Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

There are 238978 comments on the Webbunny tumblelog story from Jul 18, 2009, titled Atheism requires as much faith as religion?. In it, Webbunny tumblelog reports that:

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

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Since: Oct 11

Location hidden

#143023 Dec 11, 2012
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
<quoted text>
Not at the moment...just a question. Why do atheists advertise or promote their belief system?
Not really certain other than possibly as an active means of reinforcing their absolute LACK of belief in anything by physically embodying their blanket disbelief in the passive form of a roadside sign...?

Since: Oct 11

Location hidden

#143024 Dec 11, 2012
macumazahn wrote:
<quoted text>A term of opprobrium.
In context, "eff-up".
Although the term actually refers to the male reproductive coupling gear.
FYI, "bollocks" means 'balls'.

“What's left to defend?”

Since: Jan 11

Freedom

#143025 Dec 11, 2012
Clementia wrote:
<quoted text>
Everyone has their own understanding! hehehehehe
Sikhism denied religion, but it too is called a religion now, that's how things are in this world, people assume and put name tags on you.
Some people are simply wrong, too.

Labels should be used. We should either agree with the definitions, or pretend to in order to facilitate conversation. Labels don't change what things are, they allow us to talk about them without describing them in full detail when we want to invoke them in conversation.

What Christians like to do, is say that atheism is a religion, because they subconsciously realize that it is an insult. They are saying, "Atheism is every bit as irrational as religion." We are saying, "Show us a religious atheist." "Show us the belief system." "Describe this mythical belief system you allude to daily without any supporting evidence." If atheism was a belief system or a religion, they would be able to produce some support for the claim that it is. I have not seen it. I would ask, "Define religion, then show me where atheism fits."

It's frustrating and ironic at the same time. I don't have a belief system. I have a world view created by the methodology of rational skepticism. It hasn't got a name. It's just my world view. They'd probably rather it had a name so they could attack it. It's hard to effectively assault not believing in something.

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#143026 Dec 11, 2012
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
They wouldn't be a part of atheism, so theists could have them as well. Atheism is simply the category of people who do not have religious beliefs. Whatever else defines those people is separate from atheism.
Theism is a category, not a belief system. A theist has a belief in at least one god. An atheist has no beliefs in any gods. Theism and atheism cannot be belief systems. They lack the necessary definition to be called a system, and atheism lacks the belief part also.
<quoted text>
Rejecting a belief is not in itself a belief. I don't need to posit an alternative to religious claims. Atheism is the state of not adopting religious beliefs.
I think religion is harmful. That means I'm anti-theistic. I'm more free to be anti-theistic than theists are, but theists can also be anti-theistic. If you agree that religion is often harmful, you are also, to some degree, anti-theistic. These motivations or opinions do not come from having religious beliefs or not having them. They come from observation, reasoning, and empathy.
We can differentiate beliefs into categories. I haven't got any faith based beliefs at all. Faith based beliefs are very different from beliefs/opinions/conclusions derived in other manners. In a discussion about belief, where the religious and non religious are both involved, the difference must be constantly pointed out. It's really a failing in language that the word "belief" can be used to describe very different ideas.
ok, that'll take time to sink in.

I think you're right english language is very confusing.

If i say that my religion and my belief say the koran or bible is wrong, doesn't that mean i'm an atheist to their belief, as I don't believe that thier belief is true, But my faith and I believe in one God so i'm an theist to atheists but not christians or muslims? Or am i just an infidel to them? I'm just an infidel aren't I? or am I anti-their religion?

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#143027 Dec 11, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I got a good laugh at the atheist ad: "There's probably no God"
HA HA HA HA!!!!
What an argument, huh?
And Dick Dawkins is standing there admiring the ad........
He's thinking " Yup, this'll work!"
Actually everything you say is an argument to become atheist.

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#143028 Dec 11, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
The belief system that's based on the belief that there is no God.
That one.
Well you just blew up the belief you had a brain system.

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#143029 Dec 11, 2012
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
Can you produce anything from this "belief system"?
If it's only one belief, it's not a system.
So, what else is part of the system?
Did you just make it up?
What is that belief system called, and do you know of anyone that follows it?
Besides that, we've told you before, again and again, basic atheism is the lack of belief in gods.
No valid definition of atheism invokes the name of any specific deity.
It's his belief system.

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#143030 Dec 11, 2012
Clementia wrote:
<quoted text>
The belief system of not believing in a belief system, maybe?
The belief system of of believing there is a belief system.

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#143031 Dec 11, 2012
Clementia wrote:
<quoted text>
Everyone has their own understanding! hehehehehe
Sikhism denied religion, but it too is called a religion now, that's how things are in this world, people assume and put name tags on you.
Yah believers think everyone does.

“What's left to defend?”

Since: Jan 11

Freedom

#143032 Dec 11, 2012
Clementia wrote:
<quoted text>
You concentrate on my poem, sweetie. Tick tock goes the clock!!
Time is of little concern. I can write them in about 5 minutes.

Clementia is a lovely girl,
with burning eyes of flame,
a tornado in a dress when twirled,
she rocks me like a hurricane.

She sweeps me off my feet,
she hurls me into the sky,
in the thunderhead we meet,
as lightning strikes I cry.

My tears become a torrent fall,
precipitating anguish across the land,
I cannot reach her after all,
I become buried deep in the sand.

“What's left to defend?”

Since: Jan 11

Freedom

#143033 Dec 11, 2012
Clementia wrote:
<quoted text>
ok, that'll take time to sink in.
I think you're right english language is very confusing.
If i say that my religion and my belief say the koran or bible is wrong, doesn't that mean i'm an atheist to their belief
You don't have to believe that it's wrong to not believe it. If you had never heard of it, you wouldn't believe it either. Since one religious system may posit answers to some of the same questions as others, we see believers in some of these religions who actively object to the alternates, sometimes going to great lengths to demonstrate it, sometimes violently.
Clementia wrote:
, as I don't believe that thier belief is true, But my faith and I believe in one God so i'm an theist to atheists but not christians or muslims?
One definition of "Atheist" is holding the belief that God does not exist. That's a Christian definition. This makes everyone who is not a believer in the Bible God an atheist. This is obviously a useless definition outside of Christianity. It's dumb.

In a technical discussion, we'd want to define "God" and differentiate that from the generic "god". A lot of deists and others believe in "God" but not the same "God" found in the Bible. It gets confusing and frustrating.
Clementia wrote:
Or am i just an infidel to them? I'm just an infidel aren't I? or am I anti-their religion?
I haven't got a clue how Muslims or Christians (the actual people) will see you or define you. Define yourself to the best of your ability and see who can and can't seem to accept it. Some will never stop seeing you how they want to, because they are deluded.

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#143034 Dec 11, 2012
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
Some people are simply wrong, too.
Labels should be used. We should either agree with the definitions, or pretend to in order to facilitate conversation. Labels don't change what things are, they allow us to talk about them without describing them in full detail when we want to invoke them in conversation.
What Christians like to do, is say that atheism is a religion, because they subconsciously realize that it is an insult. They are saying, "Atheism is every bit as irrational as religion." We are saying, "Show us a religious atheist." "Show us the belief system." "Describe this mythical belief system you allude to daily without any supporting evidence." If atheism was a belief system or a religion, they would be able to produce some support for the claim that it is. I have not seen it. I would ask, "Define religion, then show me where atheism fits."
It's frustrating and ironic at the same time. I don't have a belief system. I have a world view created by the methodology of rational skepticism. It hasn't got a name. It's just my world view. They'd probably rather it had a name so they could attack it. It's hard to effectively assault not believing in something.
In my religion or culture people like you are not called atheists, that's why i get so confused in english. In those days people who said, from their mouths that they don't believe in God didn't even exist, maybe there was 1 or 2 people in India, but i even doubt that. An atheist in my religion is a person who doesn't believe in 'God' from their hearts. They are the baddest people on this planet.

"Those who have love from the bottom of their hearts are true, those who have one thing in their heart and another on their lips are a burden on this earth." -GGS

They say we believe in one God, but then the kill other people because they have greed, jealousy or fear in their hearts.

labels are not always good, coz u end up judging the thing before u know anything about it. I told u i'm 'religious' u thought i would be a nut like them (i'm a nut in my own way), but if i'm not the same religious as them I shouldn't have been given the same label, u get what i mean?

It doesn't make any difference to me if atheism is a belief or not, my opinion of you will not change, whatever makes you guys happy.

yh, i see what they try to do.

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#143035 Dec 11, 2012
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text> Yah believers think everyone does.
what? r u picking on me? u want a fight, eh? u gonna get smashed by a girl, lol these guys are gonna laugh at u, forget it! save yourself the shame!

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#143036 Dec 11, 2012
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
Time is of little concern. I can write them in about 5 minutes.
Clementia is a lovely girl,
with burning eyes of flame,
a tornado in a dress when twirled,
she rocks me like a hurricane.
She sweeps me off my feet,
she hurls me into the sky,
in the thunderhead we meet,
as lightning strikes I cry.
My tears become a torrent fall,
precipitating anguish across the land,
I cannot reach her after all,
I become buried deep in the sand.
Oh my God, that is beautiful, thank you very much i'm going to save that and then put it in my diary.

Don't worry, I got a bucket and spade, I'll rescue you!!:-)

Thank you very much again!:-)))))))

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

Since: Sep 08

The Borderland of Sol

#143037 Dec 11, 2012
just an allusion wrote:
<quoted text>
FYI, "bollocks" means 'balls'.
Actually, the entire male docking gear.

What I said.

“What's left to defend?”

Since: Jan 11

Freedom

#143038 Dec 11, 2012
Clementia wrote:
<quoted text>
In my religion or culture people like you are not called atheists, that's why i get so confused in english. In those days people who said, from their mouths that they don't believe in God didn't even exist, maybe there was 1 or 2 people in India, but i even doubt that. An atheist in my religion is a person who doesn't believe in 'God' from their hearts. They are the baddest people on this planet.
"Those who have love from the bottom of their hearts are true, those who have one thing in their heart and another on their lips are a burden on this earth." -GGS
They say we believe in one God, but then the kill other people because they have greed, jealousy or fear in their hearts.
labels are not always good, coz u end up judging the thing before u know anything about it. I told u i'm 'religious' u thought i would be a nut like them (i'm a nut in my own way), but if i'm not the same religious as them I shouldn't have been given the same label, u get what i mean?
It doesn't make any difference to me if atheism is a belief or not, my opinion of you will not change, whatever makes you guys happy.
yh, i see what they try to do.
You're a good nut.

I don't personally rely on labels to tell me much about a person. I need to talk to them about various things before I understand them and their perspective.

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#143039 Dec 11, 2012
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
You don't have to believe that it's wrong to not believe it. If you had never heard of it, you wouldn't believe it either. Since one religious system may posit answers to some of the same questions as others, we see believers in some of these religions who actively object to the alternates, sometimes going to great lengths to demonstrate it, sometimes violently.
<quoted text>
One definition of "Atheist" is holding the belief that God does not exist. That's a Christian definition. This makes everyone who is not a believer in the Bible God an atheist. This is obviously a useless definition outside of Christianity. It's dumb.
In a technical discussion, we'd want to define "God" and differentiate that from the generic "god". A lot of deists and others believe in "God" but not the same "God" found in the Bible. It gets confusing and frustrating.
<quoted text>
I haven't got a clue how Muslims or Christians (the actual people) will see you or define you. Define yourself to the best of your ability and see who can and can't seem to accept it. Some will never stop seeing you how they want to, because they are deluded.
No, I have no problem with other religions or non-beliefs, but when they cause problems in the world and make my life hell then I do have a problem with their religious/non-religious beliefs.

That's the point I was getting at, they all think we going to hell, so we all atheists to them.

Basically every religion reflects the personality of the writer.

This God thing has caused more problems than anything, "reading the vedas brahma wasted his life"...."reading false things ignorant people are happy."

My faith was saying, stop and think, u fools, you're destroying your life and the lives of the people around you by believing the things written in your religions.

yh and there's alot of them, lol.

“What's left to defend?”

Since: Jan 11

Freedom

#143040 Dec 11, 2012
Clementia wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh my God, that is beautiful, thank you very much i'm going to save that and then put it in my diary.
Don't worry, I got a bucket and spade, I'll rescue you!!:-)
Thank you very much again!:-)))))))
You're welcome.

<blushing>

Maybe you'll get another.

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#143041 Dec 11, 2012
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
You're a good nut.
I don't personally rely on labels to tell me much about a person. I need to talk to them about various things before I understand them and their perspective.
If you say so.:-)

I think if I was a nut I would either be an almond or a hazelnut.

What kind of nut would you be?

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#143042 Dec 11, 2012
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
You're welcome.
<blushing>
Maybe you'll get another.
I hope so!:-)

right, i'm off to sleep, goodnite! sweetie sweet dreams!!

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