Prove there's a god.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#642905 Jul 19, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
At the time, the classification of a bat was a bird. They didn't have the same classification system that we have today, no one did. Back then, they 'knew' all life was either plant or animal. Nowadays, we 'know' that's wrong and there are five classifications.
You go on, keep posting your ignorance.
They were also being inspired by an all knowing god.

“I never claimed to be Perfect”

Since: Nov 10

just better than yesterday

#642906 Jul 19, 2013
Reverend Alan wrote:
<quoted text>
That is only an opinion, completely worthless. The NIV, Notoriously Inaccurate Version is just that, notoriously inaccurate.
Mark 15:21, "And they compelled a passerby, Simon of Cyrene, who was coming in from the country, the father of Alexander and Rufus, to carry his cross." (ESV)
John 19:17, "And he went out, bearing his own cross, to the place called The Place of a Skull, which in Aramaic is called Golgotha.(ESV)
So, who carried the cross? Jesus carried it himself or Simon of Cyrene carried it.
This is proof that the Bible contains errors and therefore can not be the work of a perfect God.
No such thing Rev. There is no discrepancy there. Both accounts are true. As you know, Jesus had just been through the physical and traumatic experience that the Romans were so good at performing and now Jesus was being forced to carry his cross (well not the whole cross but the crossbar as you probably know) to the pole to be executed. Simply what you read is what the witnesses saw and wrote at various times on his way to the stipes as Jesus collapsed under the physical exhuastion which he was experiencing.

Of course you already knew this....

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#642907 Jul 19, 2013
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>RR, don't get me started. You have been slapped around by more people than I can count, and you remain the most stubbornly ignorant poster here.
I was wrong insofar as you did not say outright "the NIV is better than all the others," but your advocacy for it was a clear indication that this is what you think - additionally, as a good christian, isn't it your duty to use the translation that you consider superior? Are you using a translation that you consider to be inferior?
Woah. Apology accepted.

I've said it before, I think the NIV is a more accurate translation than the KJV. Why do you keep asking the same questions?

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#642908 Jul 19, 2013
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>You made a factually incorrect claim. I made a claim that is substantiated by your words and your behavior, but since you are such a pedant, you will claim that since you never outright said "it's better than all the others" that I was "wrong."
You are advocating for a book that you think your soul depends on, of which there are numerous translations - how is it "wrong" for me to assume that you consider your version of choice the best one? Don't you? If you don't, then why do you use it?
I've explained why I think the KJV is translated incorrectly - I never said the KJV is wrong.

I've also never asked you to accept my understanding of it. Just understand that it's my opinion and I choose the NIV over the KJV. Problem?

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#642909 Jul 19, 2013
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>They were also being inspired by an all knowing god.
And?

At the time it was written, it was correct.

Religionthebigli e

“saved From jesus”

Since: Jul 11

Location hidden

#642910 Jul 19, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I understand that a lot of ignorant Christians use Leviticus to claim that God doesn't promote homosexuality.
I also understand that they're flat out wrong. Leviticus was written for the Levite tribe, not for all Christians. The Old Testament laws were erased and rewritten, Jesus changed everything.
You're posting 'how it's used' by some, not by all. You're lumping all Christians together as if we're one individual. You're stereotyping and being extremely biased.
I didn't call you stupid, I asked if you were bright.
You must be terribly insecure to continuously post your biblical ignorance all day long.
Where did I say "all xtians" do it? You just pulled that one out of your ass, because you're typecasting me. Hypocrite much?

...and yes, I do ignore works of superstitious nonsense. I don't see how you equate that with insecurity. I'm also ignorant of Harry Potter.

Since: Feb 09

Location hidden

#642911 Jul 19, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
That is only an opinion, completely worthless.
You, like your fellow deceptive dishonest deceitful pew warming simple-minded bigots do not know what facts are. You insist your opinion is equal in weight to facts; you are despicable.

The King James version of the Bible contains a total of 1,189 chapters. That version of the Bible contains 66 books and 31,102 verses. The King James version of the Bible also has 788,258 words.

Those are facts RR. They are not an opinion. Anyone who wants to start counting will come up with the same numbers; this means they are objective facts.

When I say that the Bible contradicts itself it is not my opinion. I say the Bible contradicts itself because it contradicts itself. And like counting verses in the KJV it can be verified that it is true.

Here are a couple contradictions that completely disqualify the Bible as an inerrant book:

John 1:18 "No man hath seen God at any time;..."
Exodus 33:20, And he said, Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live.
John 6:46 "Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is ofGod, he hath seen the Father."
1 John 4:12 "No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us."

Versus

Gen. 32:30 "And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved."
Exod. 33:11 "And the LORD spake unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend."
Num. 14:14 "...that thou LORD art seen face to face,..."
Job 42:5 "I have heard of thee by the hearing of the ear: but now mine eye seeth thee."
Deut. 34:10 "And there arose not a prophet since in Israel like unto Moses, whom the LORD knew face to face,..."
Deut. 5:4 "The LORD talked with you face to face...."

And:

Num. 23:19 "God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent."
1 Sam. 15:29 "And also the Strength of Israel will not lie nor repent: for he is not a man, that he should repent."

Versus

Jonah 3:10 "And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not."
1 Sam.15:11 "It repenteth me that I have set up Saul to be king...."
Exod. 32:14 And the LORD repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people.
Psalms.42:10 "... for I repent me of the evil that I have done unto you."
Gen. 6:6 "And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart."
1 Sam. 15:35 "...and the LORD repented that he had made Saul king over Israel."

And:

Rom.3:23 "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God."
1Kgs. 8:46 "...for there is no man that sinneth not,...."
Prov.20:9 "Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?"
Eccl. 7:23 "For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not."
Mark 10:18 "And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God."
Rom. 3:10 "As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one."

Versus

Gen. 6:9 "Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God."
Job 1:1 There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil.
Job 1:8 "...my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?" (Job 2:3)
Gen. 7:1 "And the LORD said unto Noah, Come thou and all thy house into the ark; for thee have I seen righteous before me in this generation."
Luke 1:5-6 "In the days of Herod, the king of Judaea,there was a priest named Zacharias, of the division of Abia: andhe had a wife of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth. And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

Since: Feb 09

Location hidden

#642912 Jul 19, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
And?
At the time it was written, it was correct.
That is your wishful hoping. Us normal people deal with facts that can be verified, not your ignorant and stupid dog and pony shows.

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#642913 Jul 19, 2013
Detroit. Democrat rum for 50+ years.

http://money.msn.com/now/post--10-reasons-det...

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#642914 Jul 19, 2013
Religionthebiglie wrote:

Where did I say "all xtians" do it? You just pulled that one out of your ass, because you're typecasting me. Hypocrite much?
Yes, you are correct. You wrote "quoted passage from homophobic, cherry-picking xtians" which does NOT imply "all Christians".

Apologies.
...and yes, I do ignore works of superstitious nonsense. I don't see how you equate that with insecurity. I'm also ignorant of Harry Potter.
If you ignore it, why are you here?

Since: Feb 09

Location hidden

#642915 Jul 19, 2013
Al Garcia wrote:
<quoted text> Both accounts are true. Jesus had just been through the physical and traumatic experience being forced to carry his cross to the pole to be executed. Simply what you read is what the witnesses saw and wrote at various times on his way to the stipes as Jesus collapsed under the physical exhuastion which he was experiencing.
I see you can't resist rewriting the Bible to suit your own personal beliefs. There are many here who are impartial and can read what I posted with honesty:

Mark 15:21, "And they compelled a passerby, Simon of Cyrene, who was coming in from the country, the father of Alexander and Rufus, to carry his cross." (ESV)

John 19:17, "And he went out, bearing his own cross, to the place called The Place of a Skull, which in Aramaic is called Golgotha.(ESV)

QUESTION: So, who carried the cross? Jesus carried it himself or Simon of Cyrene carried it. Both can not be true.

Lying for the Bible to cover up its many errors and contradictions only makes you look dishonest Garcia, it does nothing to make the Bible credible.

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#642916 Jul 19, 2013
Reverend Alan wrote:
<quoted text>
You, like your fellow deceptive dishonest deceitful pew warming simple-minded bigots do not know what facts are. You insist your opinion is equal in weight to facts; you are despicable.
The King James version of the Bible contains a total of 1,189 chapters. That version of the Bible contains 66 books and 31,102 verses. The King James version of the Bible also has 788,258 words.
Those are facts RR. They are not an opinion. Anyone who wants to start counting will come up with the same numbers; this means they are objective facts.
When I say that the Bible contradicts itself it is not my opinion. I say the Bible contradicts itself because it contradicts itself. And like counting verses in the KJV it can be verified that it is true.
Here are a couple contradictions that completely disqualify the Bible as an inerrant book:
John 1:18 "No man hath seen God at any time;..."
Exodus 33:20, And he said, Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live.
John 6:46 "Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is ofGod, he hath seen the Father."
1 John 4:12 "No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us."
Versus
Gen. 32:30 "And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved."
Exod. 33:11 "And the LORD spake unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend."
Num. 14:14 "...that thou LORD art seen face to face,..."
Job 42:5 "I have heard of thee by the hearing of the ear: but now mine eye seeth thee."
Deut. 34:10 "And there arose not a prophet since in Israel like unto Moses, whom the LORD knew face to face,..."
Deut. 5:4 "The LORD talked with you face to face...."
And:
Num. 23:19 "God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent."
1 Sam. 15:29 "And also the Strength of Israel will not lie nor repent: for he is not a man, that he should repent."
Versus
Jonah 3:10 "And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not."
1 Sam.15:11 "It repenteth me that I have set up Saul to be king...."
Exod. 32:14 And the LORD repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people.
Psalms.42:10 "... for I repent me of the evil that I have done unto you."
Gen. 6:6 "And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart."
1 Sam. 15:35 "...and the LORD repented that he had made Saul king over Israel."
And:
Rom.3:23 "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God."
1Kgs. 8:46 "...for there is no man that sinneth not,...."
Prov.20:9 "Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?"
Eccl. 7:23 "For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not."
Mark 10:18 "And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God."
Rom. 3:10 "As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one."
Versus
Gen. 6:9 "Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God."
Job 1:1 There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil.
Job 1:8 "...my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?" (Job 2:3)
Gen. 7:1 "And the LORD said unto Noah, Come thou and all thy house into the ark; for thee have I seen righteous before me in this generation."
Luke 1:5-6 "In the days of Herod, the king of Judaea,there was a priest named Zacharias, of the division of Abia: andhe had a wife of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth. And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.
Seeing as how you know everything, go fix Detroit.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#642917 Jul 19, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Woah. Apology accepted.
I've said it before, I think the NIV is a more accurate translation than the KJV. Why do you keep asking the same questions?
k.

Since: Feb 09

Location hidden

#642918 Jul 19, 2013
I have discovered a training manual that our resident fundies use to prepare themselves for defending their ignorant religion and their stupid holy book. It is rather long and it will take several posts to get it all in, but it is a good read as it explains why they behave as dishonestly, deceptively and deceitfully as they do.

It is called How to think like a fundie. I'll get it posted as quickly as I can in as few posts as I can.

Please let me know how much you like it. Normal people only, no fundies need reply.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#642919 Jul 19, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I've explained why I think the KJV is translated incorrectly - I never said the KJV is wrong.
I've also never asked you to accept my understanding of it. Just understand that it's my opinion and I choose the NIV over the KJV. Problem?
You have, several times, claimed that the NIV is an objectively superior translation and that verses from the KJV are superseded by the NIV. Now it's just "your opinion," so no, I don't care which version you choose to entertain yourself with.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#642920 Jul 19, 2013
Reverend Alan wrote:
<quoted text>That is only an opinion, completely worthless. The NIV, Notoriously Inaccurate Version is just that, notoriously inaccurate.

Mark 15:21, "And they compelled a passerby, Simon of Cyrene, who was coming in from the country, the father of Alexander and Rufus, to carry his cross." (ESV)

John 19:17, "And he went out, bearing his own cross, to the place called The Place of a Skull, which in Aramaic is called Golgotha.(ESV)

So, who carried the cross? Jesus carried it himself or Simon of Cyrene carried it.

This is proof that the Bible contains errors and therefore can not be the work of a perfect God.
Hell, he's barely literate.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#642921 Jul 19, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
And?
At the time it was written, it was correct.
No, it wasn't. It was "correct" in that it agreed with the current consensus, but that is not the same thing as being actually correct, especially when we are dealing with an all knowing god that should have known better. Funny that this god's knowledge mirrors the knowledge of humans at the time.

Since: Feb 09

Location hidden

#642922 Jul 19, 2013
HOW TO THINK LIKE A FUNDIE!!!

Planning a career in online Christian fundamentalist apologetics? How about the exciting world of Young-Earth Creationism? Witnessing to, and debating with, atheists and other hellbound unsaved sinners on the internet can be hard work, so you need to familiarise yourself with the tried and tested methods used by fundies all around the world. After completing this simple training course, the shadow of doubt will never again flicker across your mind whilst listening to the lies and deceptions of those ignorant infidels who disagree with your self-evident truths.

1) Inerrancy
First and foremost, the Bible is the absolute, literal word of God. Contrary to popular opinion, it contains none of the following:

errors of any kind
contradictions
absurdities
When you understand this, dealing with those who claim to have found a contradiction is simplicity itself: there are no contradictions, so he cannot have found one! You see? Easy, isn't it? If your opponent continues in his error after having this explained to him (nice and slowly), elaborate on your answer using an appropriate response from the following list:

That translation is incorrect - in the original texts a different word is used, so it is not a contradiction.
He is taking the verses out of context, so there is no contradiction.
Satan has blinded him to the truth. There is no contradiction, and he should pray to be shown the correct meaning.
This is only an apparent contradiction. That is not the same as an actual contradiction.
If the verses are interpreted correctly, it is obvious that there is no contradiction.
There are no contradictions in the Bible, so this is not a contradiction.
The contradiction is caused by his anachronistic thinking. The word [insert word here] had a different meaning back then.
Having just demonstrated that the supposed contradictions do not exist, you have now proved that there are no contradictions in the Bible, reinforcing your claim that it is truly the unsullied Holy Word of God.

2) Science
There is but one measuring stick required to determine the truth of any claim - how it compares with Holy Scripture. More precisely, how it compares with your personal reading of Scripture. So, if some secular humanist scientists dare to dream up a theory (or "wild guess", as it is more accurately known) that apparently conflicts with the teachings of the Bible, clearly these egg-head mad professors have made yet another idiotic mistake, possibly under demonic influence. How do we know they are mistaken? See "1 Inerrancy".

Conversely, when science agrees with the Bible we should applaud the brave, Bible-believing investigators for supporting the Holy Word and showing the glory of Creation. But usually they are wrong.

Never forget, the atheists are quick to use the findings of science as "evidence" in their arguments, but this is because materialism and science are their god and religion. They want the men in white coats to save them from the God they know will judge them.

3) Debating techniques
Here we delve into the murky world of online debating with heathens. You can witness to lost souls in USENET newsgroups (such as alt.atheism and talk.origins), or in message fora on their websites.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#642923 Jul 19, 2013
Reverend Alan wrote:
<quoted text>
That is your wishful hoping. Us normal people deal with facts that can be verified, not your ignorant and stupid dog and pony shows.
A fact than can be (and has been) verified is that our current classification system of animal & plant life is different now than is was 2,000 years ago.

That is not opinion, that is fact.

Since: Feb 09

Location hidden

#642924 Jul 19, 2013
Self contradiction
In a heated argument, you will often find yourself losing track of your previous posts, and the atheist will often accuse you of contradicting comments you made earlier. As your words are Bible-based, it stands to reason that they should therefore be correct at all times. Refer to "1 Inerrancy". Alternatively, remember that, as slaves of The Evil One, atheists will do their best to twist your words and attempt to confuse you. If this appears to be happening, ignore their comments and pray for strength.

Logic and reason
These are the playthings of the unbeliever, and you should have no truck with them. Faith in the Lord is all you need. The atheist will try to imply that God should be bound by the rules of logic, but God invented logic and so cannot be constrained by it! The more illogical and unreasoning you are, the harder it becomes for atheists to refute your statements. They will scream "But that doesn't make sense! It is logically impossible!" - be that as it may, your faith will tell you that you are correct. With God, all things are possible - including impossible things. What more do you need?

The burden of proof is on the skeptic
"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" you will be told. But just who is making the extraordinary claim here? You, who simply observe the Creator's hand in all things, or the infidel who against all logic and reason denies the very same. Clearly, it is incumbent on the unbelievers to support their ludicrous assertions that there is no God. Ask them if they can prove God does not exist. Ask how they can be so arrogant to make this claim, when they have not searched the entire universe for God. They will come back and ask you to disprove the existence of Zeus, Vishnu and unicorns, but you should dismiss such childish nonsense - there is no comparison between the fairy-tale gods of other religions and the Truth of Christianity, Their inability to disprove God is evidence enough that He is real. If they cannot overturn your theory, they are clearly being unreasonable by refusing to accept it.

Repeating yourself
After spending a few days debating with a group of atheists, you should leave them alone for a week or so. This will give them time to come to terms with the truths you have revealed. Also, it will provide time for new people to join the discussion. This allows you to return to the forum once more and repeat your statements, unchanged, for the benefit of newcomers. We recommend storing your longer arguments in a text file, so it can be easily cut-and-pasted into the forum. If the forum regulars object, explain that, having already corrected their misconceptions, you are now simply trying to reach the new members and those who still unreasonably reject the truth. If they are civilised people, they will respect this and stand aside. Repeat this technique until you are banned from the board or placed in everybody's killfile.

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