Prove there's a god.

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#572765 Dec 12, 2012
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
An upscale dining establishment that offers various vegetarian dishes, along with fine wines.
What? I got to start drinking for you?

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#572766 Dec 12, 2012
Happy Lesbo wrote:
.. we have never received an honest response regarding God's 'ancient world' slavery instructions nor will believers condemn such practice because to do so would contradict their God ..
Slavery has been addressed before. As far as condemming slavery that was a long time ago in a different country and it would be ethnocentric in a historic sense to condemn slavery as well as futile. They had a differnet system set up where slaves were generally POW's and it was considered merciful to let them live. Non Jewish females underwent a status change from slave to wife if intercourse was involved. Hebrew slavery, as a whole was mild and i think most are illiterate of the Old Testament here and have fixed ideas about it. It was also time specific. I know they had debt slaves where Hebrews worked off debts but that was subject to all sorts of regulation and there was the year of Jubilee where Hebrew slaves were set free if they desired that. Some chose to stay.
.. that's intellectual dishonesty or the inability to question the authority of scriptures even if obscene or amoral ..
Obscene or immoral based on what? If them folks had a chance to look at your life what do you think they would have to say about you? Your opinion of them? How do you think they would respond? Perhaps they would mention how ignorant they find you? That you are judgmental, immoral for being a happy lesbo. Not even enough sense to be ashamed. That when it comes to their culture you don't have a clue.

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#572767 Dec 12, 2012
Somali Pirate wrote:
<quoted text>
The truth is most atheists are really agnostic.
If in the hunt for a cohesive force that runs the universe something is found or proven like the string theory......
Would that not be god in a way, the absolute, cohesive force that runs the universe and explains everything.
If through science you can prove there is a god or gods I'll be the first one there preaching, until that day....
I suppose if one was to analyze it deeply enough that could be the case. I admit that I don't know there is a god, and I don't know there isn't a god. It appears no man knows either way, but millions claim to not only know there is a god, but are also positive to the point that they will bet their life and/or their eternity on it.

Of course, if there is no eternity for any individual man, then betting one's eternity is betting nothing.

I think the biggest problem that man has faced in regards to religion(s) is that the various religions of the past and the present, because of the various expectations those religions placed on man, according to how they are taught or indoctrinated into man, man has done some extremely drastic things, many of them having some good elements, and also many having some bad to extremely evil elements.

There has likely not been any religion, though I am no authority on most other religions, that has ever not crossed all of the above.

The biggest problem is they are all propagated by man passing on stories to other men, based usually on beliefs in the supernatural and the never seen superpowers of some kind. So they always have an element of doubt whether they are true or false.

I suppose there could be claimed to be some cohesive force that controls everything, as there are smaller forces which we have identified and know exist, but the ones we do know about, though they seem to work in generally a specific way, they don't seem to have any intelligent being behind them, but are just functions of various matter relating to other various matter.

With the God that most spend so much time talking about, and many worshiping, there is not only a perceived invisible force but also this force is an entity which has some of the functions of man, such as thought, anger, revenge, jealousy.

Man claims that this force or God has those characteristics yet we have no evidence to prove such things exist. We have nothing, certainly in recent times, or even in more ancient times, that might be considered as a god taking revenge on man, that cannot be fully explained by natural phenomena that occur on the earth, which are caused by known forces within or around the earth, and though we don't always predict or are able to predict when these various events are going to happen, they can all be explained by science without any intentional control by some entity.

Again most of such events told about in ancient books are doubtful that they ever happened.

The actual stories in the Bible that might indicate a cognitive entity exhibiting these types of 'emotions' apparently are pretty well known to be myths created by man.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#572768 Dec 12, 2012
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> Slavery has been addressed before. As far as condemming slavery that was a long time ago in a different country and it would be ethnocentric in a historic sense to condemn slavery as well as futile. They had a differnet system set up where slaves were generally POW's and it was considered merciful to let them live. Non Jewish females underwent a status change from slave to wife if intercourse was involved. Hebrew slavery, as a whole was mild and i think most are illiterate of the Old Testament here and have fixed ideas about it. It was also time specific. I know they had debt slaves where Hebrews worked off debts but that was subject to all sorts of regulation and there was the year of Jubilee where Hebrew slaves were set free if they desired that. Some chose to stay.
<quoted text> Obscene or immoral based on what? If them folks had a chance to look at your life what do you think they would have to say about you? Your opinion of them? How do you think they would respond? Perhaps they would mention how ignorant they find you? That you are judgmental, immoral for being a happy lesbo. Not even enough sense to be ashamed. That when it comes to their culture you don't have a clue.
You are missing the point. Even if you were capable of defending slavery as an institution (you aren't), you still can't explain why a timeless, all powerful deity would define morality based on the shifting moral attitudes of his creations. That does not make sense.

Since: Sep 10

United States

#572769 Dec 12, 2012
Clementia wrote:
<quoted text>
What? I got to start drinking for you?
Nope.

I'm happy to drink the whole bottle.

But I may end up having to lean on you!

Since: Sep 10

United States

#572770 Dec 12, 2012
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> Slavery has been addressed before. As far as condemming slavery that was a long time ago in a different country and it would be ethnocentric in a historic sense to condemn slavery as well as futile. They had a differnet system set up where slaves were generally POW's and it was considered merciful to let them live. Non Jewish females underwent a status change from slave to wife if intercourse was involved. Hebrew slavery, as a whole was mild and i think most are illiterate of the Old Testament here and have fixed ideas about it. It was also time specific. I know they had debt slaves where Hebrews worked off debts but that was subject to all sorts of regulation and there was the year of Jubilee where Hebrew slaves were set free if they desired that. Some chose to stay.
<quoted text> Obscene or immoral based on what? If them folks had a chance to look at your life what do you think they would have to say about you? Your opinion of them? How do you think they would respond? Perhaps they would mention how ignorant they find you? That you are judgmental, immoral for being a happy lesbo. Not even enough sense to be ashamed. That when it comes to their culture you don't have a clue.
Mild slavery.

That's a good one.

Like religious truth.

Oxymoronic much?

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#572771 Dec 12, 2012
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope.
I'm happy to drink the whole bottle.
But I may end up having to lean on you!
Now I'm defo not going to drink! ;-)

Do I have to wear a dress or something?

“Jesus is Love”

Since: Jul 12

Hutchinson, MN

#572772 Dec 12, 2012
SimpleMindsYouAre wrote:
Prove there is not!!
Come on and do it.
Prove there's no God.
Don;t read out of a book or anything like that just prove there's not a God.
Or best yet believe how you choose and stop spending all your time and last brain cell trying to get others to explain their God. I will worship my God till the end.. you don't have too.. I'm ok with where I will spend my ever lasting life. Sounds like you maybe be getting nervous and not so sure of yourself.. and look God died even for you.. wow
Great response.

“Jesus is Love”

Since: Jul 12

Hutchinson, MN

#572773 Dec 12, 2012
boooots wrote:
<quoted text>
I suppose if one was to analyze it deeply enough that could be the case. I admit that I don't know there is a god, and I don't know there isn't a god. It appears no man knows either way, but millions claim to not only know there is a god, but are also positive to the point that they will bet their life and/or their eternity on it.
Of course, if there is no eternity for any individual man, then betting one's eternity is betting nothing.
I think the biggest problem that man has faced in regards to religion(s) is that the various religions of the past and the present, because of the various expectations those religions placed on man, according to how they are taught or indoctrinated into man, man has done some extremely drastic things, many of them having some good elements, and also many having some bad to extremely evil elements.
There has likely not been any religion, though I am no authority on most other religions, that has ever not crossed all of the above.
The biggest problem is they are all propagated by man passing on stories to other men, based usually on beliefs in the supernatural and the never seen superpowers of some kind. So they always have an element of doubt whether they are true or false.
I suppose there could be claimed to be some cohesive force that controls everything, as there are smaller forces which we have identified and know exist, but the ones we do know about, though they seem to work in generally a specific way, they don't seem to have any intelligent being behind them, but are just functions of various matter relating to other various matter.
With the God that most spend so much time talking about, and many worshiping, there is not only a perceived invisible force but also this force is an entity which has some of the functions of man, such as thought, anger, revenge, jealousy.
Man claims that this force or God has those characteristics yet we have no evidence to prove such things exist. We have nothing, certainly in recent times, or even in more ancient times, that might be considered as a god taking revenge on man, that cannot be fully explained by natural phenomena that occur on the earth, which are caused by known forces within or around the earth, and though we don't always predict or are able to predict when these various events are going to happen, they can all be explained by science without any intentional control by some entity.
Again most of such events told about in ancient books are doubtful that they ever happened.
The actual stories in the Bible that might indicate a cognitive entity exhibiting these types of 'emotions' apparently are pretty well known to be myths created by man.
Boring post.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#572774 Dec 12, 2012
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>

There is nothing more pleasing to me than someone who mistakenly thinks they are clever.
So, why is the sensation of sadness - heaviness, pain, uneasiness, constriction, dullness, gloom - felt in the middle of the chest region and not in the brain or elsewhere in the body?
go rilla

United States

#572775 Dec 12, 2012
why do atheists resent people christians so much? I understand there are some bigots out there but some are really good people and if they live according to the bible they shouldn't point fingers and irritate anyone. i think atheists like you are that like to antagonize are bigots
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#572776 Dec 12, 2012
Sharkey wrote:
<quoted text>

It must feel cool to know a lot of big words and say absolutely nothing to you, Joel.

Did that make you feel smart for the time it took you to type these words that you had to look in the dictionary for just yesterday?
Are you homosexual?

(smiles)
pearl

Layton, UT

#572778 Dec 12, 2012
go rilla wrote:
why do atheists resent people christians so much? I understand there are some bigots out there but some are really good people and if they live according to the bible they shouldn't point fingers and irritate anyone. i think atheists like you are that like to antagonize are bigots
Because the western/christian expansion is what is detroying the world.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#572779 Dec 12, 2012
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
JOEL wrote:

i disagree.

See, salvation must be integral - no part of existence (material, emotional, vital or mental) must be left out.
Every aspect of existence should be purified and perfected by infusing the lower reaches of existence with the superior powers of the higher ranges of consciousness-energy so that the whole system vibrates as a singularity. Perfection is the aim. Once this is achieved, then, there is no coming and no going. One simply IS!
God_Himself wrote:

My idea of Salvation involves the influence of God in removing what is valid from what is unnecessary; as in the restoration of the true self to its true place, away from the confines of this material prison.

Your idea of Salvation, especially the one you suggest that is independent of God (if you said so ) is fundamentally Lucifarian in nature.

<quoted text>

Hey Joel and GH....how's it going. I'm sitting here out on the ledge reading these two posts and I gotta admit, you two have some good points.

Joel with - "Every aspect of existence should be purified and perfected by infusing the lower reaches of existence with the superior powers of the higher ranges of consciousness-energy so that the whole system vibrates as a singularity."
- I call it Self [being/soul/Spirit/consciousne ss]

....and GH posting - "as in the restoration of the true self to its true place, away from the confines of this material prison."
..but yet Joel states "it's fictiouos".
New Age asks:
- Would either of you agree that all religions are man-made, thus some "fictious attributes are involved, because "God" has never been proven to exist in our reality?

- If you ponder for a moment on both statements, you will find that they both are relatively of the same substance - Self, and what is required by ourself to uphold "purity" through honesty, love and peace with others.

I think you both have said the same thing, but for some reason, you have denied that they are the same.

Good posts no matter which way you want to travel.
Cheers!
More on this later.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#572780 Dec 12, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>

"religious nuts", sure. But not religion.

<quoted text>

Though not formerly introduced, I have met God.
<quoted text>

Yes I can & I have.

<quoted text>

I haven't died yet, so no I haven't had a glimpse into heaven.
<quoted text>

Ok then. You're belief in the love if your mother means nothing.
<quoted text>

Lol, then get to dissolving you mind-matter barrier...... WTF?
<quoted text>

True, which is why you haven't found God yet.
<quoted text>

Are they?
Not a single intelligent line from you, religious nut.

You're place is in the zoo or circus.

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's Teapot

#572781 Dec 12, 2012
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> Slavery has been addressed before. As far as condemming slavery that was a long time ago in a different country and it would be ethnocentric in a historic sense to condemn slavery as well as futile. They had a differnet system set up where slaves were generally POW's and it was considered merciful to let them live. Non Jewish females underwent a status change from slave to wife if intercourse was involved. Hebrew slavery, as a whole was mild and i think most are illiterate of the Old Testament here and have fixed ideas about it. It was also time specific. I know they had debt slaves where Hebrews worked off debts but that was subject to all sorts of regulation and there was the year of Jubilee where Hebrew slaves were set free if they desired that. Some chose to stay.
Wikipedia entry about the Midrash and its function. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midrash also http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Catholic_Encycl... (1913)/Midrashim

More about slavery in the OT from Judaic Midrash halakha, "VE-eileh ha-mishpatim" (AND these are the statutes). It was a deeper explanation kept by the Rabbi's concerning OT text. An exegesis of the Torah. Essentially ,"fine print".

Quoting:

"Your slaves and maidservants that you shall possess from the nations that surround you, from them you may purchase slaves and maidservants. Also, from the children of the sojourners who reside with you from them you may purchase [slaves], and from their families that live among you that were born in your land.[All these] shall be your permanent possession. You shall will them as inheritance to your children after you as hereditary property; you shall keep them in servitude permanently. However regarding your bretheren, Bnei Yisroel, man over his brother, you
must not rule over him to crush him."
Vayikra 25:39-46

Commentary: A non-Jewish servant, however, can be passed on to descendants through inheritance! The possession of a non-Jewish slave is eternal. But note another difference: A Jewish slave may not be subjected to “hard labor”(b’farech); a non-Jewish slave has no such condition. Seemingly, a non-Jewish slave may be worked to the bone with the most menial of work.

As we mentioned above, a Jewish servant must be released after six years of work.

Not so, however, is the case for a non-Jewish slave. How are we supposed to understand that they are kept forever? How are we to allow hard labor for someone who was purchased like property? How can we understand the purchase of another human being at all?

The institution of slavery represents a blurring of the line dividing human personhood from property. This blurring is reflected clearly in some of the laws recorded in the parasha (Note that I am treating the institution of slavery in toto, without reference to the important distinction between Hebrew slaves and Canaanite slaves, as in Vayikra 25:39-46):

(a) When a master strikes his slave and the slave subsequently dies (after 24-48 hours), the master is exempt from punishment "because he is his property" (21:21-22. Rashbam: "and the law allows him to strike him in order to chastise him.")

(b) An ox that gores and kills a slave subjects its owner only to a 30-shekel fine and not to "ransom money" designed to redeem the master from a death penalty (21:29-32).

(c) The master may (sometimes) compel his slave to cohabit with a slave-girl and the children will belong to the master (21:4).
End quote. YESHIVA UNIVERSITY http://www.yu.edu/ http://www.slideshare.net/steiny100/jewish-sl...

"the children will belong to the master"

I'm disgusted, are you?

The modern day Rabbi is appalled as well, and he should be, but he's not trying to deny it or explain it away. He doesn't attempt to make excuses or only select the parts he likes.

The Rabbi doesn't try to ignore anything, but then again...

He's not a Christian.

“Jesus is Love”

Since: Jul 12

Hutchinson, MN

#572782 Dec 12, 2012
pearl wrote:
<quoted text>Because the western/christian expansion is what is detroying the world.
According to the local atheists on this forum, you are liar. They claim that Christianity is declining, not expanding.

They claim that atheism is what is expanding, so the destruction you must be observing must be the result of atheism.....something I've been pointing out for years.

Thanks for making atheists look like the fools they are.
go rilla

United States

#572783 Dec 12, 2012
pearl wrote:
<quoted text>Because the western/christian expansion is what is detroying the world.
please explain how morals destroy the world. let's says people aren't bigots they are peaceful and live according to the 10 commandments, what harm would that do?
curious george

United States

#572784 Dec 12, 2012
do atheist celebrate Christmas? it seems like double trouble to me since it's a pagan holiday turned christian :P

“Jesus is Love”

Since: Jul 12

Hutchinson, MN

#572785 Dec 12, 2012
JOEL wrote:
<quoted text>
Not a single intelligent line from you, religious nut.
You're place is in the zoo or circus.
When I fart, I think of you.

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