Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

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Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.
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ROCCO

Desert Hot Springs, CA

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#225632
Apr 18, 2014
 
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> Yes you did.Right here.
I think if you would look at some statistics on irreligion, you will see the evidence that not having God prevalent in society does not cause societies to become cesspools; in fact, just the opposite seems to be true.
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<quoted text> That is not what you stated. See above.
<quoted text> Some countries can and have functioned without a Christian influence. In antiquity there was Rome. Slavery was rampant. They had zero rights. There was pedophilia, pederasty, and no Roman citizen could ever be accused of rape or murder of a slave. That means they could rape or kill their slaves at will with impunity. <quoted text> I don't see any reason.
<quoted text> No i do not know your beliefs. I only know you have not demonstrated you know the difference between assumptions and facts. And your positions would meet with the approval of most Topix atheists.
<quoted text> <snipped for space> If that is true then by all means relocate to China! Certainly godless societies can function for a time but i would say they cannot function for any extended period of time without becoming totalitarian.
<quoted text> LOLOLOL. Take a reality break. If you want to live in one of them no God societies like China or North Korea because they are so progressive then go there. If you think all us Christians are liars then go to China?

ROCCO SAID:
I'm not "suggesting" anything at all. I've stated that (some) non-God societies function quite well despite the lack of belief in a Christian deity. You apparently disagree. You further assert that I consider Christianity to be harmful or a joke, and that there is no reason to doubt that I believe that. Do you personally know my religious belief? Am I an atheist? Did somewhere I say Christianity is harmful, or a joke?

Dude, you might benefit from cutting back on projecting so much.

Apparently, you disagree with the fact that Australia, Iceland, Austria, The Netherlands, Germany, South Korea, France, The Czech Republic, Japan and China are highly functioning countries with high literacy rates, good healthcare systems, high academic achievement, relatively high to very high standard of living, low crime, etc. That does suggest that the belief a deity must be involved for a society to function well is at least suspect, and strongly indicative that it is not necessarily true.

And do you know how impossible it is to find a religious (Christian) website/source that will pony up facts that don't agree with their mission? Just how many of you - no, let's make it just you - will provide any information at all that some countries can get along quite nicely without a deity. IIMO, there are fewer dishonest non-Christians than there are dishonest Christians. To get to the truth, one must pull the wool from one's eyes and look to multiple sources; the sources that don't want you to do that are, too often, trying to keep something under wraps rather than have it bathed in brilliant light.

Unlike you, I am willing to look at a whole story, not just the one I can read through the narrow swath of a set of blinders which blurs everything except a single missive.

ROCCO SAYS: I am not responsible for your butchery to my post. It's obvious you don't like the facts I ponied up, so you try to dodge and veer down another alleyway. I do not accept responsibility for your unwillingness and/or inability to acknowledge legitimate claims. It's obvious you can't/won't acknowledge anything that isn't in lockstep with your personal beliefs, and especially your personal opinions. Personally, I don't do Alice in Wonderland.

And you can't resist the old standby cliche: "America. Love it or Leave It". How stale.

And just WTF did North Korea have to do with this discussion?

Give it a break. I suspect your halo has slipped down around your throat and is restricting your air supply.
ROCCO

Desert Hot Springs, CA

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#225633
Apr 18, 2014
 
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text>
...... And your positions would meet with the approval of most Topix atheists......
Technically, this may be a salient point by you, and I suspect it's true.

That said, it would also be true to any Christian (which you are determined to make this about) who was willing to be completely open and honest with himself, and especially to others.

Since: Jun 12

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#225634
Apr 18, 2014
 
ROCCO wrote:
<quoted text>I'm not "suggesting" anything at all. I've stated that (some) non-God societies function quite well despite the lack of belief in a Christian deity. You apparently disagree.
Not really. But i do note you also have comprehension problems.
You further assert that I consider Christianity to be harmful or a joke, and that there is no reason to doubt that I believe that.
Correct on he latter. You also assert you believe most Christians are liars. While non Christians are more truthful.
Do you personally know my religious belief? Am I an atheist? Did somewhere I say Christianity is harmful, or a joke?
Repeating yourself. Have you packed your toothbrush for your extended trip to China?
Apparently, you disagree with the fact that Australia, Iceland, Austria, The Netherlands, Germany, South Korea, France, The Czech Republic, Japan and China are highly functioning countries with high literacy rates, good healthcare systems, high academic achievement, relatively high to very high standard of living, low crime, etc.
What part of my previous post are you not understanding? What part of this sentence are you not understanding?
''Some countries can and have functioned without a Christian influence.''
That does suggest that the belief a deity must be involved for a society to function well is at least suspect, and strongly indicative that it is not necessarily true.
Go to China.
ROCCO SAYS: I am not responsible for your butchery to my post. It's obvious you don't like the facts I ponied up, so you try to dodge and veer down another alleyway. I do not accept responsibility for your unwillingness and/or inability to acknowledge legitimate claims.
You have no legit claims nor do you have any legit facts. Just accusations.
It's obvious you can't/won't acknowledge anything that isn't in lockstep with your personal beliefs, and especially your personal opinions.
Personal attacks against me by insinuating i am racist or a liar are not legit claims. Your off into absurdity. Do you even know how to use the quote feature here?
And you can't resist the old standby cliche: "America. Love it or Leave It". How stale.
It is true. If you resent The United States then leave. Get out.
And just WTF did North Korea have to do with this discussion?
North Korea is one of them more honest non Christian countries. More progressive according to your reasoning because there are no Christian liars there. No Christian influence at all.
Give it a break. I suspect your halo has slipped down around your throat and is restricting your air supply.
Don't have a halo and i breath just fine. Just more cheap shots because you cannot defend your positions or assertions.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

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#225635
Apr 18, 2014
 
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>Let's see, the 'rational atheist' oxymorons used to claim the universe always existed.

Now they claim it was created out of nothing at a certain point in time, just like the Bible says.

Only 'rational atheist' oxymrons claim it 'just happened all by itself'.

How's that for faith?

Smirk.
Rational atheists say "we don't know."

Yet.

Since: Jun 12

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#225636
Apr 18, 2014
 
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
AMENDMENT XIII
Section 1.
Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
AMENDMENT XIV
Section 1.
All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
The unalienable rights come from We The People.


Then you agree the slaves of Rome had no unalienable protection from rape or murder and Roman masters had the right to use slave children as sex toys. That is since rights come from men and not God.

By the way the Declaration of Independence established the United States of America. Without that there would have been no constitution. You have not answered any of the tough questions put forth because you cannot. You just ignore them and perhaps hope they go away.

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

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#225637
Apr 18, 2014
 

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lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> North Korea is one of them more honest non Christian countries. More progressive according to your reasoning because there are no Christian liars there. No Christian influence at all.
<quoted text> Don't have a halo and i breath just fine. Just more cheap shots because you cannot defend your positions or assertions.
I told you, stupid soldier.

It's not "one of them...countries," it's "one of them there...countries."

Twenty pushups, and KP duty for one week.

Dismissed.

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

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#225638
Apr 18, 2014
 

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lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text>
Then you agree the slaves of Rome had no unalienable protection from rape or murder and Roman masters had the right to use slave children as sex toys.
We don't allow perverts in the Marines, soldier.

Try the Catholic Church, they have almost a monopoly on this sort of stuff.
Eagle 12

Troy, IL

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#225639
Apr 18, 2014
 
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
The point is that if you go to Norway, or Denmark, or Sweden, or Finland, you will find that just about everybody you meet is a nonbeliever.
And yes, you DO need to have a passport to travel to those countries.
In the world news the crises in the Ukraine continues to make the headlines. Ukraine is very much a part of Europe but Russia doesn’t have to worry about Ukraine’s fellow European neighbors. Why? Because the godless Europeans don’t care. The European community is not going to sacrifice their soldiers for a fellow country.

I got news for you and all of Europe. The United States doesn’t care either. Let Putin gobble up the Ukraine and then start digesting all of Europe piece by piece. It’s not worth fighting for again.

Your beloved Europe stands today free from tyranny because of the sacrifice of American Servicemen and their families. Thousands are still buried on European soil.

Over 98 % were Christian, as evidence of their grave memorial crosses. And all this sacrifice was for what? So the godless Europeans could thumb their arrogant noses at our sacrifice and our God. Smugly tell us that there’s no God. Let Russia have Europe or all they want of it.

If you love Europe get ready to defend it because I’m not going to send my grandchildren to that dark and dismal content to fight for Atheism. The sooner the United States pulls out of NATO the better. And we will leave NATO some day in the future.
Eagle 12

Troy, IL

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#225640
Apr 18, 2014
 
Let all of Europe fall to Russia.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Since: Dec 10

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#225641
Apr 18, 2014
 
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text>
Then you agree the slaves of Rome had no unalienable protection from rape or murder and Roman masters had the right to use slave children as sex toys. That is since rights come from men and not God.
By the way the Declaration of Independence established the United States of America. Without that there would have been no constitution. You have not answered any of the tough questions put forth because you cannot. You just ignore them and perhaps hope they go away.
The power of a King or the power of god was invested in the people.
Therefore unalienable rights became a proclamation of the people, written by the founding fathers. The rights are given to us by us, but if you believe they were bestowed by a creator then it is so. It doesn't mean there is a creator, it means no man can take these rights from you. Lest they be enemies of the Republic. Which is bound by the constitution,
AKA: We are a Constitutional Republic, and

We the people said these are our right's,
Specifically amendments cover life liberty and freedom , of religion , or from it and that no man may own another. Your Roman slave bull shit has no place in America. All of which are
crimes in our society , and yes there are men who uphold the constitution , who will take you to be tried in a court of law and put you in prison for trying to have slave, or use people as sex toys or murder them. This is not because a god created morals, it is because men created his morals and laws to prosecute those who violate them.

All this horse shit you are spewing is nonsense, and you can make it up as you go but it's still horse shit, you can try to ignore that but it will still be horse shit.

“Love much, trust none”

Since: Jul 11

There

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#225642
Apr 18, 2014
 

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lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text>
Then you agree the slaves of Rome had no unalienable protection from rape or murder and Roman masters had the right to use slave children as sex toys......
Exactly like your Bible says to treat slaves.

Jews were not much different from any other culture of the time.
ROCCO

Desert Hot Springs, CA

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#225643
Apr 18, 2014
 
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> Not really. But i do note you also have comprehension problems. <quoted text> Correct on he latter. You also assert you believe most Christians are liars. While non Christians are more truthful. <quoted text> Repeating yourself. Have you packed your toothbrush for your extended trip to China?
<quoted text> What part of my previous post are you not understanding? What part of this sentence are you not understanding?
''Some countries can and have functioned without a Christian influence.''
<quoted text> Go to China.
<quoted text> You have no legit claims nor do you have any legit facts. Just accusations. <quoted text> Personal attacks against me by insinuating i am racist or a liar are not legit claims. Your off into absurdity. Do you even know how to use the quote feature here?
<quoted text> It is true. If you resent The United States then leave. Get out.
<quoted text> North Korea is one of them more honest non Christian countries. More progressive according to your reasoning because there are no Christian liars there. No Christian influence at all.
<quoted text> Don't have a halo and i breath just fine. Just more cheap shots because you cannot defend your positions or assertions.
When you use the same meanings for words that I use, maybe we'll make some progress.

When you can stop claiming I assert things that aren't so, maybe we'll make some progress.

When you can stop claiming what I say is tantamount to calling you a liar and a racist, maybe we'll make some progress.

When you understand that "many" does not mean "all", we'll make some progress.

When you stop making projections maybe we'll make some progress.

When you stop presuming one should leave the country because he has more diverse opinions and viewpoints than you, maybe we'll make some progress.

When you can show respect for another's beliefs, opinions and views instead of demeaning and belittling them, maybe we'll make some progress.

When you can understand that facts don't only inure to your side of an exchange, maybe we'll make some progress.

When..........there is no when. You can't deal with stationary goalposts. I don't chase them all over the globe.

“Michin yeoja”

Since: Oct 10

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#225644
Apr 18, 2014
 
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
We have a street gang here in L.A. by the name of Insane Crips.
Is there a branch in SF?
Here in Connecticut, well here in one house in Connecticut, well here in one bedroom in Connecticut, we have something called an Insane Crop.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons... '_nine.JPG

Tell HL River says Hi !!!!

“Michin yeoja”

Since: Oct 10

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#225645
Apr 18, 2014
 
Oh well, it's better that nobody saw that anyway.

;-p
andet1987

Chicago, IL

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#225646
Apr 18, 2014
 
Anon wrote:
<quoted text>
I think we all have this memorized by now. No need to keep posting it...
i am only good in copy and paste. that's the only way i can participate.:)
andet1987

Chicago, IL

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#225647
Apr 18, 2014
 
wilderide wrote:
<quoted text>
Mark 10: 17-29
"17 As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him.“Good teacher,” he asked,“what must I do to inherit eternal life?”
18 “Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered.“No one is good—except God alone. 19 You know the commandments:‘You shall not murder, you shall not commit adultery, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, you shall not defraud, honor your father and mother.’[d]”
20 “Teacher,” he declared,“all these I have kept since I was a boy.”
21 Jesus looked at him and loved him.“One thing you lack,” he said.“Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
22 At this the man’s face fell. He went away sad, because he had great wealth.
23 Jesus looked around and said to his disciples,“How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of God!”
24 The disciples were amazed at his words. But Jesus said again,“Children, how hard it is[e] to enter the kingdom of God! 25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.”
26 The disciples were even more amazed, and said to each other,“Who then can be saved?”
27 Jesus looked at them and said,“With man this is impossible, but not with God; all things are possible with God.”
28 Then Peter spoke up,“We have left everything to follow you!”
29 “Truly I tell you,” Jesus replied,“no one who has left home or brothers or sisters or mother or father or children or fields for me and the gospel 30 will fail to receive a hundred times as much in this present age: homes, brothers, sisters, mothers, children and fields—along with persecutions—and in the age to come eternal life. 31 But many who are first will be last, and the last first.”
Why don't Christians ever pay attention to that Bible they love to thump at others?
hi Wilderide :)

you are knowledgeable about the Bible ? but you are not a Christian ?

everything i have is only temporary. someday, i will leave all of them to my close relatives.

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

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#225648
Apr 18, 2014
 
River Tam wrote:
<quoted text>
Here in Connecticut, well here in one house in Connecticut, well here in one bedroom in Connecticut, we have something called an Insane Crop.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons... '_nine.JPG
Tell HL River says Hi !!!!
XXOO
andet1987

Chicago, IL

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#225649
Apr 18, 2014
 
Campbell wrote:
Thank Goodness the young in this country are catching onto the game religious folks promote their artificial scaffolding and crutch: Religion and the Christian church in particular has been responsible for more evil acts than any other entity in the world. Granted often the government and church were entwined in authoritarian efforts but no group has ever
withstood the trials of time better than those with the power. The crusades wiped out hundreds of thousands for simply
differing beliefs.
For more than a thousand years the church required infant baptism. When ordinary folks began to doubt that kind of
requirement and their attendance/donations began to falter the church made it optional. The scripture is still there but
is never mentioned in that way.
For many thousands of years the church conducted witch hunts and tortured and put to death a conservative estimate of
100,000 innocent young women because they had been accused of witchcraft. When the general population caught on to the
fact that there is no such thing as a witch the church backed away and shut up. The scripture is still there.
For thousands of years the church supported slavery, often accommodated it. When ordinary folks realized slavery is a
practice for which there is no justification...guess what? The church backed away and never mentions the numerous
scriptures in the bible which lend support to the practice.
Now the thing is hell itself. After millions of preachers preaching hundreds of millions of hell fire and brimstone
sermons and the very concept of eternal torture and misery for non believing individuals making mistakes while living
their lives has become extremely distasteful to the common man they are adamant in their insistance that it's all been
errors in translation and are now preaching that hell is merely the eternal separation of man from god. All the scripture
is still there but once again they have changed their position.
The church owns more real property in this world than any other entity except the governments. The Vatican City has a
building which covers blocks and is loaded with rare treasures and art works which conservatively are worth hundreds of
billions of dollars. All this while more than 900,000,000 humans are starving to death or suffering from the effects of
malnutrition. By default the starving are mostly children.
but why is it that Christianity is still the number one religion when it comes to followers, despite of what you have written above ?
andet1987

Chicago, IL

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#225650
Apr 18, 2014
 

“Michin yeoja”

Since: Oct 10

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#225652
Apr 19, 2014
 

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andet1987 wrote:
<quoted text>
but why is it that Christianity is still the number one religion when it comes to followers, despite of what you have written above ?
Do you know what tomorrow is?

It's Zombie Jesus Day !!!!

The dead will arise and influence all the Sauls of the World !!!!

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