Prove there's a god.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#564954 Nov 21, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
See you guys! Happy Thanksgiving.
Likewise.

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#564955 Nov 21, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh please.... Churches have been tax exempt for thousands of years. They were exempt even in the Roman Empire.
Don't be jealous.
However now with 20% or less of tax payers actually involved with churches, should they be exempt? Having been on church board of executives, I know that most churches today would not survive without the help they get, because, especially in cities, the taxes on such large properties would be higher than some of them take in in a year.

But why should a church have tax exemptions in a country that has separation of church and state? Essentially by giving them tax exemptions that is involving the government with the church.

Also many churches don't take in more than the cost of maintaining their own property and employees, so that means they are being counted as a charitable organization though they might not necessarily be contributing to charity.

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#564956 Nov 21, 2012
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Some were not "deeply" religious I would say.
Happy Thanksgiving to you and all the other good people here.
In my case a month or so late, as we Canadians get a jump start on Thanksgiving by having it in October, but thank you anyway.:)

Actually I don't think my wife and I did anything particularly different on the actual day than any other day. Since being off work, and also since giving up church attendance, days seem to all run together for me, and often particular "special" days go by and are not even noticed.

Perhaps for others like me, we can be thankful just any time.

“I never claimed to be Perfect”

Since: Nov 10

just better than yesterday

#564957 Nov 21, 2012
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
You are mixed up here Al. The sole reason for separation of church and state was to prevent a church from gaining complete authority over government. The main reason for this and the fear of this was to escape the church of England who held control of Americans from across the sea. The church of England controlled everything before independence was won.
So by decree it was written into the constitution that there could be no state appointed religion or religion appointed state.
Some foolish Americans want to return to a theocracy , but it is because they do not understand the reasons why we wrote the possibility out.
isn't that what I tried to say or did I muck it up?
atheists dont have a clue

Kalamazoo, MI

#564958 Nov 21, 2012
henry wrote:
<quoted text>
Of course it is a fact: the bible is full of fakes and lies too!
if that were true, atheists would love it because it would be just like them. well, really the bible would have to also be full of jealousy, arrogance, and selfishness and then it would be just like them. lol.

Atheists, you hypocrites, you clean the outside of the cup while the inside is full of bile.
atheists dont have a clue

Kalamazoo, MI

#564959 Nov 21, 2012
henry wrote:
<quoted text>
Educated people mostly know that there is no such thing like god at all!
No, you've got it wrong. Arrogant and selfish people do. However, one should not be arrogant and selfish, so they don't know much.

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#564960 Nov 21, 2012
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
You are mixed up here Al. The sole reason for separation of church and state was to prevent a church from gaining complete authority over government. The main reason for this and the fear of this was to escape the church of England who held control of Americans from across the sea. The church of England controlled everything before independence was won.
So by decree it was written into the constitution that there could be no state appointed religion or religion appointed state.
Some foolish Americans want to return to a theocracy , but it is because they do not understand the reasons why we wrote the possibility out.
You are a FREAKSHOW. There still is NO separation from church and state. The Catholic Church controls every government. It will take the UN to VOTE...to end this control and BAN religion. Religion has caused ALL of our problems since the begining of time. You are stupid ...to think otherwise....

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#564961 Nov 21, 2012
boooots wrote:
<quoted text>
In my case a month or so late, as we Canadians get a jump start on Thanksgiving by having it in October, but thank you anyway.:)
Actually I don't think my wife and I did anything particularly different on the actual day than any other day. Since being off work, and also since giving up church attendance, days seem to all run together for me, and often particular "special" days go by and are not even noticed.
Perhaps for others like me, we can be thankful just any time.
You have no faith....nothing to hope or live for. You and the wife are hopeless FREAKSHOWS. Try to find the right truth/Religion.....God is a God of order..look at the universe...are you simply blind?? He has 1 way, an organized way for people to know and serve Him. Your thinking is to live and die. WRONG. You might as well be a radical Islamist...
atheists dont have a clue

Kalamazoo, MI

#564962 Nov 21, 2012
ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>
Oopps, sorry I thought you were someone else who actually had something to input to this thread. My mistake and forget the bit about thinking you had something good to offer – you don’t.
Ooh, listen to the judger of thread input!!! It's almighty ChristineM.
Arrogance is a virtue to people like you. lol

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

Since: Sep 08

The Borderland of Sol

#564963 Nov 21, 2012
atheists dont have a clue wrote:
<quoted text>
if that were true, atheists would love it because it would be just like them. well, really the bible would have to also be full of jealousy, arrogance, and selfishness and then it would be just like them. lol.
Atheists, you hypocrites, you clean the outside of the cup while the inside is full of bile.
But it is full of jealousy, arrogance and selfishness.

And that's just the deity.
bibul

Runnemede, NJ

#564964 Nov 21, 2012
if you went to hell wouldn't you just get used to it over time???

“Rising”

Since: Dec 10

Milky Way

#564965 Nov 21, 2012
TJ Monk wrote:
<quoted text>
You are a FREAKSHOW. There still is NO separation from church and state. The Catholic Church controls every government. It will take the UN to VOTE...to end this control and BAN religion. Religion has caused ALL of our problems since the begining of time. You are stupid ...to think otherwise....
((The Catholic Church controls every government.))

I can see you're another conspiracy nut.
Religion has been a problem , but only since civilazation.
But it hasn't cause ALL problems , as no one thing could encompass all that.

“Rising”

Since: Dec 10

Milky Way

#564966 Nov 21, 2012
civilization even.

Since: Nov 12

Jodhpur, India

#564967 Nov 21, 2012
Today internet has arisen to such a magnitude that none of the business can reach at beneficial success without making use of these websites. The reason behind this is Ecommerce professional we design is attaining more and more grandness. If you do not have a professional ecommerce website it is hard to contend in the present market. There are many open source tools for it. So web development has taken a grand achievement in India (top most in it) and many other countries in the world.

[url=http://www.emulationsoftt ech.com] web Development india[/url],
[url=http://www.emulationsoftt ech.com] emulation [/url]

Since: Nov 12

Jodhpur, India

#564968 Nov 21, 2012
Today internet has arisen to such a magnitude that none of the business can reach at beneficial success without making use of these websites. The reason behind this is Ecommerce professional we design is attaining more and more grandness. If you do not have a professional ecommerce website it is hard to contend in the present market. There are many open source tools for it. So web development has taken a grand achievement in India (top most in it) and many other countries in the world.
Liberty Warrior

Hammonton, NJ

#564969 Nov 21, 2012
To all those who seek proof...
In Jesus' day, there were many people who saw His miracles first hand but still did not follow Him. If Jesus appeared today and performed miracles, many would assume He was a skilled illusionist or a con-man operating a scam.

The point is simply that people will either believe or they will not. If someone is closed to the idea, no amount of evidence will ever convince them. There are many today who feel that miracles are simply impossible. Therefore, any time you see one, there must be some other natural explanation.

If Jesus Christ came and stood before you right now and performed a miracle, would you believe? Perhaps you would, or perhaps it would not take long before you started to think that it was dream, a hallucination, or that someone played a trick on you.

For some, it's very comforting to know that we have a loving Father in Heaven, so it's natural for us to reach out to Him. For others, it's frightening to admit that there is a God because that comes with an expectation of how He wants them to behave - and they don't want to change!

As long as people close their hearts and minds to the idea of God, nothing will ever convince them and no amount of evidence will ever suffice. For those who want to believe in God, there is more than enough evidence out there and they will find Him.

I would further add that seeking proof is better than blindly following. The evidence of God is all around us if you truly want to find it. Seek and you shall find.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#564970 Nov 21, 2012
TheUndying132 wrote:
Now I will not go into the theology of the matter, I will speak your language, the language of solid, physical facts. The bible is the single most historically accurate book in all of time.
Thanks for not going into theology.

And actually, I don't know of a book that purports to be nonfiction - factual in content - that is more wrong than your bible. You are aware, for example, that the earth is not flat or firmly fixed on pillars, the universe was not made in six days or in a few abrupt steps, bats are not birds, hares don't chew the cud, there are no four legged insects, and pi is not three.

[CONT]

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#564971 Nov 21, 2012
TheUndying132 wrote:
It passes both of the tests which are mostly used t determine the factuality of a historical work, 1: the internal test, and 2: the external test. The internal test is testing the book against it's own content, to make sure there are no contradictions. The bible has been extensively examined and no contradictions have been upheld. Name any you know and I will refute them for you, if you would like.
Your bible is replete with contradictions.

[1] An omniscient being that grants free will
[2] An omnipotent being incapable of being in the presence of sin
[3] A perfect being needing worship
[4] A perfect being that changes its mind
[5] A perfect being that makes mistakes or contradicts itself
[6] A perfect being that creates or alters anything
[7] A non-spacial being being omnipresent
[8] An all-loving, omnipotent being that allows suffering.
[9] A perfectly just being that punishes innocents like offspring.
[10] A merciful being that damns without hope of forgiveness from hell.
[11] Anything existing, persisting, thinking or acting outside of time. Those words all imply an interval of time.

Here are some in a different form:

What did Jesus say to the Sanhedrin when asked if he was the messiah?
[1] "I am" (Mark 14:62)
[2] "You have said so" (Matthew 26:64)
[3] "If I tell you, you will not believe" (Luke 22:67-8)
[4] "You say that I am" (John 19:7)).

========

[1] God creates man then animals (Genesis 2:7, 2:19)
[2] God creates animals then man (Genesis 1:24-27)

==========

[1] Man can be righteous (Genesis 7:1, Job 2:3, James 5:16)
[2] Man can't be righteous (Romans 3:10)

==========

[1] Men have seen God ("So Jacob called the place Peniel, saying, "It is because I saw God face to face, and yet my life was spared." - Genesis 32:30)
[2] And also, no man has seen God ("No one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only, who is at the Father's side, has made him known." - John 1:18)

==========

[1] Man is saved by faith, not works ("For by grace are ye saved through faith... not of works." - Ephesians 2:8-9)
[2] Except when he is saved by works ("Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only." - James 2:24)

==========

[1] God is tired and rests ("on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested" - Exodus 31:17)
[2] But yet, God is never tired and never rests ("The Lord is the everlasting God, the Creator of the ends of the earth.
He will not grow tired or weary" - Isaiah 40:28)

Note: You are constrained to using the bible if you wish to resolve the contradictions in it. I can always reconcile any apparent contradiction if I am allowed to create just-so explanations ad lib. For example, "It happened in the daytime" and "It happened in the nighttime" cannot be resolved by pointing our that it was daytime in Jerusalem, but nighttime in Beijing unless the bible itself specifically indicates that that is what was meant.

The following sites are each full of contradictions:

Quiz Show (Bible Contradictions)


A List of Biblical Contradictions
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/jim_me...

194 CONTRADICTIONS, New Testament
http://www.skeptically.org/bible/id6.html

Biblical Contradictions
http://www.evilbible.com/Biblical%20Contradic...

101 Contradictions Old Testament
http://www.skeptically.org/bible/id8.html

Bible Inconsistencies: Bible Contradictions?
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/donald...

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#564972 Nov 21, 2012
TheUndying132 wrote:
Then, there's the external test, checking it against other books of history. Note, the bible was written ofer many hundreds of years, by many different authors. The simple fact that there were never any contradictions with itself is astounding, as the authors didnt even know of many of the other parts as they wrote.
The bible is also full of historical error. Archeologists says that Canaan was not conquered by outsiders, but rather, that the Israelites were always Canaanites, and that they never wandered with Abraham from Mesopotamia, nor across the desert from Egypt with Moses.

[1] From http://freethought.mbdojo.com/archeology.html

"[T]he account of Joshua's conquest of Canaan is inconsistent with the archaeological evidence. Cities supposedly conquered by Joshua in the 14th century bce were destroyed long before he came on the scene. Some, such as Ai and Arad, had been ruins for a 1000 years.

"The Book of Judges, which directly contradicts Joshua, and shows the Israelites settling the land over a prolonged period, is nearer historical reality; but even it cannot be taken at face value. The archaeological surveys conducted over the past two decades indicate that the origin and development of the Israelite entity was somewhat different from either of the rival accounts in the Bible.

"Around 1200 bce, semi-nomads from the desert fringes to the east and the south, possibly including Egypt, began to settle in the hill country of Canaan ... most of the Israelites were in fact formerly Canaanites.

"The story of Abraham's journey from Ur of the Chaldees, the Patriarchs, the Exodus, Sinai, and the conquest of Canaan, all these were apparently based on legends"

[2] And from http://www.salon.com/2001/02/07/solomon/ :

“Ze’ev Herzog ... laid out many of the theories Finkelstein and Silberman present in their book:“the Israelites were never in Egypt, did not wander in the desert, did not conquer the land [of Canaan] in a military campaign and did not pass it on to the twelve tribes of Israel. Perhaps even harder to swallow is the fact that the united kingdom of David and Solomon, described in the Bible as a regional power, was at most a small tribal kingdom.”

"The tales of the patriarchs — Abraham, Isaac and Joseph among others — were the first to go when biblical scholars found those passages rife with anachronisms and other inconsistencies.

"The story of Exodus, one of the most powerful epics of enslavement, courage and liberation in human history, also slipped from history to legend when archaeologists could no longer ignore the lack of corroborating contemporary Egyptian accounts and the absence of evidence of large encampments in the Sinai Peninsula (“the wilderness” where Moses brought the Israelites after leading them through the parted Red Sea).

"The famous battle of Jericho, with which the Israelites supposedly launched this campaign of conquest after wandering for decades in the desert, has been likewise debunked: The city of Jericho didn’t exist at that time and had no walls to come tumbling down. These assertions are all pretty much accepted by mainstream archaeologists."
TheUndying132 wrote:
But beyond that, the bible perfectly corresponds with all other world histories from the same time period, any events recorded in the bible are also recorded the same in other, completely disconnected writings. Explain this without a god, and explain why this book shouldn't be trusted, and I will renounce my faith. This is a bet and a dare.
Your bible doesn't correspond with Egyptian or Roman records, for starters.
TheUndying132 wrote:
I must say, I respect your passion. But passion misled is a fools path.
Ditto.

“There's a feeling I get...”

Since: Jun 11

...when I look to the West

#564973 Nov 21, 2012
nanoanomaly wrote:
<quoted text>Why the need to categorize yourself?
Human beings like to define themselves. One of the basic questions one asks in life is the famous "Who am I?"

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Top Stories Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
The Christian Atheist debate 6 min Mr Wiggley 920
Poll Which is the Best SAP ABAP institute in hyderab... (Nov '12) 7 min Ramya 37
Jehovah's Witnesses are true disciple of Jesus ... (Mar '07) 19 min MUQ2 40,698
No one should blaspheme Prophet Mohammad, peace... 22 min MUQ2 648
Private Placement Program for Indian Investors ... (Nov '12) 35 min vincent 14
Why I’m no longer a Christian (Jul '08) 1 hr ChristineM 444,294
Free Download Scripts buying and selling digita... 1 hr Burke Devlin 2
Why Should Jesus Love Me? (Feb '08) 2 hr NeedInnerPeace 612,607
News Roman Catholic church only true church, says Va... (Jul '07) 3 hr 2all 596,180
Poll Was 9/11 a conspiracy?? (Oct '07) 15 hr Charlie Sheen 272,082
More from around the web