Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story
Lily GaGa

Ipoh, Malaysia

#123430 Sep 19, 2012
Christians are disgusted by Muhammed & a 9yr girl. Muslims are disgusted by priests & 9yr boys. Atheists are just plain disgusted.

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#123444 Sep 19, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I see you as a inteligent sweetheart. A real person who isn't selfish.
Ahhhhhhhhh...

how am I supposed to argue with you when you say nice stuff???

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#123445 Sep 19, 2012
TheGoodTheBadTheUgly wrote:
<quoted text>You seem to have a lot of ideas.
wow. so witty

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#123451 Sep 19, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Ahhhhhhhhh...
how am I supposed to argue with you when you say nice stuff???
Oh, I thought he said shellfish.

Carrion

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#123453 Sep 19, 2012
TheGoodTheBadTheUgly wrote:
<quoted text>Schlemiel thou are.
I don't think Jewish people talk like that.

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#123454 Sep 19, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
stuff about not "believing" in science
Here's the thing, what do you expect scientists to do? You mentioned that "there are more than 20 theories about abiogensis." I don't know whether that's accurate, but...what do you expect?

How do you expect science to tackle these questions about life's origins? About evolution?

Do you honestly expect scientists to say "gosh, this is hard. Maybe intractable. I don't know, since we haven't worked on it very long. But it's so hard I just want to chose a religion and claim that they are correct. Oh...I don't know...how about Hinduism? Ok. The Hindus have it right."

Or your religion. Or some other one - seriously, is this what you expect scientists to do? Ignore all evidence and all current knowledge and just give up on research by adopting some dogmatic, ancient religion?

Because that seems to be what you're arguing for.

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#123455 Sep 19, 2012
TheGoodTheBadTheUgly wrote:
<quoted text>Schlemiel thou are.
Double dumb schlemiel on you, with a whooooooooole lot of baka kuso yaro on top.

:)
Ray

Newark, NJ

#123456 Sep 19, 2012
Double Fine wrote:
<quoted text>\
Okay...
So your god "blesses" children with AIDS?
Not helping, amigo
agaim, avoiding the question isnt helping your case. if you want to claim that God is responsable, then do you have a woldview that can make Gods existance imposible because of evil, while still being able to accurately define what evil is. if you dont, then i dont see the force of your arguemnt. on the other hand, if you want to claim that these poor kids having aids is evil, which i agree, then you must first posit a moral foundation upon which you can make your claim. thats something that is internally consistant with my views, but not the atheistic general worldview.

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#123457 Sep 19, 2012
It aint necessarily so wrote:
Nobody with any credibility doubts the historicity of the man Jesus? Negro, please! I don't need to rebut that.
Because you cannot. All you can do is refer to me as 'Negro' and be sarcastic. Absent anything of substance that is all you have. So why compare Santa to historical Jesus?


http://www.youtube.com/watch...
http:/en.wkikpedia.org/wiki/Hi storical_Jesus

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#123458 Sep 19, 2012
Ahoy mateys. Today, September 19, 2012 is International Talk Like a Pirate Day!

Ramen!

“There's a feeling I get...”

Since: Jun 11

...when I look to the West

#123459 Sep 19, 2012
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually it isn't the Cambrian that is the biggest mystery.
It is what led to it... that the fossil record is lacking.
"The Ediacara", but they have found a few good deposits.
What is even more puzzling about it all is why it seemed to thrive and then everything in that realm vanished. And the Cambrian fossils replaced everything. It would seem the chemical composition of the oceans must have changed and that allowed a different type biota to create what became everything we know now. that is the 64 dollar question.
Yes. Different chemicals in the oceans could work against fossilisation.

“There's a feeling I get...”

Since: Jun 11

...when I look to the West

#123460 Sep 19, 2012
Ray wrote:
<quoted text>
agaim, avoiding the question isnt helping your case. if you want to claim that God is responsable, then do you have a woldview that can make Gods existance imposible because of evil, while still being able to accurately define what evil is. if you dont, then i dont see the force of your arguemnt. on the other hand, if you want to claim that these poor kids having aids is evil, which i agree, then you must first posit a moral foundation upon which you can make your claim. thats something that is internally consistant with my views, but not the atheistic general worldview.
Say what?

Here is my worldview:

1) I don't have imaginary friends
2) I don't believe in ghosts, zombies, pixies, pegasi, fairies, giants, olympians, gods etc.
3) AIDS, Cancer, Diabetes and Malaria are horrible diseases. Anyone with the ability to create and spread it, OR halt its influence immediately, is EVIL
Ray

Newark, NJ

#123461 Sep 19, 2012
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
I'd say more psychological than philosophical, and not evidential at all, or else you would not poo-poo the studies. They were quite clear in confirming the null hypothesis.
It's probably best if you drop the references to clear studies and evidence, and recognize that your beliefs are based on a choice to believe. There is no arguing against that.
i never attempted to prove prayer, nor was it my intention to say that the studies were incorrect in their findings. i dont do any kind of top down analysis if i can avoid it, and so im willing to discuss this philosophically and theologically. i dont rest my case for God on prayer alone. in any case, i believe in God because of the begining of life, the finetuning of the constants in the universe, the historical jesus, the meaning we seek in this world, and the morality we hold in this world. all of those arguements, plus a few others, are philosophical and base either on scientists or experience. im fully willing to test those beliefs whenever the chance arises.
Ray

Newark, NJ

#123463 Sep 19, 2012
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
I understand. Faith is independent of evidence.
The studies cited, incidentally, were not done in a lab. They were studies of people before and after invasive cardiac therapy.
<quoted text>
Where would that be? I can't think of a more clear demonstration of the presence or absence of the supernatural than to examine it's impact on the natural world. That pretty much limits you to studying prayer and miracles, doesn't it?
i said lab in a sort of general way, not really literal. there are too many variable to say that prayer can be tested in the lab. its more clear cut to base Gods existance on other areas. my arguements for God are from the existance of the universe, the finetuning of the universe, the meaning we seek in our personal lives, the existance of morals in this universe, and the historical existance of jesus. the first two are scientific, the next two are philosophical and based on experience and logic, and the last one is based on history. all of these arguements are testable, and so they should be satistying to the intelectual. i do believe that God can be known from prayer and experience, but those arent the only ways to know that God exists.
Ray

Newark, NJ

#123464 Sep 19, 2012
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
I would classify it as the luck of the draw.
Nothing more.
then i definately dont see the point your making. if God doesnt exist, and all of those kids are suffering because of the various chance events that occur, then i dont see why it would necessarily matter. if whats happening to them is evil however, then i would like to get internally consistant answers on this matter from anyone that makes the claim. im just seeking clarity on your position and what point you are making given all the posts that have been made.
Eye Heart Jesus

Hamilton, Canada

#123465 Sep 19, 2012
Richardfs wrote:
<quoted text>
That makes no sense at all. You only think my life is bleak because I don't believe in your fairy tale. Well guess what billions of people don't believe in your bibull.
In fact life is much brighter when one can live without the specter of some evil god peering over your shoulder. All the time ready to crush you because you think the girl standing on the corner is really cute.
Life is so much sweeter when you do a kind
deed not to appease some brutish god but simply
because it feels good.
I feel sorry for you are trapped in a life of lies
and telling lies, why, because you are too afraid
to stand on your own two feet.
What u r describing couldnt be farther from the truth my friend.
Let me reiterate, that what I meant with my post, was that IF I happen to be right with my 'God-theory' as u call it, then just as a 'test tube' may shatter my Christian beliefs, once you reach death and find out that my 'theory' happens to be true, your rejection of God will have bleak consequences... To say the least.

Ps since when is it an abomination to notice a girl's cuteness ?? You must have been part of a cult... Now I'm starting to understand the source of your rage..:(
God is love:)

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#123466 Sep 19, 2012
Eye Heart Jesus wrote:
<quoted text>
In case you're out of the science-loop... Physics is only supporting theism now more than it ever has before, and disproving evolution more each day.
Really? Would you care to point to the refereed journal where these claims are made?
Physics only enhances God's magnificence as it allows us to further our understanding of just how beautifully majestic and complex God created us and the world around us. It just further emphasiZes how much significance and care He put into His amazing creation :)
I'm so glad that you can mold your delusions into something that you think agrees with reality. But physics doesn't say *anything* about theism at all.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#123467 Sep 19, 2012
Eye Heart Jesus wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes u said it right... And this is WHY physicists and all other branches of scientists are perplexed and are seriously considering that a spiritual real exists to explain this:))
Really? I have seen no such discussion in any of the physics journals.
Science can only explain so much.... When matter is observed at a quantum level, they can act pretty peculiar- they can interchange from waves to particles. I'm fully aware of this.
it is even more unusual than you let on. Quantum particles are simultaneously waves and particles.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#123468 Sep 19, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
One problem that I can point out and I donít need a scientific research paper to explain. How did it all start from lifeless material? Going back to the very beginning. The trigger mechanism that started all life. Thereís at least twenty different hypothesis.
First of all, NONE of the chemicals in your body right now are alive. YOU are made from 'lifeless material' at the most basic level. Life isn't an 'addition', it is simply a matter of sufficient complexity. And standard chemistry does allow for the development of such complexity naturally.

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#123469 Sep 19, 2012
Ray wrote:
<quoted text>
i never attempted to prove prayer, nor was it my intention to say that the studies were incorrect in their findings. i dont do any kind of top down analysis if i can avoid it, and so im willing to discuss this philosophically and theologically. i dont rest my case for God on prayer alone. in any case, i believe in God because of the begining of life, the finetuning of the constants in the universe, the historical jesus, the meaning we seek in this world, and the morality we hold in this world. all of those arguements, plus a few others, are philosophical and base either on scientists or experience. im fully willing to test those beliefs whenever the chance arises.
Okay, let's look at those --

Prayer -- all evidence says prayer has zero effect.

Beginning of life -- unless you claim to know something no one else in the entire world knows, you really don't know how life began, you're just making stuff up.

"Fine tuning" of the universe assumes the entire universe was created just for humans and is nothing more than a modern version of a geocentric argument.

Historical Yeshua bin Yosheph has actually never been established. There is no record of Herod killing male children nor of a Passover tradition between the Romans and Hebrew. A star cannot pinpoint a particular house, etc.

Morality as defined by religion is about the worst misogynistic, slave culture morality anyone could possibly imagine. Name 1, just 1, moral precept that you can prove actually originated from your religion.

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