Why I’m no longer a Christian

“Live Love Laugh”

Since: Aug 07

Rings of Saturn Emporium

#424695 Dec 5, 2012
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
It's doing fine, don't worry.
I do have one problem with it though. Although the picture is very different of course, the color scheme so resembles Buck Crick's avatar picture that when I first look at one of your posts, sometimes I think it's Buck.
I appreciate your posts, but do miss that rascal sometimes....
I noticed that myself. Cringed a little at first, but then just got used to it.

Buck is truly one of a kind.

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#424696 Dec 5, 2012
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's hope.
I do say, Tide, your posts recently have been outstanding.
Catcher, by the rights granted him by all lawful authorities, officially dubs you our philosopher/carpenter.
"Let he who is without stones cast the first stone." ~TwB

“Live Love Laugh”

Since: Aug 07

Rings of Saturn Emporium

#424697 Dec 5, 2012
karl44 wrote:
<quoted text>
you are a sociopath
your claim to christianity a mere mask
If you were ever incarcerated, a mistake was made with your release
I've posted this before, but it never hurts to repost it.

Profile of the Sociopath

This website summarizes some of the common features of descriptions of the behavior of sociopaths.

Glibness and Superficial Charm

Manipulative and Conning
They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They may dominate and humiliate their victims.

Grandiose Sense of Self
Feels entitled to certain things as "their right."

Pathological Lying
Has no problem lying coolly and easily and it is almost impossible for them to be truthful on a consistent basis. Can create, and get caught up in, a complex belief about their own powers and abilities. Extremely convincing and even able to pass lie detector tests.

Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt
A deep seated rage, which is split off and repressed, is at their core. Does not see others around them as people, but only as targets and opportunities. Instead of friends, they have victims and accomplices who end up as victims. The end always justifies the means and they let nothing stand in their way.

Shallow Emotions
When they show what seems to be warmth, joy, love and compassion it is more feigned than experienced and serves an ulterior motive. Outraged by insignificant matters, yet remaining unmoved and cold by what would upset a normal person. Since they are not genuine, neither are their promises.

Incapacity for Love

Need for Stimulation
Living on the edge. Verbal outbursts and physical punishments are normal. Promiscuity and gambling are common.

Callousness/Lack of Empathy
Unable to empathize with the pain of their victims, having only contempt for others' feelings of distress and readily taking advantage of them.

Poor Behavioral Controls/Impulsive Nature
Rage and abuse, alternating with small expressions of love and approval produce an addictive cycle for abuser and abused, as well as creating hopelessness in the victim. Believe they are all-powerful, all-knowing, entitled to every wish, no sense of personal boundaries, no concern for their impact on others.

Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency
Usually has a history of behavioral and academic difficulties, yet "gets by" by conning others. Problems in making and keeping friends; aberrant behaviors such as cruelty to people or animals, stealing, etc.

Irresponsibility/Unreliability
Not concerned about wrecking others' lives and dreams. Oblivious or indifferent to the devastation they cause. Does not accept blame themselves, but blames others, even for acts they obviously committed.

Promiscuous Sexual Behavior/Infidelity
Promiscuity, child sexual abuse, rape and sexual acting out of all sorts.

Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle
Tends to move around a lot or makes all encompassing promises for the future, poor work ethic but exploits others effectively.

Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility
Changes their image as needed to avoid prosecution. Changes life story readily.

to be cont.

“Live Love Laugh”

Since: Aug 07

Rings of Saturn Emporium

#424698 Dec 5, 2012
karl44 wrote:
<quoted text>
you are a sociopath
your claim to christianity a mere mask
If you were ever incarcerated, a mistake was made with your release
Continued from last post:

Other Related Qualities:

Contemptuous of those who seek to understand them
Does not perceive that anything is wrong with them
Authoritarian
Secretive
Paranoid
Only rarely in difficulty with the law, but seeks out situations where their tyrannical behavior will be tolerated, condoned, or admired
Conventional appearance
Goal of enslavement of their victim(s)
Exercises despotic control over every aspect of the victim's life
Has an emotional need to justify their crimes and therefore needs their victim's affirmation (respect, gratitude and love)
Ultimate goal is the creation of a willing victim
Incapable of real human attachment to another
Unable to feel remorse or guilt
Extreme narcissism and grandiose
May state readily that their goal is to rule the world

(The above traits are based on the psychopathy checklists of H. Cleckley and R. Hare.)

NOTE: In the 1830's this disorder was called "moral insanity." By 1900 it was changed to "psychopathic personality." More recently it has been termed "antisocial personality disorder" in the DSM-III and DSM-IV. Some critics have complained that, in the attempt to rely only on 'objective' criteria, the DSM has broadened the concept to include too many individuals. The APD category includes people who commit illegal, immoral or self-serving acts for a variety of reasons and are not necessarily psychopaths.

http://www.mcafee.cc/Bin/sb.html

“Live Love Laugh”

Since: Aug 07

Rings of Saturn Emporium

#424699 Dec 5, 2012
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> If you don't have that established (existence of Jesus) <quoted text> You have zero evidence from history for any of this.
<quoted text> More reasonable than your imaginations with zero objective evidence.
<quoted text> Then you pontificate from a position of ignorance. <quoted text> If you are mistaken, what happens then?
What if you are mistaken and are worshiping the wrong God?

Since: Jul 08

Columbus, OH

#424700 Dec 5, 2012

“The future begins”

Since: Jul 07

every moment

#424701 Dec 5, 2012
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> They are different in detail. That is far from conflicting. Besides you miss Paul who witnessed resurrected Christ. Not to mention James who did not convert until post resurrection.
When four "witnesses" give four accounts so varied in detail they are completley different stories,, that is by definition, "conflicting".

When does Paul say he "witnessed Christ"? He claims a revelation. You confuse that with a "witness". Why should we believe him?
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> If they all jibed in detail then hyper critics would argue collusion. A Christian does not have to choose one over the other based on the faulty premises of a hyper critic. Also in order to be saved as you put it one does not have to choose one account over another. Please show me where you get that from the sources. Do you just make this up as you go along?
You're right, the details don't matter, in and of themselves. But we must decide if the core premise is true. The only thing we have to go on is the veracity of the various accounts.

Is Bigfoot real?

According to Mandrake, he is real, because Millie and Mildred went Friday to a cave looking for him, but it was blocked. Just then there was an earthquake, and then a fairy appeared, unblocked the cave, sat down, and said, it's too late, that they just missed him. They didn't bother going inside,'cos who can doubt a fairy? On the way back to tell the boys, Bigfoot appeared, and said to tell them to meet him in Galattin, 90 miles away.

According to Mike, Bigfoot is real, because on Friday Millie, Mildred, and Sally took some food to his cave. The cave was uncovered, and inside was a nice-looking guy in a white suit. He said, Yeah, he's not here but he'll meet with all of you in Gallatin. The girls were so scared, they didn't tell anyone.

According to Lucas, he is real, because Millie, Mildred, Joan, and several other gals, went Friday to a cave looking for him. The cave was open, but they didn't mention an earthquake. They went inside, but the cave was empty. Just then two fairies appeared, in the cave, and said, "He was here, you just missed him, but stay here in Jeroshoot and he'll find you," and he did. Who can doubt two fairies?

According to Josh, he is real, because on Thursday Millie went by herself to a cave looking for him, but got scared before going inside. She went back and told Pierre and another guy, who went and looked inside. It was empty but Bigfoot's clothes were folded up nice and neat. They left. Millie hung around by herself, and just then, Bigfoot showed up. They had a nice talk. Later Bigfoot talked with everybody and cooked up a fine fish dinner.

Sure, the details are a little mixed-up. But if they all jibed in detail, we might accuse them of collusion. There's no reason to doubt the core premise that Bigfoot is real, is there?

Since: Jul 08

Columbus, OH

#424702 Dec 5, 2012
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> They are different in detail. That is far from conflicting. Besides you miss Paul who witnessed resurrected Christ. Not to mention James who did not convert until post resurrection. <quoted text> Paul says otherwise. Luke interviews eyewitnesses and provides a report. <quoted text> They can. <quoted text> If they all jibed in detail then hyper critics would argue collusion. A Christian does not have to choose one over the other based on the faulty premises of a hyper critic. Also in order to be saved as you put it one does not have to choose one account over another. Please show me where you get that from the sources. Do you just make this up as you go along?
Whadda hoot. But this time not in a good way.

"Luke interviews eyewitnesses" -- please provide a credible source for that claim.

That the author of Luke admits he is is not basing his account on his own information in his opening passage does not mean he "interviewe[d] eyewitnesses". It is merely an admission that the synoptic problem is indeed a problem.

Copying from Mark's author is not interviewing an eyewitness, goofy.

Since: Sep 10

Hermosa Beach, CA

#424703 Dec 5, 2012
Chess Jurist wrote:
Yeah, great.

Thanks for that.

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#424705 Dec 5, 2012
water_nymph wrote:
<quoted text> And this is the very best reason to leave organized religion altogether. If your morals are greater than the morals in your holy book, why would you try to apologize for what's in that book, much less try to make it more palatable? Why wouldn't you just leave it altogether and start anew by asking what you think is right and moral and finding something that fits those words?
There is no reason for staying in a religion in which you have to condemn some of the writings of that religion while doing gymnastics to make it look better than it is.
scom finds the bible morals so filthy that he changes them, he is in fact more moral than the god who authored the book. all of that and yet he still claims the belief

he is the kind of believer who is described by christians as____ "not a christian"

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#424706 Dec 5, 2012
water_nymph wrote:
<quoted text> For some reason, the most ardent of Jesus' followers think we just got up one morning and walked away with no thought whatsoever. They think we were never 'true' Christians. To think otherwise could have the terrible consequence of making them think that their own questioning might some day lead to them leaving.
It was not without thought. It was not without anxiety or fear that I left. I was much too indoctrinated to leave and just go merrily along. It was a hard-fought battle.
I just know how much courage it takes to walk across the divide while they are still making excuses for not doing so.
they do not tithe a church (or a god)
they do not support the christian belief system (they have a personal relationship, not a religion)
they are immoral and liars (I am not perfect, I am saved)
they do no charity themselves (salvation is by faith, salvation is by grace)

but

they claim every charitable act and any act of glory, done by any person attending a church, as if they did that act.

they claim the glory and protection of the cult, they wrap themselves in the flag of their stated beliefs, and they have no right to any of it, they are dead weight to the cult.

they post on topix

and bring dishonor to the christian organization

god bless them

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#424707 Dec 5, 2012
AnnieJ wrote:
<quoted text>
I personally do not think that we will ever know but in the meantime...I think people have to find what it is they can believe or can't believe.
My thinking is...
Thousands of years ago there were shepherds watching their flock by night. After the sheep had settled down the shepherd then had time to reflect...look at the stars...gaze at the moon. He asked himself...what is out there...am I all alone...or is there someone...something...that is watching over me.
Thousands of years later...we still sit on the side of some of those same hillsides...or on our porches...behind our computer screens and we ask ourselves those same questions.
We are no closer to answering them now than the shepherd was so long ago. We sometimes think that we are...but are we? Do we even need an answer? If we had that answer...what would we talk about??? LOL
god's without attributes may not be "ruled out"

the abrahamic god eliminates itself

The kind of god who created me and now hopes I would worship him, but provides no evidence, is either non-existent, or insane, either way, I shall not worship.

if there is a god who created the humans, that god has a great deal to answer for, and I have no intent to worship a being who is less moral than I.
DeathOnCouch

Charlotte, NC

#424708 Dec 5, 2012
DearthOfCouth wrote:
<quoted text>
Here's what I think happened:
Jesus -- if he ever existed -- was an itinerant young Rabbi wandering about first century Palestine, preaching some sort of new doctrine to Jews. The authorities perceived him to be a threat so they put his lights out.
Next, a diverse gaggle of cranks, shamans, spiritualists and one opportunistic Roman emperor cobbled together a makeshift, elaborate fable based upon local folklore, creative theology, pagan myths and old Jewish texts, packaged it all up and sold the whole bundle for political purposes. Rather successfully, it turns out.
Over the centuries the mythology has been enhanced with new inventions like the Holy Trinity and "Little Drummer Boy."
And people like you, for reasons that I do not claim to understand, hear these stories and find the whole thing perfectly reasonable and acceptable.
Unlike you, I claim no special insight into any of these matters and could well be mistaken about all of this. But that's what I think.
What a load of crap. Part One.
AnnoyJ

Charlotte, NC

#424709 Dec 5, 2012
AnnieJ wrote:
<quoted text>
I personally do not think that we will ever know but in the meantime...I think people have to find what it is they can believe or can't believe.
My thinking is...
Thousands of years ago there were shepherds watching their flock by night. After the sheep had settled down the shepherd then had time to reflect...look at the stars...gaze at the moon. He asked himself...what is out there...am I all alone...or is there someone...something...that is watching over me.
Thousands of years later...we still sit on the side of some of those same hillsides...or on our porches...behind our computer screens and we ask ourselves those same questions.
We are no closer to answering them now than the shepherd was so long ago. We sometimes think that we are...but are we? Do we even need an answer? If we had that answer...what would we talk about??? LOL
What a load of crap. Part Two.
watah_floozie

Charlotte, NC

#424710 Dec 5, 2012
water_nymph wrote:
<quoted text> Continued from last post:
Other Related Qualities:
Contemptuous of those who seek to understand them
Does not perceive that anything is wrong with them
Authoritarian
Secretive
Paranoid
Only rarely in difficulty with the law, but seeks out situations where their tyrannical behavior will be tolerated, condoned, or admired
Conventional appearance
Goal of enslavement of their victim(s)
Exercises despotic control over every aspect of the victim's life
Has an emotional need to justify their crimes and therefore needs their victim's affirmation (respect, gratitude and love)
Ultimate goal is the creation of a willing victim
Incapable of real human attachment to another
Unable to feel remorse or guilt
Extreme narcissism and grandiose
May state readily that their goal is to rule the world
(The above traits are based on the psychopathy checklists of H. Cleckley and R. Hare.)
NOTE: In the 1830's this disorder was called "moral insanity." By 1900 it was changed to "psychopathic personality." More recently it has been termed "antisocial personality disorder" in the DSM-III and DSM-IV. Some critics have complained that, in the attempt to rely only on 'objective' criteria, the DSM has broadened the concept to include too many individuals. The APD category includes people who commit illegal, immoral or self-serving acts for a variety of reasons and are not necessarily psychopaths.
http://www.mcafee.cc/Bin/sb.html
You have Topix Shock Syndrome.
HypCritic

Charlotte, NC

#424711 Dec 5, 2012
HipGnosis wrote:
<quoted text>
When four "witnesses" give four accounts so varied in detail they are completley different stories,, that is by definition, "conflicting".
When does Paul say he "witnessed Christ"? He claims a revelation. You confuse that with a "witness". Why should we believe him?
<quoted text>You're right, the details don't matter, in and of themselves. But we must decide if the core premise is true. The only thing we have to go on is the veracity of the various accounts.
Is Bigfoot real?
According to Mandrake, he is real, because Millie and Mildred went Friday to a cave looking for him, but it was blocked. Just then there was an earthquake, and then a fairy appeared, unblocked the cave, sat down, and said, it's too late, that they just missed him. They didn't bother going inside,'cos who can doubt a fairy? On the way back to tell the boys, Bigfoot appeared, and said to tell them to meet him in Galattin, 90 miles away.
According to Mike, Bigfoot is real, because on Friday Millie, Mildred, and Sally took some food to his cave. The cave was uncovered, and inside was a nice-looking guy in a white suit. He said, Yeah, he's not here but he'll meet with all of you in Gallatin. The girls were so scared, they didn't tell anyone.
According to Lucas, he is real, because Millie, Mildred, Joan, and several other gals, went Friday to a cave looking for him. The cave was open, but they didn't mention an earthquake. They went inside, but the cave was empty. Just then two fairies appeared, in the cave, and said, "He was here, you just missed him, but stay here in Jeroshoot and he'll find you," and he did. Who can doubt two fairies?
According to Josh, he is real, because on Thursday Millie went by herself to a cave looking for him, but got scared before going inside. She went back and told Pierre and another guy, who went and looked inside. It was empty but Bigfoot's clothes were folded up nice and neat. They left. Millie hung around by herself, and just then, Bigfoot showed up. They had a nice talk. Later Bigfoot talked with everybody and cooked up a fine fish dinner.
Sure, the details are a little mixed-up. But if they all jibed in detail, we might accuse them of collusion. There's no reason to doubt the core premise that Bigfoot is real, is there?
What a load of crap. Part Three.

“The future begins”

Since: Jul 07

every moment

#424712 Dec 5, 2012
DearthOfCouth wrote: Jesus ....was an itinerant young Rabbi wandering about first century Palestine, preaching some sort of new doctrine to Jews. The authorities perceived him to be a threat so they put his lights out.
Next, a diverse gaggle of cranks, shamans, spiritualists and one opportunistic Roman emperor cobbled together a makeshift, elaborate fable based upon local folklore, creative theology, pagan myths and old Jewish texts, packaged it all up and sold the whole bundle for political purposes. Rather successfully, it turns out.
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> You have zero evidence from history for any of this.
You like to toss the terms "subjective" and "objective" around, but you show right here your definitions are pretty loose, and not to be applied equally around. You cannot possibly have studied Christianity in any depth and be able to make this absolute statement above.

I feel that most of the absolutists I've met - and this is true for both ends of the spectrum - utilize a lot of buzzwords and icons with extreme emotional and symbolic values. They carry heavy connotations for the speaker, and so these folks easily fall into the rut of assuming they carry the same weight with others. In a discussion at Wednesday Bible Study, such a tacit understanding would have a place. Here, in a secular setting, your sacred chakras and symbols are just words and icons to me. To assume more is self-centered and arrogant, protestations of "agape love" notwithstanding.

Your conviction is quaint and all, but the tenets on which it's based carry no uber-mojo any further than your own nose.

"zero evidence". shee.....

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

Since: Sep 08

The Borderland of Sol

#424714 Dec 5, 2012
water_nymph wrote:
<quoted text>Oh, you poor mislead man! Did I make you say that?*snark*
Yes, dear.

*helpless laughter*

The Gloop

Since: Sep 08

.

#424715 Dec 5, 2012
macumazahn wrote:
<quoted text>Yes, dear.
*helpless laughter*
Gloop!

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#424716 Dec 5, 2012
I have a rock that keeps demons away. You can't prove that it doesn't work. Some people have similar rocks that they sell for large amounts of money. I think this is unethical. I give my magic rocks away. It's because I care that I do this. There is no other solution to keep demons from entering your anus. If you don't block them with one of my magic rocks, they will eventually get in. Sure, you may be alright for 10 or 20 years, but everyone will have to face the truth, that demons are trying to burrow into your chocolate starfish. No demon has ever found it's way past one of my magic rocks. Only a fool would doubt its performance. Remember, I'm not selling, I'm offering my magic rocks free of charge. There is no reason to doubt my intentions. What would I gain by lying?

I do charge shipping and handling, but there's no way around that. Perhaps if I received enough donations I could provide free shipping or even supply magic rock accessories.

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