Prove there's a god.

[Pat]

Hidingfromyou wrote:

<quoted text>
<quoted text>
Your claim is that there's a general intelligence that is somehow selected by cold environmental pressure.
Yet, you have absolutely no evidence of that.

Not so much a general intelligence as certain kinds of intelligence like abstract reasoning for example. Being able to comprehend that what you do today will impact your situation 3 or 6 months (or years) from now is abstract reasoning and people in cold climates that need to plan well in advance for a long winter had an advantage with abstract reasoning abilities. People with good abstract reasoning abilities are more likely to save for retirement, use birth control to avoid unwanted pregnancies or STDs and so on. They can test for this type of intelligence quite easily in children. What they will do is offer them the option of a small candy bar today or a much larger one tomorrow. The children with greater abstract reasoning will wait and be rewarded with the much larger candy the next day and those with limited abstract reasoning go for the immediate gratification of the small
candy bar.

I also recall a TV interview with some black gang members. The interviewer asked them, where do you see yourself in 5 or 10 years. They immediately answered "we don't think like that" we think about the present. They were right, they don’t think like that for they are lacking in abstract reasoning abilities and a mentality like that will hurt your quality of life in the long run so differences in abstract reasoning abilities contribute to the attainment gap we see between blacks and whites.

There are a large number of traits that are highly heritable, and thus we would expect to find them expressed in different proportions according to the environment that each group evolved in.

[RiversideRedneck]

Hidingfromyou wrote:

Recall that Australians colonized Az 40-60000 years ago.

They say the first human came about in Africa.

How'd they get to Australia 40,000 years ago?

[Hidingfromyou]

Pat wrote:

<quoted text>
I've been waiting for you to bring up the egalitarian bible, "Guns, Germs and Steel". That has so many flaws in it I wouldn't know where to begin.

Thus far, you've not been able to speak to a single scientific fact I've presented. You've ducked and dodged at every turn - your response here is no different.

Racism is as supportable as creationism. Hence, your unending attempts at illusion and deception without substance.

Notice, once again, a complete lack of reference to scientific research.

[Pat]

Hukt on Fonix wrote:

<quoted text>
There are those who insist, for whatever reason(s), that humans are separate from and superior to all other animals. They get offended when humans are compared to other animals. The phrasing alone, "other animals", is enough to anger some.
In my experience...
If one starts talking animal welfare... or the consequences of out-of-control human population and our desire to conquer and tame every corner of the globe...
All of a sudden, their tune changes to something akin to this...
"Show me an animal that wouldn't do the same if it could."
...or...
"Show me an animal that would intentionally govern its own species' population."
Well, guess what?...
Those are comparisons... one animal to another.
Show me an animal with the ability to comprehend the issues and do something about them.
I can think of one.
---
In case you hadn't noticed, I sent you a PM.

Show me an animal that has willingly limited it's own population. Will we be the first or will it get ugly as we let nature do it for us by war, famine and disease? I'm betting on nature.

[Hidingfromyou]

Pat wrote:

<quoted text>
Don't project your dogmatic belief system onto me. I side with the evidence, you attemt to excuse away all the evidence that conflicts with your dogma. You offer no evidence of racial equality. If black intelligence is hidden by bias and just waiting to be discovered then discover it for us smarty pants.

Again, I'm the only one of us citing scientific research. You rely on just-so stories, fiction and the absolute rejection of history.

[Hidingfromyou]

RiversideRedneck wrote:

<quoted text>
They say the first human came about in Africa.
How'd they get to Australia 40,000 years ago?

Walking, some boats, more walking.

[Aura Mytha]

Hukt on Fonix wrote:

<quoted text>
There are those who insist, for whatever reason(s), that humans are separate from and superior to all other animals. They get offended when humans are compared to other animals. The phrasing alone, "other animals", is enough to anger some.
In my experience...
If one starts talking animal welfare... or the consequences of out-of-control human population and our desire to conquer and tame every corner of the globe...
All of a sudden, their tune changes to something akin to this...
"Show me an animal that wouldn't do the same if it could."
...or...
"Show me an animal that would intentionally govern its own species' population."
Well, guess what?...
Those are comparisons... one animal to another.
Show me an animal with the ability to comprehend the issues and do something about them.
I can think of one.
---
In case you hadn't noticed, I sent you a PM.

Animal warfare sometimes ends in a cigarette, raiding the refrigerator and a good nights sleep not to mention a smile on her face.

[Hidingfromyou]

Pat wrote:

<quoted text>
Not so much a general intelligence as certain kinds of intelligence like abstract reasoning for example. Being able to comprehend that what you do today will impact your situation 3 or 6 months (or years) from now is abstract reasoning and people in cold climates that need to plan well in advance for a long winter had an advantage with abstract reasoning abilities. People with good abstract reasoning abilities are more likely to save for retirement, use birth control to avoid unwanted pregnancies or STDs and so on. They can test for this type of intelligence quite easily in children. What they will do is offer them the option of a small candy bar today or a much larger one tomorrow. The children with greater abstract reasoning will wait and be rewarded with the much larger candy the next day and those with limited abstract reasoning go for the immediate gratification of the small
candy bar.

1. Every single human can do the above. Environmental planning is not a difficult task for any human - our cultures are our tools for dealing with the outside environment. Human intelligence is selected via social interaction and social hierarchy. If you were correct, and you aren't, then the Inuit, Tibetans and Andeans would be the most intelligent people on the planet.

1.A. And for you, intelligence = money and power. So, why aren't the Inuit, Tibetans and Andeans ruling the world?

Your racism is illogical, unsupported by the evidence and only a weak mind would believe in it.

2. Equatorial regions have seasonal variation to resource accumulation.

3. Even if cold climates selected for increased intelligence in humans, which they do not, those genes would, via gene flow, get into all other environments on the planet. There can be no differences in intelligence in one species.

4. If non-Africans had genes that increased intelligence, we'd be aware of what they are by now. But genes have not been linked to intelligence. So...where are they?

I also recall a TV interview with some black gang members.

Oh, wow, that's scientific evidence for you! Way to go, Pat, you've finally answered my challenge to you!

Whatever, dude, I have no more time for you. You're willfully ignorant, hateful and insecure such that you desperately desire others to be under you. I cannot think of more pathetic.

[RiversideRedneck]

Hidingfromyou wrote:

<quoted text>
Walking, some boats, more walking.

They had boats 40,000 years ago?

[Pat]

Hidingfromyou wrote:

<quoted text>
I did my best to answer in 4000 characters. It's a complex problem that some would like to reduce to race. But race is not explanatory. I can answer in greater detail if you are specific with whatever society you want me to talk about. Or, if you just want basic information, watch "Guns, Germs and Steel."
There is no biological theory for race, no demonstrable biology for race. Typology is not supported by evolutionary theory - even Darwin knew this 160 years ago.
I've asked Pat repeatedly to explain what a race is - she cannot. Races are cultural constructs. Their definition differs from country to country. You can take any color baby and raise it in any other culture and it will be fluent in that language, fluent in that culture.
Evolution is not Social Darwinism. That's not 140 years out of date. Social Darwinism leads to eugenics; it is a political tool and nothing more.
Racism is simply not supported by contemporary science. It's a senseless, silly and dangerous nonbiological idea supported by those who desire political power.
That's it and that's all there is to it.

The fact that the races differ when in the very same environments points to a genetic causation. The reason blacks perform worse than whites in America is the very same reason Jews, a minority group that has faced discrimination, outperform other whites in America. To believe that blacks are at the bottom due to discrimination means that you must also believe Jews are at the top due to non Jewish whites discriminating against themselves. The social hierarchy also just so happens to be consistent with IQ averages with the groups with the highest IQ averages outperforming groups with lower IQ averages. What a coincidence!

Africa is also very rich in natural resources so different levels of resources does not explain away why Africa is the way it is. Whites living in Africa have proven what can be accomplished there. Look how nice Rhodesia once was until it changed to Zimbabwe and went under black control. Today it is a hell hole of suffering, violence, corruption and famine.

[RiversideRedneck]

Aura Mytha wrote:

<quoted text> Animal warfare sometimes ends in a cigarette, raiding the refrigerator and a good nights sleep not to mention a smile on her face.

...and a $100 bill on the dresser.

Oh, wait.

[RiversideRedneck]

Hidingfromyou wrote:

<quoted text>
1. Every single human can do the above. Environmental planning is not a difficult task for any human - our cultures are our tools for dealing with the outside environment. Human intelligence is selected via social interaction and social hierarchy. If you were correct, and you aren't, then the Inuit, Tibetans and Andeans would be the most intelligent people on the planet.
1.A. And for you, intelligence = money and power. So, why aren't the Inuit, Tibetans and Andeans ruling the world?
Your racism is illogical, unsupported by the evidence and only a weak mind would believe in it.
2. Equatorial regions have seasonal variation to resource accumulation.
3. Even if cold climates selected for increased intelligence in humans, which they do not, those genes would, via gene flow, get into all other environments on the planet. There can be no differences in intelligence in one species.
4. If non-Africans had genes that increased intelligence, we'd be aware of what they are by now. But genes have not been linked to intelligence. So...where are they?
<quoted text>
Oh, wow, that's scientific evidence for you! Way to go, Pat, you've finally answered my challenge to you!
Whatever, dude, I have no more time for you. You're willfully ignorant, hateful and insecure such that you desperately desire others to be under you. I cannot think of more pathetic.

Do you think American kids will stunt their growth with this new "skinny jeans" thing?

I mean, seriously - dudes wearing skin tight jeans..... Can't be good for the two little guys in those jeans.

[Pat]

Hidingfromyou wrote:

<quoted text>
1. Every single human can do the above. Environmental planning is not a difficult task for any human - our cultures are our tools for dealing with the outside environment. Human intelligence is selected via social interaction and social hierarchy. If you were correct, and you aren't, then the Inuit, Tibetans and Andeans would be the most intelligent people on the planet.
1.A. And for you, intelligence = money and power. So, why aren't the Inuit, Tibetans and Andeans ruling the world?
Your racism is illogical, unsupported by the evidence and only a weak mind would believe in it.
2. Equatorial regions have seasonal variation to resource accumulation.
3. Even if cold climates selected for increased intelligence in humans, which they do not, those genes would, via gene flow, get into all other environments on the planet. There can be no differences in intelligence in one species.
4. If non-Africans had genes that increased intelligence, we'd be aware of what they are by now. But genes have not been linked to intelligence. So...where are they?
<quoted text>
Oh, wow, that's scientific evidence for you! Way to go, Pat, you've finally answered my challenge to you!
Whatever, dude, I have no more time for you. You're willfully ignorant, hateful and insecure such that you desperately desire others to be under you. I cannot think of more pathetic.

"If you were correct, and you aren't, then the Inuit, Tibetans and Andeans would be the most intelligent people on the planet."

There are other facts involved. I never said that was the ONLY factor.

"Your racism is illogical, unsupported by the evidence and only a weak mind would believe in it."

The attainment of blacks does equal the attainment of whites. The attainment of Jews does not equal the attainment of other whites, they perform superior to other whites. Those are what you call facts, facts you attempt to excuse away with bogus environmental excuses and the blaming of whites for black failure. What there is NO EVIDENCE FOR is racial equality. Point me to a civilized modern black society with a quality of life and crime rates comparable to white society. Where do blacks perform in school equal to whites?

If the races are equally intelligent, it should be possible to find a task intuitively requiring intelligence that blacks perform as well at as whites. To insist time after time that black ability is present but hidden by bias is like claiming that someone who apparently knows only English can also speak Chinese, but never does so because circumstances are never just right. With all the evidence pointing towards racial differences, the burden of proof lies with you to prove the evidence does not represent what it appears to represent and to date nobody has been able to do that.

[wilderide]

Mylan wrote:

<quoted text>
Yes body builders are on a strict routine to consume protein. They used to have to consume some every couple of hours, even during the night. Then it was discovered about cottage cheese and because it stays in the gut a lot longer it's kind of like a protein time release capsule, so they can get more sleep, and not have to wake up every couple of hours to consume more protein.
It's also a very good way to lose weight, although most people mistakenly think it has the opposite effect. Here's how it works. Your body does most of its repairing and healing at night during your stage 3 and stage 4 sleep cycles. To do this it needs protein, and it gets it from your muscles, cannibalizing them. The less muscle you have the more fat, so holding on to it is always a good idea. When you eat cottage cheese around an hour before you go to sleep your body will use the protein from the cottage cheese directly, instead of cannibalizing your muscles. This helps to keep you leaner, instead of gaining fat.

Well, you've sure sold me. I love cottage cheese. I have no problem snacking on some before bed, and if it helps me keep muscle tome, all the better. I'll have to look into that some more.

Yeah it's amazing. The McRib contains over 100 chemicals, including azodicarbonamide which is used to make yoga mats and tennis shoes. Azodicarbonamide is banned in Europe and Australia as a food additive, but not here in the good ol USA.
FDA? What FDA?

I know , right? Just like the EPA. It would be really nice if these government agencies which are supposed to protect the public actually did so. I mean, why bother funding them with our tax money if they don't do their freaking job?

[Catcher1]

Al Garcia wrote:

<quoted text>
Short, small words and with pictures I hope!!
Lol! Kind of like "Skippy John Jones?" Lol!

As a matter of fact, as I recall there are pictures--drawings.

[waaasssuuup]

boooots wrote:

<quoted text>
I can't judge your belief, but I can make a pretty good estimate of your morals and conduct based on what you say here (you being all of those who profess to be believers, but don't really exhibit any 'Christian' attributes). It seems to me, that generally those claiming not to have a belief in a god also appear to have the higher moral value system, taking everything in account. Not all Christians are like that, including most of the Christians that I personally know. Perhaps those on this site do not represent the majority of Christians.

hey booots - my morals and conduct have been judged & crucified on the cross with Jesus. if yours haven't been, you should be very concerned about your own and not mine.

[Pat]

Hidingfromyou wrote:

<quoted text>
1. Every single human can do the above. Environmental planning is not a difficult task for any human - our cultures are our tools for dealing with the outside environment. Human intelligence is selected via social interaction and social hierarchy. If you were correct, and you aren't, then the Inuit, Tibetans and Andeans would be the most intelligent people on the planet.
1.A. And for you, intelligence = money and power. So, why aren't the Inuit, Tibetans and Andeans ruling the world?
Your racism is illogical, unsupported by the evidence and only a weak mind would believe in it.
2. Equatorial regions have seasonal variation to resource accumulation.
3. Even if cold climates selected for increased intelligence in humans, which they do not, those genes would, via gene flow, get into all other environments on the planet. There can be no differences in intelligence in one species.
4. If non-Africans had genes that increased intelligence, we'd be aware of what they are by now. But genes have not been linked to intelligence. So...where are they?
<quoted text>
Oh, wow, that's scientific evidence for you! Way to go, Pat, you've finally answered my challenge to you!
Whatever, dude, I have no more time for you. You're willfully ignorant, hateful and insecure such that you desperately desire others to be under you. I cannot think of more pathetic.

"But genes have not been linked to intelligence. So...where are they?"

Genes have not been linked to intelligence??? What exactly do you think the human brain is, a mystery blob with magical powers unaffected by genes and not a biological organ? Try looking into behavioral genetics and see what you learn. You are taking this race denial nonsense of yours to a whole new level with that assinine remark.

Behavior Genetics is a peer-reviewed scientific journal published monthly by Springer Science+Business Media that is devoted to "research in the inheritance of behavior". It is the official journal of the Behavior Genetics Association. The journal was established in 1971 with Steven G. Vandenberg as its founding editor-in-chief.

[RiversideRedneck]

General Disarray wrote:

<quoted text>
traveled from Africa to the Middle East, over to South-East Asia, across Indonesia and on to Australia

Ah, and I suppose you can support that guess with some facts.

No?

Besides, I didn't ask for a route, I asked HOW people got to Australia "40,000 years" ago....

[Pat]

Hidingfromyou wrote:

<quoted text>
Whatever, Pat, stop being emotional and upset and just explain what race is then. Give me a biological definition of what race is and demonstrate it via scientific research.
Molecular data would be preferred, since that is what we are discussing.

Race is defined as a group of persons related by common descent or heredity.

[waaasssuuup]

Hidingfromyou wrote:

<quoted text>
We can't judge your belief. We can only judge how you misunderstand the perspectives of others.
I hope you achieve spiritual fulfillment. I just hope the price for your spirituality is not the denigration of others by failing to understand and respect difference.

i hope you can agree that our humanity is what's causing all the problems in the world so you too can get it covered under the provision of Christ and become part of the solution rather than the problem:)