What Your Church Won't Tell You by Da...

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#34116 Nov 8, 2013
USA Born wrote:
<quoted text>
I think it's you who needs to pray and read. I'm not the one that picks and chooses what is true in scripture and what isn't.
Reflect on this. We were talking about the science of archeology.
You haven't provided anything remotely scientific. I'm waiting with great anticipation for you to do so.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#34117 Nov 8, 2013
USA Born wrote:
<quoted text>
The flood was world wide. Why wouldn't people in different locations have different experiences?
Doesn't mean the writers believed in the same God.
There never was a world wide flood in the last 10,000 years, which is all the time the Bible covers.

HUGE FAIL.

Try again.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#34118 Nov 8, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Although there is evidence of regional flooding that has occurred in the world in different places worldwide, there is no evidence of a world-wide flood.
Are you going to present physical evidence to substantiate a world-wide flood?
I wonder if he is going to present some actual science to back that claim. Should be interesting.
Saban fan

Decatur, AL

#34119 Nov 8, 2013
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
There never was a world wide flood in the last 10,000 years, which is all the time the Bible covers.
HUGE FAIL.
Try again.
Scientists from NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center and Columbia University have uncovered evidence that confirms there was once a massive flood in the northern hemisphere. According to their computer models, the flood occurred approximately 8,200 years ago and resulted in climate changes that decreased the temperature. Their report noted:

The last major abrupt climate change occurred at ~8.2 kiloyears before present (kyr) and is recorded in multiple proxy records across the Northern Hemisphere. Contemporaneously, glacial Lakes Agassiz and Ojibway catastrophically drained into the Hudson Bay, possibly delivering enough freshwater into the North Atlantic to affect the ocean circulation (LeGrande, et al., 2006, 103[4]:837).

Scientists had previously documented changes in isotope, aerosol, and methane levels—all of which pointed to a major cooling event. The group used a fully coupled atmosphere/ocean general circulation model in an effort to determine what could have caused the climate changes. Their computer model used a flow of water that was equal to between 25 and 50 times the flow of the Amazon River in twelve model runs that took more than a year to complete. While none of the scientists involved in this study would suggest that this data supports the idea of the global Flood they did indicate that the effects of this event were “clearly expressed” in Greenland and Ammersee, Germany. The scientists suggested this catastrophic flood was caused by retreating glaciers. Interestingly, they documented significant decreases in temperature in the northern hemisphere—something that creationists have long suspected would have occurred after the global Flood. Multiple evidences demonstrate that the Earth’s climate has changed, and fossil records indicate that the Earth was once covered with water. The logical conclusion that incorporates all of the available evidence is the global Flood—as recorded in the book of Genesis.

REFERENCE

LeGrande, A.N., G.A. Schmidt, et al.,(2006),“Consistent Simulations of Multiple Proxy Responses to an Abrupt Climate Change Event,” Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, 103[4]:837-842.
USA Born

Claremont, CA

#34120 Nov 8, 2013
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean this?
Archaeological science, also known as archaeometry, consists of the application of scientific techniques to the analysis of archaeological materials. Archaeometry is now considered its own scientific field. The UK's Natural and Environmental Research Council provides funding for archaeometry separate from the funding provided for archaeology.[1] Archaeological science involves dating and studying ancient materials.
Archaeology, in and of itself, is not science.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archaeological_s...
You post a paragraph describing archeology as a science and still claim it's not a science. Don't get that at all. A bit strange to me.

If you are talking about being funded, that is nothing new. Scientists in all fields get funding. I'm glad they get paid to unearth the past. Who could spend months and years working on any discovery without being paid?

I'll continue to enjoy it just as always.

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#34121 Nov 8, 2013
Dave and Gary Higgins what church do you two attend?
USA Born

Claremont, CA

#34122 Nov 8, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you find it a need to twist the words around?
I didn't say anythign about "copying" the stories from the Sumerian texts, I suggested that they were used in some extent (oral tradition) and then written in a new story to "justify" Judaism.
You can argue the history all day long, it won't change the fact that the Sumerian myths are older and a direct correlation to the Bible stories.
You can accept it or not, but with you not accepting it, only shows your refusal to understand Earth's history.
This is all your opinion. I don't believe a word of it. Your myth is the world you live in.
USA Born

Claremont, CA

#34123 Nov 8, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
I guess I'll just keep posting references to the stories and how they apply to the Bible.
VII. I've heard there are Biblical parallels in Babylonian literature. What are they anyway?
Genesis: Creation of the universe
Ps:74:12-17 - YHWH vs. Leviathan; Marduk vs Tiamat. In the Enuma Elish, tablet IV, Marduk defeats the ocean goddess, Tiamat who is often depicted as a multi-headed dragon. He splits her apart, as YHWH splits apart the sea in Ps 74:13. He crushes her skull as YHWH crushes the skulls of the monster Leviathan in Ps 74:13-14. In tablet V, Marduk causes the crescent moon to appear, creates the seasons, the night and day, and creates springs from Tiamat's eyes, to form the Tigris and Euphrates rivers, as YHWH does in Ps 74:15-17 (Hooke p.106, Dalley pp.253-257)
Creation of humans.
Fall of man.
Adapa was the first "apkallu" (sage/priest), not the first man or first patriarch. He was given wisdom (knowledge of good and evil?) but not immortality. When in heaven (sent there for having broken the South Wind's wing), he is offered bread and water of eternal life. He refuses it, however having been tricked by Ea (in serpent role?) stating that he would be offered the bread and water of death instead.(Dalley pp. 182-188) In other references to the seven apkallu, he is the counsellor paired with the first anteluvian king on the Sumerian king lists (Dalley p. 328), Alulim - not Alulim himself, who was Adam's analog in patriarchal order.
Tower of Babel
As with the Sumerians, the most striking Biblical parallel within Akkadian myth is in the story of the flood. For the Babylonian account, see the entries on Atrahasis and Utnapishtim above.
Exodus - According to legend, Sargon was left in a basket in the Euphrates as an infant and "rose 'from an ark of bulrushes'" (Oppenheim, Ancient Mesopotamia p. 101). His adoptive father was a "laborer in a palm garden who spotted the basket containing the remarkable child" (Crawford p. 42) Sargon was originally the cupbearer to a king (Ur-Zababa) before achieving leadership on his own.(Crawford p. 25)
Weeping for Tammuz and the month of Tammuz.
http://home.comcast.net/~chris.s/sumer-faq.ht...
Don't bother. You'll never convince me that the Bible is not the Word of God.
USA Born

Claremont, CA

#34124 Nov 8, 2013
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
If you are speaking of the Lost Scrolls I would agree.
Like I said, the Bible is all true, some of it actually happened. The Bible is not a book of science by any means. There is not a shred of evidence that Sodom and Gomorrah ever existed, only sketchy theories.
If the Bible is all true then it all happened. I believe Sodom and Gomorrah have been located.

You confuse theory with what was discovered. A theory wraps around a find. It doesn't change the find.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#34125 Nov 8, 2013
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
Scientists from NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center and Columbia University have uncovered evidence that confirms there was once a massive flood in the northern hemisphere. According to their computer models, the flood occurred approximately 8,200 years ago and resulted in climate changes that decreased the temperature. Their report noted:
The last major abrupt climate change occurred at ~8.2 kiloyears before present (kyr) and is recorded in multiple proxy records across the Northern Hemisphere. Contemporaneously, glacial Lakes Agassiz and Ojibway catastrophically drained into the Hudson Bay, possibly delivering enough freshwater into the North Atlantic to affect the ocean circulation (LeGrande, et al., 2006, 103[4]:837).
Scientists had previously documented changes in isotope, aerosol, and methane levels—all of which pointed to a major cooling event. The group used a fully coupled atmosphere/ocean general circulation model in an effort to determine what could have caused the climate changes. Their computer model used a flow of water that was equal to between 25 and 50 times the flow of the Amazon River in twelve model runs that took more than a year to complete. While none of the scientists involved in this study would suggest that this data supports the idea of the global Flood they did indicate that the effects of this event were “clearly expressed” in Greenland and Ammersee, Germany. The scientists suggested this catastrophic flood was caused by retreating glaciers. Interestingly, they documented significant decreases in temperature in the northern hemisphere—something that creationists have long suspected would have occurred after the global Flood. Multiple evidences demonstrate that the Earth’s climate has changed, and fossil records indicate that the Earth was once covered with water. The logical conclusion that incorporates all of the available evidence is the global Flood—as recorded in the book of Genesis.
REFERENCE
LeGrande, A.N., G.A. Schmidt, et al.,(2006),“Consistent Simulations of Multiple Proxy Responses to an Abrupt Climate Change Event,” Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, 103[4]:837-842.
False. The Book of Genesis says it covered the highest mountain and the Ark came to rest upon that very mountain, Mt. Ararat. Climate change and regional floods do not make the story factual.
USA Born

Claremont, CA

#34126 Nov 8, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Although there is evidence of regional flooding that has occurred in the world in different places worldwide, there is no evidence of a world-wide flood.
Are you going to present physical evidence to substantiate a world-wide flood?
Evidence of regional flooding? Do you mean recent flooding or at a time nobody can really pinpoint?

No. Do you have evidence proving the Genesis account is not true?
Do we have to keep doing this can you prove it? You are fully aware that there is no tangible evidence ....yet.

For me it is the faith thing the scriptures talk about. Something probably not found in the gnostics.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#34127 Nov 8, 2013
USA Born wrote:
<quoted text>
If the Bible is all true then it all happened. I believe Sodom and Gomorrah have been located.
You confuse theory with what was discovered. A theory wraps around a find. It doesn't change the find.
Truth has nothing to do with things which are factual. Sodom and Gomorrah never actually existed. They have never been located. You are mistaken. Those so called finds are nothing more than wishful thinking. Geologists trump phony archaeologists every time.
Saban fan

Decatur, AL

#34128 Nov 8, 2013
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
Truth has nothing to do with things which are factual. Sodom and Gomorrah never actually existed. They have never been located. You are mistaken. Those so called finds are nothing more than wishful thinking. Geologists trump phony archaeologists every time.
They were never located because they are under the Dead Sea!

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#34129 Nov 8, 2013
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
I wonder if he is going to present some actual science to back that claim. Should be interesting.
We are still waiting, huh?

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#34130 Nov 8, 2013
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
They were never located because they are under the Dead Sea!
That's not an excuse. The Titanic is under 10,000' of water. We located the Titanic.

Besides, we know that the Titanic was built by Harland and Wolff, Belfast. We know that the Titanic sailed and sank. We have a great deal of tangible evidence. There is no such evidence of Sodom and Gomorrah other than a mythological story. Not a single artifact from either has been discovered.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#34131 Nov 8, 2013
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
Scientists from NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center and Columbia University have uncovered evidence that confirms there was once a massive flood in the northern hemisphere. According to their computer models, the flood occurred approximately 8,200 years ago and resulted in climate changes that decreased the temperature. Their report noted:
The last major abrupt climate change occurred at ~8.2 kiloyears before present (kyr) and is recorded in multiple proxy records across the Northern Hemisphere. Contemporaneously, glacial Lakes Agassiz and Ojibway catastrophically drained into the Hudson Bay, possibly delivering enough freshwater into the North Atlantic to affect the ocean circulation (LeGrande, et al., 2006, 103[4]:837).
Scientists had previously documented changes in isotope, aerosol, and methane levels—all of which pointed to a major cooling event. The group used a fully coupled atmosphere/ocean general circulation model in an effort to determine what could have caused the climate changes. Their computer model used a flow of water that was equal to between 25 and 50 times the flow of the Amazon River in twelve model runs that took more than a year to complete. While none of the scientists involved in this study would suggest that this data supports the idea of the global Flood they did indicate that the effects of this event were “clearly expressed” in Greenland and Ammersee, Germany. The scientists suggested this catastrophic flood was caused by retreating glaciers. Interestingly, they documented significant decreases in temperature in the northern hemisphere—something that creationists have long suspected would have occurred after the global Flood. Multiple evidences demonstrate that the Earth’s climate has changed, and fossil records indicate that the Earth was once covered with water. The logical conclusion that incorporates all of the available evidence is the global Flood—as recorded in the book of Genesis.
REFERENCE
LeGrande, A.N., G.A. Schmidt, et al.,(2006),“Consistent Simulations of Multiple Proxy Responses to an Abrupt Climate Change Event,” Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, 103[4]:837-842.
Odd that you post this, considering you as a "Christian" should be believing that the Earth is only 6000 years old.

I can give you scientific evidence that the Black Sea overflowed and caused a regional flood.

I could also state were Mt Aetna - about 8000 years ago - caused a massive tsunami in the Mediterranean.

Some could even attribute these floods to polar ice melting (Northern Hemisphere) after the last Ice Age occurred about 10K-13K years ago.

If you think flooding attributes occurred world wide, lets see you post data for the middle region of the Earth - around the Equator as well as the Southern Hemisphere. Just posting northern details, is not completing the story, buit in fact, scooting around the story just to show you "think" you have the answers.

Wanna try again?

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#34132 Nov 8, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
We are still waiting, huh?
Indeed! I'm waiting for some actual science.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#34133 Nov 8, 2013
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
They were never located because they are under the Dead Sea!
That's funny. Some of those so called archaeologists photographed geological formations calling them the walls of the fabled city. Do you disagree with their findings?
USA Born

Claremont, CA

#34134 Nov 8, 2013
WasteWater wrote:
<quoted text>
You haven't provided anything remotely scientific. I'm waiting with great anticipation for you to do so.
I don't have to prove anything to you. You can stop waiting now.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#34135 Nov 8, 2013
USA Born wrote:
<quoted text>
This is all your opinion. I don't believe a word of it. Your myth is the world you live in.
Nah - just restating facts that others produced through research.

I know, its tough to accept facts that causes people to look at their own theology to see if it applies, which could cause one to dis-believe.

I know....the dismay is tough to get past.

Wallowing in lies and trying to escape them is quite hard to do.

I understand your dilemma whole-heartedly.

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