Prove there's a god.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#705154 Mar 22, 2014
thewordofme wrote:
<quoted text>
....
How did God come to exist?
From the dismembered corpse of Tiamat.
(Enumma Elish)

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#705155 Mar 22, 2014
Ghost Writer wrote:
Your use of the word "cult" is very generic and I have to say, in my opinion is a deliberate (albeit subtle) attempt to use the word in an improper context so as to influence opinion by attributing the negative attributes in the second definition to the first definition you posted, to suit your own biased agenda.
I'm not using the word in any context. I was contradicting Riverside Redneck's comment about what the word "cult"means. I already acknowledged that there was a pejorative meaning alongside more neutral meaning.

My agenda is no secret. It's the opposite of that of the apologists.

And yes, using the word "cult" with Christianity would be a tactic to demean it by association with a different and better known type of cult.
Ghost Writer wrote:
The second listed definition that RR is referring to is as follows:
A relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or practices regarded by others as strange or sinister:
http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definiti...
Christianity does not meet that definition. It is large and familiar.
Ghost Writer wrote:
Because Christianity is one of the "Big Three" religions with an enormous global population, it doesn't conform to the 2nd definition, although in it's most generic sense does conform to the first.
I think we're in agreement there. You seem to agree with me in my disagreement with RR about whether Christianity can or cannot properly be called a cult.
Ghost Writer wrote:
Under that criteria, atheist and secular humanist organizations could also be classified as cults. They venerate the concept that there is no God and attribute cultural value to notable persons who share the same ideology. If you hold Madelyn Murray O'Hair in high esteem and are a member of American Atheists, you're in a cult.
"New Atheism" could be classified as a cult. Dawkins, Dennett, Hitchens, and Harris are essenitally worshipped as the "Four Horsemen" of the new evangelical atheist movement. The Rally for Reason gathering in Washington D.C. demonstrates this quite nicely.
No argument. Have you heard of the Cult of Reason?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult_of_Reason

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#705156 Mar 22, 2014
Divinity Surgeon wrote:
<quoted text>
If it's true that he disowned his son then he lied when he said he doesn't indoctrinate or force his kids into his religion.
Ar ar, lie? Surely not.
Pffffftttbbbb.
My post was a play on RR's statement a few months ago that "kill" and "disown" mean the same thing.
He was defending the verse in the Bible that says to kill disobedient male children.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#705157 Mar 22, 2014
tricki wrote:
..... i'd love to act like an animal and get away with it. i'd love to spam and harass and insult ....
That describes more theists than atheists.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#705158 Mar 22, 2014
Divinity Surgeon wrote:
<quoted text>
Interesting point, that's exactly what the Romans did when they killed the bickerers that refused to comply with their one op shop religion.
"Look at these idiots fighting and killing each other over their various gods, I know! Let's feed them some bullsh!t and get them under one umbrella."
They probably didn't use the word umbrella, they didn't have umbrellas back then.
Fooking sheep.
"Why do you kill each over what word you use for The Creator ?" - Ghandi

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#705159 Mar 22, 2014
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/TOCO8TE...
Greens - Tuf wrote:
I agree with your post 100 %.
Good to know.
Greens - Tuf wrote:
I mentioned to somebody on here a few months ago that we down here in Australia don't have Religion as our primary goal in life
Organized religion is a primary goal for too many Americans, which creates a terrible problem in America. Recall that I was answering your question, "Why on earth would you want to change a persons beliefs? How will this help you in the long run," and pointing out to you how different thing are far from you. Perhaps you can understand American unbelievers better knowing what they are up against.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#705160 Mar 22, 2014
RiversideRedneck wrote:
I think you have more than just an "interest" in expressing your beliefs.
So do I.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Third, I don't know why you'd think that Americans would see pedophile priests a better than atheists.
Ask American Christians which they would rather have as their president: a pedophile that believes in their god, or an atheist.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
I think you're frothing in hatred towards your Christian brethren.
Nope. I don't hate you - just the institution that keeps spitting out atheophobes by the millions. What you call "frothing hatred" is simply me letting you know what a problem your church is - how it teaches my Christian brethren to diminish the lives of unbelievers - and why that is justification for us to resist it in this cultural war of ideas. To me, it's the church that is frothing hatred. We're merely defending ourselves from it. And I doubt anybody thinks that it will ever cease until its voice is too weak to influence the culture at large any more.

“True Blue”

Since: Jun 13

Opal-Hearted Land

#705161 Mar 22, 2014
Divinity Surgeon wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope but we have some very weak arguments.
I can settle one, I believe that I don't believe in the existence of deities. I could say I know that I don't believe in the existence of deities but what would I know about what I don't believe about my lack of belief.
Ffs.
Hey Rosa :D
Gday Luci :D

Well, we'll see...

“True Blue”

Since: Jun 13

Opal-Hearted Land

#705162 Mar 22, 2014
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
My post was a play on RR's statement a few months ago that "kill" and "disown" mean the same thing.
He was defending the verse in the Bible that says to kill disobedient male children.
I remember that debate.
Greens - Tuf

Australia

#705163 Mar 22, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
http://www.topix.com/forum/top stories/TOCO8TEGNA8I5JT63/post 704816
<quoted text>
Good to know.
<quoted text>
Organized religion is a primary goal for too many Americans, which creates a terrible problem in America. Recall that I was answering your question, "Why on earth would you want to change a persons beliefs? How will this help you in the long run," and pointing out to you how different thing are far from you. Perhaps you can understand American unbelievers better knowing what they are up against.
I do understand what you are saying, I can see the problem, but that problem is a two way street regarding my experiences for I know that the Bible is a pack of lies but I also know that atheism is a totally flawed concept.
So where does that leave me ?
It leaves me open for attack because what ever I explain regarding my experiences will be seem as delusional for
it is not mainstream knowledge.
Greens - Tuf

Australia

#705164 Mar 22, 2014
Sometimes it is better to just sit back and just watch the show.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#705165 Mar 22, 2014
Ghost Writer 2 You wrote:
While I don't see Ain't frothing in hatred, I do believe there is more than casual interest in his expressions. He's actually been quite honest in stating that he would like to see all religions in general and Christianity in particular as having less public influence in Western society, and specifically here in the United States.
That's correct.
Ghost Writer 2 You wrote:
To Ain't: A few days ago we had a dialogue in which you stated that you wanted to know the truth, and that you don't respect the authority of the Christian church as a whole to accept what they say about the truth of reality as we understand it. This prompts me to ask; if you don't trust the authority of the church to teach you what we believe is true, then what authority would you trust?
What authority would I trust about theological matters? There are no such authorities - none greater than my own mind and my sense of reason, just like with you. You may choose to subordinate yourself to the church, but that remains a choice - one that you can rescind at any time. You are still the authority in your life even if you are not used to thinking in those terms any more..
Ghost Writer 2 You wrote:
I hope you don't say something like "God should've written the Bible better" or "God should do x instead of y." As finite humans before an infinite God, we don't have that luxury.
I don't accept that argument. If a god exists that wants to communicate with me, it will know how to do that, and how not to do that.

Besides, if I am expected to see goodness in the world and conclude that it is due to a good god, I can't be asked to excuse that god for the misery.
Ghost Writer 2 You wrote:
If you sincerely want to know the truth, then there has to be some authoritative institution from which you would respect enough to receive that truth. I would further add that such an institution should challenge your own present ideological worldview. It should transcend your comfort zone in such a way that you become determined to arrive at the heart of the matter, regardless of how it intrudes upon your psychological defense mechanisms. If you are unable to come to terms with that, then all of your claims about wanting to know the truth are compromised and end up looking like empty rhetoric. I hope this is not the case, but then again, I'm not your judge either.
Your ideas about how we arrive at truth are faulty. There are no authorities in these matters, just people with claims, many not backed up by evidence or arguments.

Nobody has a good god argument.
Greens - Tuf

Australia

#705166 Mar 22, 2014
Rosa_Winkel wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, thunderstorms are always magnificent. Esp after a stinking hot day.
A hurricane...you're brave.
. We just had a huge thunderstorm roll on through.
She put on a show.

Since: Feb 14

Location hidden

#705167 Mar 22, 2014
Bellamy Brothers

Let Your Love Flow



Susie, I thought of you when I saw this.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#705168 Mar 22, 2014
scaritual wrote:
Yeah, and the signs or hallmarks that accompany a cult apply directly to Christianity.
Quoting:
*Absolute authoritarianism without meaningful accountability.
*No tolerance for questions or critical inquiry.
*No meaningful financial disclosure regarding budget, expenses such as an independently audited financial statement.
*Unreasonable fear about the outside world, such as impending catastrophe, evil conspiracies and persecutions.
*There is no legitimate reason to leave, former followers are always wrong in leaving, negative or even evil.
*Former members often relate the same stories of abuse and reflect a similar pattern of grievances.
*There are records, books, news articles, or television programs that document the abuses of the group/leader.
*Followers feel they can never be "good enough".
*The group/leader is always right.
*The group/leader is the exclusive means of knowing "truth" or receiving validation, no other process of discovery is really acceptable or credible.
http://www.culteducation.com/warningsigns.htm...
As you pointed out, just because it has became socially acceptable, or is not perceived as a cult due to societal involvement, does not remove the cultish implications.
That certainly must sound familiar to veterans of these threads.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#705169 Mar 22, 2014
Rosa_Winkel wrote:
<quoted text>
I remember that debate.
That was the argument that proved to me he is either a theist imbecile or a genius Poe.
marvinbeta

Pittsburgh, PA

#705170 Mar 22, 2014

What God? nobody can prove such person existed..

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#705171 Mar 22, 2014
"Until you can see God's face in a blade of grass, you will never hear God's voice in the wind." - anomymous

Since: Feb 14

Location hidden

#705172 Mar 22, 2014
Don Williams

Til The Rivers All Run Dry



It's one of them mornings..

“True Blue”

Since: Jun 13

Opal-Hearted Land

#705173 Mar 22, 2014
Greens - Tuf wrote:
<quoted text> I do understand what you are saying, I can see the problem, but that problem is a two way street regarding my experiences for I know that the Bible is a pack of lies but I also know that atheism is a totally flawed concept.
So where does that leave me ?
It leaves me open for attack because what ever I explain regarding my experiences will be seem as delusional for
it is not mainstream knowledge.
If that's what you believe, you're entitled.

Personally I'm browned off with Xianity, as I was brought up to believe it. But I'm not an atheist because I believe there is Something out there. Maybe we'll know what someday.

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