Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#640562 Jul 14, 2013
Hey, man, you don't talk to the Colonel. You listen to him. The man's enlarged my mind. He's a poet warrior in the classic sense. I mean sometimes he'll... uh... well, you'll say "hello" to him, right? And he'll just walk right by you. He won't even notice you. And suddenly he'll grab you, and he'll throw you in a corner, and he'll say, "Do you know that 'if' is the middle word in life? If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs and blaming it on you, if you can trust yourself when all men doubt you"... I mean I'm... no, I can't... I'm a little man, I'm a little man, he's... he's a great man! I should have been a pair of ragged claws scuttling across floors of silent seas...

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#640563 Jul 14, 2013
Truth signed in wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL...you have no idea what you're talking about....for Pete's sake...you don't see it fitting to include law enforcement and healthcare cost directly related to drug abuse...as drug related costs? Are you off your meds? When your state Medicaid program goes broke paying thousands of dollars in hospital bills for drug abusers who repeatedly end up in the ER overdosed, or to manage the many complications that occur from alcohol induced cirrhosis, IV drug related hepatitis...whatever...and your state continues to drop the amount they will pay for care of the elderly lady living next door as the result of the inexcusable overuse of funds they've spent on the druggie...you might get it. As for treatment, that's all fine and dandy if you can relocate and have a support system in place for these people, because sending them back to the same environment, only causes them to fall off the wagon...and then you're right back at square one. There's a great deal you apparently don't understand about drug abuse and the related costs.
I understand drug abuse perfectly well. I did not say that drug related healthcare costs should not be included, I said that they would be mitigated with better education, research, and treatment.

I did say that enforcement should not be included, because it is not a direct result of drug abuse. It is a result of the state enforcing a set of laws that it has no business enforcing. Do you think it's reasonable that we spend billions of dollars "warring" with a problem that isn't going away? Enforcement is completely unnecessary and not a "natural," direct result of drug abuse. We bring those costs on ourselves in trying to codify morality. Vices are not criminal acts.

Anyways, we are off topic - my initial assertion was that treatment is cheaper than the revolving door of incarceration, which it is, and which your own stats have borne out.
uidiotRaceMAKEWO RLDPEACE

United States

#640564 Jul 14, 2013
oneear69 wrote:
<quoted text>The major contributor where the railroads,the development, as well, as believe it or not, but shooting Bison and other big game from a moving train, was somewhat of a sport, not to mention the fur trade.Mankinds development,has done this to every environment on the planet. There really is not much left that we haven't fuked up. We have become no different than the animals we lock up at the zoo. There is no more natural, in nature.
the bad US military and hired gunslingers need mass murder the Bison and Indians before r ailroad can be build! Stop defending evil!

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#640565 Jul 14, 2013
Truth signed in wrote:
<quoted text>
No Hiding...I fully recognize that science can only deal with materialist explanations. Which is my point exactly. Yes, organic molecules are everywhere...have been since the beginning of time...(whenever you might think that would have been).,,and we don't have one single piece of evidence to prove that any of those molecules have come together to form life. Not on their own or even with the aid of scientists...hasn't happened. Why in the name of all things holy would you argue that? Argue evolution, Argue theories that have at least a tinge of rational evidence to support them...but your wasting your time on this??? THere is NO proof whatsoever to substantiate abiogenesis. That meteorites have building blocks for life and scientists were able to create a ribonucleotide in a lab is not evidence...they aren't theories or even credible hypotheses...it's just research. It's not that big of a deal really...I mean you got your evolution theory going on...turn that theory into scientific law...focus on something else, cause abiogenesis ain't gonna fly.
There wasn't life. Now there is life. We've never found a god anywhere. QED.

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's Teapot

#640566 Jul 14, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =1p9iUnZfSiUXX
Blasphemy.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#640567 Jul 14, 2013
True Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
You perceive moderate as being weak, mellowed, watered down, soft handed. To me, that's not necessarily what moderation is about. To me, moderation is about balance.
I think chopping off limbs and heads for repeated offenders, career criminals, may be a good idea. On its own it is indeed an extreme notion, so it thus has to be balanced. If a government is considering these extreme measures, then it also has to put an extreme effort into ensuring its countrys youth and general citizens are not put in a position where they have to turn to crime.
I believe in the death penalty, but certainly don't believe it'll work in South Africa. Our government doesn't do enough to ensure equal quality education, entrepreneurship and good employment opportunities, so it has no has no right to punish criminals with the death penalty.
If you want an extreme law, you have to provide an extreme service to balance it.
It is an extreme leftist view that all humans rights are inviolable. You are putting humans above principle, above ethics, above standards of civilization, above consequence. This is a key extreme leftist characteristic. Make the humans like sacred gods.
And your idea turns the state into a god. There exists no possible society in which the government can provide such excellent service that no one will have to turn to crime to survive. I doubt there exists a government that could even prevent a significant portion of the population from turning to crime at some point or another.

And so your "balanced state" will be nothing but a bunch of "haves" congratulating themselves on weeding out, via execution and dismemberment, the "have nots," who clearly turned to crime because of some innate evil, not because of external conditions.

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#640568 Jul 14, 2013
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>The fact that our society is not perfect does not mean we should treat our prisoners badly. Life is terribly unfair sometimes. We don't gain anything by making it worse for criminals.
The psychological/sociological ramifications resulting from the priority of profit are of grave
proportions when it comes to the conduct of human beings. In fact, an entire structure of imposed control has been created in order to deal with the never-ending problems associated with the need for survival by way of gain/profit/income - The Legal System. While non-monetary related crimes, often born from ego, jealousy, emotional deprivation and other psychological issues are currently a problem, the frequency of non-monetary related crimes are nothing in comparison to the crimes committed that are motivated by the acquisition of money and property.
In fact, if we define “Crime” as ‘Corruption’ and define “Corruption” as “Moral Perversion; Dishonesty”, then an entirely new perspective comes into play, for, if you look closely enough, you will see that nearly every act of strategic monetary gain is corrupt by its very construct…it is just accepted as ‘normal’ by the conditioned culture to whatever degree is deemed tolerable by consensus.“Greed and Competition are not the result of immutable human temperament…greed and fear of scarcity are in fact being continuously created and amplified as a direct result of the kind of money we are using…We can produce more than enough food to feed everybody…but there is clearly not enough money to pay for it all. The scarcity is in our national currencies. In fact, the job of the central banks is to create and maintain that currency scarcity. The direct consequence is that we have to fight with each other in order to survive.
The Zeitgeist Movement

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#640569 Jul 14, 2013
The “Corporate Criminal’s” need to secure a business’s profitability is no different in basis than the “General Criminal’s” need to survive. While the latter typically commits crimes to live, the former commits crimes to further secure their positions of power, lifestyle and wealth. It is based on fear.
The notion of “Greed”, which manifests from a perpetual insecurity derived from the fear of losing
what one has, serves as the motivating factor for most corporate crimes. It is like a gambling
addiction. The more you get, the more you want. This neurosis is perpetuated/reinforced by the
social stratification that the monetary system creates, for there is a never-ending progression of
“luxuries” available as one’s purchasing power increases (i.e.: mansions, yachts, limos, diamonds,
land, etc). More on this will be addressed in the next section:“The Distortion of Values”.
Government Crime is one of the more complex and difficult forms of conduct to consider, for
perception of government is highly modified by the prevailing values this “ruling class” perpetuates
through society, via the mass media and traditional jingoism. In other words, if we look back at the
horrors of Hitler, many often forget that many of the German people also maintained the anti-
Semitic value system, propagated by the regime through pamphlets and broadcasts. The same can be
said for the US Invasion of Iraq, which was fueled initially by public support, simply because of the
hate and fear of so called “Islamic terrorists”, generated by the attacks of September 11th 2001. That
being said, let’s put aside our traditionalized values of loyalty and “patriotism” and take an objective look at what government within a Monetary System actually is and represents.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#640570 Jul 14, 2013
MisterCharrington wrote:
<quoted text>
word salad and solopsism...
Enough innocents have been exonerated after the death penalty was handed down in countries which actually have due process to know that the death penalty and ANY form of capital punishment are very very wrong. To have the death penalty in countries with APPALLING human rights records and a system of 'justice'(and I use the term loosely) which is not fit for purpose is simply par for the course.
As the state, which is the entity which has the monopoly on coercive force...you apply those ethics to yourself, first and foremost.
If someone cuts off my hand for stealing a loaf of bread because I was hungry, do I then have the ability to get a job and pay my way?
No I do not! I am labelled as a thief and beyond redemption, nor do I have two hands to carry out manual labour, SO I AM REDUCED TO STEALING AGAIN.
...why am I even typing this to a fanatic.
Indeed. It's an absurd system.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#640571 Jul 14, 2013
True Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Surely you would realise that it is nowhere near as simple as you portray.
It's not as simple as "He stole! Chop his hand!" or "He murdered! Chop his head!". I don't know of any country in the world that carries out law like that, nor would I ever accept such a system as civilized.
Murder and theft are always handled on a case by case basis. No two cases are the same. Circumstances, and how definitive the evidence is, the plea, past offenses, and a whole host of other things. It all counts. Punishment by chopping is only to be used in extreme cases. Deliberate pre-meditated murder, career theft, serial killing.
And a person with 1 hand can find work, and it is reasonable to expect that the person would not steal, and behave in a trustworthy manner at least for the sake of keeping his remaining hand.
You are on the extreme left. You are a fanatic, so anyone who's not on the extreme left would look like fanatics to you.
I wouldn't quite call disagreeing with dismemberment and execution via beheading "extreme."

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#640572 Jul 14, 2013
Truth signed in wrote:
<quoted text>
get some help...seriously!
take your own advice

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#640573 Jul 14, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
Blasphemy.
It's scary indey.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#640574 Jul 14, 2013
MisterCharrington wrote:
<quoted text>
Josephus on jesus:
"So...I was having a rip roaring time in Rome, I had just gorged myself on suckling pig and I was off to the vomitorium for the sixth time while contemplating a visit to the local brothel.....oh and by the way there was this dude in the province of judea who was OBVIOUSLY THE SON OF GOD.....when I discovered that some little urchin had picked my toga and I found myself financially embarassed, so I had to get a sub from Marcus Graxus Platypus, and you know what he's like, he'll never let me forget it....JESUS IS LORD OK!"
...seems legit.
Lol... really not that far from the truth.

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#640575 Jul 14, 2013
uidiotRaceMAKEWORLDPEACE wrote:
<quoted text> the bad US military and hired gunslingers need mass murder the Bison and Indians before r ailroad can be build! Stop defending evil!
I think your version of history is a bit biased, The earliest such railroad, built from Quincy, Mass. to the Neponset River dates from 1826, and in the next year another was built in Pennsylvania from the coal mines in Carbon County to the Lehigh River
Between the Rocky Mountains and the States lying along the Mississippi River on the west, from Minnesota to Louisiana, the whole country was one vast buffalo range, inhabited by millions of buffaloes. One could fill a volume with the records of plainsmen and pioneers who penetrated or crossed that vast region between 1800 and 1870, and were in turn surprised, astounded, and frequently dismayed by the tens of thousands of buffaloes they observed, avoided, or escaped from. They lived and moved as no other quadrupeds ever have, in great multitudes, like grand armies in review, covering scores of square miles at once. They were so numerous they frequently stopped boats in the rivers, threatened to overwhelm travelers on the plains, and in later years derailed locomotives and cars, until railway engineers learned by experience the wisdom of stopping their trains whenever there were buffaloes crossing the track.
The primary cause of the buffalo's extermination, and the one which embraced all others, was the descent of civilization, with all its elements of destructiveness, upon the whole of the country inhabited by that animal. From the Great Slave Lake to the Rio Grande the home of the buffalo was everywhere overrun by the man with a gun; and, as has ever been the case, the wild creatures were gradually swept away, the largest and most conspicuous forms being the first to go.

The secondary cuases of the extermination of the buffalo may be catalogued as follows:

(1) Man's reckless greed, his wanton destructiveness, and improvidence in not husbanding such resources as come to him from the hand of nature ready made.(2) The total and utterly inexcusable absence of protective measures and agencies on the part of the National Government and of the Western States and Territories.(3) The fatal preference on the part of hunters generally, both white and red, for the robe and flesh of the cow over that furnished by the bull,(4) The phenomenal stupidity of the animals themselves, and their indifference to man.(5) The perfection of modern breech-loading rifles and other sporting fire-arms in general...

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#640576 Jul 14, 2013
Truth signed in wrote:
<quoted text>
Uh hem! Look around you Scar...I don't care how many different scenarios you come up with for it to happen or how many different molecules you try to place together. I don't have the scientific data to back it up...right off the top of my head, but I would guarentee since Darwin proposed the idea in the 1870/ there have been countless failed experiments. And beyond that, nature itself, which supposedly caused this magnificent phenomena to occur, has never repeated the act again. If what I said boggles your mind...you're easily boggled. It's pretty simple math.
You are basing your "nature has never done this again" argument on how large a slice of the universe?

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#640577 Jul 14, 2013

“Michin yeoja”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#640578 Jul 14, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
He did too~/.
Imagine his surprise when "she" turned over.

We all look like sisters when we bend over. It's the duct tape that gives it away.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#640579 Jul 14, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Unable to dispute any of it, huh?
It doesn't need to be disputed. Any large enough volume of quackery will hit on a few things. How do you think the bible would fare if we subjected every single claim in it to scientific scrutiny? Yes, I know you would claim "metaphor," but that's besides the point. You can't pick and choose, and you can't take the word of scientists when it confirms your beliefs but discard it when it contradicts your beliefs (the flood, etc).

Also, you can't claim the few "scientific claims" of the bible to be indicative of its truth if you won't allow that same logic to apply to any religious text.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#640580 Jul 14, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>

We all have our skills but we all rely on each other's skills as well.
A profound breakthrough.

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#640581 Jul 14, 2013
Truth signed in wrote:
<quoted text>
are you a scientists?
for you

what would make someone a scientist?

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