Calif. gay marriage opponents gear up for rallies

[xxxx]

Rick in Kansas wrote:

<quoted text>I can:
http://colfaxrecord.com/detail/91429.html

There is no scripture from GOD's word to back this up. This is mans own belief.

Gen,19:5-8 says different. For further study a hebrew concordance will help. Lev,20:13 Romans 1:26-27 ICor:6-9.

[devons]

xxxx wrote:

<quoted text>
First I NEVER spit in anyones face, don't twist what I said!! Second... I don't make the rules GOD does!! The Bible is VERY CLEAR on this issue study what it says. Jesus did in fact speak against it!! Third... Your saying my choice to believe Gay life is not O.K. will cause my realationship with Jesus Christ to be separated. You talk to him about that. When someone calls Christians = HATE... you can bet I'm going to lash out. I never spread hate for gays. Fourth... There is no greater price to be paid than one who either rejects Jesus or does not believe in him. Your so wrong on that. don't put word in other people's mouth. Your post is outrageous!!!

Your words is a kick in the face of Jesus. Sorry I used the word 'spit'.

You are making the rules for God.....all while ignoring many of the rules of God.

Post some more and do further damage to Christianity. If you weren't destroying something that is supposed to spread love I would say you are the perfect joke.

[devons]

Green Hornet 007 wrote:

<quoted text>
Homosexuality is not a right. If you want to practice it then go ahead but do not expect the rest of us to give you rights that were not given by our Founding Fathers and especially by our Holy Father. The argument would make sense if you would only clear up the cloud of sin that is prevailing.

LOL

If you want to continue thinking that people are fighting for a right to be homosexual....please continue.

I'm beyond practicing.....if you are new to it you may practice all you want....just remember to practice safe sex and always show respect for the other person.

Now go and ask your heavenly father for forgiveness. You have a lot to explain as to why you pissed away His gift of the brain.

[Green Hornet 007]

devons wrote:

<quoted text>
Your words is a kick in the face of Jesus. Sorry I used the word 'spit'.
You are making the rules for God.....all while ignoring many of the rules of God.
Post some more and do further damage to Christianity. If you weren't destroying something that is supposed to spread love I would say you are the perfect joke.

God makes his own rules and He is very clear about homosexuality.
What is the source for correct behavior? The Church’s “constitution” is the Bible. All teaching and practice must align itself with the Bible, since it is God’s Word.(II Timothy 3:16) It is true that there are a multitude of opinions based on “tradition,”“reason” and “experience.” The Church, however, subordinates all opinions to sacred Scripture. From a Christian perspective all “truth” is valid, only to the extent that it conforms to the Word of God. Whereas there are many opinions and solutions regarding correct behavior, the Church submits herself, to God’s will, as revealed in His Word. Let’s look at what the Scripture states regarding Homosexual behavior.

A. Leviticus 18:22

“You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination.”

B. Leviticus 20:10-16

10 “If a man commits adultery with the wife of his neighbor, both the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death. 11 If a man lies with his father's wife, he has uncovered his father's nakedness; both of them shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them. 12 If a man lies with his daughter-in-law, both of them shall surely be put to death; they have committed perversion; their blood is upon them. 13 If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them. 14 If a man takes a woman and her mother also, it is depravity; he and they shall be burned with fire, that there may be no depravity among you. 15 If a man lies with an animal, he shall surely be put to death, and you shall kill the animal. 16 If a woman approaches any animal and lies with it, you shall kill the woman and the animal; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them.

Among the sexual sins punishable by death, incest, adultery, bestiality and homosexuality are all placed in the same category. Judaism unambiguously prohibited homosexuality based on the “holiness code” given by the LORD in Leviticus. Judaism was unequivocal in its stance toward homosexual relations; they were an abomination.
Are we to hate gay people? No. We are to love them but we hate the sin. Don't get me wrong, gay people have feelings and I will treat them with kindness and love but I will not accept their lifestyle unless God changes his word and tells us to.Have a great day.

[Rick in Kansas]

xxxx wrote:

<quoted text>
There is no scripture from GOD's word to back this up. This is mans own belief.

The same would apply to your own belief on the subject. The reality is that the early Christian Church did in fact bestow God's blessings on same sex unions.

xxxx wrote:

Gen,19:5-8 says different. For further study a hebrew concordance will help. Lev,20:13 Romans 1:26-27 ICor:6-9.

For proof of your position you offer the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, which doesn't even mention same sex marriage or same sex consensual relationships and even as a supposed "condemnation" of homosexuality is dubious at best (Ezekiel 16:46-50, Judges 19&20), a verse from the Levite holiness code that has never been practiced by the Chrisitan faith, a condemnation of Paganism as engaged in by the Christians of Rome, edited down by you to leave only the reference to same sex behavior which Paul viewed as God's retribution for their greater crimes against God and a quote from one of Paul's epistles which relies on a less than faithful English translation to be made into a condemnation of "homosexuality". In other words, all you've given me is your man's own belief, not God's....

[devons]

Green Hornet 007 wrote:

<quoted text>
God makes his own rules and He is very clear about homosexuality.
What is the source for correct behavior? The Church’s “constitution” is the Bible. All teaching and practice must align itself with the Bible, since it is God’s Word.(II Timothy 3:16) It is true that there are a multitude of opinions based on “tradition,”“reason” and “experience.” The Church, however, subordinates all opinions to sacred Scripture. From a Christian perspective all “truth” is valid, only to the extent that it conforms to the Word of God. Whereas there are many opinions and solutions regarding correct behavior, the Church submits herself, to God’s will, as revealed in His Word. Let’s look at what the Scripture states regarding Homosexual behavior.
A. Leviticus 18:22
“You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination.”
B. Leviticus 20:10-16
10 “If a man commits adultery with the wife of his neighbor, both the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death. 11 If a man lies with his father's wife, he has uncovered his father's nakedness; both of them shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them. 12 If a man lies with his daughter-in-law, both of them shall surely be put to death; they have committed perversion; their blood is upon them. 13 If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them. 14 If a man takes a woman and her mother also, it is depravity; he and they shall be burned with fire, that there may be no depravity among you. 15 If a man lies with an animal, he shall surely be put to death, and you shall kill the animal. 16 If a woman approaches any animal and lies with it, you shall kill the woman and the animal; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them.
Among the sexual sins punishable by death, incest, adultery, bestiality and homosexuality are all placed in the same category. Judaism unambiguously prohibited homosexuality based on the “holiness code” given by the LORD in Leviticus. Judaism was unequivocal in its stance toward homosexual relations; they were an abomination.
Are we to hate gay people? No. We are to love them but we hate the sin. Don't get me wrong, gay people have feelings and I will treat them with kindness and love but I will not accept their lifestyle unless God changes his word and tells us to.Have a great day.

On thing for sure is that you don't know what you are professing to being easily understood.

YAWN

[xxxx]

devons wrote:

<quoted text>
Your words is a kick in the face of Jesus. Sorry I used the word 'spit'.
You are making the rules for God.....all while ignoring many of the rules of God.
Post some more and do further damage to Christianity. If you weren't destroying something that is supposed to spread love I would say you are the perfect joke.

You (and the other persons post) don't read very well. Again, I did not make the rules GOD did. I used to get mad when I was convicted too. I learned as a born again christian not to box with GOD my arms are to short and so are yours!! Other christians are in total agreement with the scriptres too. You are only going to hear what your itching ears want to hear. Timothy 4:3-4. You are in a conflict with yourself, and you know it, that's why your result is in the name calling and hateful reaction. you can't seem to carry on a peaceful or sound debate. Proverbs, 29:11. I feel sorry for you. I backed everything up with scripture, you on the other hand have nothing, just spew.

[devons]

xxxx wrote:

<quoted text>
You (and the other persons post) don't read very well. Again, I did not make the rules GOD did. I used to get mad when I was convicted too. I learned as a born again christian not to box with GOD my arms are to short and so are yours!! Other christians are in total agreement with the scriptres too. You are only going to hear what your itching ears want to hear. Timothy 4:3-4. You are in a conflict with yourself, and you know it, that's why your result is in the name calling and hateful reaction. you can't seem to carry on a peaceful or sound debate. Proverbs, 29:11. I feel sorry for you. I backed everything up with scripture, you on the other hand have nothing, just spew.

YOu mean the laws you made up to use against others? Those laws?

Another person born yesterday. As you mature I hope you learn your faith better then you know it today.

Now continue to pretend all you want....you are not convincing anyone. As a matter of fact I'm feeling a bit sorry for you.

[Green Hornet 007]

Rick in Kansas wrote:

<quoted text>The same would apply to your own belief on the subject. The reality is that the early Christian Church did in fact bestow God's blessings on same sex unions.
<quoted text>For proof of your position you offer the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, which doesn't even mention same sex marriage or same sex consensual relationships and even as a supposed "condemnation" of homosexuality is dubious at best (Ezekiel 16:46-50, Judges 19&20), a verse from the Levite holiness code that has never been practiced by the Chrisitan faith, a condemnation of Paganism as engaged in by the Christians of Rome, edited down by you to leave only the reference to same sex behavior which Paul viewed as God's retribution for their greater crimes against God and a quote from one of Paul's epistles which relies on a less than faithful English translation to be made into a condemnation of "homosexuality". In other words, all you've given me is your man's own belief, not God's....

What was the last thing that happened before Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed?
In the Tanach version, Genesis19:4-5, the final episode in the story of Sodom is described as the angels visit Lot to warn him to flee:

When they had not yet retired, and the people of the city, the people of Sodom, surrounded the house, both young and old, the entire populace from every end [of the city]. And they called to Lot and said to him, "Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us, and let us know them."

Lot refused to give the visiting angels to the inhabitants of Sodom. He offered them his two daughters instead, but the people refused. The men were struck with blindness, allowing Lot and his family, who were then instructed to leave the city, to escape. As they made their escape the angels commanded that Lot and his family not look back under any circumstance. However as Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed with fire and brimstone by God, Lot's wife looked back longingly at the city, and she was instantly transformed into a pillar of salt.
Pretty clear that God was not happy with what was going on in that city.

[Green Hornet 007]

devons wrote:

<quoted text>
LOL
If you want to continue thinking that people are fighting for a right to be homosexual....please continue.
I'm beyond practicing.....if you are new to it you may practice all you want....just remember to practice safe sex and always show respect for the other person.
Now go and ask your heavenly father for forgiveness. You have a lot to explain as to why you pissed away His gift of the brain.

I urge you to visit their web page entitled “Comparing the Lifestyles of Homosexual Couples to Married Couples,” by Timothy J. Dailey, Ph. D. There you will find the article complete with reference material substantiating what I’m quoting here from that page.
The Family Research Council states that “... the evidence indicates that “committed” homosexual relationships are radically different from married couples in several key respects:”
“relationship duration”
“monogamy vs. promiscuity”
“relationship commitment”
“number of children being raised”
“health risks”
“rates of intimate partner violence”
* relationship duration
Male homosexual relationships last only a fraction of the length of most heterosexual marriages and few homosexual relationships achieve the longevity common in heterosexual marriages. A study of homosexual men in the Netherlands published in the journal AIDS found that the “duration of steady partnerships” was 1.5 years.
* monogamy vs. promiscuity: sexual partners outside of the relationship
Their research indicates that the average male homosexual has hundreds to thousands of sex partners in his lifetime. Homosexual relationships ascribe a radically different meaning to “committed” or “monogamous.” Many self-described ‘monogamous’ couples reported an average of three to five partners in the past year. All couples with a relationship lasting more than five years have incorporated some provision for outside sexual activity in their relationships and view sexual relations outside the relationship to be the norm and adopting monogamous standards as an act of oppression.
Sexual relationships are primarily for pleasure rather than procreation. And they are taught that monogamy in a marriage is not the norm and should be discouraged if one wants a good “marital” relationship.
* relationship commitment
Research shows there is a significant difference between the negligible lifetime fidelity rate of 4.5 percent cited for homosexuals and the 75 to 85 percent cited for married couples. This indicates that even “committed” homosexual relationships display a fundamental incapacity for the faithfulness and commitment that is axiomatic to the institution of marriage.
Surprisingly few homosexuals and lesbians choose to enter into legally recognized unions where such arrangements are available, indicating that such couples do not share the same view of commitment as typified by married couples.
Data from Vermont, Sweden, and the Netherlands, where same-sex unions or marriages were made legal, reveal that only a small percentage of homosexuals and lesbians identify themselves as being in a committed relationship, with even fewer taking advantage of civil unions or, in the case of the Netherlands, of same-sex “marriage.” This indicates that even in the most “gay friendly” localities, the vast majority of homosexuals and lesbians display little inclination for the kind of lifelong, committed relationships that they purport to desire to enter. As a typical example, 79 percent of homosexuals and lesbians in Vermont choose not to enter into civil unions. In Sweden, about 98 percent of Swedish homosexuals and lesbians do not officially register as same-sex couples. In the Netherlands, where “gay marriage ” is legal, only 2.8 percent of the homosexual and lesbian population have registered their unions as “married.” In other words, 97 percent of homosexuals and lesbians in the Netherlands chose not to get “married.”

[Green Hornet 007]

* number of children being raised
Only a small minority of gay and lesbian households have children. Beyond that, the evidence also indicates that comparatively few homosexuals choose to establish households together—the type of setting that is normally prerequisite for the rearing of children. Only a small percentage of partnered homosexual households actually have children. Those that do may include biological children conceived in a previous heterosexual relationship. The evidence does not support the claim that significant numbers of homosexuals desire to provide a stable home for children.
* health risks
The evidence indicates that homosexual and lesbian relationships are at far greater risk for contracting life-threatening disease compared with married couples. Young gay men have become more likely to contract HIV from a steady sexual partner than from a casual one. Lesbians involved in exclusive sexual relationships also are not at reduced risk for sexual disease.
Homosexual and lesbian relationships experience a far greater rate of mental health problems and suicide attempts compared to married couples and non-homosexual peers.
* rates of intimate partner violence
Research indicates very high levels of violence in homosexual and lesbian relationships. 90 percent of the lesbians surveyed had been recipients of one or more acts of verbal aggression from their intimate partners during the year prior to this study, with 31 percent reporting one or more incidents of physical abuse. The incidence of domestic violence among gay men is nearly double that in the heterosexual population.
Surveys conducted by the U.S. Department of Justice confirm that homosexual and lesbian relationships had a far greater incidence of domestic partner violence than opposite-sex relationships including cohabitation or marriage.
Looking at your last paragraph there seems to be some anger issues that you may need to address. There are some very good anger management classes available. I have never slammed you in any way,yet you seem to find it appropriate to do so to me.Have a great day.

[devons]

Green Hornet 007 wrote:

* number of children being raised
Only a small minority of gay and lesbian households have children. Beyond that, the evidence also indicates that comparatively few homosexuals choose to establish households together—the type of setting that is normally prerequisite for the rearing of children. Only a small percentage of partnered homosexual households actually have children. Those that do may include biological children conceived in a previous heterosexual relationship. The evidence does not support the claim that significant numbers of homosexuals desire to provide a stable home for children.
* health risks
The evidence indicates that homosexual and lesbian relationships are at far greater risk for contracting life-threatening disease compared with married couples. Young gay men have become more likely to contract HIV from a steady sexual partner than from a casual one. Lesbians involved in exclusive sexual relationships also are not at reduced risk for sexual disease.
Homosexual and lesbian relationships experience a far greater rate of mental health problems and suicide attempts compared to married couples and non-homosexual peers.
* rates of intimate partner violence
Research indicates very high levels of violence in homosexual and lesbian relationships. 90 percent of the lesbians surveyed had been recipients of one or more acts of verbal aggression from their intimate partners during the year prior to this study, with 31 percent reporting one or more incidents of physical abuse. The incidence of domestic violence among gay men is nearly double that in the heterosexual population.
Surveys conducted by the U.S. Department of Justice confirm that homosexual and lesbian relationships had a far greater incidence of domestic partner violence than opposite-sex relationships including cohabitation or marriage.
Looking at your last paragraph there seems to be some anger issues that you may need to address. There are some very good anger management classes available. I have never slammed you in any way,yet you seem to find it appropriate to do so to me.Have a great day.

I can only suggest that you actually do some study of this religion or are pretending to follow.

YAWN

[American dood]

*Playing Leftist extremist card*
How dare you guyz have a different opinion than a small percentage of the population. ALL YOU CHURCH GOERS ARE BIGGOTS!!! btw (Even though Barrack Obama agrees with you, hes not a biggot)

[DrSnoflake]

Be angry and do not sin." Ephesians 4:26

There can hardly be goodness in a man if he is not angered by sin; he who loves truth must hate every false way.

[devons]

DrSnoflake wrote:

yet another trying to pretend they are religious

YAWN.

[Rick in Kansas]

Green Hornet 007 wrote:

<quoted text>
What was the last thing that happened before Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed?

The real question one should ask regarding the story of Sodom and the other cities of the plain is what led God to want to destroy them in the first place? Prior to the story of what occurred that night in Sodom, it rates only one mention in the Book of Genesis and is merely described as a wicked place where Abraham's nephew Lot choses's to settle. When Abraham strikes his deal with God over the fate of the cities there is again no mention of the reason for this. This lack of an explanation has led far too many "good Christians" to believe that the reason for the destruction of Sodom was the result of the nature of the threat against the strangers who had taken refuge in Lot's house. That somehow a threat to "know" the men/angels means that Sodom and by extension Gomorrah and the other cities, were destroyed because these places were rife with homosexuality. But this belief is not supported by scriptural evidence. When the prophet Ezekiel laid out the sins of Sodom and her sisters, one would think that such a central motivation would at least rate a mention, but it doesn't. Then there is the parallel story in the Book of Judges chapters 19 and 20, of the unnamed Levite visiting the town of Gibeah. There too the house is surrounded by a crowd of men and boys who want to "know" the stranger. But oddly enough this story isn't often used to clobber homosexuals because of a key difference between the two stories. In Sodom, the crowd refused the offer of Lot's daughters but in Gibeah, the crowd accepted the offer of the Levite's concubine where upon they promptly raped her to death. In the story from Judges, the threat to "know" someone is quite rightly viewed, not in a sexual context but, as a death threat, just as it should in the story of Lot.

If you wish to believe that the story of the fate of Sodom somehow supports your anti-gay theology, go right ahead, but in my reading of the exact same Bible, I know differently...

[DrSnoflake]

devons wrote:

<quoted text>
YAWN.

Typical....

[DrSnoflake]

American dood wrote:

*Playing Leftist extremist card*
How dare you guyz have a different opinion than a small percentage of the population. ALL YOU CHURCH GOERS ARE BIGGOTS!!! btw (Even though Barrack Obama agrees with you, hes not a biggot)

BO is arguably the worst hypocrite out there at the moment,(if you believe he's a christian)

[Rick in Kansas]

xxxx wrote:

<quoted text>
You (and the other persons post) don't read very well.

That is because you have CHOSEN to disagree with what was said.

xxxx wrote:

Again, I did not make the rules GOD did.

But then again, there are many Christians who believe in the exact same God as you do and who base their beliefs on the exact same book as you have who have come to a very different conclusion as to what those rules are. You can say that our issue is with GOD, but the reality is, our issue is YOUR choice.

xxxx wrote:

I used to get mad when I was convicted too. I learned as a born again christian not to box with GOD my arms are to short and so are yours!!

You're making yet another assumption, that we are somehow angry with God. Heck, I'm not even angry with you, merelypointing out there is a difference of opinion in the validity of YOUR anti-gay theology lesson.

xxxx wrote:

Other christians are in total agreement with the scriptres too.

But far from all, many Christians believe differently from you.

xxxx wrote:

You are only going to hear what your itching ears want to hear.

As do you.

xxxx wrote:

Timothy 4:3-4. You are in a conflict with yourself, and you know it, that's why your result is in the name calling and hateful reaction.

Yet another assumption on your part, although you want to believe that I am, I most definitely am not in conflict with myself, there is no need to be.

xxxx wrote:

you can't seem to carry on a peaceful or sound debate. Proverbs, 29:11. I feel sorry for you. I backed everything up with scripture, you on the other hand have nothing, just spew.

But in my response to you, I cited scripture which undercuts your anti-gay theology, you seemed to have missed it. I don't wonder why.

[xxxx]

devons wrote:

<quoted text>
YOu mean the laws you made up to use against others? Those laws?
Another person born yesterday. As you mature I hope you learn your faith better then you know it today.
Now continue to pretend all you want....you are not convincing anyone. As a matter of fact I'm feeling a bit sorry for you.

Laws GOD made, Laws Jesus preached. Not my laws. Don't accuse me for following GODS WORDS. I'm not trying to change you!! Only you can do that. I'm not trying to convince you or anyone else. Just trying to tell you what The Bible says. Either you accept it or not, and it's quite clear you do not. I also started my post, not with changing people, but to defend Christians from being called a hate group. We agree with the word of GOD we do not treat people in a hurtful manner gay or not. We just don't agree with you!!! And we are to spread his word. Weather you like it or not.