Atheism requires as much faith as rel...

Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

There are 258471 comments on the Webbunny tumblelog story from Jul 18, 2009, titled Atheism requires as much faith as religion?. In it, Webbunny tumblelog reports that:

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

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“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

Since: Sep 08

The Borderland of Sol

#181896 Oct 29, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, you were there and watched it?
Now. let me rephrase so perhaps you can understand.
Earth started out as a moon of Saturn. Probably Mars and the other inner rocky planets.
You have rocky moons of Jupiter and Saturn. Gas planets. I believe the other outer planets are, too.
Rocky means denser, like an Irishman's head. Stronger attraction to the sun. Gravitational and magnetic wise.
Those big gas planets spin rocky moons and the sun steals their babies.
Oh, there is a considerable amount of EM involved. Jupiter and Saturn have strong magnetic fields with magnetospheres that slap those moons like we do ours. This induces charge and even current flow, which then creates a magnetic field, and which all planets and component parts thereof are slave to the sun's magnetic field. Hit things right and baby pops out to see Papa.
You really think a rocky planet will accrete this close to the sun?
A little poetic, I know, but that is roughly how it works.
Okay, Dai the Dip, cite your source.

Since: Sep 08

Alamosa, CO

#181897 Oct 29, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>CONCENTRATE, now, really concentrate. A modern day life boat like they use on Oil rigs and large ships are 25-30 feet in length, made for very strong composites or fiberglass. Now to the Ark, over 400 feet in length and made ENTIRELY OF WOOD. Can you or can you NOT see the difference?
Now, take a very long board, lest say 25 feet. Balance it on a saw horse, now put very heavy weights on both ends, whats happens? At the very least the board will BEND, probably break. Now put your 400 plus foot wooden Ark on a large wave, it goes up the face of the wave and at some point it will be as the board on the saw horse, balancing on the wave with the bow and stern unsupported. So maybe it doesn't break, but it will certainly twist, and then the next wave comes, and the ark twists once again, and another wave, and another, a non-stop parade of huge ocean waves, how long before your Ark splits down the middle or twists so repeatedly that she begins to ship water. No bilge pumps, how long before she slips under the waves?
It is exactly why she has no propulsion that she would be in constant danger. Without the ability to face the waves head on she would be like a cork with waves battering her from all sides. You do know that is is not uncommon for ocean waves to reach the height of 70-100 feet in storms. An oil rig of the coast of Newfoundland had its platform 75 feet above the ocean, in an Atlantic storm she simply DISAPPEARED with all hands. No trace of it was ever found. And now you have a 400 foot wooden boat loaded with animals and supplies, bobbing around in Ocean, she would NOT stand a chance against the mighty ocean.
Why do you think EVERY wooden ship over 300 feet, HAD to have steel reenforcement rods and iron brackets? And still they leaked so badly that bilge pumps had a difficult time keeping up with the leaks.
Yes it was designed for a one time use, or so the fable goes, but it supposedly spent a entire year at sea. Do you even have a clue as to how much growth can accumulate on an unprotected hull, its massive.
Doesn't the ballast and center of gravity determine how much of that midsection will balance on?

The weight will displace water, period. Going up or down a wave. You center the weight over an area long enough to take that strain off the center, which will also help keep from pitching and yawing so much. Of course you need sufficient draft. The difference between a round cork bobber and one of those elongated ones. They probably do something like that in mind when loading large cargo ships. Actually, I am pretty certain they do. You spread your load for maximum stability and less structural stress.

Hey, Shem!!! Make sure to put them elephants and rhinos in the middle, then the lions and tigers, and the birds fore and aft!

OK, Dad!

Loony, go up to the bow and toot your horn. We'll load the boat, OK?

.Jesus, Kibbitzers, what a pain in the ass.
Eagle 12

Edwardsville, IL

#181898 Oct 29, 2013
Just Think wrote:
<quoted text>
"Everyone in the world community knew Noah was building a Ark."
You gotta be effing kidding me with this...
Just how would they keep that a secret?
Eagle 12

Edwardsville, IL

#181899 Oct 29, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
The simple physical problems with the construction material alone are but one of the numerous problems that your myth based religion suffers.
"Hogging and sagging"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hogging_and_sagg...
Skeptics would have justification had the bible described the Ark being made out of stone and rocks.

But it was wood.

Since: Sep 08

Alamosa, CO

#181900 Oct 29, 2013
macumazahn wrote:
<quoted text>Okay, Dai the Dip, cite your source.
Mac, most of my Irish genes has been washed out. I can think for myself.

Go read a book and come back with a snappy answer.

Oh, tell loony something about going up and down waves in a kayak, centers of gravity, etc.

Watch out for them gators.

:-)
Anon

Lakewood, OH

#181901 Oct 29, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
So what you are telling me it couldn't rain in Noah's day?
You are going on the record and saying it could not flood?
I believe that position doesn't support science.
Face it, you can't allow hard science to puncture your religious beliefs - your life would collapse like a house of cards.
LCNLin

Marietta, GA

#181902 Oct 29, 2013
Anon wrote:
<quoted text>
Face it, you can't allow hard science to puncture your religious beliefs - your life would collapse like a house of cards.
Agnostics avoid the "pixie atheism Malarkey"
Eagle 12

Edwardsville, IL

#181903 Oct 29, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>CONCENTRATE, now, really concentrate. A modern day life boat like they use on Oil rigs and large ships are 25-30 feet in length, made for very strong composites or fiberglass. Now to the Ark, over 400 feet in length and made ENTIRELY OF WOOD. Can you or can you NOT see the difference?
Now, take a very long board, lest say 25 feet. Balance it on a saw horse, now put very heavy weights on both ends, whats happens? At the very least the board will BEND, probably break. Now put your 400 plus foot wooden Ark on a large wave, it goes up the face of the wave and at some point it will be as the board on the saw horse, balancing on the wave with the bow and stern unsupported. So maybe it doesn't break, but it will certainly twist, and then the next wave comes, and the ark twists once again, and another wave, and another, a non-stop parade of huge ocean waves, how long before your Ark splits down the middle or twists so repeatedly that she begins to ship water. No bilge pumps, how long before she slips under the waves?
It is exactly why she has no propulsion that she would be in constant danger. Without the ability to face the waves head on she would be like a cork with waves battering her from all sides. You do know that is is not uncommon for ocean waves to reach the height of 70-100 feet in storms. An oil rig of the coast of Newfoundland had its platform 75 feet above the ocean, in an Atlantic storm she simply DISAPPEARED with all hands. No trace of it was ever found. And now you have a 400 foot wooden boat loaded with animals and supplies, bobbing around in Ocean, she would NOT stand a chance against the mighty ocean.
Why do you think EVERY wooden ship over 300 feet, HAD to have steel reenforcement rods and iron brackets? And still they leaked so badly that bilge pumps had a difficult time keeping up with the leaks.
Yes it was designed for a one time use, or so the fable goes, but it supposedly spent a entire year at sea. Do you even have a clue as to how much growth can accumulate on an unprotected hull, its massive.
It wasn’t made to sail the entire globe Doctor. It was a rescue craft with lots of compartments. Giving it internal support for the bulkheads.

Did you know the Amish have been known to build large barns without the use of metal or nails. Completely all wood and these barns have lasted for decades.

So why couldn’t a barge be built entirely of wood and be sea worthy for at least one year? Had the bible said it was made out of stone and rocks. You would have a right to be skeptical. But it was made out of wood.

And history has recorded other very large vessels. One being the “Tessarakonteres.” It’s length was reported to be 420 feet. Made of wood. Hellenistic period.

For hundreds of yeas the Egyptian Pyramids puzzled people in how in a primitive society could build such structures without modern machinery. Yet they did it.

It is not outside the bounds of reasoning to believe such a vessel could be made to last at least one year.

Eagle 12

Edwardsville, IL

#181904 Oct 29, 2013
Anon wrote:
<quoted text>
Face it, you can't allow hard science to puncture your religious beliefs - your life would collapse like a house of cards.
But it depends on what you mean by “hard” science. If you are referring to pseudo science then I’m a skeptic.

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#181905 Oct 29, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Doesn't the ballast and center of gravity determine how much of that midsection will balance on?
The weight will displace water, period. Going up or down a wave. You center the weight over an area long enough to take that strain off the center, which will also help keep from pitching and yawing so much. Of course you need sufficient draft. The difference between a round cork bobber and one of those elongated ones. They probably do something like that in mind when loading large cargo ships. Actually, I am pretty certain they do. You spread your load for maximum stability and less structural stress.
Hey, Shem!!! Make sure to put them elephants and rhinos in the middle, then the lions and tigers, and the birds fore and aft!
OK, Dad!
Loony, go up to the bow and toot your horn. We'll load the boat, OK?
.Jesus, Kibbitzers, what a pain in the ass.
To be clear, your're arguing against noahs ark being complete and utter bollocks.
Eagle 12

Edwardsville, IL

#181906 Oct 29, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
The simple physical problems with the construction material alone are but one of the numerous problems that your myth based religion suffers.
"Hogging and sagging"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hogging_and_sagg...
Other large wooden vessels have been recorded in history.

Tessarakonteres 420 feet.

“A hull of such size would involve great bend-induced stresses, which were dealt with using strake edge jointing. The plank shear issue was more directly addressed in the ancient practice of mortise and tenon-jointed planks (strakes), which "certainly goes back to 14th century BC and very probably before that".[

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tessarakonteres
Eagle 12

Edwardsville, IL

#181907 Oct 29, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>CONCENTRATE, now, really concentrate. A modern day life boat like they use on Oil rigs and large ships are 25-30 feet in length, made for very strong composites or fiberglass. Now to the Ark, over 400 feet in length and made ENTIRELY OF WOOD. Can you or can you NOT see the difference?
Now, take a very long board, lest say 25 feet. Balance it on a saw horse, now put very heavy weights on both ends, whats happens? At the very least the board will BEND, probably break. Now put your 400 plus foot wooden Ark on a large wave, it goes up the face of the wave and at some point it will be as the board on the saw horse, balancing on the wave with the bow and stern unsupported. So maybe it doesn't break, but it will certainly twist, and then the next wave comes, and the ark twists once again, and another wave, and another, a non-stop parade of huge ocean waves, how long before your Ark splits down the middle or twists so repeatedly that she begins to ship water. No bilge pumps, how long before she slips under the waves?
It is exactly why she has no propulsion that she would be in constant danger. Without the ability to face the waves head on she would be like a cork with waves battering her from all sides. You do know that is is not uncommon for ocean waves to reach the height of 70-100 feet in storms. An oil rig of the coast of Newfoundland had its platform 75 feet above the ocean, in an Atlantic storm she simply DISAPPEARED with all hands. No trace of it was ever found. And now you have a 400 foot wooden boat loaded with animals and supplies, bobbing around in Ocean, she would NOT stand a chance against the mighty ocean.
Why do you think EVERY wooden ship over 300 feet, HAD to have steel reenforcement rods and iron brackets? And still they leaked so badly that bilge pumps had a difficult time keeping up with the leaks.
Yes it was designed for a one time use, or so the fable goes, but it supposedly spent a entire year at sea. Do you even have a clue as to how much growth can accumulate on an unprotected hull, its massive.
Other large wooden vessels have been recorded in history.

Tessarakonteres 420 feet.

“A hull of such size would involve great bend-induced stresses, which were dealt with using strake edge jointing. The plank shear issue was more directly addressed in the ancient practice of mortise and tenon-jointed planks (strakes), which "certainly goes back to 14th century BC and very probably before that".[

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tessarakonteres
Anon

Lakewood, OH

#181908 Oct 29, 2013
LCNLin wrote:
<quoted text>
Agnostics avoid the "pixie atheism Malarkey"
What?
LCNLin

Marietta, GA

#181909 Oct 29, 2013
-Skeptic- wrote:
<quoted text>
To be clear, your're arguing against noahs ark being complete and utter bollocks.
UK has The Church of England as Established Church.
Funny she advises Americans while in her own Kingdom she pays taxes to the Church

God Save the Queen

Since: Sep 08

Alamosa, CO

#181910 Oct 29, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
It wasn’t made to sail the entire globe Doctor. It was a rescue craft with lots of compartments. Giving it internal support for the bulkheads.
Did you know the Amish have been known to build large barns without the use of metal or nails. Completely all wood and these barns have lasted for decades.
So why couldn’t a barge be built entirely of wood and be sea worthy for at least one year? Had the bible said it was made out of stone and rocks. You would have a right to be skeptical. But it was made out of wood.
And history has recorded other very large vessels. One being the “Tessarakonteres.” It’s length was reported to be 420 feet. Made of wood. Hellenistic period.
For hundreds of yeas the Egyptian Pyramids puzzled people in how in a primitive society could build such structures without modern machinery. Yet they did it.
It is not outside the bounds of reasoning to believe such a vessel could be made to last at least one year.
I haven't really studied the account. Is there mention of how long the keel was to be? The shape of it? Or if there was a keel? Or the draft of the craft?

A dagger pointed downwards hull with weight at the bottom would lend much to strength and stability in rough water if you are just going to float. Center of gravity and leverage to keep the craft relatively horizontal.

Actually, large boulders on ropes hanging over the sides would accomplish much the same effect. Would also give you a shallower draft.

I think they call them sea anchors.

Catcher1

Since: Sep 10

Fremont, CA

#181911 Oct 29, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
So why couldn’t a barge be built entirely of wood and be sea worthy for at least one year?

It is not outside the bounds of reasoning to believe such a vessel could be made to last at least one year.
Yes, I have heard that the ark sang this song:

I will never love you,
The cost of love's too dear.
But though I'll never love you,
I'll stay with you one year.

And we can sing in the sunshine,
We'll laugh everyday,
We'll sing in the sunshine,
Then I'll be on my way.

(Gale Garnett)

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#181912 Oct 29, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Just how would they keep that a secret?
Good grief, you're an idiot.

You do understand what the word "world" means, right?

EVERYONE in the world knew Noah was building an ark?

Since: Sep 08

Alamosa, CO

#181913 Oct 29, 2013
Just Think wrote:
<quoted text>
Good grief, you're an idiot.
You do understand what the word "world" means, right?
EVERYONE in the world knew Noah was building an ark?
Uneducated savage. Your world does not mean my world. Thank God.

" 2.
a part or aspect of human life or of the natural features of the earth, in particular.
a region or group of countries.
"the English-speaking world"
a period of history.
"the ancient world"
a group of living things.
"the animal world"
the people, places, and activities to do with a particular thing.
"they were a legend in the world of British theater"
synonyms: sphere, society, circle, arena, milieu, province, domain, orbit, preserve, realm, field, discipline, area, sector More
"the academic world"
human and social interaction.
"he has almost completely withdrawn from the world"
synonyms: society, material things, secular interests, temporal concerns, earthly concerns More
"she renounced the world"
average, respectable, or fashionable people or their customs or opinions.
a person's life and activities.
noun: one's world;&#8195;plural noun: one's worlds
"he felt his whole world had collapsed"
everything that exists outside oneself.
a stage of human life, either mortal or after death.
"in this world and the next"
secular interests and affairs.
"parents are not viewed as the primary educators of their own children, either in the world or in the church"

Origin
More
Old English w(e)oruld, from a Germanic compound meaning ‘age of man’; related to Dutch wereld and German Welt .

https://www.google.com/search...

Since: May 09

Location hidden

#181914 Oct 29, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Skeptics would have justification had the bible described the Ark being made out of stone and rocks.
But it was wood.
You obviously didn't read the link...

Hogging and sagging.

Hogging is the stress a ship's hull or keel experiences that causes the center or the keel to bend upward. Sagging is the stress a ship's hull or keel is placed under when a wave is the same length as the ship and the ship is in the trough of two waves. This causes the middle of the ship to bend down slightly, and depending of the level of bend, may cause the hull to snap or crack.
Sagging or dynamic hogging may have been what sank the Prestige off Spain on 19 November 2002.
Hogging, or "hog", also refers to the semi-permanent bend in the keel, especially in wooden-hulled ships, caused over time by the ship's center's being more buoyant than the bow or stern."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hogging_and_sagg...

Hogging

"Until the 1920's a large percentage of the world's shipping consisted of large wooden ships and their plague, after plain old rot, was "hog". A ship floating quietly in still water is subjected to external forces. These are the weight of the vessel on its cargo (downwards) and the buoyancy force (upwards). Archimedes showed us that for a floating vessel, these two forces must be equal in magnitude. For a floating rectangular piece of wood, they are also equal in distribution. For most normally shaped ships, the distribution is not equal. For example, when an empty ship has more weight (relatively heavy structure, engines and equipment) in the ends, and more buoyancy in the middle. This "excess" of buoyancy in the middle cause the middle to rise up and the ends to bend down -- a hog in profile. The opposite condition is sagging. For old wooden ships, this resulted in a long term, plastic deformation. The total curvature could be a meter or more in larger vessels. Some vessels like the Wapama hogged so much that they nearly broke in two.

Hogging is no longer the problem it was in the 1920's when it threatened the nation's merchant fleet -- because those ships have sunk!"
http://www.tricoastal.com/shipbuilding/woodsh...
Anon

Lakewood, OH

#181915 Oct 29, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
I haven't really studied the account. Is there mention of how long the keel was to be? The shape of it? Or if there was a keel? Or the draft of the craft?
A dagger pointed downwards hull with weight at the bottom would lend much to strength and stability in rough water if you are just going to float. Center of gravity and leverage to keep the craft relatively horizontal.
Actually, large boulders on ropes hanging over the sides would accomplish much the same effect. Would also give you a shallower draft.
I think they call them sea anchors.
Way to go Dave, you absolutely nailed that one... Now, where did they store the food supply for eight people and two of every animal in the world? I think of all the specialized dietary needs in any metropolitan zoo, but, by golly, god took care of that, huh? Wonder where they kept the coelacanths? Oh, I reckon god destroyed all the diseases that would occur in that stinking environment over the course of a year. Yeah, that must be it.

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