Why I知 no longer a Christian

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#440379
Jan 29, 2013
 

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water_nymph wrote:
<quoted text>You think that only the Bible has the 'right' information, and then only if it is interpreted as you understand to be 'right'. That's what every other Christian thinks. The Muslims think that only their holy book is the 'right' one, and then only if interpreted as each of them understands it.
With 39,000 and growing sects of Christianity, I would say that it is so subjective that it is open to anyone to interpret it in the manner they think is 'right'. That's the problem with every and all religions. They are subjective enough to be individual time and again.
Christians can't even agree on basic teachings, yet they expect everyone else to worship in the way they personally think is the 'right' way.
They will make terrible remarks about how another Christian believes. They will disparage (to put it kindly) others of their own religion without a thought. How do you think that looks to those outside your faith? There are actually churches who print pamphlets degrading other sects of the Christian religion, calling them cults, idolaters, demons and such. Had they looked up the word 'cult', they would have known that they too are a cult as they worship a supernatural being. But that doesn't stop anyone from doing it.
I have no problem with someone coming to their own understanding of any scriptures by study, prayer/meditation, etc. unless it harms other human beings. Religion has harmed mankind on a very large scale for thousands of years. Not just Christianity, but Christianity and Islam have by far been the worst since their invention.
I believe what Jesus said when he said that heaven is within you (or in your midst as some people interpret it). That means heaven is in the here and now. All you have to do is recognize that the kingdom is within and all around you. So is hell. It is of our own making, not that of God. There are no literal streets paved with gold. There are no literal priceless jewels. No God would need those, unless he were only trying to attract those to whom these things are important..a bauble dangled in front of the nose of elitists. That would not comply with the teachings of Jesus, anyway.
The jewels are the things we recognize on a daily basis, and the lessons we learn. The gold is what is inside of us.
To hope, as some here do, that someone will be tortured forever just for disagreeing with them is an abomination and a God who would do that is not worth worshiping. That's not justice, it's tyranny as practiced by a sociopath.
So, interpretation is everything. It is also nothing. It is everything to those who think they have all the answers, and nothing to those who know that no one has all the answers.
We believe as we do because of our own experiences, our own study, our own ability to understand or the lack thereof. There is not a single religion that applies to everyone, proven by humanity itself. An estimated 2.1 billion Christians who can't agree is proof that no one of them has all the answers. We are left to our own seeking or following.
I am not saying one group or sect has a monopoly on the truth. And if someone wishes to base their beliefs on something other than the Bible that is their choice. My point is if someone chooses to base their beliefs on the Bible then they should research those beliefs for themselves instead of just going by what someone else has told them. If someone is going to base their beliefs on the Bible then they should read it first hand. Whatever people base their beliefs on is their business. I simply am not a fan of people coming to a position because someone else told them to. That goes for politics or anything else

You said:

"I have no problem with someone coming to their own understanding of any scriptures by study, prayer/meditation, etc."

Would you consider someone coming to their own understanding if it is simply repeating what someone else told them?

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#440380
Jan 29, 2013
 

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water_nymph wrote:
<quoted text> I personally think most human beings, even those in prison, are about as likely to forgive you if you say you're sorry as does any God. They just won't make you a promise of eternal life. And that's really what Christianity is about...not forgiveness. If it were only forgiveness, with no promise of something special that you think others won't get, then there wouldn't be a single person who is Christian who could not be persuaded by a God with more to offer.
Whether a prisoner is more likely to forgive someone than God would be a different conversation. The discussion was based on deterrence and does being answerable to God act as more of a deterrent for a believer than being answerable to man. If a believer is confident God will forgive them than fear of punishment from God does not serve as more of a deterrent than punishment by man. And especially if a believer feels God has already forgiven all future sins then there is no possibility of punishment from God being a deterrent for that believer. Deterrence is subjective and is effective to the extent that the person fears the repercussions.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

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#440381
Jan 29, 2013
 

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G_O_D wrote:
<quoted text>
Them taste jest like rat tirds.
Them's the ones ya pick up off'n the ground in Greece.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

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#440382
Jan 29, 2013
 
Proxysan wrote:
So, what's been happening since I've been gone?
We been paint'n over the slogans on yer soapbox, piss'n on yer Darth Nader costume, an stomp'n on yer 24 karat gold plated KAZOO. Jist the usual stuff ...Y'know?

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#440383
Jan 29, 2013
 

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water_nymph wrote:
<quoted text>Thank you, Skom. I have a hard time just wrapping my mind around behavior like that. Why would anyone say a friend had died if they hadn't? I don't get the idea behind that. I don't get the idea behind being nasty to people who lost a friend or acquaintance that they truly liked. I don't get a lot of stuff, I suppose.
I suspect this poster is either pretending to be Duststorm or the poster known as Duststorm has always been a sock. In which case then they are intentionally being as offensive as possible just for the sake of doing so to get a reaction.

Of course the question still remains what motivates someone, whether they are pretending to be someone else or not, to engage in such behavior? My guess is they resent seeing people mourning the loss of a loved one knowing their own passing would not invoke the same reaction from the people that know them. At bare minimum I'd assume someone who seeks pleasure out of intruding on such a private moment has very few things in their life that brings them joy. And haven given up any hope that will change they resort to trying to make other people as miserable as they are.

Even in an anonymous setting, people tend to reveal quite a bit about themselves. And having to face no consequences for their actions affords quite a bit of freedom for people to show their true colors. For whatever reason misery loves company. I have never understand that as how does someone else going thru difficult times make my situation any better? It is definitely one of the more twisted aspects of human psychology.

“Love much, trust none”

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#440384
Jan 29, 2013
 
AnnieJ wrote:
<quoted text>
Then some worship this god.
Deuteronomy 32:39-42
泥o you see it now? Do you see that I知 the one?
Do you see that there痴 no other god beside me?
I bring death and I give life, I wound and I heal
there is no getting away from or around me!
I raise my hand in solemn oath;
I say,選知 always around. By that very life I promise:
When I sharpen my lightning sword
and execute judgment,
I take vengeance on my enemies
and pay back those who hate me.
I値l make my arrows drunk with blood,
my sword will gorge itself on flesh,
Feasting on slain and captive alike,
the proud and vain enemy corpses.樗
Along with this god.
http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2010/...
The problem I see is that they try to usurp that which is not theirs to have.

In the Hebrew Scriptures (at least) it is God that has the power to kill, destroy, judge, give life and give power; not man.

“BE BRAVE ENOUGH ”

Since: Oct 09

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#440385
Jan 29, 2013
 
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
I suspect this poster is either pretending to be Duststorm or the poster known as Duststorm has always been a sock. In which case then they are intentionally being as offensive as possible just for the sake of doing so to get a reaction.
Of course the question still remains what motivates someone, whether they are pretending to be someone else or not, to engage in such behavior? My guess is they resent seeing people mourning the loss of a loved one knowing their own passing would not invoke the same reaction from the people that know them. At bare minimum I'd assume someone who seeks pleasure out of intruding on such a private moment has very few things in their life that brings them joy. And haven given up any hope that will change they resort to trying to make other people as miserable as they are.
Even in an anonymous setting, people tend to reveal quite a bit about themselves. And having to face no consequences for their actions affords quite a bit of freedom for people to show their true colors. For whatever reason misery loves company. I have never understand that as how does someone else going thru difficult times make my situation any better? It is definitely one of the more twisted aspects of human psychology.
LOL I think Dusty is the one and only Dusty.

This might sound a little crazy but it might also hold some truth.

I think when Dusty came to Topix she envisioned saving souls. When that didn't happen she got angry and just decided to condemn us all to hell...the worse she could make it sound...the more revenge that she can get.

Who knows...maybe she has a quota that she needs to reach and we just aren't cooperating with her.

Plus...she gets attention this way and who knows...maybe that is what she is truly looking for.

As irritating as it might be...it is also sad.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

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#440386
Jan 29, 2013
 

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Janitor Of The LORD wrote:
<quoted text>
That's quite disturbing to say the least. I really don't have score cards on who is what. Like in reality, I don't recall meeting anyone and saying "are you a Christian or something else". It's ludicrous. Although we are not to be ashamed of what we love, neither are we to force it upon another.
As far as the dream, "Vengeance is mine saith the Lord". "As we forgive, so too will we be forgiven". Looks like Dusty better go fishing and see if she can drown that worm that won't die.
That Dusty gal's jist in a real bad disposition coz when they plastic welded them "bobby pullups" on 'er they maked 'em so tight that they makes 'er look like a penguin when she walks, an that real loud {{{squeeeek'n}}} noise is real irritat'n too! Them size 24 Keds sneakers don't help matters none neither...Jist so ya know... It does tend ta make them "inquisition" gather'ns kinda interest'n though.

“Love much, trust none”

Since: Jul 11

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#440387
Jan 29, 2013
 
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
... My point is if someone chooses to base their beliefs on the Bible then they should research those beliefs for themselves instead of just going by what someone else has told them...
You are one of the few who understand that.

That is why people here proclaiming to be Christians are held up to the Christian Bible, Jews are held up to the TaNaKh ad Muslims held up to the Qu'ran.

If one claims to believe a document is the foundation of their lives then it is fair to assess them according to that document.

Sadly, many Christians and Muslims use those documents to measure others instead of themselves. THAT is what makes them "lost" in my opinion.

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

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#440388
Jan 29, 2013
 
Doctor REALITY wrote:
There's no such thing as 'used to be' a christian. Either you're saved right now,or you've NEVER been saved.
That's what she said when the bed broke!
Oh what a nite!

“Love much, trust none”

Since: Jul 11

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#440389
Jan 29, 2013
 
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
... My guess is they resent seeing people mourning the loss of a loved one knowing their own passing would not invoke the same reaction from the people that know them...
Not sure about that. I am pretty confident I will die alone, few will attend my funeral, if there even is one, and few tears will be shed.

I won't mind, I'll be dead. It is living until then that is the tough part full of tears of joy as well as sorrow.

“Love much, trust none”

Since: Jul 11

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#440390
Jan 29, 2013
 

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AnnieJ wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL I think Dusty is the one and only Dusty.
This might sound a little crazy but it might also hold some truth.
I think when Dusty came to Topix she envisioned saving souls. When that didn't happen she got angry and just decided to condemn us all to hell...the worse she could make it sound...the more revenge that she can get.
Who knows...maybe she has a quota that she needs to reach and we just aren't cooperating with her.
Plus...she gets attention this way and who knows...maybe that is what she is truly looking for.
As irritating as it might be...it is also sad.
Sounds much like YellowDog.

Very sad. The reason I left that thread was I couldn't bear to read her tormented posts nor those prodding her further into her self made Hell.

“BE BRAVE ENOUGH ”

Since: Oct 09

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#440391
Jan 29, 2013
 

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G_O_D wrote:
<quoted text>
Sounds much like YellowDog.
Very sad. The reason I left that thread was I couldn't bear to read her tormented posts nor those prodding her further into her self made Hell.
I remember YD posting in the Gay/Lesbian forum several years ago. She was always so angry...so filled with hate. I never stayed long on any thread that she was posting on.

You are right...very sad.

“BE BRAVE ENOUGH ”

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#440392
Jan 29, 2013
 

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Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text> That's what she said when the bed broke!
Oh what a nite!
Was that late December back in 63???

http://www.youtube.com/watch...
socci

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----------


GENESIS: oldest text on the planet


In recent years a much better insight into the origin of Genesis has emerged. As ancient Near Eastern libraries have been unearthed and their contents deciphered, many insights into biblical times have been gained. In particular, tablets from before the time of Moses in the area of Mesopotamia (where Abraham hailed from) were noted to frequently contain a colophon a formula of sorts, at the close of the tablet. This is similar to modern customs of ending a letter with a formula like "Sincerely yours,(Name)".

Often these tablets were family records or king-lists giving the ancestry of a person. The Hebrew term for generations is toledoth. These tablets would contain a colophon describing who had written the tablet or whose history it recorded. Scholars recognized that these colophons were similar in structure to toledoth phrases in Genesis:

1) "These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created." (Genesis 2:4)

2) "This is the book of the generations of Adam." (Genesis 5:1)

3) "These are the generations of Noah." (Genesis 6:9)

4) "Now these are the generations of the sons of Noah, Shem, Ham, and Japheth." (Genesis 10:1)

5) "These are the generations of Shem." (Genesis 11:10)

6) "Now these are the generations of Terah." (Genesis 11:27)

7) "And these are the generations of Isaac, Abraham's son." (Genesis 25:19)

8) "This is the account of Abraham's son Ishmael." (Genesis 25:12)

9) "This is the account of Esau (that is, Edom)." (Genesis 36:1)

10) "These are the generations of Jacob." (Genesis 37:2)

The implication of these colophons in Genesis is that they separate Genesis into distinct source documents each dating from the period of the person named in them. These source documents were handed down from father to son until the time of Moses, when they were edited together to form the book of Genesis under divine inspiration. In almost every case the logical author for each document would be the person named in the colophon itself. The statements immediately following each colophon would be the beginning of the next tablet; for example, Genesis 2:4 reads "When the LORD God made the earth and the heavens" beginning Adam痴 story.
http://www.rae.org/FAQ09.htm
http://www.trueorigin.org/tablet.asp
http://www.dtl.org/bible/ng-post/gilgamesh.ht...
http://www.specialtyinterests.net/Toledoth.ht...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiseman_hypothes...
(video)
http://archive.org/details/WhoWroteTheBookOfG...
socci

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Babylon and the Bible
by Professor Walter J. Veith, PhD

Two hundred years ago, scholars doubted whether Babylon ever existed. The only record could be found in the Bible. Critics used the story of Babylon, and what they called its "non-historic kings," to discount Scripture. However, Babylon was discovered and excavated in 1898.

We know today that Babylon was one of the first cities in the world, and founded by Nimrod, great-grandson of Noah (Genesis 10:9-10). Archaeologists have found his name on many inscriptions and tablets, while a massive head of Nimrod has been excavated near Calah on the Tigris River.
http://amazingdiscoveries.org/S-deception_arc...


Sumeria is located in the Land of Kish (Kush or Cush) founded by son of Noah's son Ham.


"Kish was occupied beginning in the Jemdet Nasr period (3100 BC), gaining prominence as one of the pre-eminent powers in the region during the early dynastic period.

The Sumerian king list states that it was the first city to have kings following the deluge, beginning with Jushur."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kish_%28Sumer%29


"Cush, son of Ham. The Empire of Kush to the south of Egypt is known from at least 1970 BC, but this name has also been associated by some with the Kassites who inhabited the Zagros area of Mesopotamia, the Sumerian city of Kish in the Land of Kish."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sons_of_Noah#Ham...


"The Sumerian Kish, the first city established in Mesopotamia after the Flood, took its name from the man known in the Bible as Cush. The first kingdom established after the Flood was Kish, and the name "Kish" appears often on clay tablets. The early post-Flood Sumerian king lists say that "kingship descended from heaven to Kish" after the Flood."


continues:

http://davelivingston.com/nimrod.htm

http://www.noahs-ark.tv/noahs-ark-flood-creat...


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Owning Glyndwyr wrote:
<quoted text>See, but the point is that it was, historically, not a small minority of Christians. The religion was promoted at sword and later gunpoint. Its current popularity is based on that very violent history. I have already conceded that the Hindus are making up for lost time and that Christians have, as an aggregate, grown less violent over time as they live in more modern environments, influenced by secular laws, and no longer under divine command theory.
The history of Christianity is well documented. It begins with the kidnapping, torture, and murder of a peaceful innocent. It spreads rapidly on the jagged edge of the "believe or die" process. Please do not succumb to presentism. We all have a tendency to view events through our own chronological microscope. Christianity has grown increasingly less violent, although there is a minority in America that finds that intolerable. We have modernized. The Hindus and the Muslims are still suffering under the same tyranny that besieged Christianity throughout its history. This tyranny begets violence. As the poster Drifter used to exclaim, "It is hard to brush the dust from hsitory". And besides, when dealing with a timespan as vast as the last two millennia, generalization is the only methodology available.
I was curious to see how you would respond to my post. I felt the things I asked you to consider were reasonable within the context but admittedly they were some loaded questions and a lot of people wouldn't see past it as a challenge to their ego. I think it speaks well to your character that you handled it as you did. Not that you need my approval but I like to acknowledge when someone does something i respect

I agree that we view things thru our own chronological microscope. And I agree that if judged solely on present time the gap between those who practice it peacefully and those that do not has widened significantly. I do understand the importance of learning historical lessons and acknowledging past wrongs. I am sure everyone knows the famous Edmund Burke quote ""Those who don't know history are destined to repeat it"

Although what is a fair amount of time for people to shed the culpability of those that came before them? I am actually asking as I am sure it is subjective. But consider America for instance. We slaughtered the Indians, infected women and children with small pox, put innocent Japanese in Internment camps, had slaves, and women couldn't vote. Much of that was indicative of the culture and not simply our government acting unilaterally. I bring up the government because imo still today we engage in some pretty heinous things. But culturally as a people we have come a long way. Should today's American still wear the label of slave-master?

I can concede the point that even if not all Christians engaged in some of the atrocities of the past that the culture of Christianity itself was more violent. And since you agree in modern times the culture is much less violent and the same generalizations wouldn't be as applicable today then there is really no dispute. But I would be curious as to what you feel about how much time is reasonable for a group to be able to start its own legacy. Or do you think no amount of time allows for that? For me personally I feel no responsibility for say something like slavery. I wasn't even born when it happened and never would have been ok with it so I feel like that has nothing to do with me. While it will always be part of our history, should the modern-day American still own part of the blame in your opinion?

(T) Peace

“Love much, trust none”

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#440396
Jan 29, 2013
 
socci wrote:
...
GENESIS: oldest text on the planet.
...
The Sumerian tablets which have the original stories the Hebrews modified are 4000 years older and we have the clay tablets they were written on to prove it.

Please get an education. At least google "The Epic of Gilgamesh".

“Love much, trust none”

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#440397
Jan 29, 2013
 
socci wrote:
Babylon and the Bible
by Professor Walter J. Veith, PhD
Two hundred years ago, scholars doubted whether Babylon ever existed. The only record could be found in the Bible. Critics used the story of Babylon, and what they called its "non-historic kings," to discount Scripture. However, Babylon was discovered and excavated in 1898.
We know today that Babylon was one of the first cities in the world, and founded by Nimrod, great-grandson of Noah (Genesis 10:9-10). Archaeologists have found his name on many inscriptions and tablets, while a massive head of Nimrod has been excavated near Calah on the Tigris River.
http://amazingdiscoveries.org/S-deception_arc...
Sumeria is located in the Land of Kish (Kush or Cush) founded by son of Noah's son Ham.
"Kish was occupied beginning in the Jemdet Nasr period (3100 BC), gaining prominence as one of the pre-eminent powers in the region during the early dynastic period.
The Sumerian king list states that it was the first city to have kings following the deluge, beginning with Jushur."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kish_%28Sumer%29
"Cush, son of Ham. The Empire of Kush to the south of Egypt is known from at least 1970 BC, but this name has also been associated by some with the Kassites who inhabited the Zagros area of Mesopotamia, the Sumerian city of Kish in the Land of Kish."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sons_of_Noah#Ham...
"The Sumerian Kish, the first city established in Mesopotamia after the Flood, took its name from the man known in the Bible as Cush. The first kingdom established after the Flood was Kish, and the name "Kish" appears often on clay tablets. The early post-Flood Sumerian king lists say that "kingship descended from heaven to Kish" after the Flood."
continues:
http://davelivingston.com/nimrod.htm
http://www.noahs-ark.tv/noahs-ark-flood-creat...
So Orange Crush is the blood of Jesus ?
Or are you saying you have a crush on an Egyptian ?

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#440398
Jan 29, 2013
 

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AnnieJ wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL I think Dusty is the one and only Dusty.
This might sound a little crazy but it might also hold some truth.
I think when Dusty came to Topix she envisioned saving souls. When that didn't happen she got angry and just decided to condemn us all to hell...the worse she could make it sound...the more revenge that she can get.
Who knows...maybe she has a quota that she needs to reach and we just aren't cooperating with her.
Plus...she gets attention this way and who knows...maybe that is what she is truly looking for.
As irritating as it might be...it is also sad.
ll say that up until a few days ago it never crossed my mind that Dusty may be a sock. Not only she didn't follow any of the normal patterns seen from socks but IMO it would be almost impossible for someone to create that persona and remain as consistent as she has over the years. She is someone who in my opinion has always been guarded emotionally and somewhat detached and absolutely came across as someone who was influenced at a very early age about hell. I also have always seen her as intelligent albeit a little crazy and have seem occasions over the years where she let herself be human and would show some emotion and even affection. And even the things I found offensive like children are deserving of hell or things like that stemmed from her beliefs. I never saw her as someone who was trying to be immoral.

If this is indeed the same poster and is legit then I gotta admit I am very surprised. The last few days were nothing more than a conscious effort to be as heartless as possible and to even seem to be deriving pleasure out of it. This was not someone rationalizing to themselves that they are telling people the truth no matter how harsh it may be. This was someone practically gloating in a "I told you so" way trying to inflict as much emotional harm on people in the process of mourning. If this is the same poster than that is just real unfortunate. I don't want to go as far as saying I wish any harm to her but I can say any sympathy I ever had for her, any respect I ever had for her, and perception I had of her that she was motivated by her beliefs has evaporated.

She is basically a sadist as I never seen anything like this in my life. I read about something worse in real life where people protested the military funerals of people that were gay shouting all sorts of hate speech. There are some moral lines there are no coming come back once someone crosses. It takes a certain type of evil to do certain things. Some of what I read in the last few days qualifies

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