Jehovah's Witnesses are true disciple...
Student

Nogales, Mexico

#40309 Mar 31, 2014
Daily Text

es14 pp. 26-36 March

Monday, March 31


We are fellow workers for your joy.—2 Cor. 1:24.


With that expression, Paul referred to himself and his close associates. Why do we draw that conclusion? Well, in the same letter, Paul reminded the Corinthians of two of these associates when he wrote:“Jesus ... was preached among you through us, that is, through me and Silvanus and Timothy.”(2 Cor. 1:19) Moreover, whenever Paul used the term “fellow workers” in his letters, it always referred to his close associates, such as Apollos, Aquila, Prisca, Timothy, Titus, and others.(Rom. 16:3, 21; 1 Cor. 3:6-9; 2 Cor. 8:23) Hence, by saying:“We are fellow workers for your joy,” Paul assured the Corinthians that he and his companions wanted to do all they could to promote the joy of all members of the congregation. Today, Christian elders have the same desire. They want to do all they can to help their brothers to “serve Jehovah with rejoicing.”—Ps. 100:2; Phil. 1:25. w13 1/15 5:4
Student

Nogales, Mexico

#40310 Mar 31, 2014
lovewithin wrote:
<quoted text>
Firstborn of all creation....means Jesus INHERRITED all creation. "By Him and For Him"
So are you saying ..student...even though the Bible says that Jesus Christ created all things,;;
you don't BELIEVE that Jesus created the heavens and the earth , in the beginning.?
Is it really that hard for you to BELIEVE in Jesus Christ and who He really is ? Jesus was with God... "Let US go down" ....who was GOD talking to there student?
Jesus was not created...student.. Jesus was "In the beginning" ..Jesus created ALL things...making Him (Jesus) the CREATOR.
I can see why the person I know that left your CULT organization....said she found herself "Leaving Jesus Christ " out..... Jesus was slowly leaving her,...that He wasn't really as important as she once thought.
Revelation 3:14 (NW)-14 “And to the angel of the congregation in Laodicea write: These are the things that the Amen says, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation by God,

(KJV) 14And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

Since Jesus as the firstborn of all creation is a created person, he cannot be Almighty God. The Scriptures repeatedly portray him as in a position subordinate to God. For example, concerning the resurrected Jesus Christ, the apostle Paul wrote:“I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a woman is her husband, and the head of Christ is God.”(1 Cor. 11:3, CB)

When giving the inspired “Revelation” to the apostle John, Jesus said concerning himself:“He who conquers, I will make him a pillar in the temple of my God; never shall he go out of it, and I will write on him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem which comes down from my God out of heaven, and my own new name.”(Rev. 3:12)

Did you note that four times in this verse alone Jesus refers to his Father, Jehovah, as “my God”?

In no way do I mean to deny the exalted position that Jesus occupies next to God. Before ascending to heaven, Jesus said to his disciples:“All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.”(Matt. 28:18)

It was appropriate for God to ‘give’ to his Son such authority, since the Son was the firstborn of all creatures.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#40311 Mar 31, 2014
Student wrote:
<quoted text>
Revelation 3:14 (NW)-14 “And to the angel of the congregation in Laodicea write: These are the things that the Amen says, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation by God,
(KJV) 14And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
Since Jesus as the firstborn of all creation is a created person, he cannot be Almighty God. The Scriptures repeatedly portray him as in a position subordinate to God. For example, concerning the resurrected Jesus Christ, the apostle Paul wrote:“I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a woman is her husband, and the head of Christ is God.”(1 Cor. 11:3, CB)
When giving the inspired “Revelation” to the apostle John, Jesus said concerning himself:“He who conquers, I will make him a pillar in the temple of my God; never shall he go out of it, and I will write on him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem which comes down from my God out of heaven, and my own new name.”(Rev. 3:12)
Did you note that four times in this verse alone Jesus refers to his Father, Jehovah, as “my God”?
In no way do I mean to deny the exalted position that Jesus occupies next to God. Before ascending to heaven, Jesus said to his disciples:“All authority ien heaven and on earth has been given to me.”(Matt. 28:18)
It was appropriate for God to ‘give’ to his Son such authority, since the Son was the firstborn of all creatures.

What the he11 is a "jehovah".

It appears to have no valid etymological roots.
Student

Nogales, Mexico

#40312 Mar 31, 2014
"Brother Lee Love"

Regarding the twelve tribes in Revelation. It could hardly be natural Israel, since there is no indication that that many accepted Christ during the time this class was being selected. Moreover, it would hardly have worked out that exactly the same number from each tribe would have responded to the call, since some tribes were far more populous than others.
And here is an important point: the tribal records of natural Jews did not survive the long period during which these 144,000 were being selected, so no record of tribal descent would be available for classifying them on any such natural basis.

So here too we see a spiritual Israel is meant, and the equal number from each tribe shows a well-balanced organization, with no partiality in choosing being shown. This grouping into twelve divisions of equal numbers balances well with the twelve foundation stones on which appear the names of the twelve apostles.(Rev. 21:14, NW)

Also, when Israel left Egypt they were accompanied by a “mixed multitude” of non-Jews; and here in Revelation 7:9 these spiritual Israelites have associated with them a “great multitude” from all nations.—Ex. 12:38
.
The majority of Israelites after the flesh stumbled over Christ Jesus as Messiah, and for that reason they are shown as being cast off, away from Abraham and Isaac and Jacob, no longer associated with them in God’s kingdom, but in their places men from nations to the east and west and north and south come to be associated with what these patriarchs symbolize.(Luke 13:27-30) Jesus said those not in union with him were cast out, like trimmed-off branches that dry up and are burned.(John 15:6) Paul showed that many of the natural branches, the Jews after the flesh, were pruned off the theocratic tree and wild branches were grafted in to take their places; meaning by this, the formerly alienated Gentiles that became a part of the “Israel of God”. Then with these Gentiles grafted in, Paul adds,“In this manner all Israel will be saved.” NW. w51 9/15 p.564-565

Have a great day
lovewithin

Denver, CO

#40313 Mar 31, 2014
Student wrote:
<quoted text>
Revelation 3:14 (NW)-14 “And to the angel of the congregation in Laodicea write: These are the things that the Amen says, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation by God,
(KJV) 14And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
Since Jesus as the firstborn of all creation is a created person, he cannot be Almighty God. The Scriptures repeatedly portray him as in a position subordinate to God. For example, concerning the resurrected Jesus Christ, the apostle Paul wrote:“I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a woman is her husband, and the head of Christ is God.”(1 Cor. 11:3, CB)
When giving the inspired “Revelation” to the apostle John, Jesus said concerning himself:“He who conquers, I will make him a pillar in the temple of my God; never shall he go out of it, and I will write on him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem which comes down from my God out of heaven, and my own new name.”(Rev. 3:12)
Did you note that four times in this verse alone Jesus refers to his Father, Jehovah, as “my God”?
In no way do I mean to deny the exalted position that Jesus occupies next to God. Before ascending to heaven, Jesus said to his disciples:“All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.”(Matt. 28:18)
Student....you have been taught very good by your 'watch tower men on how to completely

SKIP over the actual question, and just rattle on and on about the same ole , same ole!

So...lets try this again..... the question WAS....here it is ...student: Do you believe what the Bible says in COLSSIANS 1:16 ?

For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities--all things have been created by Him and for Him.

Student..........HIM- is Jesus in this scripture . Is that correct???? yes or no

You said :
It was APPROPRIATE for God to ‘give’ to his Son such authority, since the Son was the firstborn of all creatures.?????????

Student....GOD does not have to make sure HE does things APPROPRIATE for our eyes....

GOD . IS the Authority period!!! Jesus was the firstborn to this inheritance!

.
Liam

Denver, CO

#40314 Mar 31, 2014
Student wrote:
<quoted text>
Revelation 3:14 (NW)-14 “And to the angel of the congregation in Laodicea write: These are the things that the Amen says, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation by God,
(KJV) 14And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
Since Jesus as the firstborn of all creation is a created person, he cannot be Almighty God. The Scriptures repeatedly portray him as in a position subordinate to God. For example, concerning the resurrected Jesus Christ, the apostle Paul wrote:“I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a woman is her husband, and the head of Christ is God.”(1 Cor. 11:3, CB)
When giving the inspired “Revelation” to the apostle John, Jesus said concerning himself:“He who conquers, I will make him a pillar in the temple of my God; never shall he go out of it, and I will write on him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem which comes down from my God out of heaven, and my own new name.”(Rev. 3:12)
Did you note that four times in this verse alone Jesus refers to his Father, Jehovah, as “my God”?
In no way do I mean to deny the exalted position that Jesus occupies next to God. Before ascending to heaven, Jesus said to his disciples:“All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.”(Matt. 28:18)
It was appropriate for God to ‘give’ to his Son such authority, since the Son was the firstborn of all creatures.
Jesus, the word made flesh, became fully human, yet fully divine. An orange is fully an orange, yet its also fully a fruit.
It's uncertain when the human intellect of Jesus became aware He was God made manifest. Some say it was when John Baptised Him in the waters. Others when He resurrected. What is certain is that the first Christians understood Him to be God Himself manifested into a human being after 33 AD.
. Even in writings outiside of Christianity, people wrote that Christians believed in the divinity of Christ Jesus. Nobody misread the Bible. The divinity of the Lord was understood and taught before Paul wrote the first Book of the NT, some 25 yrs after Christ rose. Nobody 'got it wrong'- only to have some Bible students 'get it right' 1800 yrs later......
lovewithin

Denver, CO

#40315 Mar 31, 2014
Liam wrote:
<quoted text>
Jesus, the word made flesh, became fully human, yet fully divine. An orange is fully an orange, yet its also fully a fruit.
It's uncertain when the human intellect of Jesus became aware He was God made manifest. Some say it was when John Baptised Him in the waters. Others when He resurrected. What is certain is that the first Christians understood Him to be God Himself manifested into a human being after 33 AD.
. Even in writings outiside of Christianity, people wrote that Christians believed in the divinity of Christ Jesus. Nobody misread the Bible. The divinity of the Lord was understood and taught before Paul wrote the first Book of the NT, some 25 yrs after Christ rose. Nobody 'got it wrong'- only to have some Bible students 'get it right' 1800 yrs later......
Amen!
doug

Grootfontein, Namibia

#40316 Mar 31, 2014
sevenwanders wrote:
<quoted text>
Im quite sure that the bible states Jesus is the son of god?????
the only diff. in the Bible's are that God's name appears in the new world translation and in your Bible nothing just a confusion between Lord and God

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#40317 Mar 31, 2014
Student wrote:
"Brother Lee Love"
Regarding the twelve tribes in Revelation. It could hardly be natural Israel, since there is no indication that that many accepted Christ during the time this class was being selected. Moreover, it would hardly have worked out that exactly the same number from each tribe would have responded to the call, since some tribes were far more populous than others.
And here is an important point: the tribal records of natural Jews did not survive the long period during which these 144,000 were being selected, so no record of tribal descent would be available for classifying them on any such natural basis.
So here too we see a spiritual Israel is meant, and the equal number from each tribe shows a well-balanced organization, with no partiality in choosing being shown. This grouping into twelve divisions of equal numbers balances well with the twelve foundation stones on which appear the names of the twelve apostles.(Rev. 21:14, NW)
Also, when Israel left Egypt they were accompanied by a “mixed multitude” of non-Jews; and here in Revelation 7:9 these spiritual Israelites have associated with them a “great multitude” from all nations.—Ex. 12:38
.
The majority of Israelites after the flesh stumbled over Christ Jesus as Messiah, and for that reason they are shown as being cast off, away from Abraham and Isaac and Jacob, no longer associated with them in God’s kingdom, but in their places men from nations to the east and west and north and south come to be associated with what these patriarchs symbolize.(Luke 13:27-30) Jesus said those not in union with him were cast out, like trimmed-off branches that dry up and are burned.(John 15:6) Paul showed that many of the natural branches, the Jews after the flesh, were pruned off the theocratic tree and wild branches were grafted in to take their places; meaning by this, the formerly alienated Gentiles that became a part of the “Israel of God”. Then with these Gentiles grafted in, Paul adds,“In this manner all Israel will be saved.” NW. w51 9/15 p.564-565
Have a great day


The above is what you will believe if you drink the Koolaid. A stern warning to those who value their own minds and souls.

I cannot, myself, think of something that would drive rational people away from the JW faster nor further.
doug

Grootfontein, Namibia

#40318 Mar 31, 2014
Liam wrote:
<quoted text>
Ok..... how can I be clear... you erroneously believe that the so called "Roman Catholic religion". Wait, I can't even say that title like that because it doesnt make sense. "Roman Catholic religion"?? What is that? How is it different than the Byzantine Catholic religion or the Ethiopian Catholic religion? There is no separate Church called "Roman"Catholic. "Roman" describes a diocese and liturgical rite, not a separate Church. I don't entirely blame you for your error as most western English speaking peoples have slowly come to identify the Catholic Church with the adjective "Roman" and that's that.
Anyway, you erroneously believe that the Catholic Church in Rome was presented with a codex Bible; it was labeled "Word of God" and they opened it and read it. They came upon Mathew 16: 18 and thunk 'this verse says Peter was the first Pope!!" That scenario is impossible. The Bible didn't come to us like that.
Mathew 16:18 physically happened. It was an action put into motion. Not a verse that was written and later organized around. The Church came first, then the Bible. Before all the NT manuscripts were completed, men like Clement of Rome were already running the Church. He was ordained Bishop by Peter. See, Clement didn't read Mathew 16:18, he was the product of Mathew 16:18..
see www.vaticandesignexposed.com

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#40319 Mar 31, 2014
doug wrote:
<quoted text>
the only diff. in the Bible's are that God's name appears in the new world translation and in your Bible nothing just a confusion between Lord and God

Actually God's name does not appear even once in the NWT!!!!!!!

There are translations that appropriately use the correct name of the Elohim (Yahweh), but the NWT is not one of them.

Whores than that they implant a fake name (jehovah) which is a name created by Satan to deceive people.
Student

Mexico

#40321 Mar 31, 2014
Colossians 1:16
(NW) 16 because by means of him all [other] things were created in the heavens and upon the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, no matter whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All [other] things have been (Notice) created through him and for him.

New International Version
For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; (Notice) all things have been created through him and for him.

New Living Translation
for through him God created everything in the heavenly realms and on earth. He made the things we can see and the things we can't see--such as thrones, kingdoms, rulers, and authorities in the unseen world. Everything was (Notice) created through him and for him.

English Standard Version
For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were (Notice) created through him and for him.

New American Standard Bible
For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities-- all things have been (Notice) created through Him and for Him.

King James Bible
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Holman Christian Standard Bible
For everything was created by Him, in heaven and on earth, the visible and the invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities-- all things have been (Notice) created through Him and for Him.

International Standard Version
For by him all things in heaven and on earth were created, things visible and invisible, whether they are kings, lords, rulers, or powers. All things have been (Notice) created through him and for him.

NET Bible
for all things in heaven and on earth were created by him--all things, whether visible or invisible, whether thrones or dominions, whether principalities or powers--all things were (Notice) created through him and for him.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
By him was everything created which is in Heaven and in The Earth: everything that is seen and everything that is unseen, whether Thrones or Dominions or Principalities or Rulers; everything has been created by his hand and in him.

Cont...
Student

Mexico

#40322 Mar 31, 2014
GOD'S WORD® Translation
He created all things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible. Whether they are kings or lords, rulers or powers- everything has been (Notice) created through him and for him.

Jubilee Bible 2000
for by him were all things created, that are in the heavens and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they are thrones or dominions or principalities or powers: all things were created by him and in him;

King James 2000 Bible
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

American King James Version
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

American Standard Version
for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been (Notice) created through him, and unto him;

Douay-Rheims Bible
For in him were all things created in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominations, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him and in him.

Darby Bible Translation
because by him were created all things, the things in the heavens and the things upon the earth, the visible and the invisible, whether thrones, or lordships, or principalities, or authorities: all things have been created by him and for him.

English Revised Version
for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been (Notice) created through him, and unto him;

Webster's Bible Translation
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are upon earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Weymouth New Testament
For in Him was created the universe of things in heaven and on earth, things seen and things unseen, thrones, dominions, princedoms, powers--all were (Notice) created, and exist through and for Him.

World English Bible
For by him all things were created, in the heavens and on the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been (Notice) created through him, and for him.

Young's Literal Translation
because in him were the all things created, those in the heavens, and those upon the earth, those visible, and those invisible, whether thrones, whether lordships, whether principalities, whether authorities; (Notice) all things through him, and for him, have been created,

Our New World Translation agrees with:all these others translation that says all things have been created through him and for him.
yon

Miami Beach, FL

#40324 Mar 31, 2014
What's become of Dr Shrink et al?
lovewithin

Denver, CO

#40325 Mar 31, 2014
you said "Our New World translation agrees....But do YOU ?????

Our New World Translation agrees with:all these others translation that says all things have been created through him and for him.

Student.....THROUGH Him...... didn't change a damn thing! are you really that stupid???....

NOTICE! we MUST go THROUGH Jesus to even get to God..
NOTICE! we MUST go THROUH Jesus for everlasting Life!
NOTICE we PRAY through Jesus!

If Jesus went THROUGH a door way, so He could see the other room FOR Himself..... wouldn't this mean, HE did it HIMSELF????

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#40331 Mar 31, 2014
Student wrote:
GOD'S WORD® Translation
He created all things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible. Whether they are kings or lords, rulers or powers- everything has been (Notice) created through him and for him.
Jubilee Bible 2000
for by him were all things created, that are in the heavens and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they are thrones or dominions or principalities or powers: all things were created by him and in him;
King James 2000 Bible
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
American King James Version
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
American Standard Version
for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been (Notice) created through him, and unto him;
Douay-Rheims Bible
For in him were all things created in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominations, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him and in him.
Darby Bible Translation
because by him were created all things, the things in the heavens and the things upon the earth, the visible and the invisible, whether thrones, or lordships, or principalities, or authorities: all things have been created by him and for him.
English Revised Version
for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been (Notice) created through him, and unto him;
Webster's Bible Translation
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are upon earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Weymouth New Testament
For in Him was created the universe of things in heaven and on earth, things seen and things unseen, thrones, dominions, princedoms, powers--all were (Notice) created, and exist through and for Him.
World English Bible
For by him all things were created, in the heavens and on the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been (Notice) created through him, and for him.
Young's Literal Translation
because in him were the all things created, those in the heavens, and those upon the earth, those visible, and those invisible, whether thrones, whether lordships, whether principalities, whether authorities; (Notice) all things through him, and for him, have been created,
Our New World Translation agrees with:all these others translation that says all things have been created through him and for him.

Well this was a pointless waste of bandwidth.

“I am Sisyphus”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#40332 Mar 31, 2014
yon wrote:
What's become of Dr Shrink et al?

I am sure Baltimore is not gone. Demons are not that easy to cast out.
Student

Nogales, Mexico

#40333 Mar 31, 2014
lovewithin wrote:
you said "Our New World translation agrees....But do YOU ?????
Our New World Translation agrees with:all these others translation that says all things have been created through him and for him.
Student.....THROUGH Him...... didn't change a damn thing! are you really that stupid???....
NOTICE! we MUST go THROUGH Jesus to even get to God..
NOTICE! we MUST go THROUH Jesus for everlasting Life!
NOTICE we PRAY through Jesus!
If Jesus went THROUGH a door way, so He could see the other room FOR Himself..... wouldn't this mean, HE did it HIMSELF????
I agree that "all things have been created through him and for him."

AM I STUPID? NO BUT YOU SURE SEEM TO BE!!
lovewithin

Denver, CO

#40334 Mar 31, 2014
student.......... this scripture states a FACT.

John 1 : 3

All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.

Student....this scripture is talking about Jesus Christ here.
lovewithin

Denver, CO

#40335 Mar 31, 2014
Student wrote:
<quoted text>
I agree that "all things have been created through him and for him."
AM I STUPID? NO BUT YOU SURE SEEM TO BE!!
Explain .....THROUGH HIM...please!

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