Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News 554,500
The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ. Full Story
socci

Plattsburg, MO

#422360 Feb 13, 2013

The Roman Church claims to found itself upon ONE verse in the Bible:

Mt 16:18 "And I say also to you, That you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."

Nowhere does it say there would be a Catholic Church.

Jesus is the rock the church / Christianity is founded upon.

Mk 12:10 "And have you not read this scripture; The stone which the builders rejected is become the head of the corner:"

Jesus is also the stone in the OT book of Daniel, symbolized here the Second Coming..

Dn 2:34 You saw till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image... and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth... For as much as you saw that the stone was cut out of the mountain without hands,

Stone = Jesus

At the time of the Apostles MANY churches were founded. Paul founded the churches at Rome.

Romans 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle 7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: 10 Making request, if by any means now at length I might have a prosperous journey by the will of God to come to you. 15 So, as much as in me is, I am ready to preach the gospel to you that are at Rome also.

more Bible truth here..

www.youtube.com/playlist...

Saban fan

Mobile, AL

#422362 Feb 13, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm shocked that you and everyone else would still hold true to sola scripture. Its evident on this thread that its a complete disaster. I mean, do you think we're that stupid? You guys are arguing tooth and nail about serious Christian matters. Hello? Some of you - obviously - are dead wrong.
So who is it? I'll sit back n let the fireworks begin.
Its you against that smug fella who's concerned about Egypt and Preston - who was visited by Jesus a few yrs ago, and his grandpa talked with the Apostle Paul in Heaven... Plus there are some SDAs and a Jehovah witness, and a gnostic.
Keep in mind, their all using sola scripture - supposedly guided to truth by the Holy Spirit.
Let me get a beer and watch.
Martin Luther was pointing out inconsistencies between scripture and the RCC's popes and councils too.

"Martin Luther told secular and Church officials at the Diet of Worms: "Unless I am convinced by scripture and plain reason -- I cannot accept the authority of popes and councils because they have contradicted each other -- my conscience is captive to the Word of God.""

What are your thoughts about Martin Luther? Did he have a legitimate point?

Or, is the other statement correct that the RCC wishes to be the sole interpreter of scripture?

Would the current RCC acting as the sole interpreter of scripture be in violation of Paul's words to the Galatians concerning... if he or anyone else including an angel taught them differently...?
Saban fan

Mobile, AL

#422363 Feb 13, 2013
socci wrote:
The Roman Church claims to found itself upon ONE verse in the Bible:
Mt 16:18 "And I say also to you, That you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."
Nowhere does it say there would be a Catholic Church.
Jesus is the rock the church / Christianity is founded upon.
Mk 12:10 "And have you not read this scripture; The stone which the builders rejected is become the head of the corner:"
Jesus is also the stone in the OT book of Daniel, symbolized here the Second Coming..
Dn 2:34 You saw till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image... and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth... For as much as you saw that the stone was cut out of the mountain without hands,
Stone = Jesus
At the time of the Apostles MANY churches were founded. Paul founded the churches at Rome.
Romans 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle 7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: 10 Making request, if by any means now at length I might have a prosperous journey by the will of God to come to you. 15 So, as much as in me is, I am ready to preach the gospel to you that are at Rome also.
more Bible truth here..
www.youtube.com/playlist...
They miss the point of Matt. 16:18 all together:

13 When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples,“Who do people say the Son of Man is?”

14 They replied,“Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”

15 “But what about you?” he asked.“Who do you say I am?”

16 Simon Peter answered,“You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.”

17 Jesus replied,“Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by flesh and blood, but by my Father in heaven. 18 And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.

The subject is Peter's confession that Jesus IS the Messiah, the son of the living God. The confession is the Rock being discussed.
Clay

Chicago, IL

#422364 Feb 13, 2013
concerned in Eygpt wrote:
<quoted text>
. Come on you need to take it up a level if you want to play with the big boys
I just saw your last line above. "you need to take it up a level if you want to play with the big boys"

Unbelievable. You actually think this is some sort of game. A contest. Bible verse warfare. A scripture slinging shoot out.
You make me sick. You have no clue about Christianity nor what it means to be a Christian.

The reality is: you and your Ideologues have drawn up a religion, based on some of the letters the Apostles wrote. You've zig zagged from verse to verse and found the religion you sought. You feel you're justified by this.
After all, it says right there in the books that Jesus said "this is a symbol of my body", right?
Oh wait, it was later that he undid the Eucharist by saying "the flesh profits nothing" yeah, that's the ticket. That's what we're looking for.' Our hands are washed now, we can just show God John 6:63, then he'll forgive us.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#422365 Feb 13, 2013
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
We, as Catholics do believe Jesus--but "more important" we believe (What HE Said)--in Matthew 16:13-21 regarding His One (AND ONLY) True (Universal-Catholic) Church and in John 6:47-59 regarding His TRUE BODY AND TRUE BLOOD --"in the Eucharist"---The bigger question for you New Age-- Why don't you believe the (spoken, stated and expressed words) of Jesus --in the Gospels?????????
Stop making up things and lying about your belief.

You only believe in a portion of his teachings.

Honesty is not strong with this one.
7th Day Catholic Rocks

Poplar Bluff, MO

#422366 Feb 13, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
As I'm sure you're aware (but probably convinced yourself otherwise) that Pauls letter to Timothy was telling him that scripture is profitable for teaching...
The scripture Paul was referring to would be the Hebrew Books the Apostles considered scripture. It would not have been his letter Timothy was reading. Nor would it have been future letters or Johns Revelation - which came at a later date.
Even so, Paul did NOT say scripture is the ONLY thing. You guys said this 1600 yrs later.
In fact Paul says the exact opposite in his letter to the Thessalonians "Hold steadfast to your traditions, taught to you by word of mouth AND letter" 2Thess 2:15
Any mention of scripture in the New Testament by the Apostles is always referring to the OT.
And when one uses teh O T scripture to prove a point then someone wants to start in Oh That is under the Old Covenant.
Well I got News for you there is Two Testaments of Scripture inspired by the Holy Spirit Old and New.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#422367 Feb 13, 2013
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm sorry if I'm frustrating you.
OK, I don't think Paul was more enlightened than Jesus, but I can't say he was less so either if his writing was inspired.
(Is that still ducking your question?)
Thank you for answering.

So you beleive Paul was "just as enlightened as Jesus". Of course this is a paraphrase of your post above.

Now back to your question to me....concerning contradictions.

As I posted before, "Paul" taught of the Spirit - as did Jesus. There may or may not be contradictions, as I have never physically compared "Paul's" teaching completely with Jesus'- due to the many letters and size of his letters, but that isn't my point.

The difference is that "Paul's" teachings have been spun in so many directions by men, that these men (even those who forged letters in the name of "Paul") lost the truth of the original teachings about Spirit along the way. Certain men changed the phrasing and then applied their own spin to it.

That is why I asked you to post Jesus' teachings on what you stated "Paul" taught. I believe you can't. But I'm not the one who thinks that there isn't. Remember - you think that there are no contradictions between "Paul" and Jesus. In most ways, you probably are correct, but in many ways, much of the Pauline theology was not taught by Jesus. Namely, "to know yourself is to know the kingdom of God".

Clearly Jesus is telling us to examine our inner beings of the actions we take and the speech we make, so we can ensure we are only promoting good things to others.

"To know yourself is to know the kingdom of God."
- encompasses many aspects of Self in just this one statement.

But as a so-called "Christian", you have been told not to beleive this teachings. Thus, you and many others, fail to believe in "all of what Jesus taught" and instead chose to accept what men have given you to believe.

The Self aspect of you has disappeared.

Does this help?

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#422368 Feb 13, 2013
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm sorry if I'm frustrating you.
OK, I don't think Paul was more enlightened than Jesus, but I can't say he was less so either if his writing was inspired.
(Is that still ducking your question?)
BTW Saban you aren't frustrating me.

I've long passed that stage in my life.

Now the only frustration I may encounter is related to the many so-called "Christians" who claim to believe in all of what Jesus taught, when very blatantly, they have lied and are not honest with theirself, because they really only beleive in those "exclusive" texts that men chose to be the basis of Christianity.

It's all about how honest one can be with themselves and others.

In Christianity's case - it is one big lie perpetuated by men and their prowessness to gain followers. Lying to have followers?

Only in organized religion does this occur.

So why don't you believe in all of what Jesus taught?

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#422369 Feb 13, 2013
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
I didn't "join" a religion. I became a member of the church.
And, yes, I tried my hardest to disprove and discredit it before I eventually submitted to it. I became convinced beyond a shadow of a doubt after I failed miserably in proving it wrong.
I've not yet heard a question here that i didn't first ask and tried to prove correct.- with the exception of some of Preston's. Is he and that Australian Truth guy one in the same?
If you had done the research, you wouldn't be a "Christian".

I really don't think you asked the right questions.

Just out of curiosity, what did you try to disprove?

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#422370 Feb 13, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm shocked that you and everyone else would still hold true to sola scripture. Its evident on this thread that its a complete disaster. I mean, do you think we're that stupid? You guys are arguing tooth and nail about serious Christian matters. Hello?
Tell me Clay, which doctrines and/or dogmas are "serious Christian matters"?

How do they play out with saving someone? How do you know they do?

What evidence do you have to support your position besides men talking about it? We already know men wrote the Bible, did you have something that proves otherwise?

If you truly believe that there are "serious Christian matters" that are embedded in Christianity, we all already know only men came up with them, as there are no existing "God" writings to verify the "He" even exists.

And please don't go on the basis that "Faith" is your governing party, because I've already shown and proven that aspect to be a character of Self.

So whatcha got?

Enlighten me.....if you can.

Thanks!

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#422371 Feb 13, 2013
342 232
preston wrote:
<quoted text>I will take Jewish knowledge over that of Strongs. you are welcome to believe which ever you prefer.
as for me, the jewish people would know more about their religion and their land ,than you, me or strongs.
Judaism (from the Latin Iudaismus, derived from the Greek Ioudaïsmos, and ultimately from the Hebrew &#1497;&#1492;&#14 93;&#1491;&#1492;, Yehudah, "Judah"; in Hebrew: &#1497;&#1492;&#14 91;&#1493;&#1514;, Yahadut, the distinctive characteristics of the Judean ethnos) is the religion, philosophy and way of life of the Jewish people.

I will stick to my Christian beliefs and teachings...
7th Day Catholic Rocks

Poplar Bluff, MO

#422372 Feb 13, 2013
preston wrote:
<quoted text>it is easy to discern.
IF A PERSON HAS NO TESTIMONY AS TO WHEN GOD SAVED HIM, THEN GOD DIDNT.
IF A PERSON SAYS THAT THEY GOT SAVED WHEN THEY WERE BAPTISED WHEN THEY WERE THREE MONTHS OLD, WE KNOW THEY WERENT.
IF A PERSON SAYS THEY GOT SAVED WHEN THEY WERE BAPTISED AS AN ADULT, WE KNOW THEY ARE LYING(EVEN IF THEY DO BELEIVE IT), SINCE WATER BAPTISM ALONE DOESNT SAVE ANYONE.
AS IT IS WRITTEN, WITHOUT THE SHEDDING OF BLOOD THERE IS NO REMISSION OF SINS.SINS ARE ONLY WASHED AWAY BY HIS BLOOD NOT SOME RIVER WATER, NOR SOME CHLORINE FILLED WATER TUB.THAT CHLORINE WILL KILL LOTS OF DIFFERENT BACTERIA, BUT IT DOESNT KILL THE STENCH OF SIN.
If one was to review your many post they would see you spend more time trying to crush ones Faith in Christ that you do toward bring them to Christ.

Very Anti-Christ you are.
Clay

Chicago, IL

#422373 Feb 13, 2013
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
They miss the point of Matt. 16:18 all together:
13 When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples,“Who do people say the Son of Man is?”
14 They replied,“Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”
15 “But what about you?” he asked.“Who do you say I am?”
16 Simon Peter answered,“You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.”
17 Jesus replied,“Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by flesh and blood, but by my Father in heaven. 18 And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.
The subject is Peter's confession that Jesus IS the Messiah, the son of the living God. The confession is the Rock being discussed.
That makes zero sense. You're trying to see what you wanna see.
The truth is that the Catholic Church didn't launch because they read Matthew 16:18 nor any certain Biblical verse. They existed for almost 40 yrs before the Gospel of Matthew was even written.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#422374 Feb 13, 2013
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
They miss the point of Matt. 16:18 all together:
13 When Jesus came to the region of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples,“Who do people say the Son of Man is?”
14 They replied,“Some say John the Baptist; others say Elijah; and still others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”
15 “But what about you?” he asked.“Who do you say I am?”
16 Simon Peter answered,“You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.”
17 Jesus replied,“Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by flesh and blood, but by my Father in heaven. 18 And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.
The subject is Peter's confession that Jesus IS the Messiah, the son of the living God. The confession is the Rock being discussed.
If one is to compare these passages to the non-canonical texts in GoThomas, one will find that the characterization of Jesus is more profound:

(28) Jesus says:

(1) "I stood in the middle of the world, and in flesh I appeared to them.
(2) I found all of them drunk. None of them did I find thirsty.
(3) And my soul ached for the children of humanity,
because they are blind in their heart, and they cannot see;
for they came into the world empty,
(and) they also seek to depart from the world empty.
(4) But now they are drunk.
(But) when they shake off their wine, then they will change their mind."

- the transcendence of knowing Spirit lives on after we die

(37)

(1) His disciples said: "When will you appear to us, and when will we see you?"
(2) Jesus said: "When you undress without being ashamed and take your clothes
(and) put them under your feet like little children (and) trample on them,
(3) then [you] will see the son of the Living One, and you will not be afraid."

- examining yourself - even in those uncompromising positions, one should not sway from knowing that their Spirit requires nothing except itself to reach the glory of our Father.

(50) Jesus says:

(1) If they say to you:‘Where do you come from?’(then) say to them:‘We have come from the light, the place where the light has come into being by itself, has established [itself] and has appeared in their image.’
(2) If they say to you:‘Is it you?’(then) say:‘We are his children, and we are the elect of the living Father.’
(3) If they ask you:‘What is the sign of your Father among you?’(then) say to them:‘It is movement and repose.’"

- Staying true to your Self - others cannot damage "the good of Spirit", but only to themselves when they speak out against those who are aware.

(77) Jesus says:

(1) "I am the light that is over all. I am the All.
The All came forth out of me. And to me the All has come."
(2) "Split a piece of wood – I am there.
(3) Lift the stone, and you will find me there."

- Spirit is present everywhere - although we cannot see it - "smaller than a mustard seed"

(91)

(1) They said to him: "Tell us who you are so that we may believe in you."
(2) He said to them: "You examine the face of sky and earth,
but the one who is before you, you have not recognized,
and you do not know how to test this opportunity."

- One not need any organizaed religion to understand that their Spirit is how they will achieve "greatness" in the Lord.

Self and the living Spirit is the message he taught.

Why don't you believe Jesus?
Clay

Chicago, IL

#422375 Feb 13, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Tell me Clay, which doctrines and/or dogmas are "serious Christian matters"?
How do they play out with saving someone? How do you know they do?
What evidence do you have to support your position besides men talking about it? We already know men wrote the Bible, did you have something that proves otherwise?
If you truly believe that there are "serious Christian matters" that are embedded in Christianity, we all already know only men came up with them, as there are no existing "God" writings to verify the "He" even exists.
And please don't go on the basis that "Faith" is your governing party, because I've already shown and proven that aspect to be a character of Self.
So whatcha got?
Enlighten me.....if you can.
Thanks!
You remind me of my pot head nephew. Lol

Why do you believe men. Men men men?

It sounds like your gospel of Thomas was determined authentic by ... Um .. Men.

Serious Christian matters would be, for one: Salvation and how to attain it.
The sola scripturist can't seem to agree.
Clay

Chicago, IL

#422376 Feb 13, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
If one is to compare these passages to the non-canonical texts in GoThomas, one will find that the characterization of Jesus is more profound:
(28) Jesus says:
(1) "I stood in the middle of the world, and in flesh I appeared to them.
(2) I found all of them drunk. None of them did I find thirsty.
(3) And my soul ached for the children of humanity,
because they are blind in their heart, and they cannot see;
for they came into the world empty,
(and) they also seek to depart from the world empty.
(4) But now they are drunk.
(But) when they shake off their wine, then they will change their mind."
- the transcendence of knowing Spirit lives on after we die
(37)
(1) His disciples said: "When will you appear to us, and when will we see you?"
(2) Jesus said: "When you undress without being ashamed and take your clothes
(and) put them under your feet like little children (and) trample on them,
(3) then [you] will see the son of the Living One, and you will not be afraid."
- examining yourself - even in those uncompromising positions, one should not sway from knowing that their Spirit requires nothing except itself to reach the glory of our Father.
(50) Jesus says:
(1) If they say to you:‘Where do you come from?’(then) say to them:‘We have come from the light, the place where the light has come into being by itself, has established [itself] and has appeared in their image.’
(2) If they say to you:‘Is it you?’(then) say:‘We are his children, and we are the elect of the living Father.’
(3) If they ask you:‘What is the sign of your Father among you?’(then) say to them:‘It is movement and repose.’"
- Staying true to your Self - others cannot damage "the good of Spirit", but only to themselves when they speak out against those who are aware.
(77) Jesus says:
(1) "I am the light that is over all. I am the All.
The All came forth out of me. And to me the All has come."
(2) "Split a piece of wood – I am there.
(3) Lift the stone, and you will find me there."
- Spirit is present everywhere - although we cannot see it - "smaller than a mustard seed"
(91)
(1) They said to him: "Tell us who you are so that we may believe in you."
(2) He said to them: "You examine the face of sky and earth,
but the one who is before you, you have not recognized,
and you do not know how to test this opportunity."
- One not need any organizaed religion to understand that their Spirit is how they will achieve "greatness" in the Lord.
Self and the living Spirit is the message he taught.
Why don't you believe Jesus?
Lol. That is funny. Please post this to Preston and that guy who's concerned about Egypt. It seems they are missing other books too.
Boy, that Jesus from Thomas sounds like a totally different guy then the one from the Gospel of the NT.
John Brown

Oklahoma City, OK

#422377 Feb 13, 2013
What part of Yahweh is not A god do you sheeple not understand.....His name Is Yahweh And because of the divine reverence of his name was believed to be to holy to be spoken.Man changed his name and made him a god.....the very thing he warns you not to worship god and or gods This Is one of satans greatest deceptions.And as revelation 12/9 say's the whole world is deceived.

And lets not leave out the fact that the roman catholick church is the woman that sits on seven hills named after seven different gods. And is with out a teacher but for satan.and has admitted to changing the sabbath from Saturday to Sunday they done away with the feast days for pagan holidays.And has changed the laws And if I remember right he say's do not add to or take away from his word...And this is what I read on here day after day his word.....His words are his laws....that no one keeps....And thus the reason we live in A sin sick world.

And he destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah because of sin can you imagine what he will do to this world.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#422378 Feb 13, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
You remind me of my pot head nephew. Lol
You sound like you are joining him.
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>Why do you believe men. Men men men?
It sounds like your gospel of Thomas was determined authentic by ... Um .. Men.
I don't believe men, I believe in what I have experienced and why I experienced it. So you are still wrong.

Actually men decided that it wasn't authentic.

Just like the ones who decided for what you are to believe.

Yep....men.
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>Serious Christian matters would be, for one: Salvation and how to attain it.
Yes - to believe in the teachings of Jesus on the subject.

Yet you don't, huh? Imagine that.

[QUOTE who="Clay"]<quote d text>The sola scripturist can't seem to agree.
Diverting again? I'm not "ss".

Sorry to disappoint you.
Tiger Lily

New Zealand

#422379 Feb 13, 2013
Can everybody see plainly the wind up to the Great Climax of Jesus' Return in the clouds?

The Catholic Church is positioning itself with a new pope, USA has no answer to its financial & health & unemployment problems, North Korea has detonated a nuclear bomb & shaken the earth,Iran had a protest march with 1000's yelling "Death to America" & they threaten to destroy Israel ASAP.

In contrast, God's remnant people are reading the Bible through & are praying for the outpouring of the Holy Spirit to warn the world so Jesus can come back.

The world as we know it will never be the same again, it is deteriorating so quickly that if Jesus doesn't come soon we will destroy ourselves.
He made this world & He will be the one to destroy it.

Wonderful Love! He will also recreate it as a Home for His Loved ones, & death & war,sickness & hatred will be no more but will be replaced with Love Eternal.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#422380 Feb 13, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
Lol. That is funny. Please post this to Preston and that guy who's concerned about Egypt. It seems they are missing other books too.
Boy, that Jesus from Thomas sounds like a totally different guy then the one from the Gospel of the NT.
That is....because he is....and more direct in his teachings of his philosophy than the NT.

Take the challenge to combine them together, learn them together, and then you will be able to fully understand Jesus.

It will be "astonishing" to say the least.

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