Atheism requires as much faith as rel...

Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

There are 258482 comments on the Webbunny tumblelog story from Jul 18, 2009, titled Atheism requires as much faith as religion?. In it, Webbunny tumblelog reports that:

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Webbunny tumblelog.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#182026 Oct 30, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>By your definition someone has a "closed mind" if they refuse to believe anything without evidence. Also, if all reason and logic coupled with science, dictates that an event could not possibly have happened, you would call that "close minded?" You believe that being completely gullible gives you an OPEN mind? Believing in something without supporting evidence means to have an OPEN MIND? Really now!!! What is your definition of the word Skeptic? What does skepticism mean to you?
I guess you covered it already. Good post.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#182027 Oct 30, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
The typical Atheist likes to hold Christianity to the old 1940’s interpretation. Nearly all arguments are to these old interpretations. That 1940’s generation is nearly all gone. A few remain but we are losing them everyday. So Atheist are stuck in the past with their outdated arguments. And we are not buying it. This is 2013 and soon to be 2014. It’s time that Atheist update themselves with how modern Christianity believes.
Actually, we let you tell us what you believe. We don't believe any of it. Go ahead and give us your latest positions, and we'll be happy to address those, just as we are doing with you here now. Nobody is fighting with you about the ark that you wish to discuss. Nobody is invoking the 1940s.

But it is interesting and instructive to see how things are updated. What is the basis for your decision to throw out older interpretations and adopt new ones? Can you say? Would you agree that it has to be an extra-biblical standard - something happening in the world since the bible was written is determining how you understand your bible?

If so, what would that be? New scriptures? New prophets?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#182028 Oct 30, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
if you trying to tell me that there couldn’t have been a massive flood in Noah’s day. I’m not accepting that as being true. Floods happen today on a massive scale. Rain happens today on a massive scale. What science and evidence is there that says a massive flood couldn’t have happened in biblical times?
A. None
Massive flooding definitely did occur in biblical times, before and since. But that is irrelevant to a discussion of the Christian bible story. If you shrink your claim enough, we'll likely eventually agree with you, but not your bible.

"Massive" sounds like a 2013 interpretation of what was described millennia ago as a nearly life extinguishing event, meaning a global phenomenon, which is what they were calling it in the 1940s. I don't think anybody present is arguing against massive flooding having occurred.

From the trailer for the 1928 film Noah's Ark: "See the flood that destroyed the world"
http://www.tcm.com/mediaroom/video/28970/Noah...

What is the 2013 version? The massive flood that damaged a region?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#182029 Oct 30, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
The Bible describes Noah as a “Preacher of Righteousness.” Everyone in the world community knew Noah was building a Ark. This was not some super secret stealth project built in Area 51.
It was common knowledge and you can’t hide the fact you’re building a huge vessel. Unlike anything that was ever built. I’m sure he got it all, laughter, ridicule, jokes. The people of the time knew. They refused to believe. That is until it was too late. They had plenty of warning. They just chose to ignore it.

Noah's best friend Larry was the one who ridiculed him the most. Bill Cosby covered it.
John K

Medina, OH

#182030 Oct 30, 2013
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
You had me fooled, John.
I thought your debunking was for real.
But what about balsa wood?
My point is that anyone can ramble on about Noah's ark and sound like they are making a well reasoned description of events. But sprinkling actual facts into a fabricated story doesn't make it true. I personally am on the side of the ark story being folklore. But it is amazing how much everyone on both sides of the question will go on and on about nothing. It just seems like a bunch of mental masterbaition .

“When you treat people as they ”

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#182031 Oct 30, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Tidal forces work on liquids beneath frozen surfaces just like they do on solid matter and liquids. You will get a wave period. It is how the material can react that makes the difference. If you fractured that frozen surface you will get a different dynamic.
A few feet rise in ocean levels floods coasts. For every increase, even in centimeters, the flooding will reach even further by miles. Even if it isn't raining. Sloshing water can cover a lot of territory. Tidal actions, change in rotational speed, axial tilt, orbital velocity, or orbital position will all cause that water to slosh. Walk with a full cup of coffee and stop suddenly, or tilt the cup, or move your hand in or outwards to see what I mean. Try all at the same time. Make sure it is hot.
Yes beneath, however ice does not make surface waves

If, but, maybe???

Yes stop suddenly, then stand still for 40 days and 40 nights while pouring a never emptying kettle into the cup.

You are not considering what is actually written but what you think should have been written. There is a big BIG difference.

“When you treat people as they ”

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#182032 Oct 30, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
"There is no argument as to whether wood floats."
[two thumbs up]
That shows that wood (most woods anyway) float.

The fact remains that the report is deliberately biased and does not take into account of, in fact deliberately ignores (and states so) several factors.

“When you treat people as they ”

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#182033 Oct 30, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
30 minutes is about right-- the length of the boards. Hand-cut to boot-- they would not have fit tightly in any case.
But as the wave action begins? Those long-long boards begin to twist under the stresses of the waves variable lift under the hull.
And? That much separation?
30 minutes at best...
**glug**
**glug**
**glug**
Poor incestuous Noah .. drowns like a wet kitten in a gunny sack...
... very sad.
So sad and to think of the genocide of the entire human race baring for 8 people.

But so lucky that inbreeding defects did not condemn the human race to lunacy and extinction.

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#182034 Oct 30, 2013
John K wrote:
<quoted text>
My point is that anyone can ramble on about Noah's ark and sound like they are making a well reasoned description of events. But sprinkling actual facts into a fabricated story doesn't make it true. I personally am on the side of the ark story being folklore. But it is amazing how much everyone on both sides of the question will go on and on about nothing. It just seems like a bunch of mental masterbaition .
noah ark didn't happen, only an idiot would believe such a stupid story.

Religious lies deserve no attention without proof.

“When you treat people as they ”

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#182035 Oct 30, 2013
John K wrote:
<quoted text>
My point is that anyone can ramble on about Noah's ark and sound like they are making a well reasoned description of events. But sprinkling actual facts into a fabricated story doesn't make it true. I personally am on the side of the ark story being folklore. But it is amazing how much everyone on both sides of the question will go on and on about nothing. It just seems like a bunch of mental masterbaition .
Or perhaps to some people, the lies of the abrahamic religions are worth highlighting to show the idiocy of such a myth.

Catcher1

Since: Sep 10

Redondo Beach, CA

#182036 Oct 30, 2013
John K wrote:
<quoted text>
My point is that anyone can ramble on about Noah's ark and sound like they are making a well reasoned description of events. But sprinkling actual facts into a fabricated story doesn't make it true. I personally am on the side of the ark story being folklore. But it is amazing how much everyone on both sides of the question will go on and on about nothing. It just seems like a bunch of mental masterbaition .
It does demonstrate the silliness of faith-based thinking; people who are impervious to evidence, who resist it like Crusaders in a quest.

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

Since: Sep 08

The Borderland of Sol

#182037 Oct 30, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
I haven't really studied the account. Is there mention of how long the keel was to be? The shape of it? Or if there was a keel? Or the draft of the craft?
A dagger pointed downwards hull with weight at the bottom would lend much to strength and stability in rough water if you are just going to float. Center of gravity and leverage to keep the craft relatively horizontal.
Actually, large boulders on ropes hanging over the sides would accomplish much the same effect. Would also give you a shallower draft.
I think they call them sea anchors.
No, Dai, that's not a sea-anchor.

And a keeled hull will NOT keep your craft head-to-wind if it's unpowered. You're still going beam-end-on, and roll.

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

Since: Sep 08

The Borderland of Sol

#182038 Oct 30, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Any vessel is subjected to hydraulic forces and other physics. The same goes for a small survival raft made of wood.
Is it possible a large vessel could be made of wood? Yes it is and other large wood vessels are recorded in history.
Is it possible this large wood vessel could survive at sea for just one year?
Yes it is possible. We have had debris from Japan’s Tsunami come all the way from Japan and land on US shores one year later. This debris was not made for a cross oceanic trip. But is survived the ocean trip.
Yes. Debris.

Go to the Atlantic Garbage Patch, you'll find bits of wood and styrofoam been floating around for decades. Not seagoing craft, though.

Do pay attention.

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

Since: Sep 08

The Borderland of Sol

#182039 Oct 30, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Plywood proved to be very seaworthy in WWII. Strong stuff. Just wood laminates at right angles and glued in between. Usually stronger than the original wood used. Like soft pines or what have you. That and some proper bracing and you can get some very durable PT and Higgin's boats. In short order.
You can get much the same effect with boards instead of those thin laminates. Might not even have to glue them. Maybe a little pitch in between, or a peg here and there. The biggest issue is the ends and how you fasten.
Hey, Eagle, why are Topix atheists so limited in their understanding of things?
Dai, that has nothing to do with the overall structural integrity of such a hypothetical craft. Even unladen.

Now add a million or so tonnes of animal and vegetable matter, and you're sunk.

Literally.

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

Since: Sep 08

The Borderland of Sol

#182040 Oct 30, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
Magic?
Okay... magic it is-- it would **have** to be.
A wooden boat built according to the bible would have sunk in short order.
Modern seaworthy tests have proven this for multiple reasons.
Worth noting that that halfwit Huibers wanted to take the thing to London for the Olympics, but it was denied a COS (Certificate of Seaworthiness), and the London Council denied it permission to dock anyway, on the grounds that it represented a fire and sinking danger.

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

Since: Sep 08

The Borderland of Sol

#182041 Oct 30, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
They also experimented with ice-hulled ships-- the ice was strengthened with sawdust. Look it up-- it's real. "pyrocrete" I think it was called.
But.
Ancient building tools would not have permitted the high precision needed to keep the hull-planks from leaking, plank-to-plank.
And?
A **wooden** boat that **long**? Would twist under each and every wave-- just enough to open the seams, and let the water come boiling in... like...
.... a flood.
*glug*
*glug*
*glug*
... poor Noah sunk like the bankrupt dreams of Mitt The Twitt Romney.
"Pykrete". Close enough.

And the Ark would have hogged, sagged, and broken her back in minutes, yes. The phenomenon's well-known to anyone who's spent much tims on the water.

Buck Crick

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#182042 Oct 30, 2013
macumazahn wrote:
<quoted text>"Pykrete". Close enough.
And the Ark would have hogged, sagged, and broken her back in minutes, yes. The phenomenon's well-known to anyone who's spent much tims on the water.
I've spent much time on whiskey. Does that count, MacMucousHands?

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#182043 Oct 30, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
I've spent much time on whiskey.
That explains a lot.

“Crusading Fundies r hilarious!”

Since: Feb 11

Location hidden

#182044 Oct 30, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
The Bible describes Noah as a “Preacher of Righteousness.”
We weren't discussing Noah, we were discussing your murdering god.
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Everyone in the world community knew Noah was building a Ark. This was not some super secret stealth project built in Area 51.
It was common knowledge and you can’t hide the fact you’re building a huge vessel. Unlike anything that was ever built.
I’m sure he got it all, laughter, ridicule, jokes. The people of the time knew. They refused to believe. That is until it was too late.
None of that alters the fact that your bible clearly indicates it was your god's INTENT to murder everyone. That's genocide.
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
They had plenty of warning. They just chose to ignore it.
Your god planned and intended for their death. Warning or no warning, he murdered them all. That's genocide. You can dress it up with all the fancy bows and flowers and justifications you want. But in the end, it was your god's intent to murder everyone. Sorry you dislike that so much.

Since: Sep 08

Alamosa, CO

#182045 Oct 30, 2013
macumazahn wrote:
<quoted text>Yes. Debris.
Go to the Atlantic Garbage Patch, you'll find bits of wood and styrofoam been floating around for decades. Not seagoing craft, though.
Do pay attention.
The ark was designed to be a sea floating craft, not a sea "going" craft.

Propulsion through the water adds the stress. Bow pressure and the twisting, etc.

A really big wooden bucket filled with stuff can float in the ocean.

The ark was in passive mode.

Sea anchors for stability riding waves, and those weights like I posted a picture of extending from the stern to keep it headed into the waves. Structure to spread the load over the maximum length on the crests. A combo of displacement, structure, and cargo loading. Intelligent design.

Don't say it couldn't be done. Look at that stretch DC-8 I posted the link about. And that thing had to fly.

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