Prove there's a god.

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#635551 Jul 2, 2013
Snow Bunny_ wrote:
<quoted text>How do you know "nothing" doesn't exist, if we do not have an example of "nothing"?
You say "nothing doesn't exist, or there would be nothing"....EXACTLY...so how can you say it does not exist, if there's no way to measure or research "nothing"?
This should have said.....

This works even if there is a god, because god would have to have been something that created nothing

This works even if there is a god, because god would have to have been something within the nothing that created something.

“Listen to the sounds”

Since: Feb 09

of your own extinction......

#635552 Jul 2, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
It could be an infinite amount.
An infinite amount of uncreated universes? You are prepared to believe that?

And do let me guess, you are prepared to believe that these other universes may have their own set of entirely different physical laws? Will you even entertain the idea that whole entirely different systems of law can exist, and yet still wish to bind God to evidence as per the laws of this universe?

The mathematics of all of this can suggest such things and multiverses and things always existing conveniently, but ultimately as far as we are talking matter you have to look at what is logical.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#635553 Jul 2, 2013
Snow Bunny_ wrote:
<quoted text>There is a GREAT debate among scientists regarding WHAT "nothing" is, or if it's anything at all.
Just like NOW, the claim of nothing simply being NOTHING...yet we are talking about NOTHING, as though it is something.
The mere fact that we can't give an example of NOTHING, means we can't say EITHER way...because there's no way to research or study "nothing"..
My sophomore year in college proves it is indeed possible to study nothing.

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#635554 Jul 2, 2013
Double Fine wrote:
<quoted text>
You know, if you take a length of rope and divide it...
Oh wait. Buck's not here

Buck like all believers cannot imagine anything counter intuitive,
which unfortunately most of everything in quantum physics.
I had a hard time understanding the double slit experiment and
Schrodinger's cat but once you understand them and the uncertainty principle , it starts to make sense. Light cones are fun too as is understanding length contraction acceleration and future points on a temporal curve such as the twin paradox. Infinities exist like god, in our minds but they also exist in reality , just beyond the scope of human reasoning.

“Imaginez tous les gens”

Since: Sep 09

Sunbury, OH

#635555 Jul 2, 2013
Ilovewhitemen20 wrote:
Google Irminism? Lmao oh please you dont know where I got my knowledge of Irminism from, and it most certainly isnt Google.
Where you get your agnostic "wisdom" from? YouTube? Lol :P
Your post is a rant because you posted jumbled group of sentences that have nothing to do with Irminism. You dont know what it is, so stop making long boring paragraphs about something you know nothing about.
I never said praying to a "god" or "God" therefore makes them a "god" or "God". My point was that your deluded little brain cant see, is that they never BELIEVED them to actually exist like the Christians do. Unlike Christians, Irminists dont sit back and hope their "God" does something, they believe in action. And they saw their "gods" as metaphors. They didnt really believe the god Thor actually rode in a carriage across the sky to cause lightning with a real hammer. If you know so much about Irminism, I'd like to see you explain to me how the hell it's exactly like Christianity. I've been studying Germanic mythology and culture for years, thank you very much.
REDACTED FOR SPACE!
WOW, talk about a RANT^ lol! No?
Did you google the definition of hypocrite yet?

I get my agnostic wisdom from life experience, I studied Theology in college (which led me to be Agnostic, lol), many professors, and my grandpa was a Quantum physics professor at Otterbein University, in Ohio.

"A jumbled group of sentences"...how were my sentences jumbles? Can you be SPECIFIC to what sentences you are referring to? My response DID have to do with "Irminism"...can you read? I CLEARLY said "how does praying to a God equate making a God"...did you miss that part?
I also addressed a SECOND time in the above post.

Again, how does your point regarding "Irminism" have anything to do with my point regarding Christians rationally rejecting OTHER Gods, but yet NOT turning that critical rational thinking onto their own God? Why do you keep deflecting with "Irminism"?
The fact that you CLAIM their God doesn't "exist" (which in itself is debatable) is moot to the point.
Again, why dodge the point regarding Allah, or Mohammed...since you want an example of a supposed God worshipers believe is "real"...?

I never said Christianity was like "Irminism," Can you read? For the 4th time....I said how can CHRISTIANS use critical thinking and rationally reject OTHER Gods (whether they are pagan Gods, mythical Gods, etc...) Yet NOT use that same rational thinking when it comes to THEIR God?

You say "hey didnt really believe the god Thor actually rode in a carriage across the sky to cause lightning with a real hammer".....really? Because Christians believe God came from a VIRGIN. Talking snakes, 900 year old men, the earth was made the world in 6 days, and they believe the Earth is less than 7,000 years old....just ask a YOUNG creationist.
LOL> again, your point contradicts itself...and makes my point!
If Christians believe ALL that crap, then why NOT believe in the Thor mythology?

It is >you< who keeps getting Irminism confused with religion...because I was making a point about RELIGION, and their belief in GOD...and YOU brought up Irminism as a point regarding Christians...again, do you see how hypocritical and contradictory your post is?

LASTLY, you clearly claimed "no one ever believed Zeus was real"...and I have proven quite CLEARLY that Greeks DID believe he was real..and worshipped him. And punished those like Sacretes for claiming they were NOT real. The mere fact that Zeus has a "birth place " that is REAL, proves they believed he was REAL!
Why are you denying documented FACT?
Greeks believing in Zeus in that time period is very much the same as Christians believing in Christian God? Can you explain the difference?
...and aren't you embarrassed for wrongly claiming NO ONE ever believed Zeus was reaL?

“Listen to the sounds”

Since: Feb 09

of your own extinction......

#635556 Jul 2, 2013
Snow Bunny_ wrote:
<quoted text>WOW...really?! Then please...do tell us all!
<quoted text>That's not proof of God :(
<quoted text>That is not proof of God :(
<quoted text>That is not proof of God :(
<quoted text>AGAIN, that is certainly NOT proof of God.
<quoted text>None of that ids proof whatsoever.
What you listed are ways of people deluding themselves into believing something with ZERO proof.
I think another word for that is FAITH...blindly believing in someone irrational without proof.
True right up till the last point.

The possession of proof negates faith. If someone has proof, then they don't believe, they know. Faith is for people who do not know. This is not to say they are blind. They may well have evidence, just not proof.

No one has proof that the person they're marrying is going to make them happy till their death. It doesn't mean they are blindly marrying them either. They have evidence, past experience of the person and so they take this step of marriage in good faith. Without faith, no one can ever live. We make decisions everyday based on half truths and partial evidence.

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#635557 Jul 2, 2013
Snow Bunny_ wrote:
<quoted text>There is a GREAT debate among scientists regarding WHAT "nothing" is, or if it's anything at all.
Just like NOW, the claim of nothing simply being NOTHING...yet we are talking about NOTHING, as though it is something.
The mere fact that we can't give an example of NOTHING, means we can't say EITHER way...because there's no way to research or study "nothing"..
Sure there is and we do, you just haven't.... its quantum physics, the study of how nothing is something and how what we thought impossible becomes possible.
lol This link will prolly make Dave figgity.

http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/143782-mit...

“Imaginez tous les gens”

Since: Sep 09

Sunbury, OH

#635558 Jul 2, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
Because nothing is the ground state, or simply the lowest energy state that can exist. If there were absolutely nothing at the ground state there could never be anything, that is why there is something instead of nothing. We call it ZPE or zero point energy and is though to be what is causing the universe to expand.
Because as you say something cannot come from nothing, but in reality nothing is something and everything is nothing.
The total energy of the universe balances out to zero, all this in a nutshell is quantum physics my dear and we do research nothing.
But you can't quite remove everything from even empty space , there remains a potential , this is demonstrable through the Casimir effect, where even with no energy a photon will pop into existence , which ties in with the uncertainty principle.
So that being said a condition of nothing is a vacuum with virtual particles having the potential to become something or ZPE.
If you want to try to understand this you can research ground state, and ZPE. But though hard to understand , this makes more sense than simply saying something comes from nothing.
Is to realize even nothing is something, or there never would be anything. This works even if there is a god, because god would have to have been something that created nothing, though to a quantum physicist the nothing that god exists in is the ground state of everything. I hope this makes sense to you, because quantum physics can be very counter intuitive.
http://www.calphysics.org/zpe.html
I think you might have misunderstood my point :)

I completely agree that something CAN come from nothing!
However, that is a BELIEF...not a fact, and THAT is my point!

My point is we can not FACTUALLY or scientifically know something can come from nothing, because we've never had a REAL example of nothing to measure, study, or research.

If "nothing is the ground state"...then WHAT is the Ground state, and can it be measured as nothing?
...and where did the "ground state" derive from?...from nothing? from something?

Get my point?
:D

Since: Mar 13

Anaheim, California

#635559 Jul 2, 2013
Snow Bunny_ wrote:
<quoted text>
WOW, talk about a RANT^ lol! No?
Did you google the definition of hypocrite yet?
I get my agnostic wisdom from life experience, I studied Theology in college (which led me to be Agnostic, lol), many professors, and my grandpa was a Quantum physics professor at Otterbein University, in Ohio.
"A jumbled group of sentences"...how were my sentences jumbles? Can you be SPECIFIC to what sentences you are referring to? My response DID have to do with "Irminism"...can you read? I CLEARLY said "how does praying to a God equate making a God"...did you miss that part?
I also addressed a SECOND time in the above post.
Again, how does your point regarding "Irminism" have anything to do with my point regarding Christians rationally rejecting OTHER Gods, but yet NOT turning that critical rational thinking onto their own God? Why do you keep deflecting with "Irminism"?
The fact that you CLAIM their God doesn't "exist" (which in itself is debatable) is moot to the point.
Again, why dodge the point regarding Allah, or Mohammed...since you want an example of a supposed God worshipers believe is "real"...?
I never said Christianity was like "Irminism," Can you read? For the 4th time....I said how can CHRISTIANS use critical thinking and rationally reject OTHER Gods (whether they are pagan Gods, mythical Gods, etc...) Yet NOT use that same rational thinking when it comes to THEIR God?
You say "hey didnt really believe the god Thor actually rode in a carriage across the sky to cause lightning with a real hammer".....really? Because Christians believe God came from a VIRGIN. Talking snakes, 900 year old men, the earth was made the world in 6 days, and they believe the Earth is less than 7,000 years old....just ask a YOUNG creationist.
LOL> again, your point contradicts itself...and makes my point!
If Christians believe ALL that crap, then why NOT believe in the Thor mythology?
It is >you< who keeps getting Irminism confused with religion...because I was making a point about RELIGION, and their belief in GOD...and YOU brought up Irminism as a point regarding Christians...again, do you see how hypocritical and contradictory your post is?
LASTLY, you clearly claimed "no one ever believed Zeus was real"...and I have proven quite CLEARLY that Greeks DID believe he was real..and worshipped him. And punished those like Sacretes for claiming they were NOT real. The mere fact that Zeus has a "birth place " that is REAL, proves they believed he was REAL!
Why are you denying documented FACT?
Greeks believing in Zeus in that time period is very much the same as Christians believing in Christian God? Can you explain the difference?
...and aren't you embarrassed for wrongly claiming NO ONE ever believed Zeus was reaL?
Did YOU look up the definition of hypocrite yet? Dont point your fingers unless they're clean.:)

And you IMPLIED Christianity is like Irminism, because you said "Irminists pray to their gods like Christians do to their God".

And you havent proved the Greeks actually believed their "gods" to be actual beings like the Christians do. And you cant because they didnt. I dont see why its so hard for you to understand, Irminists dont think like Christians AT ALL.

Do you see how ignorant you are in Irminism? Matter of fact, Christianity is a hodgepodge parody of Irminism, anyway.

YOU are the one who thinks Irminism is a religion, because you keep saying the Irminists think like Christians. Irminists didnt believe fairies really existed.

Stop making up assumptions so you can keep vomiting out your rants in an attempt to sound smart. You dont know a damn thing about Irminism, so stop talking like you do.
Myth Buster

Scottsdale, AZ

#635560 Jul 2, 2013
scambuster wrote:
Been there, done that, came back, and I am happier now with who I am
The blind hypocrisy of your username is almost beyond belief. Organized religion is the cruelest and most dangerous scam ever perpetuated against the human race. It's inevitable that there will an international ban on this abomination. There are no valid justifications in defense of religious brainwashing and no place for cults with violence inciting dogma in a world with weapons of mass destruction.

“Imaginez tous les gens”

Since: Sep 09

Sunbury, OH

#635561 Jul 2, 2013
Freebird USA wrote:
<quoted text>
My sophomore year in college proves it is indeed possible to study nothing.
Then...please do elaborate?! Tell us all!

...because when I was in college, we were taught you can NOT study "nothing" because there is NO example of "nothing" to study, or research.

Can you give me an example of the "nothing" you studied in college?

Since: Mar 13

Anaheim, California

#635562 Jul 2, 2013
Snow Bunny_ wrote:
<quoted text>No, obviously it's NOT the end of the discussion, lol
Again, you are being intellectually dishonest if you claim to not recognize to difference between Agnostics and Atheists.
Let me write in simple terms, to make it easier for you to understand:
1. Atheist believe in NO God, and believe there is NO possibility of a God.
2. Agnostics believe in NO God, but believe there is a possibility of a God.
AGAIN, for the 3rd time....I don not believe in God, but I do believe it is possible.
It's really quite clear....I feel bad for you if you can't see the difference.
There is no difference you fool. You BOTH STILL ARE IN BLIND BELIEF ABOUT SOMETHING. THAT is my point.

Feel sorry for yourself that you cant see this.

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#635563 Jul 2, 2013
True Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
An infinite amount of uncreated universes? You are prepared to believe that?
And do let me guess, you are prepared to believe that these other universes may have their own set of entirely different physical laws? Will you even entertain the idea that whole entirely different systems of law can exist, and yet still wish to bind God to evidence as per the laws of this universe?
The mathematics of all of this can suggest such things and multiverses and things always existing conveniently, but ultimately as far as we are talking matter you have to look at what is logical.
"and yet still wish to bind God to evidence as per the laws of this universe?"

For the record I have never said that.
I'm never been against the idea there could be some sort of god, but that the genesis account and the mythical deity YHWH or Allah is complete hogwash, sorry.

Since: Mar 13

Anaheim, California

#635564 Jul 2, 2013
Snow Bunny_ wrote:
<quoted text>
WOW, talk about a RANT^ lol! No?
Did you google the definition of hypocrite yet?
I get my agnostic wisdom from life experience, I studied Theology in college (which led me to be Agnostic, lol), many professors, and my grandpa was a Quantum physics professor at Otterbein University, in Ohio.
"A jumbled group of sentences"...how were my sentences jumbles? Can you be SPECIFIC to what sentences you are referring to? My response DID have to do with "Irminism"...can you read? I CLEARLY said "how does praying to a God equate making a God"...did you miss that part?
I also addressed a SECOND time in the above post.
Again, how does your point regarding "Irminism" have anything to do with my point regarding Christians rationally rejecting OTHER Gods, but yet NOT turning that critical rational thinking onto their own God? Why do you keep deflecting with "Irminism"?
The fact that you CLAIM their God doesn't "exist" (which in itself is debatable) is moot to the point.
Again, why dodge the point regarding Allah, or Mohammed...since you want an example of a supposed God worshipers believe is "real"...?
I never said Christianity was like "Irminism," Can you read? For the 4th time....I said how can CHRISTIANS use critical thinking and rationally reject OTHER Gods (whether they are pagan Gods, mythical Gods, etc...) Yet NOT use that same rational thinking when it comes to THEIR God?
You say "hey didnt really believe the god Thor actually rode in a carriage across the sky to cause lightning with a real hammer".....really? Because Christians believe God came from a VIRGIN. Talking snakes, 900 year old men, the earth was made the world in 6 days, and they believe the Earth is less than 7,000 years old....just ask a YOUNG creationist.
LOL> again, your point contradicts itself...and makes my point!
If Christians believe ALL that crap, then why NOT believe in the Thor mythology?
It is >you< who keeps getting Irminism confused with religion...because I was making a point about RELIGION, and their belief in GOD...and YOU brought up Irminism as a point regarding Christians...again, do you see how hypocritical and contradictory your post is?
LASTLY, you clearly claimed "no one ever believed Zeus was real"...and I have proven quite CLEARLY that Greeks DID believe he was real..and worshipped him. And punished those like Sacretes for claiming they were NOT real. The mere fact that Zeus has a "birth place " that is REAL, proves they believed he was REAL!
Why are you denying documented FACT?
Greeks believing in Zeus in that time period is very much the same as Christians believing in Christian God? Can you explain the difference?
...and aren't you embarrassed for wrongly claiming NO ONE ever believed Zeus was reaL?
Oh and just because a few nutcases actually believed some bearded man namaed Zeus actually lived in a mountain called Crete, doesnt justify that Irminism is about teaching that fairies and other fantastic beings existed, nor does it justify real Irminists believed fairies to actually exist either.

Are you white? If you are, Its sad you dont know your own history.
Iloveblackwomen2 1

Oakland, CA

#635565 Jul 2, 2013
Ilovewhitemen20 wrote:
<quoted text>

Stop making up assumptions so you can keep vomiting out your rants in an attempt to sound smart.
http://www.freakingnews.com/Monkey-in-a-Wig-P...

“Listen to the sounds”

Since: Feb 09

of your own extinction......

#635566 Jul 2, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
Buck like all believers cannot imagine anything counter intuitive,
which unfortunately most of everything in quantum physics.
I had a hard time understanding the double slit experiment and
Schrodinger's cat but once you understand them and the uncertainty principle , it starts to make sense. Light cones are fun too as is understanding length contraction acceleration and future points on a temporal curve such as the twin paradox. Infinities exist like god, in our minds but they also exist in reality , just beyond the scope of human reasoning.
A finite being can never know whether infinity exists, since to witness infinity, one has to be infinite as well.

Your statement that believers cannot imagine anything counter intuitive, is perhaps the most absurd statement you have ever made. We're believers dude! We specialize in counter intuitive!

"Infinities exist like god, in our minds but they also exist in reality , just beyond the scope of human reasoning."

A curious statement. So now you are saying that infinity and god exist in our mind and in reality. Infinity is like god, infinity exists in reality like god exists in reality, infinity is beyond the scope of human reasoning, like god is beyond the scope of human reasoning?

Aura Mytha: "Infinities exist like god, in our minds but they also exist in reality , just beyond the scope of human reasoning."

The typical theist: "God works in mysterious ways! God is beyond human reasoning"

Do you not see the resemblance?

You've sure come back full circle here my friend.

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#635567 Jul 2, 2013
Snow Bunny_ wrote:
<quoted text>I think you might have misunderstood my point :)
I completely agree that something CAN come from nothing!
However, that is a BELIEF...not a fact, and THAT is my point!
My point is we can not FACTUALLY or scientifically know something can come from nothing, because we've never had a REAL example of nothing to measure, study, or research.
If "nothing is the ground state"...then WHAT is the Ground state, and can it be measured as nothing?
...and where did the "ground state" derive from?...from nothing? from something?
Get my point?
:D
"My point is we can not FACTUALLY or scientifically know something can come from nothing"

We do know scientifically that something can come from nothing.

The Casimir effect and virtual particles demonstrate this.

Scratches head....

You want to know where nothing came from?
UM....
I guess from nowhere and no time.:)

Since: Mar 13

Anaheim, California

#635568 Jul 2, 2013
Iloveblackwomen21 wrote:
You either must be Sharkey or that dumb f uck ReligionMustDie.
If you think you're going to annoy me, dont waste your time.:)

“Imaginez tous les gens”

Since: Sep 09

Sunbury, OH

#635569 Jul 2, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text> Sure there is and we do, you just haven't.... its quantum physics, the study of how nothing is something and how what we thought impossible becomes possible.
lol This link will prolly make Dave figgity.
http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/143782-mit...
My grandfather was a physics professor.....Quantum physics has NOT given an example of "nothing" .
How can nothing be SOMETHING? That would make it SOMETHINg...not nothing.
I agree quantum physics shows how impossible is possible...BUT, that in no way is an example of "nothing".

Can you show me how Quantum physics has an example of Nothing?
...and how they can STUDY nothing, with having an example of nothing?

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#635570 Jul 2, 2013
Myth Buster wrote:
<quoted text>
The blind hypocrisy of your username is almost beyond belief.
Funny thing is, that I chose this username when I was agnostic.
Myth Buster wrote:
<quoted text>
Organized religion is the cruelest and most dangerous scam ever perpetuated against the human race.
Is it? What's your perception of disorganized religion?
Myth Buster wrote:
<quoted text>
It's inevitable that there will an international ban on this abomination.
I suppose that time will tell. Until then you're entitled to speculate about the future, like psychics and mediums do, and call it the truth.
Myth Buster wrote:
<quoted text>
There are no valid justifications in defense of religious brainwashing and no place for cults with violence inciting dogma in a world with weapons of mass destruction.
I agree. Brainwashing is a horrible thing, and religion and lack thereof should never be forced on anyone.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Top Stories Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
News Roman Catholic church only true church, says Va... (Jul '07) 3 min Just Think 685,908
Extra Fertility meds for sale: Gonal f and menopur (Sep '12) 5 min Karen 13
News Plurality of Americans think Trump is failing 6 min UMORONRACEMAKEWOR... 27,020
God is REAL - Miracles Happen! (Jun '11) 37 min Jake999 6,454
Mark Cubans Powerball winner to say "NO!!" 56 min Doctor REALITY 2
solar eclipse a sign of the growing foolishness... 1 hr Corvus 2
Anyone know nicole horne that works at family d... 3 hr My Comment 5
More from around the web