Prove there's a god.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#766615 Aug 9, 2014
curiouslu wrote:
<quoted text>
I mostly like scrolling past her spam with the occasional skim and observation.
http://i.imgur.com/MotfXZr.jpg
lol
IANS.

There's Luci not talking about Christianity again...

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#766616 Aug 9, 2014
Stilgar Fifrawi wrote:
The universe "had to" self-assemble? On what grounds do you make that assumption?
It aint necessarily so wrote:
The evidence. Big Bang cosmology describes how it happened.
Stilgar Fifrawi wrote:
That position has been argued, but there's not enough evidence to say it's fact.
Sorry, but you're wrong. The Big Bang Theory is correct. It will be tweaked over the coming decades or centuries, but not overturned. Nobody assembled the galaxies, atoms or anyhting in between.
Stilgar Fifrawi wrote:
Some scientists disagree with your claim. Ever heard of Hawking? "If we discover a complete theory, it would be the ultimate triumph of human reason – for then we should know the mind of God."
Hawking is not disagreeing with my claim there. Nor does he believe in supernatural creators.

As many times as you and other religious critics of science assert yourselves is as many times as I will tell you that in the minds of evidence based thinkers, you have nothing to offer the conversation. Faith pollutes your thinking. You begin with an unjustified conclusion about a god, and all thinking that follows is done to defend that choice. Faith based thinkers have a confirmation bias at the portal to their mind that selects evidence not according to its quality, but its implications. You will without fail reject any scientific pronouncement that contradicts what you believe your bible says, and say that there is no evidence, or refer to spontaneous generation or Haeckel and declare science corrupt or otherwise unreliable.

Your faith based values and methods are radically different from Enlightenment values and methods, and generate results of no use to evidence based thinkers Have you not noticed that faith based thought has not generated one useful idea? It is as sterile as the moon. In the meantime, the tradition that I have embraced generated had made our lives longer, healthier, safer, easier, more comfortable, and more interesting.

To an evidence based thinker, that is huge. To a faith based thinker, it is meaningless and dismissed out of hand. That's the degree to which faith pollutes reason, and why the output of faith based thinkers is of no interest or value to those of us whose goal is to understand the world rather than promote the church.

You've read this before, and will no doubt many of you will give me cause to post it again.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#766617 Aug 9, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:

Yes, it is clear. I have said it myself, providing that you mean what I mean by the word. I am anti-theism regarding public and organized religion. I am not the enemy of any theist for believing in, praying to, or worshiping a god, nor fellowshipping with other Christians in their private spaces.
Like the private churches you love seeing closed down?
But when Christianity bleeds into the lives of unbelievers - when it want to define who is acceptable, who should be allowed to marry, what prescriptions are acceptable for insurers to provide, what research should be banned, what medical procedures should be banned, how public schools should conduct themselves - it needs to be kicked back, because at the end of the day, our answer to "What Would Jesus Do?" is "We don't care." Do you think that's asking too much?
What would Jesus do, indeed. It's that very thought process as to why most Christians aren't homophobes and why I've been trying to teach you that Christianity doesn't teach homophobia. Some pastors might, yes. Some Christians might be downright gay-haters, yes. But that doesn't mean Christianity "teaches" homophobia, it actually teaches the opposite.

Jesus teaches us to love all, respect all, to give to all that need, etc. He does not ever teach us to hate anyone or malign a certain group if people into unhappiness.

Christianity and Christians can certainly define who is unacceptable or what actions are unacceptable, just as any unbelievers can. We all do it all the time. You do it. I do it. We all do it. What's your issue with that?

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#766618 Aug 9, 2014
Catcher1 wrote:
Whodat?
I Habakkuked a big loogie this morning.

'Twas glorious.

Buck Crick

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#766619 Aug 9, 2014
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Aw, you poor persecuted baby.
You should stop whining.
It's terribly undignified and wimpy.
Sorry, man. I'm trying to quit.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#766620 Aug 9, 2014
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Aw, you poor persecuted baby.
You should stop whining.
It's terribly undignified and wimpy.
Ok fine. Give me back my sippy cup, if you're all done with it.

Buck Crick

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#766621 Aug 9, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, it is clear. I have said it myself, providing that you mean what I mean by the word. I am anti-theism regarding public and organized religion. I am not the enemy of any theist for believing in, praying to, or worshiping a god, nor fellowshipping with other Christians in their private spaces.
But when Christianity bleeds into the lives of unbelievers - when it want to define who is acceptable, who should be allowed to marry, what prescriptions are acceptable for insurers to provide, what research should be banned, what medical procedures should be banned, how public schools should conduct themselves - it needs to be kicked back, because at the end of the day, our answer to "What Would Jesus Do?" is "We don't care." Do you think that's asking too much?
Those kinds of decisions are made by "the people" in a self-governing republic.

Atheists, and people of no belief have the same voting rights.

For the record, no religious group determined what prescriptions are available to insurers. They just resisted being forced to pay for them, which is a protection provided by our Constitution, and upheld my a majority of SC justices.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#766623 Aug 9, 2014
Buck Crick wrote:
If you have no idea, I like my guess better than yours because mine involves intelligence.
Is that so?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#766625 Aug 9, 2014
Buck Crick wrote:
If a god exists it is naturalistic.
Agreed.

Are you rejecting supernaturalism now?

Buck Crick

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#766626 Aug 9, 2014
Stilgar Fifrawi wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey me, what's up? You posted 6 hours before I did, you're going to throw off the conspiracy theory that you and I are the same person. Watch out
Obviously, it's a trick to throw them off the trail of me,...I mean us,...or me.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#766627 Aug 9, 2014
UIdiotRaceMAKEWORLDPEACE wrote:

Quotes from Hitler:
No. Not again.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#766628 Aug 9, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
Sorry, but you're wrong. The Big Bang Theory is correct. It will be tweaked over the coming decades or centuries, but not overturned. Nobody assembled the galaxies, atoms or anyhting in between.
<quoted text>
Hawking is not disagreeing with my claim there. Nor does he believe in supernatural creators.
As many times as you and other religious critics of science assert yourselves is as many times as I will tell you that in the minds of evidence based thinkers, you have nothing to offer the conversation. Faith pollutes your thinking. You begin with an unjustified conclusion about a god, and all thinking that follows is done to defend that choice. Faith based thinkers have a confirmation bias at the portal to their mind that selects evidence not according to its quality, but its implications. You will without fail reject any scientific pronouncement that contradicts what you believe your bible says, and say that there is no evidence, or refer to spontaneous generation or Haeckel and declare science corrupt or otherwise unreliable.
Your faith based values and methods are radically different from Enlightenment values and methods, and generate results of no use to evidence based thinkers Have you not noticed that faith based thought has not generated one useful idea? It is as sterile as the moon. In the meantime, the tradition that I have embraced generated had made our lives longer, healthier, safer, easier, more comfortable, and more interesting.
To an evidence based thinker, that is huge. To a faith based thinker, it is meaningless and dismissed out of hand. That's the degree to which faith pollutes reason, and why the output of faith based thinkers is of no interest or value to those of us whose goal is to understand the world rather than promote the church.
You've read this before, and will no doubt many of you will give me cause to post it again.
Here we are. I'll make this simple with two points.

1. You believe the universe is self-created.
2. I believe the universe is not self-created.

I won't convince you otherwise and you won't convince me. Why? Because we BOTH trust our faith.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#766629 Aug 9, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
There can be no such thing. Creation is an action with a before and after state. That requires time. Anything that acts or thinks exists in time.
Buck Crick wrote:
Not true. "Before" and "after" are linguistic tenses based on the consciousness of the observer. The act of creation of time and its observance by the resultant conscious being - in time - is the source of tensed action. It is the subjective view of the observer of time. Absent time, there is no objective view of before and after, and what existed would have to have always existed.
Absent time, nothing exists. Existence is tracing a path through time. All verbs imply a prior and subsequent states that may vary or remain unchanged, including static existence.

Consciousness is a phenomenon of time as well. The conscious agent at all times experiences itself "here now" implicitly if not explicitly. Thinking is going from a prior mental state to another later mental state. You simply cant divorce wither consciousness or exitence from time, let alone change or action.

If you examine the sentence, "Absent time, there is no objective view of before and after, and what existed would have to have always existed" closely, it falls apart. You use words like "existed" and "always" at the same time as you talk about there being no time.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#766630 Aug 9, 2014
Buck Crick wrote:
Obviously, it's a trick to throw them off the trail of me,...I mean us,...or me.
Ah yes, the dastardly plan. How could I forget?

Buck Crick

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#766631 Aug 9, 2014
UIdiotRaceMAKEWORLDPEACE wrote:
“We were convinced that the people needs and requires this faith. We have therefore undertaken the fight against the atheistic movement, and that not merely with a few theoretical declarations: we have stamped it out.”-Adolf Hitler, in a speech in Berlin on 24 Oct. 1933
[This statement clearly refutes modern Christians who claim Hitler as favoring atheism. Hitler wanted to form a society in which ALL people worshipped Jesus and considered any questioning of such to be heresy. The Holocaust was like a modern inquisition, killing all who did not accept Jesus. Though more Jews were killed then any other it should be noted that MANY ARYAN pagans and atheists were murdered for their non-belief in Christ.]
by EvilBible
That's a bald-faced lie.

Hitler hated the idea of Jesus, a Jew, as a savior. He hated Christianity and had plans in place, and had already begun implementing them, to eradicate Christianity from Germany.

The declassified Nuremberg documents prove this beyond a shadow of a doubt, and it's settled history.

You lying stack of dog shit.

Word for Word/The Case Against the Nazis; How Hitler's Forces Planned To Destroy German Christianity
By JOE SHARKEY
Published: January 13, 2002
New York Times

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#766632 Aug 9, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
. Nobody assembled the galaxies, atoms or anyhting in between.
Blind faith assertion. Yeah they self assembled due to laws of physics and chemistry. Laws don't do anything anymore than numbers do anything. A law presupposes an agent. 1+1=2 does not cause anything or put money in your bank account.
Hawking is not disagreeing with my claim there. Nor does he believe in supernatural creators.
Not big on philosophy, either.
As many times as you and other religious critics of science assert yourselves is as many times as I will tell you that in the minds of evidence based thinkers, you have nothing to offer the conversation.
Nothing but the truth which you are not interested in.
Faith pollutes your thinking.
This is from a fellow who asserts the universe self assembled. LOLOLOLOL.

Buck Crick

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#766633 Aug 9, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Agreed.
Are you rejecting supernaturalism now?
Something that always existed and created nature would be natural, as it would be consistent with the circumstances of nature.

"Supernatural" would seem an artificial classification in this case.

Catcher1

Since: Sep 10

Manhattan Beach, CA

#766634 Aug 9, 2014
Stilgar Fifrawi wrote:
<quoted text>
IANS.
There's Luci not talking about Christianity again...
It's humor, Redneck.

Yeah, at the expense of your big bad book.

But it's a spoof; a joke; a hahaha; a chuckle.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#766636 Aug 9, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:

Absent time, nothing exists. Existence is tracing a path through time. All verbs imply a prior and subsequent states that may vary or remain unchanged, including static existence.
Consciousness is a phenomenon of time as well. The conscious agent at all times experiences itself "here now" implicitly if not explicitly. Thinking is going from a prior mental state to another later mental state. You simply cant divorce wither consciousness or exitence from time, let alone change or action.
If you examine the sentence, "Absent time, there is no objective view of before and after, and what existed would have to have always existed" closely, it falls apart. You use words like "existed" and "always" at the same time as you talk about there being no time.
It aint necessarily so wrote:

Absent time, nothing exists.
Prove it. A demonstration would be nice.

Catcher1

Since: Sep 10

Manhattan Beach, CA

#766637 Aug 9, 2014
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
Those kinds of decisions are made by "the people" in a self-governing republic.
Atheists, and people of no belief have the same voting rights.
For the record, no religious group determined what prescriptions are available to insurers. They just resisted being forced to pay for them, which is a protection provided by our Constitution, and upheld my a majority of SC justices.
The justices you so often malign for corrupting the Constitution.

But OK, I like the new Buck: When a majority of SC justices rule, that's the proper interpretation of the Constitution.

Unfortunately, I have a sneaky feeling you'll hold to that only when you agree with the result.

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