Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#147646 Jan 8, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
I looked it up and read one of the treatises explaining it. It seems to be more of a philosophical mish-mash than anything actually useful. There were some things that I consider to be laughably wrong and a few things that I thought were correct. I'm willing to wait and see if anything useful comes out of it. I doubt it will.
Very interesting life story Chris has.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#147647 Jan 8, 2013
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
Some evidence has been presented to you. Not all by no means. But some good stuff and your choice was to disregard it. That's your call, it effects only you. But with your rejection of the evidence you should stop asking for proof. You just look silly.
No, all I have seen are assertions, no evidence at all.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#147648 Jan 8, 2013
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
This is a lie. I have, along with others presented evidence. As I said you simply dismissed it.
No, you present assertions, the assertions are dismissed because you present no evidence to support them.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#147649 Jan 8, 2013
Hedonist wrote:
<quoted text>
The Bible cannot be used as proof of the validity of the Bible.
Hearsay is not evidence.
Anecdotal stories are not evidence.
Goad of the gaps does not equal evidence.
Anthropomorphism does not equal evidence.
Anthropic philosophical arguments do not equal evidence.
Evidence is observable, measurable, independently verifiable, and testable.
Thus far you have presented absolutely NO evidence.
bUt Why can't i be proof of my own Power?
I paid tax on it lol
Thinking

Leighton Buzzard, UK

#147650 Jan 8, 2013
Why?
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
Which god are you talking about?
The God of the Bible is alway capitalized. So you must be talking of something I cannot help you with.

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#147651 Jan 8, 2013
KJV:

A 2012 estimate is not likely to be based on 2012 data. It could be based on data that is more than a decade old with some rationale for adjusting it. We simply do not know, and that is exactly the point. If you look at the various encyclopedia entries that you referenced, you will find that they, in turn, reference other sources. You have to follow the trail to the original study before you can evaluate the data itself.

In order to evaluate a study's accuracy, you have to look at how and when the data was collected and analyzed. That information is called metadata, i.e., data about the data. Unless you look at that, you can't know whether you are citing valid statistics, shoddy work, or outright fabrications. Most government statistical departments include metadata in all of their published works, but the CIA does not. Pew and ARIS are just as open about their methods. When two sources show very different results, the metadata usually shows why. When the metadata is absent, preference has to be given to the better documented study.

Beyond the accuracy of the statistics, using them to advance an ad populum argument will not play for anyone who is familiar with the basic principles of logic. When assessing ideas, it is foolish to see what the majority of people believe and go with that. Ideas the come to be widely accepted are often accepted by tiny minorities at their inception. We all agree, for instance, that slavery was an outrageous injustice, but it was accepted as normal for most of human history. Racial segregation and discrimination was the rule of the day until after the middle of the last century. Women's roles in society were commonly accepted as secondary until about the same time, and the struggle for women's suffrage required decades before the nineteenth amendment finally gave all American women equal voting rights.

Majorities can be wrong. Communities decide on action by voting, but only on the ship of fools is truth put to a vote.

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#147653 Jan 8, 2013
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
That may in fact be true. However who's place is it to tell parents they cannot teach their children what they believe to be true and can save them from eternal damnation. And why do so many atheist children leave atheism to become a theist?
"Posted earlier by derek4
Study: Atheists Have Lowest 'Retention Rate' Compared to Religious Groups
Only about 30 percent of those who grow up in an atheist household remain atheists as adults. This "retention rate" was the lowest among the 20 separate categories in the study.
There were 1,387 atheists (weighted) in the survey. Four-hundred thirty-two weighted respondents said they were raised atheist. Of those, 131 self-identified as atheist.
Continued:
Gray also noted that, "of those raised as atheists, 30% are now affiliated with a Protestant denomination, 10% are Catholic, 2% are Jewish, 1% are Mormon, and 1% are Pagan."
Jehovah's Witness, congregationalist and holiness churches had the next lowest retention rates at 37 percent, 37 percent and 32 percent, respectively. Thirty-eight percent of those who grew up with no particular religious faith or belief system remained that way.
Hindus had the highest retention rate at 84 percent, followed by Jews (76 percent), Muslims (76 percent), Greek Orthodox (73 percent), Mormons (70 percent) and Catholics (68 percent).
Baptists had the highest retention rate of the Protestant Christian categories at 60 percent, followed by Lutheran (59 percent) and Pentecostal (50 percent).
http://www.christianpost.com/news/study-athei...
[Right; NO thinking people don't want to be atheists.]
From: Deseret News / Salt Lake City, UT
July, 2012
“Atheists abandon their beliefs more often than people in other religious groups, study finds”
A new study has found that people raised in an atheist home abandon those beliefs as adults more often than people raised with other religious belief systems, putting atheism at a 30 percent retention rate. Conclusions and interpretations of the study are that atheists are more often "made" as adults rather than "raised." The highest retention rates are in the Hindu faith, which holds onto about 84 percent of adherents.
Those who grow up in an atheist household are least likely to maintain their beliefs about religion as adults, according to a study by Georgetown University's Center for Applied Research in the Apostolate (CARA).
Only about 30 percent of those who grow up in an atheist household remain atheists as adults. This "retention rate" was the lowest among the 20 separate categories in the study.
There were 1,387 atheists (weighted) in the survey. Four-hundred thirty-two weighted respondents said they were raised atheist. Of those, 131 self-identified as atheist."
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/765589392/...
Here's the really interesting point about the retention data: while the news article says it comes from "a study by Georgetown University's Center for Applied Research in the Apostolate (CARA)," ist actually comes from a blog by CARA editor Mark Gray. He displays the data in a graph that show the data coming from at least two sources, one of which is the Pew Forum. CARA appears to do surveys only of the Catholic supbpopulation, relying on other sources for comparative data. Since these other studies are conducted differently, the data from them cannot be compared with defensible validity. Moreover, the subjects for their internal surveys self-select, which invalidates their results as well.

That said, the data they present may be reasonably accurate. Or not--we have no way of knowing for sure. CARA does not show its metadata.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#147654 Jan 8, 2013
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope
You have demonstrated as much, especially with the bandwagon fallacy you pulled.
KJV

United States

#147655 Jan 8, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>The god of the bible is not omniscient.
There is no god of the Bible

The God of the Bible is always to be capitalized.
KJV

United States

#147656 Jan 8, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>The god of the bible is not omniscient.
"Incorrect capitalization of the noun “god”

Well, you say that god exists, but I think Santa Claus is more plausible.

Here, the writer is showing his complete and utter disdain for God by demoting him below Santa Claus, not only with his sentence, but with his capitalization. This is just plain wrong. In this sentence, God is a proper noun, and needs to be capitalized to distinguish it from “a god” as seen in the following sentence (which is correct usage):

I don’t see proof that there is a god.

Incorrect capitalization of pronouns

I know that God is alive because He shows himself to me.

Here, the writer is capitalizing a pronoun to try to convey the massive respect he has for his god above anything else that may be expressed with a proper noun. This is also bad grammar, though it does not introduce the confusion that not capitalizing “God” can (as noted above); it looks like he either has a sticky shift key or meant to break a sentence. Proper usage would be something to the effect of:

I know that God is alive because he shows himself to me

or
I know that God is alive because He shows Himself to me.(If you are capitalizing all the pronouns.)"

http://www.teachingcollegeenglish.com/2004/02...

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#147657 Jan 8, 2013
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
There is no god of the Bible
The God of the Bible is always to be capitalized.
What's so much more important for the god of your bible than any of the other gods?

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#147658 Jan 8, 2013
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
"Incorrect capitalization of the noun “god”
Well, you say that god exists, but I think Santa Claus is more plausible.
Here, the writer is showing his complete and utter disdain for God by demoting him below Santa Claus, not only with his sentence, but with his capitalization. This is just plain wrong. In this sentence, God is a proper noun, and needs to be capitalized to distinguish it from “a god” as seen in the following sentence (which is correct usage):
I don’t see proof that there is a god.
Incorrect capitalization of pronouns
I know that God is alive because He shows himself to me.
Here, the writer is capitalizing a pronoun to try to convey the massive respect he has for his god above anything else that may be expressed with a proper noun. This is also bad grammar, though it does not introduce the confusion that not capitalizing “God” can (as noted above); it looks like he either has a sticky shift key or meant to break a sentence. Proper usage would be something to the effect of:
I know that God is alive because he shows himself to me
or
I know that God is alive because He shows Himself to me.(If you are capitalizing all the pronouns.)"
http://www.teachingcollegeenglish.com/2004/02...
Aw, you don't like facts.

Since: Sep 10

United States

#147659 Jan 8, 2013
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Ive been watching episodes of Gold Rush. By all accounts gold mining doesnt come easy. Its hard work and a lot of stubbornness to keep going despite multiple failures. On the show there have been lots of setbacks and disappointments. Determination drives the teams to get results.
My Dear Catcher, you want to see the gold but you dont want to dig for it. You want proof of God yet you dont want to bend your knee and humble yourself to meet him in prayer. I would love for you to find him. But it takes effort and determination on your part.
I'm too busy for wild god chases.

Tell the dude to make an appearance.

It shouldn't be difficult for someone omnipotent.

Since: Sep 10

United States

#147660 Jan 8, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. this is not a sentence ..
.. pitch hitting for CATCHER. He's addressing a convention of esteemed lawyers this afternoon ..
.. as his sock, I'm filling in ..
No, no, I made a film today.

Rated PG unfortunately.
Thinking

Leighton Buzzard, UK

#147661 Jan 8, 2013
Why?
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
There is no god of the Bible
The God of the Bible is always to be capitalized.
Thinking

Leighton Buzzard, UK

#147662 Jan 8, 2013
Apparently god is too busy giving African babies malaria to prove he exists to you.
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm too busy for wild god chases.
Tell the dude to make an appearance.
It shouldn't be difficult for someone omnipotent.
KJV

United States

#147663 Jan 8, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>The god of the bible is not omniscient.
Holy Bible

-Names for the Bible – Capitalize all names for the Bible, for parts and versions of the Bible and all names of other sacred books.

Examples:
· Bible · Scriptures · Word of God · Holy Bible · Old Testament ·
New Testament
· Gospels · Ten Commandments · Lord’s Prayer · Gospels ·
Gospel of Luke
· King James Version ·
New International Version
- Creeds and Confessions –

Capitalize all names of creeds and confessions of faith and general Biblical terms.

Examples:
· Lord’s Supper · the Apostles’ Creed
· the Westminster Catechism ·
Nicene Creed
- Deity - Capitalize all names for Deity

Examples:
· Father · Almighty · God · Lord · Holy Spirit · Son of Man
· Messiah · Lord of Hosts · Redeemer · Savior · Holy Trinity

-Devil - Capitalize all names for the Devil

Examples:
· Devil · Satan · Adversary · Father of Lies · Evil One · Lucifer
· Prince of Darkness · Beelzebub (meaning Satan)

* Do not capitalize when used in a general sense or as an expletive.(Example: The devil is a formidable adversary.)
KJV

United States

#147664 Jan 8, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>The god of the bible is not omniscient.
Sorry forgot the link

http://www.libraryonline.com/default.asp...

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#147665 Jan 8, 2013
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm too busy for wild god chases.
Tell the dude to make an appearance.
It shouldn't be difficult for someone omnipotent.
I think that was a typo, the bible probably meant impotent.
KJV

United States

#147666 Jan 8, 2013
Hedonist wrote:
<quoted text>Actually, to specify a god of the Bible, you would use Adonai, Jehovah, Elohim, El-Shaddai, etc.

"God" is a generic term that Christians have tried to steal and claim as their own by capitalizing it. Seems stealing is a defining characteristic of the Abrahamic religions.
Holy Bible

- Names for the Bible – Capitalize all names for the Bible, for parts and versions of the Bible and all names of other sacred books.
Examples:
· Bible · Scriptures · Word of God · Holy Bible · Old Testament · New Testament
· Gospels · Ten Commandments · Lord’s Prayer · Gospels · Gospel of Luke
· King James Version · New International Version
- Creeds and Confessions – Capitalize all names of creeds and confessions of faith and general Biblical terms.
Examples:
· Lord’s Supper · the Apostles’ Creed
· the Westminster Catechism · Nicene Creed
- Deity - Capitalize all names for Deity
Examples:
· Father · Almighty · God · Lord · Holy Spirit · Son of Man
· Messiah · Lord of Hosts · Redeemer · Savior · Holy Trinity
- Devil - Capitalize all names for the Devil
Examples:
· Devil · Satan · Adversary · Father of Lies · Evil One · Lucifer
· Prince of Darkness · Beelzebub (meaning Satan)
* Do not capitalize when used in a general sense or as an expletive.(Example: The devil is a formidable adversary.)

http://www.libraryonline.com/default.asp...

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Top Stories Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Is A Race War Brewing? 5 min Clarence688 56
Roman Catholic church only true church, says Va... (Jul '07) 7 min Liam 560,189
Prove there's a god. (Mar '08) 11 min Jac 777,510
I'm looking for a writer to write my true story (Nov '08) 16 min zoeybelle 211
Can REAL PEACE be REALIZED without Jesus Christ?? 31 min Clarence688 4
Bull and Boar - an 18th century Welsh tavern. 52 min Ed Teach 97
Jehovah's Witnesses are true disciple of Jesus ... (Mar '07) 1 hr lovewithin 39,366
Why Im no longer a Christian (Jul '08) 1 hr hpcaban 441,809
Was 9/11 a conspiracy?? (Oct '07) 1 hr YellowPissreality 265,393
Why Should Jesus Love Me? (Feb '08) 4 hr Atheist girl 605,279
More from around the web