Roman Catholic church only true churc...

Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

There are 654272 comments on the CBC News story from Jul 10, 2007, titled Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican. In it, CBC News reports that:

The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at CBC News.

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 53:1.--6 "MATT 10:27"

#405204 Nov 27, 2012
who="Fr Robert Dye"
All right, you are saying the Good Thief received a "Baptism of Blood."
.
Well and good.(Are you SURE you aren't a Catholic?)
.
But we are speaking of water baptism, and whether it is absolutely necessary in all cases, or are there any exceptions?
.
If you are trying to say that the Good Thief is NOT an exception to the necessity of water baptism, because he received "Baptism of Blood," well, you are not thinking logically.
.
The Baptism of Blood IS an exception to the necessity of water baptism.
.
Or are you trying to say they are the same thing?
.
They are not.
.
Water Baptism is the norm, and what Jesus said He intended we should do.
.
Baptism of Blood and Baptism of Desire are extraordinary circumstances, and appear to be logical exceptions to the norm (the rule) of water baptism.
.
In a similar way, water baptism by immersion ought to be the norm, as it best expresses the sign of "Dying with Christ." Baptism by pouring would logically be *allowed* for cases where immersion is not possible or advisable (the sick, the dying, infants).
.
(And yes, the CC is not at a Best Practice on this. I wish we were. If I had my way, we would never baptize a healthy adult via any manner but full immersion. Not because pouring is not valid--it is--but because pouring pales in sign value when compared with full immersion.)
.
Rob

*********

I didn't say 'baptism of blood'. I said, "baptism of DEATH WITH JESUS CHRIST." The thief did not have an opportunity for water baptism, some do not have the opportunity. That is in God's hands, and He is capable of 'saving to the uttermost'.

For one who deliberately resists baptism, he/she will be responsible...again, that, too, is in God's hands.

I prefer full immersion. The Greek word for baptism is 'bapto', which means full immersion.

KayMarie
hojo

Minneapolis, MN

#405205 Nov 27, 2012
Fr Robert Dye wrote:
<quoted text>
.
LOL?
.
Why?
.
Do you believe it likely the Good Thief was baptized? To me, it seems rather unlikely ...
The thief was not subject to the New Testament command to be baptized into Christ’s death (Romans 6:3-4), just as Moses, Abraham, and David were not amenable to it. They all lived prior to the cross under different law codes. They could not have been baptized into Christ’s death—because He had not yet died! The establishment of the church of Christ and the launching of the Christian religion did not occur until after Christ’s death, on the day of Pentecost in the year A.D. 30 in the city of Jerusalem (Acts 2). An honest and accurate appraisal of the biblical data reveals for us to conclude that the thief on the cross is not an appropriate example of how people are to be saved this side of the cross.
Clay

Denver, CO

#405206 Nov 27, 2012
Michael wrote:
<quoted text>
Clay says......
1. We Baptize our infants because we feel Christ wants us too.
2. Catholics are required to make another Holy Sacrament. Confirmation. This is like Baptism, but we do it on our own accord at an age of maturity.
Michael says......
Infants are baptized so they don't grow up and use their own personal knowledge to decide their own religion or none.
Confirmation is not done on your own accord. I was confirmed like you and there was NO WAY my parents would have it any other way. Could you Clay tell your parents you didn't want to be confirmed?
Get real!
Actually Mike, I DID have a choice. My parents stayed out of it... Of course, I would have been the only one in my class to opt out, so there could have been pressure and also I didn't wanna disappoint my folks.
But regardless mike, your parents can 'force' you to put a suit on and go up to the alter. But they can't force your heart and mind to participate.
You confirm yourself. Period.

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 53:1.--6 "MATT 10:27"

#405207 Nov 27, 2012
who="Michael"
Clay says......
1. We Baptize our infants because we feel Christ wants us too.
2. Catholics are required to make another Holy Sacrament. Confirmation. This is like Baptism, but we do it on our own accord at an age of maturity.
Michael says......
Infants are baptized so they don't grow up and use their own personal knowledge to decide their own religion or none.
Confirmation is not done on your own accord. I was confirmed like you and there was NO WAY my parents would have it any other way. Could you Clay tell your parents you didn't want to be confirmed?
Get real!

**********

Someone likened Confirmation to the Baptism in the Holy Ghost. Confirmation is EXPECTED of children at a certain age. Do ANY of them prophesy, speak in tongues, or do miracles when they are confirmed by a man?

No comparison...

KayMarie
Michael

Canada

#405208 Nov 27, 2012
_BobLoblah_ wrote:
<quoted text>28Nov12.....
.....You just do NOT get it, do you...ya schidt-for-brains.
Yes. There were hundreds, if not thousands of ILK that professed to be priests and 'other' members of the clergy and others outside the clergy in the Holy Roman Catholic Church that sexually abused the youth of their times.
BobLoblah takes NO sides with these monsters and BobLoblah has said it before and will say it again that they should be lined UP and shot.
However, these numbers 'pale' when compared to the 'millions' of good, kind, compassionate, honest, hardWorking Popes, Biships, Cardinals, Priests, Monks, Nuns, Brothers, and other members of the clergy that have come down da pipes over the passt 2000 years.
Ps:....Why don'tCha readUP on those 'outside' the Catholic Church that have sexually abused our youth. Take for example within the BBC where the children's showMan, Jonny Seville has recently been found to have abused over 450 kids. Other ILK associated with him...including the wannabee Rock 'n Roller Gary Glitter.
You should also give some attention to what is going on within the different 'sports organizations'....Penn State comes to mind, and within the hockeyWorld....there are still monsters that roam amongst the young up-'n-commers.
BobLoblah believes dat ven it comes to you 'sickel', there's more brains in a bottle of wadda.
Go figure.
Forever and Ever
BobLoblah
Mr. Loblaws......

Name calling your forte? Mr. Loblaws?

You make up nothing but excuses. Sex abuse scandals worldwide within the catholic church. Vatican bank money laundering scandals. 2 investigations by the vatican on our hard working nuns.

Catholic church takes in BILLIONS of dollars. Pays no property taxes....every week ask for more money.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/a-...

For many years the bishops lied and covered up sex abuse scandals for their priests, now the pope puts the very same bishops in charge of blowing the whistle on these sexual abusive clergy, the very same clergy they covered up for in the first place. Does that make sense to you Mr. Loblaws?

You are a joke Mr. Loblaws..

and UNBELIEVABLE!

Clay

Denver, CO

#405209 Nov 27, 2012
Michael wrote:
<quoted text>
Clay says......
1. We Baptize our infants because we feel Christ wants us too.
2. Catholics are required to make another Holy Sacrament. Confirmation. This is like Baptism, but we do it on our own accord at an age of maturity.
Michael says......
Infants are baptized so they don't grow up and use their own personal knowledge to decide their own religion or none.
Confirmation is not done on your own accord. I was confirmed like you and there was NO WAY my parents would have it any other way. Could you Clay tell your parents you didn't want to be confirmed?
Get real!
No parent, teacher or Priest can tamper with your free will. If they dragged you to the Church to get Confirmed, and forced you to the front....so what? Either you want it or you don't. You didn't, so here you are 40 yr later. You won. Your parents didn't get what they wanted.
Michael

Canada

#405210 Nov 27, 2012
_BobLoblah_ wrote:
<quoted text>28Nov12.....
....Some Christians do this.
Ps:...ALL Roman Catholics do NOT.
Go reFigure.
Forever and Ever
BobLoblah
Are you old enough to remember the GONG show?

You just got GONGED! Mr. Loblaws
Michael

Canada

#405211 Nov 27, 2012
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
You comments "definitely prove" that you are not happy!!!----Because--if you were--you would not be spending so much of your "anti-catholic rebellious attitude" --- attacking, condemning, criticizing, and then spreading your distorted ,heretical, and exaggerated lies against Jesus Christs One True Catholic Church. The fact that you "cannot" leave 2000 years of the TRUTH, regarding the Historical and Biblical TRUE teachings of Christ and His Church--ALONE---only shows how hostile, defiant and angry you (really) are!!
Wrong again HOJO! What is this 89 times now. LOL!

Again, post back to me what you claim I am posting is incorrect?

You won't, because you never have. GONG!
Clay

Denver, CO

#405212 Nov 27, 2012
Michael wrote:
<quoted text>
Mr. Loblaws......
Name calling your forte? Mr. Loblaws?
You make up nothing but excuses. Sex abuse scandals worldwide within the catholic church. Vatican bank money laundering scandals. 2 investigations by the vatican on our hard working nuns.
Catholic church takes in BILLIONS of dollars. Pays no property taxes....every week ask for more money.
http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/a-...
For many years the bishops lied and covered up sex abuse scandals for their priests, now the pope puts the very same bishops in charge of blowing the whistle on these sexual abusive clergy, the very same clergy they covered up for in the first place. Does that make sense to you Mr. Loblaws?
You are a joke Mr. Loblaws..
and UNBELIEVABLE!
Day 1,845.
Michael has brought up child sexual abuse.. Again !!
That's a helluva streak you got going on there bud.
Any other news?
How come you won't acknowledge the great strides the Holy Catholic Church has made in this department?.. Its safe to say there will never be any cover up by a Bishop again. There are new protocols put in place. Amen.
However, this won't stop your agenda. You wish to keep it as fresh as possible for reasons OTHER than child sexual abuse.

Unbelievable.
Michael

Canada

#405213 Nov 27, 2012
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
No parent, teacher or Priest can tamper with your free will. If they dragged you to the Church to get Confirmed, and forced you to the front....so what? Either you want it or you don't. You didn't, so here you are 40 yr later. You won. Your parents didn't get what they wanted.
I try to be nice to you and this is how you treat me?

I made my first holy communion. I made my confirmation, I went to mass every sunday..........because my parents said so. You don't want me to be honest?

What would you expect from a child when all he has ever learned is catholicism?

All schools should be teaching world religions to teach our children to not fear being different, to practice conscious living, and to be able to make decisions themselves.

When people are in a state of fear they will just about believe anything to comfort themselves. I see that in you.

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 53:1.--6 "MATT 10:27"

#405215 Nov 27, 2012
Fr Robert Dye wrote:
<quoted text>
All right, you are saying the Good Thief received a "Baptism of Blood."
.
Well and good.(Are you SURE you aren't a Catholic?)
.
But we are speaking of water baptism, and whether it is absolutely necessary in all cases, or are there any exceptions?
.
If you are trying to say that the Good Thief is NOT an exception to the necessity of water baptism, because he received "Baptism of Blood," well, you are not thinking logically.
.
The Baptism of Blood IS an exception to the necessity of water baptism.
.
Or are you trying to say they are the same thing?
.
They are not.
.
Water Baptism is the norm, and what Jesus said He intended we should do.
.
Baptism of Blood and Baptism of Desire are extraordinary circumstances, and appear to be logical exceptions to the norm (the rule) of water baptism.
.
In a similar way, water baptism by immersion ought to be the norm, as it best expresses the sign of "Dying with Christ." Baptism by pouring would logically be *allowed* for cases where immersion is not possible or advisable (the sick, the dying, infants).
.
(And yes, the CC is not at a Best Practice on this. I wish we were. If I had my way, we would never baptize a healthy adult via any manner but full immersion. Not because pouring is not valid--it is--but because pouring pales in sign value when compared with full immersion.)
.
Rob
~~~

YOU WROTE..

"The Baptism of Blood IS an exception to the necessity of water baptism."

I BELIEVE BOTH SHOULD BE DONE ..where possible..

The Bible speaks of the -->washing of regeneration..

(IN THE BLOOD OF JESUS ....WHICH SHOULD COME FIRST)

THAT BAPTIZES US INTO THE KINGDOM OF GOD.

IN THE BLOOD OF JESUS CHRIST....

Col_1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

The baptism of/in the blood of Jesus...-->IS THE WASHING OF REGENERATION.

Tit 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us,-->by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Tit 3:6 -->Which he shed (HIS BLOOD) on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

Tit 3:7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

WATER BAPTISM...(BEING BAPTIZED INTO GOD'S CHURCH,

THE BODY OF CHRIST ) SHOULD FOLLOW.

(I am not referring here to a earthly denomination..

I am speaking of becoming a part of the body of Christ.)

OUR JUSTIFICATION, BY FAITH IN HIS BLOOD.

Since: Dec 06

Location hidden

#405216 Nov 27, 2012
Dust Storm wrote:
<quoted text>
And Jesus came and said to them, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, to the close of the age." Mt 28:18-20
God was not happy with them not circumcizing. Baptism is not symbolic it is a command.
Josh 5:2-7
2 At that time the Lord said to Joshua,“Make for yourself flint knives and circumcise again the sons of Israel the second time.” 3 So Joshua made himself flint knives and circumcised the sons of Israel at [a]Gibeath-haaraloth. 4 This is the reason why Joshua circumcised them: all the people who came out of Egypt who were males, all the men of war, died in the wilderness along the way after they came out of Egypt. 5 For all the people who came out were circumcised, but all the people who were born in the wilderness along the way as they came out of Egypt had not been circumcised. 6 For the sons of Israel walked forty years in the wilderness, until all the nation, that is, the men of war who came out of Egypt,[b]perished because they did not listen to the voice of the Lord, to whom the Lord had sworn that He would not let them see the land which the Lord had sworn to their fathers to give us, a land flowing with milk and honey. 7 Their children whom He raised up in their place, Joshua [c]circumcised; for they were uncircumcised, because they had not circumcised them along the way.
1 Cor 7:14
14 For the unbelieving husband has been sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife has been sanctified through her believing husband. Otherwise your children would be unclean, but as it is, they are holy.
Dust Storm good friend

I want to thank you for writing on this subject, as well as Truth, as it has helped me think on this subject a bit more deeply....

It is hard to lump all the kinds of baptisms, and circumcision together and speak generally about them. However I think of them as signs. I suppose what has lingered in my mind is the question of baptism and being born again/saved/eternal salvation.

When a person is unable to get baptised by water, does that negate being born again? I think not. The reason is that God's Grace is sufficient.

Another way to say it: God performs the miracle of eternal salvation by knowing the truth(which sets one free) and coming to the light, and then choosing to do good(following God's Will). In this way, one can understand that God's Grace can be extended to those who have never heard of Jesus, and were not baptised.

I think circumcision and baptism are real. They both have symbolic meanings because there is a deeper meaning, and are a type, and sign. In the case of Joshua, it was the last vestage of Egypt being cast off before entering the Promised Land.(The last of a sinful nature left behind. And God steps between Egypt and the Promised Land) It is interresting" that this came at Passover....And the Lamb of God for us is our Passover Lamb, and in baptism we are buried, die, and rise with Christ....

(The question then arises if the Jews who entered into the Promised Land failed to do good, then what about Christians that sin after arising with Christ...?) What effect is circumcision, and what effect are baptism when one sins?
Clay

Denver, CO

#405217 Nov 27, 2012
Michael wrote:
<quoted text>
I try to be nice to you and this is how you treat me?
I made my first holy communion. I made my confirmation, I went to mass every sunday..........because my parents said so. You don't want me to be honest?
What would you expect from a child when all he has ever learned is catholicism?
All schools should be teaching world religions to teach our children to not fear being different, to practice conscious living, and to be able to make decisions themselves.
When people are in a state of fear they will just about believe anything to comfort themselves. I see that in you.
My parents made me go to Catholic grade school.I received first Holy Communion because they made me too. So what?
At some point in both of our lives, we made a conscience decision to accept or deny what we were taught. I chose by my own free will to accept it. You, by your own free will, chose not to.
So please don't imply I'm Catholic because of some other forces. I'm Catholic by my own choice.
Michael

Canada

#405218 Nov 27, 2012
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
Day 1,845.
Michael has brought up child sexual abuse.. Again !!
That's a helluva streak you got going on there bud.
Any other news?
How come you won't acknowledge the great strides the Holy Catholic Church has made in this department?.. Its safe to say there will never be any cover up by a Bishop again. There are new protocols put in place. Amen.
However, this won't stop your agenda. You wish to keep it as fresh as possible for reasons OTHER than child sexual abuse.
Unbelievable.
Bobloblah responded to my post about it and I responded back. Nothing to do with you.


Just GOOGLE......why catholics are leaving.....

check out the many different threads.

You should know about this but you don't. And you claim to know your catholic church.

put your head back in the sand!

The roman catholic news in the top right hand column of this forum almost daily still has reports of abuses. Take it up with them.

see for yourself, but you won't do that because you don't want to know about it.

Put your head back in the sand.







bobloblah posted about it, I responded. Does that bother you?


dr fill

United States

#405219 Nov 27, 2012
Robert F wrote:
<quoted text>
Dust Storm good friend
I want to thank you for writing on this subject, as well as Truth, as it has helped me think on this subject a bit more deeply....
It is hard to lump all the kinds of baptisms, and circumcision together and speak generally about them. However I think of them as signs. I suppose what has lingered in my mind is the question of baptism and being born again/saved/eternal salvation.
When a person is unable to get baptised by water, does that negate being born again? I think not. The reason is that God's Grace is sufficient.
Another way to say it: God performs the miracle of eternal salvation by knowing the truth(which sets one free) and coming to the light, and then choosing to do good(following God's Will). In this way, one can understand that God's Grace can be extended to those who have never heard of Jesus, and were not baptised.
I think circumcision and baptism are real. They both have symbolic meanings because there is a deeper meaning, and are a type, and sign. In the case of Joshua, it was the last vestage of Egypt being cast off before entering the Promised Land.(The last of a sinful nature left behind. And God steps between Egypt and the Promised Land) It is interresting" that this came at Passover....And the Lamb of God for us is our Passover Lamb, and in baptism we are buried, die, and rise with Christ....
(The question then arises if the Jews who entered into the Promised Land failed to do good, then what about Christians that sin after arising with Christ...?) What effect is circumcision, and what effect are baptism when one sins?
I heard the way they test the priest for indocrination is they tie a set of bells to the priest privates and then prance a young maked young man in front of them .then if they hear any bells ring they are in like flynn!!!!

Since: Dec 06

Location hidden

#405220 Nov 27, 2012
Dust Storm wrote:
<quoted text>
And Jesus came and said to them, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, to the close of the age." Mt 28:18-20
God was not happy with them not circumcizing. Baptism is not symbolic it is a command.
Josh 5:2-7
2 At that time the Lord said to Joshua,“Make for yourself flint knives and circumcise again the sons of Israel the second time.” 3 So Joshua made himself flint knives and circumcised the sons of Israel at [a]Gibeath-haaraloth. 4 This is the reason why Joshua circumcised them: all the people who came out of Egypt who were males, all the men of war, died in the wilderness along the way after they came out of Egypt. 5 For all the people who came out were circumcised, but all the people who were born in the wilderness along the way as they came out of Egypt had not been circumcised. 6 For the sons of Israel walked forty years in the wilderness, until all the nation, that is, the men of war who came out of Egypt,[b]perished because they did not listen to the voice of the Lord, to whom the Lord had sworn that He would not let them see the land which the Lord had sworn to their fathers to give us, a land flowing with milk and honey. 7 Their children whom He raised up in their place, Joshua [c]circumcised; for they were uncircumcised, because they had not circumcised them along the way.
1 Cor 7:14
14 For the unbelieving husband has been sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife has been sanctified through her believing husband. Otherwise your children would be unclean, but as it is, they are holy.
Dust Storm good friend

P.S

Also you wrote, "God was not happy with them not circumcizing. Baptism is not symbolic it is a command."

If you read Joshua, you will not see a "command" by God, rather that Joshua just did this. The first generation of Jews out of Israel died away in the wilderness, because they did not obey the voice of God. One might say that the circumcision(baptism) seperated that last bit(sin and guilt) of Egypt(The world) between Israel(The Christian), before they entered the Promised Land(Kingdom of God).

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 53:1.--6 "MATT 10:27"

#405221 Nov 27, 2012
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
The thief was not subject to the New Testament command to be baptized into Christ’s death (Romans 6:3-4), just as Moses, Abraham, and David were not amenable to it. They all lived prior to the cross under different law codes. They could not have been baptized into Christ’s death—because He had not yet died! The establishment of the church of Christ and the launching of the Christian religion did not occur until after Christ’s death, on the day of Pentecost in the year A.D. 30 in the city of Jerusalem (Acts 2). An honest and accurate appraisal of the biblical data reveals for us to conclude that the thief on the cross is not an appropriate example of how people are to be saved this side of the cross.
~~~

Jesus died before the two others on the cross...One went with Him to paradise...under grace..

the other is waiting for the judgment of God.

If you ever receive Jesus Christ as you savior then you will have the leadership of the Holy Ghost and you will not be making so many false statement about the Bible..

The Church (under grace) was birth through the travail of Christ...

at Calvary.

It came forth with him from the tomb...at his resurrection...

The church will follow Him at his ascension when He returns for His bride.

Tr Church was set in order in the first Chapter of the acts of the Apostles

and was enabled in the second chapter ...at the day of the feast of first fruits Pentecost.
Truth

Leesburg, VA

#405222 Nov 27, 2012
Live Action wrote:
<quoted text>Are you well if so you would know what it says about the scribes and the law...And the word is his laws.my heart is full of the laws not a bunch of lies.
Apparently, you believe that we are still under the Old Testament in which we ARE NOT...
Truth

Leesburg, VA

#405223 Nov 27, 2012
Live Action wrote:
<quoted text>saved you mean baptized i have yet to see this done correctly.
You will get it one day....
Truth

Leesburg, VA

#405224 Nov 27, 2012
Live Action wrote:
<quoted text>awe haw you admit to satan having power most seem to over look this...
Power is in the Word of God, in which you seem to be lacking in that area....

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Top Stories Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Bush is a hero (Sep '07) 8 min X Pendable 183,192
The Christian Atheist debate (Jun '15) 12 min ROCCO 64,316
Poll Is homosexuality a sin? (Oct '07) 1 hr Truth Teller 106,580
Poll Was 9/11 a conspiracy?? (Oct '07) 1 hr crucifiedguy 281,925
Israel End is Near (Feb '15) 1 hr Steve III 497
Jehovah's Witnesses are true disciple of Jesus ... (Mar '07) 2 hr Steve III 45,259
Play "end of the word" part 2 (Dec '15) 2 hr ImFree2Choose 2,594
Prove there's a god. (Mar '08) 3 hr Gabriel 973,912
first gay experience? (Sep '14) 7 hr andy 46
More from around the web