Peter in Acts 2:34 was speaking about David the patriarch, he answered the question. "For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand." Acts 2:29, "Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day."

Peter made it perfectly clear that David was still in his tomb, not in heaven or hell as many believe.

David will come forth when the "dead in Christ rise first" at the second coming of Jesus. David is now resting in the grave until the resurrection.

What About Lazarus?
If you just stop for a moment and think about this wonderful truth. You will realize that our loved ones who have preceded us in death, are not being tormented now in hell, nor are they in heaven either where they would be looking down upon the terrible scenes taking place on this earth. They are all sleeping the sleep of death until resurrection morning. The Bible calls death a sleep. Jesus said his friend Lazarus was asleep when he referred to Lazarus' death. "Our friend Lazarus sleepeth" John 11:11.

Lazarus Is Dead

Then in John 11:14 Jesus said, "Lazarus is dead." Christ called Lazarus forth from his tomb where he had been dead for four days.
When Lazarus stepped forth from his tomb, he did not say that he had been to heaven.
If Lazarus had been in heaven, don't you think that he would have protested about being brought back to this sinful earth?
He would not have wanted to stay here for even one minute.
He would have told those around him of the glorious scenes of heaven.

But Lazarus did not speak of heaven.

Lazarus had been sleeping in the dust of the earth since the breath of life had left him.

Ecclesiastes 9:5. "For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not anything, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten."

Lazarus was not conscious of anything that was going on during the time he was in the tomb. Psalms 146:4 says; "His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish." We have no thoughts after death.

Psalms 115:17 tells us that there is no praise of God as far as the dead are concerned.

"The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into silence."

Isaiah 38:18,19 says: "For the grave cannot praise thee, death cannot celebrate thee: they that go down into the pit cannot hope for thy truth.

The living, the living, he shall praise thee, as I do this day: the father to the children shall make known thy truth." Psalms 6:5 says, "For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks?"

If you believe other than this which is plain scripture, you believe contrary to the Word of God.

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#430076 Mar 27, 2013
062
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
I disagree.
Even Jesus disagrees with you.
(44) Jesus says:
(1) "Whoever blasphemes against the Father, it will be forgiven him.
(2) And whoever blasphemes against the Son, it will be forgiven him.
(3) But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, neither on earth nor in heaven."
http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/gth_pat_rob.htm
Why do you try to instill fear unto others with false teachings?
Did I not say that blasphemy is the one sin that cannot be forgiven???!!!! Any Christian knows that is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit!!!!!!
Tiger Lily

New Zealand

#430077 Mar 27, 2013
Oxbow wrote:
<quoted text>
"The Kingdom of Heaven is our reward AFTER the resurrection."
Lu 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.
You are saying that Christ got it wrong...that He can't do that!!!!
I am not surprised!!!!
Have you not seen all my previous posts, Oxbow?

Jesus was in his tomb on Friday after sunset, Sabbath and not until Sunday morning early did He arise. He was on earth another 40 days: not in Heaven.

Lu 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee To day, thou shalt be with me in paradise.

I have explained this a number of times and yet you refuse to see that this is contrary to other scriptures so your understanding has to be questioned. It is quite biblical to prove one text against another but if you cling to your favourite belief, there is nothing which will convince you.

A man convinced against his will
Is of the same opinion still.

The Nature Of Man
We must first establish the facts about the nature of man. The first Bible text we need to look at is Job 4:17. "Shall mortal man be more just than God? Shall a man be more pure than his maker?" The word mortal means subject to death; the word immortal means not subject to death. The word immortal is used only once in the Bible, 1 Timothy 1:17. "Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever, Amen." God is the only One who has immortality. 1 Timothy 6:l6 is even more clear. "Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen." Only God has this power of immortal existence. Man is described as being mortal, or subject to death.
Does The Soul Die?
Some people believe that the above texts refer to the body and that the soul is immortal, and that the soul itself cannot die. This next text will forever clear up this misunderstanding. "Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die." Ezekiel 18:4. This text says that the soul is subject to death. Nowhere in the Bible is the doctrine taught that the soul is immortal.
If the soul is subject to death, then where did this belief originate that the soul does not die? We can start at the beginning of the Bible and find out very soon who is responsible for this lie. You can read Genesis 3:1-4 which is the conversation between the Serpent and Eve and you will see in the fourth verse that Satan, the Serpent, told Eve the very first lie: "Ye shall not surely die." Right at the beginning of mankind, Satan originated this lie that the soul would not die and it has been carried down through the ages. If indeed the soul is mortal or subject to death, then what actually happens when a person dies?

http://www.preparingforeternity.com/dead.htm

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#430078 Mar 27, 2013
072
Tiger Lily wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry... Me too.
Which version is infallible then?
You have not disproven the fact that Jesus was in His tomb on Good Friday, Sabbth and the first day of the week, not in Paradise with the thief.
Until you do so all the slings and arrows are worthless.
If you believe we live a conscious life before we are resurrected, you have fallen into gross error yourself.
Death is a sleep and there are many passages which positively state that.
Jesus followed the path we will all take: Life - death - sleep - resurrection. SIMPLE yet so hard for you to see that in all the Bible.
too
1. In addition; also: He's coming along too.
2. More than enough; excessively: She worries too much.
3. To a regrettable degree: My error was all too apparent.
4. Very; extremely; immensely: He's only too willing to be of service.
5. Informal Indeed; so: You will too do it!

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#430079 Mar 27, 2013
075
Tiger Lily wrote:
http://www.preparingforeternit y.com/dead.htm
Where Are The Dead?
If the fact then is that the body returns to the ground and the breath of life returns to God, then where are the dead?
When Peter in Acts 2:34 was speaking about David the patriarch, he answered the question. "For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand." Acts 2:29, "Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day."
Peter made it perfectly clear that David was still in his tomb, not in heaven or hell as many believe.
David will come forth when the "dead in Christ rise first" at the second coming of Jesus. David is now resting in the grave until the resurrection.
What About Lazarus?
If you just stop for a moment and think about this wonderful truth. You will realize that our loved ones who have preceded us in death, are not being tormented now in hell, nor are they in heaven either where they would be looking down upon the terrible scenes taking place on this earth. They are all sleeping the sleep of death until resurrection morning. The Bible calls death a sleep. Jesus said his friend Lazarus was asleep when he referred to Lazarus' death. "Our friend Lazarus sleepeth" John 11:11.
Lazarus Is Dead
Then in John 11:14 Jesus said, "Lazarus is dead." Christ called Lazarus forth from his tomb where he had been dead for four days.
When Lazarus stepped forth from his tomb, he did not say that he had been to heaven.
If Lazarus had been in heaven, don't you think that he would have protested about being brought back to this sinful earth?
He would not have wanted to stay here for even one minute.
He would have told those around him of the glorious scenes of heaven.
But Lazarus did not speak of heaven.
Lazarus had been sleeping in the dust of the earth since the breath of life had left him.
Ecclesiastes 9:5. "For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not anything, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten."
Lazarus was not conscious of anything that was going on during the time he was in the tomb. Psalms 146:4 says; "His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish." We have no thoughts after death.
Psalms 115:17 tells us that there is no praise of God as far as the dead are concerned.
"The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into silence."
Isaiah 38:18,19 says: "For the grave cannot praise thee, death cannot celebrate thee: they that go down into the pit cannot hope for thy truth.
The living, the living, he shall praise thee, as I do this day: the father to the children shall make known thy truth." Psalms 6:5 says, "For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks?"
If you believe other than this which is plain scripture, you believe contrary to the Word of God.
heaven: the abode of God, the angels, and the spirits of the righteous after death; the place or state of existence of the blessed after the mortal life.

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#430080 Mar 27, 2013
077
Tiger Lily wrote:
<quoted text>
Have you not seen all my previous posts, Oxbow?
Jesus was in his tomb on Friday after sunset, Sabbath and not until Sunday morning early did He arise. He was on earth another 40 days: not in Heaven.
Lu 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee To day, thou shalt be with me in paradise.
I have explained this a number of times and yet you refuse to see that this is contrary to other scriptures so your understanding has to be questioned. It is quite biblical to prove one text against another but if you cling to your favourite belief, there is nothing which will convince you.
A man convinced against his will
Is of the same opinion still.
The Nature Of Man
We must first establish the facts about the nature of man. The first Bible text we need to look at is Job 4:17. "Shall mortal man be more just than God? Shall a man be more pure than his maker?" The word mortal means subject to death; the word immortal means not subject to death. The word immortal is used only once in the Bible, 1 Timothy 1:17. "Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever, Amen." God is the only One who has immortality. 1 Timothy 6:l6 is even more clear. "Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen." Only God has this power of immortal existence. Man is described as being mortal, or subject to death.
Does The Soul Die?
Some people believe that the above texts refer to the body and that the soul is immortal, and that the soul itself cannot die. This next text will forever clear up this misunderstanding. "Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die." Ezekiel 18:4. This text says that the soul is subject to death. Nowhere in the Bible is the doctrine taught that the soul is immortal.
If the soul is subject to death, then where did this belief originate that the soul does not die? We can start at the beginning of the Bible and find out very soon who is responsible for this lie. You can read Genesis 3:1-4 which is the conversation between the Serpent and Eve and you will see in the fourth verse that Satan, the Serpent, told Eve the very first lie: "Ye shall not surely die." Right at the beginning of mankind, Satan originated this lie that the soul would not die and it has been carried down through the ages. If indeed the soul is mortal or subject to death, then what actually happens when a person dies?
http://www.preparingforeternity.com/dead.htm
Lu 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

You are changing Scripture to make it say what you want it to say....I have not seen any versions of the Bible that shows the error you are saying is in the Bible...

“OneLordOneFaith Eph4:5”

Since: Apr 08

Saint John Paul II Pray 4 Us.

#430081 Mar 27, 2013
FROM POPE FRANCIS ---- ON HOLY WEEK----

“ On the Cross, Jesus "loved me and gave Himself for me" (Gal 2:20). Each of us can say, "He loved me and gave Himself for me." Everyone can say that "for me"!

“I am pleased to welcome you to my first general audience. With deep gratitude and veneration I am taking up the "witness" from the hands of my beloved predecessor, Benedict XVI. After Easter we will resume the catechesis on the Year of Faith. Today I would like to focus a little on Holy Week. With Palm Sunday we began this week - the center of the whole liturgical year - in which we accompany Jesus in His Passion, Death and Resurrection.

But what does it mean for us to live Holy Week? What does it means to follow Jesus on His way to the Cross on Calvary and the Resurrection? In His earthly mission, Jesus walked the streets of the Holy Land; He called twelve simple people to remain with Him, to share His journey and continue His mission; He chose them among the people full of faith in the promises of God. He spoke to everyone, without distinction, to the great and the lowly; to the rich young man and the poor widow, the powerful and the weak; He brought the mercy and forgiveness of God to all; He healed, comforted, understood, gave hope, He led all to the presence of God, who is interested in every man and woman, like a good father and a good mother is interested in each child.
God did not wait for us to go to Him, but He moved towards us, without calculation, without measures. This is how God is: He is always the first, He moves towards us. Jesus lived the daily realities of most ordinary people: He was moved by the crowd that seemed like a flock without a shepherd, and He cried in front of the suffering of Martha and Mary on the death of their brother Lazarus; He called a tax collector to be His disciple and also suffered the betrayal of a friend. In Christ, God has given us the assurance that He is with us, in our midst. "Foxes", Jesus said, "have dens and birds of the sky have nests, but the Son of Man has nowhere to rest His head" (Mt 8:20). Jesus did not have a home because His house is the people -- that is, us; His mission is to open all God’s doors, to be the loving presence of God.

In Holy Week we live the highest point of this journey, this loving plan that runs throughout the entire history of the relationship between God and humanity. Jesus enters Jerusalem to take the final step, in which His whole existence is summarized: He gives Himself totally, He keeps nothing for Himself, not even His life. At the Last Supper, with His friends, He shares the bread and distributes the chalice "for us." The Son of God is offered to us, He consigns His Body and his Blood into our hands to be with us always, to dwell among us. And on the Mount of Olives, as in the trial before Pilate, He puts up no resistance, He gifts Himself: He is the Suffering Servant foretold by Isaiah, who stripped himself unto death (cf. Is 53:12).
Jesus does not live this love that leads to sacrifice passively or as a fatal destiny; certainly He does not hide His deep human commotion in the face of a violent death, but He entrusts Himself with full confidence to the Father. Jesus voluntarily consigned Himself to death to respond to the love of God the Father, in perfect union with His will, to demonstrate His love for us. On the Cross, Jesus "loved me and gave Himself for me" (Gal 2:20). Each of us can say, "He loved me and gave Himself for me." Everyone can say that "for me"!

Continue....

“OneLordOneFaith Eph4:5”

Since: Apr 08

Saint John Paul II Pray 4 Us.

#430082 Mar 27, 2013
Page 2 continued... Pope Francis

What does this mean for us? It means that this is my, your, our path. Living Holy Week following Jesus not only with the emotions of the heart; living Holy Week following Jesus means learning how to go beyond ourselves - as I said on Sunday - to reach out to others, to go to the outskirts of existence, to be the first to move towards our brothers and sisters, especially those who are most distant, those who are forgotten, those who are most in need of understanding, consolation and help. There is so much need to bring the living presence of Jesus, merciful and full of love!

Living Holy Week means increasingly entering into God's logic, the logic of the Cross, which is not first of all that of pain and death, but of love and of self-giving that brings life. It means entering into the logic of the Gospel. Following, accompanying Christ, remaining with Him requires a "stepping outside," a stepping beyond. Stepping outside of ourselves, of a tired and routine way of living the faith, of the temptation to withdraw into pre-established patterns that end up closing our horizon to the creative action of God. God stepped outside of Himself to come among us, He pitched His tent among us to bring the mercy of God that saves and gives hope. Even if we want to follow Him and stay with Him, we must not be content to remain in the enclosure of the ninety-nine sheep, we have to "step outside", to search for the lost sheep together with Him, the one furthest away. Remember well: stepping outside of ourselves, like Jesus, like God has stepped outside of Himself in Jesus and Jesus stepped outside of Himself for all of us.

Some might say to me, "But, Father, I have no time", "I have so many things to do", "it is difficult", "what can I do with my little strength?", with my sin, with so many things? Often we settle for a few prayers, a distracted and inconsistent presence at Sunday Mass, a random act of charity, but we lack this courage to "step outside" to bring Christ. We are a bit like St. Peter. As soon as Jesus speaks of the Passion, Death and Resurrection, of self-giving, of love for all, the Apostle takes him aside and rebukes him. What Jesus says upsets his plans, seems unacceptable, undermines the sense of security tthe Messiah. And Jesus looks at the disciples and addresses Peter with
perhaps one of the strongest words of the Gospel: "Get behind me, Satan. You are thinking not as God does, but as human beings do"(Mk 8:33).

God always thinks with mercy: do not forget this. God always thinks with mercy: our merciful Father. God thinks like a father who awaits the return of his child and goes to meet him, sees him coming when he is still far away ... What does this mean? That each and every day he went out to see if his son was coming home. This is our merciful Father. It is the sign that he was waiting for him from the terrace of his house; God thinks like the Samaritan that does not approach the victim to commiserate with him, or look the other way, but to rescue him without asking for anything in return, without asking if he was Jew, if he was pagan, a Samaritan, rich or poor: he does not ask anything – he does not ask these things, he asks for nothing. He goes to his aid: This is how God thinks. God thinks like the shepherd who gives his life to defend and save his sheep.
Always step outside yourself! And with the love and tenderness of God, with respect and patience, knowing that we put our hands, our feet, our hearts, but then it is God who guides them and makes all our actions fruitful.

May you all live these days well, following the Lord with courage, and carrying within ourselves a ray of His love for all those whom we meet.”
Tiger Lily

New Zealand

#430083 Mar 27, 2013
Oxbow wrote:
075
<quoted text>
heaven: the abode of God, the angels, and the spirits of the righteous after death; the place or state of existence of the blessed after the mortal life.
I have not found that in any of my Bibles.

Chapter and verse please?

It sounds like it is from a source which is not in alignment with the Bible.

Do these "spirits of the righteous" look like people?
Can they see us here on Earth?
Are they immortal?
Have they been through a Judgement Day?

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing...(Ecclesiastes 9:5)

The dead are at total rest.

They know and are aware of absolutely nothing!

They do not even know they are dead.

They are not in heaven with God or burning in hellfire or in purgatory.

There are not spirits or ghosts of dead humans running around the earth spooking people.

That fact should ruin many a bad movie and book plots for you, but it is a fact!

The person who recently put his soul up for auction on the Internet should be charged with fraud if he accepted any bid because he is selling something he does not have!

I'm sure he knew this to be true.

The only spirits and ghosts around are God and the angels.

God has existed from the beginning, and He created the angels.

“OneLordOneFaith Eph4:5”

Since: Apr 08

Saint John Paul II Pray 4 Us.

#430084 Mar 27, 2013
socci wrote:
<quoted text>
Meaningless. I can start a church tomorrow and presto a new denomination!
Our relationship with God is between You and Jesus alone.
Nonsense. It would not be a valid church.

Jesus told Peter build MY Church!!
Jesus wanted only ONE CHURCH.
The Bible says the Church is the bride of Christ (Eph. 5:23–32). Jesus can have but one spouse, and his spouse is the Catholic Church.

Your 20th century church can NOT make up NEW rules!

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

#430085 Mar 27, 2013
Tiger Lily wrote:
http://www.preparingforeternit y.com/dead.htm
Where Are The Dead?
If the fact then is that the body returns to the ground and the breath of life returns to God, then where are the dead?
When Peter in Acts 2:34 was speaking about David the patriarch, he answered the question. "For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand." Acts 2:29, "Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day."
Peter made it perfectly clear that David was still in his tomb, not in heaven or hell as many believe.
David will come forth when the "dead in Christ rise first" at the second coming of Jesus. David is now resting in the grave until the resurrection.
What About Lazarus?
If you just stop for a moment and think about this wonderful truth. You will realize that our loved ones who have preceded us in death, are not being tormented now in hell, nor are they in heaven either where they would be looking down upon the terrible scenes taking place on this earth. They are all sleeping the sleep of death until resurrection morning. The Bible calls death a sleep. Jesus said his friend Lazarus was asleep when he referred to Lazarus' death. "Our friend Lazarus sleepeth" John 11:11.
Lazarus Is Dead
Then in John 11:14 Jesus said, "Lazarus is dead." Christ called Lazarus forth from his tomb where he had been dead for four days.
When Lazarus stepped forth from his tomb, he did not say that he had been to heaven.
If Lazarus had been in heaven, don't you think that he would have protested about being brought back to this sinful earth?
He would not have wanted to stay here for even one minute.
He would have told those around him of the glorious scenes of heaven.
But Lazarus did not speak of heaven.
Lazarus had been sleeping in the dust of the earth since the breath of life had left him.
Ecclesiastes 9:5. "For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not anything, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten."
Lazarus was not conscious of anything that was going on during the time he was in the tomb. Psalms 146:4 says; "His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish." We have no thoughts after death.
Psalms 115:17 tells us that there is no praise of God as far as the dead are concerned.
"The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into silence."
Isaiah 38:18,19 says: "For the grave cannot praise thee, death cannot celebrate thee: they that go down into the pit cannot hope for thy truth.
The living, the living, he shall praise thee, as I do this day: the father to the children shall make known thy truth." Psalms 6:5 says, "For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks?"
If you believe other than this which is plain scripture, you believe contrary to the Word of God.
See my response
xxxxxxx

“OneLordOneFaith Eph4:5”

Since: Apr 08

Saint John Paul II Pray 4 Us.

#430086 Mar 27, 2013
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
~~~
You wrote
You don't even know who founded your church!
---
HIS NAME IS JESUS CHRIST..
.YOU REALLY SHOULD MAKE A POINT TO MEET HIM..PERSONALLY...
IF YOU DON'T MEET HIM PERSONALLY HERE ON EARTH...YOU WILL MEET HIM ON JUDGMENT DAY.
YOU WILL ACTUALLY MEET HIM...AS YOUR ADVOCATE/ATTORNEY..
THERE WILL BE NO POPES CARDINALS SAINTS, MARY, NOR ANY ONE ELSE
TO STAND
AS A PROXY WITNESS FOR YOU. HE WILL BE YOUR ONLY MEDIATOR
ON THAT DAY...YOU WILL TESTIFY FOR, OR AGAINST YOURSELF..
THAT WHICH YOUR OWN BRAIN HAS RECORDED WILL BE REGURGITATED FORTH AS
WITNESS.... EITHER FOR YOU OR AGAINST YOU....YOUR BODY SOUL AND SPIRIT
WILL GIVE AND ACCOUNT OF YOUR ACTIONS...OBEDIENCE OR DISOBEDIENCE TO GOD.
WHAT WILL HE SAY THEN, IS ENTIRELY UP TO YOUR ACCEPTING OR REJECTING
HIM NOW...WHILE YOU ARE HERE ON EARTH...
NOW YOU THINK YOU ARE SHIELDED BY YOUR PROXY'S... THAT STAND BETWEEN YOU AND CHRIST...
BUT THE TRUTH WILL BE REVEALED AT THE... WHITE THRONE JUDGMENT... OF GOD.
YOU WILL FIND OUT ..THAT, NO SUCH THING AS PURGATORY EXIST..
Heb_9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
NO, JESUS HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH your church!!!
YOUR WOMEN MADE 20th century church WAS FOUNDED BY sinful AIMEE. PERIOD!

The Bible says the Church is the bride of Christ (Eph. 5:23–32). Jesus can have but one spouse, and his spouse is the Catholic Church.

You too will meet him on judgment day, and you will have to answer to HIM on... why you demean HIS Church.[BTW - I will be care free and happy when I meet my Lord]

FYI….
JESUS IS IN OUR CHURCH, WE RECEIVE HIM DAILY IN HOLY COMMUNION AS HE ORDERED.

Amiee CHANGED THE RULES THAT JESUS TAUGHT. JESUS started only ONE Church. not 42,000.

YOU’RE IN A FAKE CHURCH!! Again.....
The Bible says the Church is the bride of Christ (Eph. 5:23–32). Jesus can have but ONE spouse, and HIS spouse is the Catholic Church!!!

In your church you are either damned or saved. In our Church we have more hope of seeing Jesus.

Regarding Purgatory...

NOTHING UNCLEAN SHALL ENTER
The purification is necessary because, as Scripture teaches,

NOTHING UNCLEAN WILL ENTER
the presence of God in heaven

(Rev. 21:27) and, while we may die with our mortal sins forgiven, there can still be many impurities in us, sins and the temporal punishment due to sins already forgiven.


[see Bible verses here]
Tiger Lily

New Zealand

#430087 Mar 27, 2013
Oxbow wrote:
077
<quoted text>
Lu 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.
You are changing Scripture to make it say what you want it to say....I have not seen any versions of the Bible that shows the error you are saying is in the Bible...
We are taught in Timothy that we should compare scripture with scripture, text with text to prove a doctrine.

As I said, the comma is in the wrong place.

You believe the punctuation is inspired?

If the above text is correct and Jesus DID meet the thief in Heaven when He died, it puts a lot of texts in jeopardy.

Death is a sleep and there are dozens of texts which state that.

How come King David did not go to heaven when he died then?

Death is sleep.

David spoke of “the sleep of death”(Psalms 13:3).

All throughout the Old Testament, when kings died, they “slept with their fathers”(1 Kings 2:10).

The same is true in the New Testament. When Lazarus died, Jesus Christ said,“Our friend Lazarus is sleeping… Jesus spoke of his death”(John 11:11 -13).

After Stephen was martyred,“he fell asleep”(Acts 7:60).

Dead Christians “sleep in Jesus”(1 Thessalonians 4:14).

Daniel wrote that at the end of time,“many who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt”(Daniel 12:2).

Thus the dead are sleeping in the dust of the earth. Someday, they will wake up.

Finally, the Christians’ hope is the return of Jesus Christ and the resurrection. When our Lord returns,“the dead in Christ shall rise… so shall we ever be with the Lord”(1 Thessalonians 4:16, 17).

Look closely. Paul said Christians will “be with the Lord” when He returns.

Jesus taught the same thing when He promised His disciples,“I will come again, and receive you to Myself”(John 14:3). Again, look closely.

Jesus did not say,“I’ll meet you in Heaven when you die,” but that He would receive us when He returns.

Ultimately, Bible truth about death is comforting. Our beloved dead are sleeping quietly, awaiting the resurrection when Jesus returns. Truth also protects us from being deceived by heartless, tricky demons who can easily impersonate the dead.

I’ll conclude with the words of Jesus Christ Himself:
Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice and come forth - those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation (John 5:28, 29, NKJV).

http://www.thetruthaboutdeath.org/
http://www.thetruthabouthell.org/

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

#430088 Mar 27, 2013
my response
xxxxxxx

I AM NOT ATTEMPTING TO CONTRADICT YOUR POST...with all the discussion about Saints being in Heaven etc...there are two examples that give us light on the subject..

First was Jesus...At the time of his death his last words were...

Luk_23:46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said,

==>Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.

~~~

A second example was Stephen...at the time of his death....


Act 7:59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and

==>saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.

In both instances they commended their spirits ...

Jesus first to the Heavenly Father...Then Stephen to Jesus...

The body is made of dirt and it returns to the earth...

The spirit (Gr(Pneuma. which is the breath of God (Gr( returns to God.

In the catching away..(called the rapture,by some.) The spirit and a

new body (made like unto the body of Christ) will be reunited...

The Bible says

1Co 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

1Co 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

1Co 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

1Co 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

1Co 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

IT IS THEN WE WILL BE THE FULFILLMENT OF THE PROPHECY...

1Jn_3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

Php 3:20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:

Php_3:21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

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