Prove there's a god.

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

#639807 Jul 11, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Catcher is probably better.
Catcher has much experience.

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#639808 Jul 11, 2013
True Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Who do you blame for such a mess? This crony capitalism.
I don't know how political your society is, but in my country, lotsa people don't give a damn what's going on in the country, but they very quick to complain when the shit hits them.
Yes, a true democracy, is only as good as the participation and education of the citizenry. As it is now less than 60% of eligible voters vote in any given democracy in the world today. Even less understand policy and how it is laws and regulations come to be. While it is easy to say the 1% do manipulate the system for their own need, it is only possible because we the people let it be.At the bottom of that pyramid is we the people, we are the foundation of our society, and it will only be when the people of the world stand in solidarity, will the inequality stop. Change does not have to be violent, just an understanding that we are all here on this boat ride of life , together. One world, one people. as critical thinkers, we should not wait, until things are critical before we think, they did that on Easter Island, and that did not go so well.

“Rising”

Since: Dec 10

Milky Way

#639809 Jul 11, 2013
Al Garcia wrote:
<quoted text>
I've never had a female lawyer.
Then you never had a mother of children.

“I speak my mind”

Since: Sep 10

It hurts to bite my tongue

#639810 Jul 11, 2013
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
False.
No, it wasn't false. Science currently has a hypothesis...not evidence...otherwise...it'd be a theory.
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Our current inability to demonstrate life from organic molecules does not, in no way, mean we have no evidence they cannot. You are confusing propositions here.
No, I'm not confusing propositions...if science had evidence...of any kind...if they could provide at least one single event...then they could demonstrate the possibility...currently...they cannot...hence...no evidence. NONE
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Though I'm ignorant of the specific sciences surrounding abiogenesis, I understand more about science than you do and base my position on my knowledge - and lack of knowledge.
And I base my position on a lack of scientific evidence...of ny kind...as well as common sense and the ability to observe nature and my surroundings...which have adequately shown...non-living matter does not produce living things.
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
See? You're mistaken again. You confusing evidence for abiogenesis from direct observation of abiogenesis.
THere is NO proof whatsoever to substantiate abiogenesis.
Science works in evidence, not proof.
I'm not confusing evidence of abiogenesis with direct observation of abiogenesis. There's nothing to confuse...it's never been observed and there is no evidence to suggest it happens. There is only an assumption that it must have.
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Why do you believe that you can speak to this issue, with such great authority, when you're entirely ignorant about how science works, especially the sciences surrounding abiogenesis?
That meteorites have building blocks for life and scientists were able to create a ribonucleotide in a lab is not evidence...
Oh, really? Why not? Just 'cause you really, really believe it's not?
I can speak on this issue with authority because, contrary or what you may believe, I'm not entirely ignorant about how science works and I'm not an idiot. And, the reason I believe that meteorites having building blocks for life and that scientists were able to create a ribonucleotide in a lab was not evidence of abiogenesis is because it isn't. Just because meteorites have building blocks for life, in no way proves life formed from them. And certainly, being the scientific whiz kid you gloat on about...you understand that manipulating elements to form a ribonucleotide...which is only a component of RNA...is a far stretch from evidence that life forms from non-living matter.
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Your opinion on these matters is precisely the same as a bricklayer's, a fishmonger, or an actor. You're welcome to your uninformed opinion, certainly.
See post above. I'm stunned that you believe your ignorance makes for some kind of argument.not?
I'm stunned you haven't a more intelligent, scientifically based argument. Attacking my intelligence doesn't prove your point...just shows yours inability to do so.
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Why would a biologist, chemist, or biochemist care if it doesn't fly with you? Your opinion as a scientifically ignorant person on the state of abiogenesis research is meaningless.
Maybe so, but it certainly has you all in a tizzy.
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
In the above, you've confused evidence with observation, demonstrated a failure to understand what research is (it's absolutely based on hypotheses), the difference between hypotheses, theory and research, etc. Your critique here has no value.
LOL...my critique may have no value...that's probably true. As for the rest of that statement...please back that up...because thus far..you have not.

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#639811 Jul 11, 2013
True Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
In my opinion one can't be too individualistic about this issue. The goal is to ensure most people are able to, and choose to obey the law. There will be casualties. People will die, sometimes innocents will die. That is highly unfortunate. Maybe those innocents could be you or me, or someone we know or love. But the goal is to bring MOST people under law and principle.
I don't believe we should be sanctifying every single person just because they happened to pop out of a human womb. Some people are incredibly destructive and if they had their way, would probably kill or enslave us all. I'd rather put my money towards animal conservation.
I know that some people, regardless of how well a society is run, and all people are given equal opportunities, and those having problems are helped before the problems escalate, will still have those that go bad. THAT is the cost we pay, but killing them still lowers everyone else who condones that killing to their level, and sometimes below it.

There are many countries that murder prisoners for things that are not harming other people at all, but rather are what their culture or religions claim is a sin punishable by death. There should be no country or society anywhere in the world that is tolerated by the rest of the world that would treat other human beings that way.

I am against all the senseless attacking of these countries that are having internal problems nowadays, but when I hear of someone who is facing the death penalty in some relatively advanced, but socially backward country, for something that would be considered a minor offence in my country (and I live in one of the best countries in the world in many ways), I think the UN or Nato, or whatever body is in control, should tell those countries that if that prisoner is executed every official in that country, who had any control over that will become enemies of the world, and put on a hit list. To me there is nothing lower.

Of course, we do put pressure on countries nowadays if they are about to execute a citizen of one of the free countries, but there needs to be more than just pressure. It has to be something that will make the others back down, without question.

Tribal laws, religious beliefs, or just plain ignorance, are no excuse for murder.

Those that put animal life ahead of human life (not that I think any animal should be purposely mistreated) should put their own money to help the animals, but society should never place a higher value on other animals than human animals.

Since: Sep 08

Westcliffe, CO

#639812 Jul 11, 2013
oneear69 wrote:
<quoted text> Yes, a true democracy, is only as good as the participation and education of the citizenry. As it is now less than 60% of eligible voters vote in any given democracy in the world today. Even less understand policy and how it is laws and regulations come to be. While it is easy to say the 1% do manipulate the system for their own need, it is only possible because we the people let it be.At the bottom of that pyramid is we the people, we are the foundation of our society, and it will only be when the people of the world stand in solidarity, will the inequality stop. Change does not have to be violent, just an understanding that we are all here on this boat ride of life , together. One world, one people. as critical thinkers, we should not wait, until things are critical before we think, they did that on Easter Island, and that did not go so well.
And of course you should do the leading of that bottom of the pyramid, educating them along the way. I mean, you understand these things, so you are a natural for it.

Hey, that 1% didn't force or coerce their way into power. They were allowed to rise to the top by the bottom. They got trapped just like the rest of us. They do bad and they get disposed of. Has been that way for ages and ages. Why they had kings.

The system and life you enjoy now came from their handling the money and direction of resources. Someone has to be at the top. Even the poor are doing better than they used to. Who do you intend to replace them with?

Amazing, you think 7 billion people will agree on the course of action civilization will take.

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#639813 Jul 11, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
How do pot plants grow in closets, then?
Dave, everything that requires energy to grow, gets it from the sun, even if indirectly. Without the sun which is the source of all energy which is used on the earth, nothing would grow. We might harness some sun energy and convert it into some other form which then transmits that energy to whatever is growing, but without the sun we could not do that. In fact, we wouldn't be.

Yes, I am sure that you will come up with a good number of organisms that are either so deep in the ocean or deep in the earth, but still alive, that don't directly get any benefit from sunlight, but they do get benefit from something that got the sunlight initially.

Since: Mar 11

Australia

#639814 Jul 11, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm starting to understand that. Me and my boys were just talking about houses, and some of the houses here in Riverside are like 100 years old. The boys were like "wow, that's amazing". I told them that it may seem amazing, but then you go to Boston they may have a 300 year-old house. Then you go to England they may have 1000 year-old house. Our little hundred year old houses ain't got nothing on that.
Now if you keep going backwards you will be able to work out how people lived in the past and how "WE KNOW".
Check out areas where it is believed civil war battles occurred, dig around a bit and you may find evidence. You will then be able to understand how humans manage to know what an arrowhead or a piece of pottery means.
Just because someone said those houses are 100 years old, how do you know? where is the proof? The paperwork could be false it could all be a lie!

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#639815 Jul 11, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
And of course you should do the leading of that bottom of the pyramid, educating them along the way. I mean, you understand these things, so you are a natural for it.
Hey, that 1% didn't force or coerce their way into power. They were allowed to rise to the top by the bottom. They got trapped just like the rest of us. They do bad and they get disposed of. Has been that way for ages and ages. Why they had kings.
The system and life you enjoy now came from their handling the money and direction of resources. Someone has to be at the top. Even the poor are doing better than they used to. Who do you intend to replace them with?
Amazing, you think 7 billion people will agree on the course of action civilization will take.
My friend, it is not mine or yours to decide, but all of humanity . One would hope that one day, society has the maturity and responsibility, that leaders, are no longer needed. And no, Elitism has maintained its hierarchy for centuries, fuk, since the Babylonian, Egyptian, Greek, and Roman Empires. You think, the British and European aristocrats and Monarchs, gave up all their wealth,lol. You understand that all the wars of the last century and beginning of this one where all financed by the same global private bankers, that over 60% of monetary wealth in the world is owned and controlled by less than 1%, that over 80% of the raw material and resources are controlled and owned by these same bunch. My friend, you really gotta pull your head from the sand, this great opportunity you think is available is an illusion to almost 75% of the global population.

Since: Sep 08

Westcliffe, CO

#639816 Jul 11, 2013
saidI wrote:
<quoted text>
Now if you keep going backwards you will be able to work out how people lived in the past and how "WE KNOW".
Check out areas where it is believed civil war battles occurred, dig around a bit and you may find evidence. You will then be able to understand how humans manage to know what an arrowhead or a piece of pottery means.
Just because someone said those houses are 100 years old, how do you know? where is the proof? The paperwork could be false it could all be a lie!
Put on the clothes of an era and walk around the ruins of that era. But instead of acting like you think they acted from gathered info like you described, or how you assumed they thought, just be yourself in the environment and trappings of the time. That is how they lived. Same goes wearing skins and living in caves.

The pictures you draw in your mind from artifacts found, or books read, is a false picture of the reality.

Put yourself there and think how you would interact with others in that environment.

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#639817 Jul 11, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>

The system and life you enjoy now came from their handling the money and direction of resources. Someone has to be at the top. Even the poor are doing better than they used to. Who do you intend to replace them with?
Amazing, you think 7 billion people will agree on the course of action civilization will take.
You understand , that Americas wealth of its Elitists, came from stolen Native land, and slave labour. In fact had it not been for the resources of North and South America, there's no doubt , the rest of the world would have already , depleted its way out of existence.

Since: Sep 08

Westcliffe, CO

#639818 Jul 11, 2013
boooots wrote:
<quoted text>
Dave, everything that requires energy to grow, gets it from the sun, even if indirectly. Without the sun which is the source of all energy which is used on the earth, nothing would grow. We might harness some sun energy and convert it into some other form which then transmits that energy to whatever is growing, but without the sun we could not do that. In fact, we wouldn't be.
Yes, I am sure that you will come up with a good number of organisms that are either so deep in the ocean or deep in the earth, but still alive, that don't directly get any benefit from sunlight, but they do get benefit from something that got the sunlight initially.
Wrong again, boooots.

The sun got and gets its energy from the rest of the universe. The sun just localized some of it. Captures and redirects, if you will.

Just another Topix atheist that can't see the forest for the trees, and think they are educated.

Tsk..

should expect better from a Canadian.

Since: Sep 08

Westcliffe, CO

#639819 Jul 11, 2013
oneear69 wrote:
<quoted text> You understand , that Americas wealth of its Elitists, came from stolen Native land, and slave labour. In fact had it not been for the resources of North and South America, there's no doubt , the rest of the world would have already , depleted its way out of existence.
Oh my God.

Can you imagine a world of 7 billion all full of the political fire you are? Look how much trouble with the relatively few we have now.

“I speak my mind”

Since: Sep 10

It hurts to bite my tongue

#639820 Jul 11, 2013
Double Fine wrote:
<quoted text>
Sigh. I cannot quite fathom whether you are being a bit ignorant, or deliberately obtuse.
Witnesses need to have first hand accounts, historians do not.
Historians, however, make it their job to obtain first hand accounts.
If I am going to investigate the Holocaust, obviously I am 27, I am too young to have a personal account. But I can speak to survivors. I can go through Nazi records and Allied accounts.
If I want to write a piece about Apartheid, which I do not remember, I can speak to whites, blacks, Indians, colourds, etc that lived during those times. I can see newspaper articles of the massacres at Sharpville, Langa and Soweto uprising.
And even when I have no first hand sources, it is still possible for me to trace soneone credible who used a first hand source and then have a report, research paper or dissertation about it.
So I can be a good historian. But that does not make me a witness.
Can you grasp that difference?
Uhm...excuse me...but I don't need to be taught the difference between a historian and an eye witness...try to keep up!

I mentioned Josephus...and someone, I. can't even remember who, made a big deal about him not having an eye witness account. I pointed out that he need not have an eye witness account, as he was a historian!

In yet another attempt to demean my intelligence, you have only shown you either aren't paying attention to what is being discussed or you simply found a post you could twist and use as a reason to be rude and condescending.

Whatever your intention...all you've done is prove what I've been saying all along...with excellent information to nack me up. Thanks :)

Since: Sep 08

Westcliffe, CO

#639821 Jul 11, 2013
oneear69 wrote:
<quoted text> My friend, it is not mine or yours to decide, but all of humanity . One would hope that one day, society has the maturity and responsibility, that leaders, are no longer needed. And no, Elitism has maintained its hierarchy for centuries, fuk, since the Babylonian, Egyptian, Greek, and Roman Empires. You think, the British and European aristocrats and Monarchs, gave up all their wealth,lol. You understand that all the wars of the last century and beginning of this one where all financed by the same global private bankers, that over 60% of monetary wealth in the world is owned and controlled by less than 1%, that over 80% of the raw material and resources are controlled and owned by these same bunch. My friend, you really gotta pull your head from the sand, this great opportunity you think is available is an illusion to almost 75% of the global population.
Who do you think is going to support your lifestyle in your perfect world? Who will haul your shit, go down in mines for the resources to make your cell phone, to grow and harvest the crops, to do an endless number of jobs no one wants to do? You gonna have them raise their hands and volunteer?

Quit dreaming and start thinking. Might hurt, but you will get used to it.
Myth Buster

Phoenix, AZ

#639822 Jul 11, 2013
njpetservicesdirectory wrote:
Proving the existence of God is the beginning of having faith in God, so it is one of the most important goals to establish in our lives.
100% wrong! All of the scientific evidence fully supports entirely natural origins for the universe and life on earth. Organized religion is a cruel hoax created to control imbeciles like you.

The most important goal of every brainwashed godbot should be to objectively study the historical, scientific and medical evidence that discredits their cult's Dark Ages dogma and return to the modern world.

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#639823 Jul 11, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh my God.
Can you imagine a world of 7 billion all full of the political fire you are? Look how much trouble with the relatively few we have now.
No need to worry, my friend,lol, it will be generations before mankind has that kind of maturity. Chances are our resources and environments will be long depleted before any kind of change will come about. They say the carrying capacity of the Earth is about 9 billion, at today's rate, we will achieve that by 2050.

Since: Mar 11

Australia

#639824 Jul 11, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/ 2013/07/11/md-man-swims-5-hour s-to-save-his-family-after-the ir-boat-capsized/
Wow.
I bet he wasn't praying to Darwin.
No, he would have been praying the authority don't get him, again.

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#639825 Jul 11, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Who do you think is going to support your lifestyle in your perfect world? Who will haul your shit, go down in mines for the resources to make your cell phone, to grow and harvest the crops, to do an endless number of jobs no one wants to do? You gonna have them raise their hands and volunteer?
Quit dreaming and start thinking. Might hurt, but you will get used to it.
My friend, the problems are not technical, we now have the science , technology, ingenuity and management skills to feed, house and educate the entire planet. Our problems are social and our inability to work with one another for the best interest of everyone, Again, our democracies of the globe are for the most part Bread and Circuses, when people vote on self interest rather than what is good for the whole. An argument against democracy, since the Greek Empire, The Romans then made a Republic, a chance for the people to be heard, but have no power.
Myth Buster

Phoenix, AZ

#639826 Jul 11, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
I wish he'd be my friend.
Today, you're a brainwashed Christian godbot with the intellectual capacity of a mentally retarded child totally humiliating yourself and embarrassing your country on an international forum with your self-degrading compulsive proselytizing. Of course, it doesn't have to be this way.

You can take your head out of your ass, get off you knees, walk out of the local brainwashing institution, leave the Dark Ages behind and return to the modern world. I'd welcome you back to the human race.

http://articles.exchristian.net/2002/10/becom...

Are you caught up in an unhealthy, compulsive and destructive Christian lifestyle?

Do you feel that your Jesus fetish is screwing up your brain and isolating you from the rest of modern society?

Do crucifixes, Bibles and songs like "Onward Christian Soldiers" turn you on?

The truth is that you don't have to be a Christian. You can recover. There is hope. Many men and woman have reclaimed their brains and walked away from the Christian lifestyle. It's not about hate, it's about hope.

Christianity is a fusion of an ancient Jewish set of legends and myths, such as all ancient societies had, mixed up with a bizarre little personality cult that emerged in the first century. It has no relevance to modern society, and time and time again the progress of reason and science has shown it to be inaccurate.

Walk out of the Christian lifestyle today! Remember, no one has to be a Christian. You were not 'born that way'. There is hope. You can leave your destructive lifestyle.

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