“THE HEAT IS ON”

Since: Apr 12

Satan IS in "The Church"

#30436 Mar 22, 2013
Brother Lee Love wrote:
Before I begin this, let me just say that at this point and after reading all your posts, my frustration levels have peaked. I think it's safe to assume that you're either, not reading my posts fully, not understanding my posts, or just blatantly rejecting every bible-quote and assertions I post. With that being said...<quoted text>You say that as if I'm a novice-- not knowing how to compare spiritual with spiritual, nor knowing almost the whole bible by heart.
<quoted text>And the point you're neglecting is that just the term "repent" is an action expected of us. Of a surety, we would not be instructed to fulfill anything that we were incapable of performing on our own.
<quoted text>First, the above quotes say nothing as to who will repent. All these say is that our anointed Savior prayed for his apostles and by extension, those that will come to fulfill the same vocation. But, like I've been saying, every person elected are believers, but not every believer is elected.
<quoted text>And once again, you're overlooking speaker-audience relevance and the intended meaning.
1) Speaker-audience relevance: "those that oppose themselves"-- Gentiles that haven't yet converted.
2) "if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth"-- "give them repentance" means "grant them repentance." What this is saying is that there's hope that the Gentiles that might repentant will do so accordingly. If their repentance is not genuine and sincere, then their expression of repentance will not be accepted even though repentance, itself, is still granted them.
<quoted text>And that's why I composed a whole post of biblical quotes that prove that we become alive by hearing or reading, and learning, the word of "God". Apparently, you rejected every verse and assertion. You must have, because you said not one thing about that post.
Still at it I see. WOWZA, who is that gorgeous man in your avatar?? Could it be .... surely not. hehe

;*:*;

“Become Love!”

Since: Jan 09

Nowhere/Now here

#30437 Mar 22, 2013
WasteWater wrote:
Oh really. Isn't that assuming a great deal? What are you talking about healing anyway?
I'm not assuming anything. Perhaps, you noticed my post about the importance of discernment. And my reason for mentioning "healing" is because our limitations are a product of our own mistakes made. If an adult is incapable of discernment, at all, then they'll be healed of this limitation. Then, they'll be granted entrance into the kingdom.

Why the change of attitude?

“THE HEAT IS ON”

Since: Apr 12

Satan IS in "The Church"

#30438 Mar 22, 2013
evoL eeL rehtorB wrote:
<quoted text>Actually, there are exceptions with the people you mentioned being among them. People that can't understand and/or make such a decision are exempt from judgment. Instead, they'll be healed, if need be, and allowed entrance into the kingdom.
You're backwards. Am I the first person that noticed that??

;*:*;
Gary

Buffalo, NY

#30439 Mar 22, 2013
Hi Lee:

I am sorry but all that I have been doing here is trying to have a fruitful dialog with you and some of your comments I will address.

For example, you were right when you said that it is ALL the work of God to make one born again.

Lee, in meekness of the fruit of the Spirit according to, 2 Tim. 25-26, I ANSWERED IN DETAIL YOUR GREAT QUESTION. I agree that there is nothing one can do to become saved or born again because as you so rightly said it was all the work of God.

Lee, anyone can look at my posts and see I have asked you question after question I am not up-set with thiis because if you do not know the answer then it would be wise not to say anything.

For example, I have asked you a number of times as you could go back to my last 20 posts I and asked you this most basic question and tht is, Are we born dead in sins and trespasses? Eph. 2:1, Romans3:10-12.

You see Lee, this is a foundational question and if we do not understand this then all the rest is built on sand sorry to say. However, I am greatful that you understand that it is ALL the work of God to become [born again] I agree with this also and it shows us that there is not one that will seek after God no not one, at least on His terms, Romans 3:10-12. This is why many are up-set with this true gospel of salvation because it takes [self]out of the equation and I understand since I have been there done that I know where they are coming from I was snared also in this do it your self have it your way gospel. Did we have any say in our first birth? Did we ACCEPT the parents WE wanted? Did we have a say when we would be born in our mother's womb? Why all this is silly is it not? The same goes for working to being [born again] as you said it is ALL the work of God. Now this is what we can build on I am greatful that you can see this truth Lee.

You see once we see that we cannot become [born again] in our own power why that is just a pride trip to think this and that is what this do it your self gospel is all about that is, built on the pride of man. Gary
Brother Lee Love wrote:
Before I begin this, let me just say that at this point and after reading all your posts, my frustration levels have peaked. I think it's safe to assume that you're either, not reading my posts fully, not understanding my posts, or just blatantly rejecting every bible-quote and assertions I post. With that being said...<quoted text>You say that as if I'm a novice-- not knowing how to compare spiritual with spiritual, nor knowing almost the whole bible by heart.
<quoted text>And the point you're neglecting is that just the term "repent" is an action expected of us. Of a surety, we would not be instructed to fulfill anything that we were incapable of performing on our own.
<quoted text>First, the above quotes say nothing as to who will repent. All these say is that our anointed Savior prayed for his apostles and by extension, those that will come to fulfill the same vocation. But, like I've been saying, every person elected are believers, but not every believer is elected.
<quoted text>And once again, you're overlooking speaker-audience relevance and the intended meaning.
1) Speaker-audience relevance: "those that oppose themselves"-- Gentiles that haven't yet converted.
2) "if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth"-- "give them repentance" means "grant them repentance." What this is saying is that there's hope that the Gentiles that might repentant will do so accordingly. If their repentance is not genuine and sincere, then their expression of repentance will not be accepted even though repentance, itself, is still granted them.
<quoted text>And that's why I composed a whole post of biblical quotes that prove that we become alive by hearing or reading, and learning, the word of "God". Apparently, you rejected every verse and assertion. You must have, because you said not one thing about that post.

“THE HEAT IS ON”

Since: Apr 12

Satan IS in "The Church"

#30440 Mar 22, 2013
Gary wrote:
Hi evol:
Those are some good questions,
Gary. 1 John 3:13-15.
<quoted text>
Hi Gary!! Remember me, ET? I keep saying HI to you when I randomly post to Bro Love but you won't wave back. Hope all is well. Tell Dave I said HI. I miss him too!!

;*:*;

“THE HEAT IS ON”

Since: Apr 12

Satan IS in "The Church"

#30441 Mar 22, 2013
Brother Lee Love wrote:
<quoted text>I'm not assuming anything. Perhaps, you noticed my post about the importance of discernment. And my reason for mentioning "healing" is because our limitations are a product of our own mistakes made. If an adult is incapable of discernment, at all, then they'll be healed of this limitation. Then, they'll be granted entrance into the kingdom.
Why the change of attitude?
Hi Bro Love!! Wait. I had a disease from birth that has effected me throughout life and increases with age. Are you saying that I'm responsible, or my parents are?? My limitations are physical. I did the best to do more than I was told I was capable of, but the limitations are irreversible.

Another example is the drunk driver that totaled my body when I was returning from a job less than one year after graduation. That is my own mistake?? I have not only not been healed, aging increases the limitations by leaps and bounds. Just wondering how that fits with your post here.

;*:*;

“Become Love!”

Since: Jan 09

Nowhere/Now here

#30442 Mar 22, 2013
Gary wrote:
Hi evol:
It's me, Gary. I wasn't logged-in, so I "grey-boxed" it and spelled my screen-name backwards.
Gary wrote:
Those are some good questions,
I know.
Gary wrote:
1- The true believer serves God because God saved him and he is a new creation in Christ Jesus.
Don't you mean that "God" causes us to serve Him and causes others not to serve Him?
Gary wrote:
2- Jesus loved us even while we were sinners He died for us. These are the people God has saved He came to seek and to save His people from their sins. Who are [His people?]
Israel, primarily. But, the Gentiles can be grafted in.
Gary wrote:
it could be you just as well as anyone we do not know who God will save He says He will have mercy on whom He will have mercy.
He said that about specific people.
Gary wrote:
3- If it was all up to us to be saved then not one would become saved because the word tells us that there is none that will seek Him no not one. Romans 3:10-12.
Paul was likening those that don't accept "God's" son to those that originally rejected the existence of "God".
Gary wrote:
4- When God does save one by His word and His Spirit the person whom God saves has a want to serve God because God the Holy Spirit dwells in him He is also called [the comforter]
And this function of the Holy Spirit ended in the first century.
Gary wrote:
Question, how can anyone call themselves saved? The reason being, our spirit will bear witness with God this is what God's word declares we will have a desire to do His will and when we pray we will pray not my will be done but thy will be done knowing God knows best for us. God also tells us that these things I write unto you that you may know you have etenal life. God tells us ,,,those that abide in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. 2 John 1:9.
You're contradicting yourself. You're saying that we know we're saved based on the works we do. But, then, you're not contradicting yourself, because you're saying that the works we do are because "God" makes us do these works. That's called "confusion," Gary.
Gary wrote:
God has given the believer His word and we believe what His word said as it is written:
"THhese things I have written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; ye may KNOW THAT YOU HAVE ETERNAL LIFE, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God." 1 John 5:13
My issue is that you'll tell me that I only believe in His son because He makes me believe in him. This means that "God" is both, unjust and a respecter of persons, but you fail to realize this.

“Become Love!”

Since: Jan 09

Nowhere/Now here

#30443 Mar 22, 2013
PART II
Gary wrote:
The only reason why the person whom God saves believes on Him is because God has already done the work to believe on Him whom He hath sent, John 6:29.
And again, you repeat this verse. And without any explanation as to why my assertions regarding this verse were and are wrong.
Gary wrote:
5- The only ones that can be obediant unto the Lord are those that God has already saved they will worship the Father in Spirit and in truth, John 4:23
Father sent His son to bestow salvation upon all men, Jew and Gentile. But, only those that accept His means of salvation will be saved.
Gary wrote:
6- Yes, we have no control according to God when it comes to salvation here is what He said will we believe it? Jesus said,
"You have not chosen me but I have chosen you and ordained you that you should go and bear fruit,,," John 16:15.
...to his apostles and those that would, soon afterward, join their ranks.
Gary wrote:
God tells us it is not of him that wills to be saved but God that showeth mercy so we cannot will our self to become saved.
That's not what he said, at all.
Gary wrote:
"For He saith to Moses, I WILL have mercy on whom I WILL have mercy, and I WILL have comassion on whom I WILL have compassion. So it IS NOT OF HIM THAT WILLETH, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy." Romans 9:15-16
And this was about specific people, namely Jacob and Esau, and Pharaoh.
Gary wrote:
The true believer will bow down to God's word not in what he believes he thinks should be the salvation program for salvation this is all of God alone and He is telling us how He saves one in His word. We do not trust what we want not my will be done but thy will be done O Lord. God's word is a test to all mankind and not one will seek after God on God's terms unless God is drawing him to seek Him in spirit and in truth. The reason being is, we are all dead in sins and tresspasses, Eph. 2:1. Have you had any say in your first birth? No! We also have no say in the second bith. Thank you for those great questions. Gary. 1 John 3:13-15
Yeah. This is now become quite frustrating.
Gary

Buffalo, NY

#30444 Mar 22, 2013
Hi Lee:

I am sorry but your not making a sense when you first said that being born again is ALL the work of God.

Then you turn this around and say in your last statement:

"To enter into the kingdom of God is all based on their works"

Lee, we cannot have it both ways either being [born again] becoming saved is ALL the work of God. Lee, don't you see you void out what you have just said?

Fact, salvation is not based on any of the works of righteousness which we have done but by His mercy alone! This is what God declares I am not saying this God is the test and the test is, will we believe God or will we hold to our own will?

"Not by WORKS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH WE HAVE DONE, but according to HIS MERCY HE SAVED US, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Spirit." Titus 3:3

Lee, don't you see the utter danger one puts themselves in when they think salvation is all based on their works? Many want that verse to read like this,

"salvation is according to the WORKS of righteousness which WE have done,,,"

Don't you see the, WE, ME, I, same spirit as in, Isa. 14, where Satan said the five [I WILL'S] I will be like the most High same spirit is, I WILL get saved by my own righteousness!

Now Lee, Satan loves to get people traped in the pride trip I know I was traped in this at one time also but it is by God's mercy alone that saved me apart from anything I did I was dead in my sins, Eph. 2:1,

Now the false gospel is the gospel of works of righteousness which man thinks he can do apart from the work of God listen very carfully in what God is telling us how Satan comes and his ministers he is using look what gospel they come with and see that they come looking like Christ as an angel of light when the fact is, he is an angel of darkness and it is time to expose Satan and his angels of light who come with a do it your self gospel listen and pray for wisdom.

"For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apotles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be ACCORDING TO THEIR WORKS." 2 Cor. 11:13-15

Did you see this Lee? Yes, Satan comes with a do it your self have it your way gospel that is ALL built on who's work? Yes, THEIR WORK!

You see Lee in love and true concern I am warning all here but more important God says to all of us here, Behold I have told you before.

"Behold, I HAVE TOLD YOU BEFORE." Matthew 24:25

This verse comes right after when God warns of us these false ministers who come to try to deceive IF possible the very elect. Matthew 24:24.

Lee, in love I am warning people not to be snared in a gospel of works which they have done Jesus will just say to those, Depart from me, I NEVER KNEW YOU, YOU THAT WORKS WICKEDNESS.

Lee, God calls our own works works, WORKS of wickedness, so who am I to go against the most High God? God forbid! Let God be true and every man a liar!

Fact, anyone claiming they can be saved by what they have done by their works are snared by Satan and held captive because God did not yet give them repentance to acknowledge the true gospel, 2 Tim. 2:25-26. This is why out of love and concern for all here I bring this to your attention. Thank you. Gary. 1 John 3:13-15.
Brother Lee Love wrote:
PART II
<quoted text>Grace is "God's" mercy bestowed upon us when the law dictates that sinners were to be put to death.
<quoted text>Because, that's the natural reaction for people that hear what was accomplished for us on the cross.
<quoted text>...with His word.
<quoted text>Salvation is offered regardless of what anyone does. Whether a person is born or not does nothing for or against salvation. But, whether or not a person enters into the kingdom is based on their works. This is the whole reason for the day of Judgment.
Gary

Buffalo, NY

#30445 Mar 22, 2013
Hi:

I am sorry I missed your post. Hope all is well with you. I am sharing as you can see with some dear people here the true gospel of the salvation work of God. My ptrayer is, that some will see it is all the work of God that saves when we add [self] to the work of God we make void the spirit of grace the word declares as you know. I will tell Dave you said hello. keep in touch hope to hear from you on here and some of your input. Gary. 1 John 3:13-15
Hell Sucks wrote:
<quoted text>
Hi Gary!! Remember me, ET? I keep saying HI to you when I randomly post to Bro Love but you won't wave back. Hope all is well. Tell Dave I said HI. I miss him too!!
;*:*;

“Become Love!”

Since: Jan 09

Nowhere/Now here

#30446 Mar 22, 2013
Hell Sucks wrote:
Still at it I see. WOWZA, who is that gorgeous man in your avatar?? Could it be .... surely not. hehe
Yep. Still at it, as you can see. And yes. That's yours truly. Thank you, too.(smile and a wink)
Hell Sucks wrote:
You're backwards. Am I the first person that noticed that??
Funny thing is, I think so.
Hell Sucks wrote:
Hi Bro Love!! Wait. I had a disease from birth that has effected me throughout life and increases with age. Are you saying that I'm responsible, or my parents are?? My limitations are physical. I did the best to do more than I was told I was capable of, but the limitations are irreversible.
We were created perfect. Our limitations derive from becoming imperfect way-back-when. None can be born with these limitations and be blamed for them, because before birth, we have no record, whatsoever. Neither can our parents be blamed unless our defects are directly related. But, for the most part, it's like I said. Adam and Eve are to blame, initially.
Hell Sucks wrote:
Another example is the drunk driver that totaled my body when I was returning from a job less than one year after graduation. That is my own mistake??
No. You were in the wrong place at the wrong time, just like the people our anointed Savior mentioned after the tower fell on them and killed them. A day of judgment has been set. Therefore, we'll not be judged until then. And until then, everything negative that takes place is entirely circumstantial.
Hell Sucks wrote:
I have not only not been healed, aging increases the limitations by leaps and bounds. Just wondering how that fits with your post here.
The healing will come after judgment. If we're worthy of access into the kingdom, then we'll be healed before entering. Until then, we must rely on the faith we have in His promises and what our Godhead accomplished on the cross, and the righteousness He revealed to us.

Good to see you again, Hell Sucks. Real talk.
Gary

Buffalo, NY

#30447 Mar 22, 2013
Hi Lee:

I fully understand just how frustrating all this can be when one try's to say something God is not declaring here Lee. I know how frustrated I began when I heard the true gospel of grace alone apart from any of my work. Lee, this was a huge blow to my pride you mean I cannot do anything to get myself saved? You mean I am to just both hope and quietly wait for the salvation of God? Lam. 3:26, You see this gospel is just so hard to swallow because it takes [self] out of the equation I want a do it your self have it your way gospel that is all built on what I, ME, ME, WE, WE, DO.

Lee, when God did save me the frustration all left me because I did not have to do the work I never could because I was a spiritually dead man before God saved me as I had no part in my first birth I had no part in the second bith of being [born again] as you said before and now you are some what confused here is it my work or is it ALL the work of God in being [born again?] I undertand the utter frustration one can have it is a real strugel and my heart goes out to you and many others trying to make the do it your self help gospel fit. However, as I have shown over and over again it is not the works of righteousness which we have done Lee but by the mercy of God alone! Now I am not the one declaring these truth's they come from the word of God so who am I to resist God?

"Therefore hath He mercy on whom He will have mercy, and whom He will He hardeneth. Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he find fault? For who hath RESISTED HIS WILL? No but, O man, who art thou that repliest AGAINST GOD? Shall the thing formed say to Him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishounor? What if God, willing to shew His wrath, and make His power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destrustion." Romans 9:18-22

Lee, who am I to tell the Almighty what to do? You see just who is in the driver seat here? MANY HATE THESE VERSESs BECAUSE IT TAKES SELF OUT.

lee, we can see just who is in control here, God likens us to just a lump of clay to do as He fits and to make one vessel unto hounor [salvation] and another unto dishounor for [destruction] you see in our sinful flesh we cannot stand this and this is why there is not one that will seek after God no not one! Romans 3:10-12, the reason why is, we are all born dead and in sins fact! When we insist in our own way God tells us there is a way that seems right unto man but his ways are the ways of death and destruction will follow him. You see just how much we need the mercy of God? You see Lee, the true gospel will strip man from his own pride trip of ME, ME, I, I, WE, WE, and turn it into God's will, not my will be done O Lord but thy will be done. You see the true believer will bow to the word of God when He declares how He saves one. This is why we must be [born again] because it is all the work of God that one is saved period! This gives God all the glory the do it your self gospel robs God of His glory but really it robs man of salvation when he believes this do it your self help gospel. This is why in true love and concern for all here I take the time to answer your points. Thank you. Gary.
Brother Lee Love wrote:
PART II
<quoted text>And again, you repeat this verse. And without any explanation as to why my assertions regarding this verse were and are wrong.
<quoted text>Father sent His son to bestow salvation upon all men, Jew and Gentile. But, only those that accept His means of salvation will be saved.
<quoted text>...to his apostles and those that would, soon afterward, join their ranks.
<quoted text>That's not what he said, at all.
<quoted text>And this was about specific people, namely Jacob and Esau, and Pharaoh.
<quoted text>Yeah. This is now become quite frustrating.

“Become Love!”

Since: Jan 09

Nowhere/Now here

#30448 Mar 22, 2013
Gary wrote:
Hi Lee:
I am sorry but your not making a sense when you first said that being born again is ALL the work of God.
Then you turn this around and say in your last statement:
"To enter into the kingdom of God is all based on their works"
Lee, we cannot have it both ways either being [born again] becoming saved is ALL the work of God. Lee, don't you see you void out what you have just said?
You're not understanding me, Gary. That's the problem. Becoming born-again can only be accomplished by Father. Such blessings are outside our control. Our becoming born-again, though, depends on whether or not we've proven ourselves worthy of the vocation. But, being a faithful, obedient believer does not mean that we've been elected to fulfill the vocation. That decision is "God's" only, just like those who will sit on the sides of our anointed Savior and when our anointed Savior returns is "God's" decision. But, even then, we can deny this vocation. This is what Hebrews 6 proves. Regardless, these have nothing, at all, to do with our final salvation. On this side of the kingdom, we're only saved from the penalty of death. It's our being saved from the penalty of death that's called "grace." And if we continue until the end, we'll be granted the ultimate salvation. But, until then?
Gary wrote:
Fact, salvation is not based on any of the works of righteousness which we have done but by His mercy alone! This is what God declares I am not saying this God is the test and the test is, will we believe God or will we hold to our own will?
That's not what I'm saying, at all. Or, "God," for that matter. We've done nothing that we can claim-- to say that it was because of anything we've done as the reason that "God" bestowed grace upon us. "God" bestowed grace upon man because He chose to. This isn't the important part, though. What's important is how we'll treat "God's" mercy and grace. Will we accept it and adhere to the stipulations applied to it, or will we use our liberty as an occasion to the flesh?
Gary wrote:
"Not by WORKS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH WE HAVE DONE, but according to HIS MERCY HE SAVED US, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Spirit." Titus 3:3
Lee, don't you see the utter danger one puts themselves in when they think salvation is all based on their works? Many want that verse to read like this,
"salvation is according to the WORKS of righteousness which WE have done,,,"
I see that faith without works is dead, being alone, and that how our works proves our faith (James 2). I see how that the day of Judgment is the moment we'll all be judged based on the works we've done (Rev 20). You can reject these all you like, Gary, but this is what's written. You're repetition isn't changing a thing except proving that you reject all my assertions without explanation.
Gary wrote:
Don't you see the, WE, ME, I, same spirit as in, Isa. 14, where Satan said the five [I WILL'S] I will be like the most High same spirit is, I WILL get saved by my own righteousness!
Didn't you see the "ye's," "yours'," and "I's," that the verses I quoted used, but in a positive manner? Did you see how Paul said to follow him?
Gary wrote:
Now Lee, Satan loves to get people traped in the pride trip I know I was traped in this at one time also but it is by God's mercy alone that saved me apart from anything I did I was dead in my sins, Eph. 2:1,
What's so different now from what you used to say before May 21st and October 21st came and went uneventful? The only difference in what you preach, now, is that you exclude dates. Other than that, though...

“Become Love!”

Since: Jan 09

Nowhere/Now here

#30449 Mar 22, 2013
PART II
Gary wrote:
Now the false gospel is the gospel of works of righteousness which man thinks he can do apart from the work of God listen very carfully in what God is telling us how Satan comes and his ministers he is using look what gospel they come with and see that they come looking like Christ as an angel of light when the fact is, he is an angel of darkness and it is time to expose Satan and his angels of light who come with a do it your self gospel listen and pray for wisdom.
Learn the history of the Church, Gary. At that time, the opposition were those that either/both, denied that our anointed Savior was the son of "God," or/and that he had come in the flesh. These were the Church's first opposition.
Gary wrote:
"For such are false apostles, deceitful WORKERS, transforming themselves into the apotles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be ACCORDING TO THEIR WORKS." 2 Cor. 11:13-15
Do you not notice the issue here? They, like the scribes and Pharisees, preached one thing, but their works contradicted their teachings.
Gary wrote:
Did you see this Lee? Yes, Satan comes with a do it your self have it your way gospel that is ALL built on who's work? Yes, THEIR WORK!
That's not what it says, at all. I explained it, just above.
Gary wrote:
You see Lee in love and true concern I am warning all here but more important God says to all of us here, Behold I have told you before.
"Behold, I HAVE TOLD YOU BEFORE." Matthew 24:25
This verse comes right after when God warns of us these false ministers who come to try to deceive IF possible the very elect. Matthew 24:24.
Lee, in love I am warning people not to be snared in a gospel of works which they have done Jesus will just say to those, Depart from me, I NEVER KNEW YOU, YOU THAT WORKS WICKEDNESS.
You shall know them by their fruits. Do they preach against idolatry while committing the same? Do they preach against adultery while coveting their neighbor's wife? This is the issue.
Gary wrote:
Lee, God calls our own works works, WORKS of wickedness, so who am I to go against the most High God? God forbid! Let God be true and every man a liar!
So, you rejected that assertion, too, and without explanation. So, be it.
Gary wrote:
Fact, anyone claiming they can be saved by what they have done by their works are snared by Satan and held captive because God did not yet give them repentance to acknowledge the true gospel, 2 Tim. 2:25-26. This is why out of love and concern for all here I bring this to your attention. Thank you. Gary. 1 John 3:13-15.
~sigh~

“THE HEAT IS ON”

Since: Apr 12

Satan IS in "The Church"

#30450 Mar 22, 2013
Gary wrote:
Hi:
I am sorry I missed your post. Hope all is well with you. I am sharing as you can see with some dear people here the true gospel of the salvation work of God. My ptrayer is, that some will see it is all the work of God that saves when we add [self] to the work of God we make void the spirit of grace the word declares as you know. I will tell Dave you said hello. keep in touch hope to hear from you on here and some of your input. Gary. 1 John 3:13-15
<quoted text>
Thanks for the shout back!! Well, it hasn't been easy but then there would be no challenge in that.

Yes, the grace of our Lord is what we need. Any works are the effects of God's grace through His Spirit of those that are born again.

John 1 3:

5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Titus 3:

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Not by works of righteousness which we have done - The plan was not based on our own good works, nor are our own good works now the cause of our salvation. If people could have been saved by their own good works, there would have been no need of salvation by the Redeemer; if our own deeds were now the basis of our title to eternal life, the work of Christ would be equally unnecessary.

It is a great and fundamental principle of the gospel that the good works of men come in for no share in the justification of the soul. They are in no sense a consideration on account of which God pardons a man, and receives him to favor. The only basis of justification is the merit of the Lord Jesus Christ, and in the matter of justification before God, all the race is on a level; see the notes at Ephesians 2:8-9.

http://barnes.biblecommenter.com/titus/3.htm

I plan to check in more often now that there is some true debating exchanges between my dear friends!! God bless you and yours ....

;*:*;
Gary

Buffalo, NY

#30451 Mar 22, 2013
Hi Lee:

Nice picture. However, why look so sad? Smile and be happy, lol.

Yes, I believe you have it right God works and will's of His good pleasure in the lives of man to serve him as those verses I have shared in Romans 9: my last post really puts us all in our place does it not?

I am sorry I don't folow you or understand what your saying concerning the Holy Spirit this function of the Holy Spirit ended in the first century? Do you mean when the Bible is complete there is no more revelation and not to add nor take away from His word?
We know the Holy Spirit which is also called [the comforter] will be with the true believer until the return of the Lord to redeem them because they are sealed by the Holy Spirit the word declares unto the day of redemtion. So I am sorry I am not sure your point here maybe you can explain?

No, I said concerning any work we do it is first the work of God that must work the good work in one and that good work is the work of salvation after all what could be greater than this for the believer? When God does save one he will work out what God has already worked in the person. So maybe you did not read my last posts closly? God tells us to work out our salvation does He not? However, many who has a do it your self gospel wants to stop there and not go further in the context because if they did they would see in the very next verse it states for it is Christ IN YOU that doeth the good work. The believer is to work out his salvation with fear and trembling this is the spirit God gives him a broken and a contrie heart and a very humble spirit not prideful or arroagant but a spirit of true love and concern for all here.

"Wherfore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but how much more in my absence, WORK OUT YOUR OWN SALVATION WITH FEAR AND TREMBLING. For it is God which WORKETH IN you both to will and do of his good pleasure."

Lee, you can see it is God's work first not our work. God worketh for His good pleasure we see this also here:

"For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that THE PURPOSE OF GOD ACCORDING TO ELECTION MIGHT STAND, NOT OF WORKS, BUT OF HIM THAT CALLETH." Romans 9:11

We can see just who is in full control and we can know for sure it is not man but of God's good pleasure to will and do accoding to His good pleasure according to God's ELECTION that it will stand NOT OF WORKS but of Him that CALLETH.

Question, are we born in sins and tresspasses?

Answer Yes! we were born dead in sins just as we have no say in our first birth we have no say in the second birth in being [born again] as you said being [born again] is ALL the work of God. However, I am sad to see that your back tracking now on this most imortant issue, I was hoping that you seen this but maybe your just confused and frustrated not able to get a good handle on all these verse and questions and answers I am giving to all your questions it can be hard I fully understand I was there done that. Thank you. Gary
Brother Lee Love wrote:
<quoted text>It's me, Gary. I wasn't logged-in, so I "grey-boxed" it and spelled my screen-name backwards.
<quoted text>I know.
<quoted text>Don't you mean that "God" causes us to serve Him and causes others not to serve Him?
<quoted text>Israel, primarily. But, the Gentiles can be grafted in
<quoted text>You're contradicting yourself. You're saying that we know we're saved based on the works we do. But, then, you're not contradicting yourself, because you're saying that the works we do are because "God" makes us do these works. That's called "confusion," Gary.
<quoted text>My issue is that you'll tell me that I only believe in His son because He makes me believe in him. This means that "God" is both, unjust and a respecter of persons, but you fail to realize this.

“THE HEAT IS ON”

Since: Apr 12

Satan IS in "The Church"

#30452 Mar 22, 2013
Brother Lee Love wrote:
<quoted text>Yep. Still at it, as you can see. And yes. That's yours truly. Thank you, too.(smile and a wink)
<quoted text>Funny thing is, I think so.
<quoted text>We were created perfect. Our limitations derive from becoming imperfect way-back-when. None can be born with these limitations and be blamed for them, because before birth, we have no record, whatsoever. Neither can our parents be blamed unless our defects are directly related. But, for the most part, it's like I said. Adam and Eve are to blame, initially.
<quoted text>No. You were in the wrong place at the wrong time, just like the people our anointed Savior mentioned after the tower fell on them and killed them. A day of judgment has been set. Therefore, we'll not be judged until then. And until then, everything negative that takes place is entirely circumstantial.
<quoted text>The healing will come after judgment. If we're worthy of access into the kingdom, then we'll be healed before entering. Until then, we must rely on the faith we have in His promises and what our Godhead accomplished on the cross, and the righteousness He revealed to us.
Good to see you again, Hell Sucks. Real talk.
Bro Love, is that your frustrated look, like when you post to Gary?? LOL. I bet you have a wonderful smile too.

Ahhh, original sin. I see. When you stated "our actions" I was a bit confused. No doubt my actions are responsible for many aspects of my life. And yes, sometimes our parents can be responsible for our health issues, but some things are just an "act of God" so to speak.

".... our Godhead accomplished on the cross"?? That seems like a new choice of words for you. Is it? I don't recall you referring to any such thing other than "our anointed Savior" or something to that effect.

It's really good to chat with you again too. Iron sharpeneth iron indeed. It's quite difficult to find anywhere to post on Topix these days. The Christian Forum is a mess. I seldom post there, and it's generally not even worth reading. This is much more what forums were designed for and worth one's time.

;*:*;
Gary

Buffalo, NY

#30453 Mar 22, 2013
Hi:

Thank you for sharing those verses. Yes, it is sad to see some come very close to truth but fall short by adding [self] to the salvation work alone of God. What this does they do not realize is, it voids out the grace of God alone thus voids out the spirit of grace because they mix [works] into their salvation. I know no matter what verses I share no matter how clear they are it is only the work of the Holy Spirit that can make His word real to them to give them light in a dark place. Sad to say that most including myself at one time was taken snare by a false foundation that was based on what I, ME, WE, have done not really understanding at all it was never the works of our righteousness which we have done but accoding to His mercy alone He saves one here and another there. It could be someone hearing the word of God on this site God may apply His word by the power of His Spirit and save one as you said in John 3,

You see when one truly knows the true salvation he or she is able to explain all their verses but sad to say they cannot explain the verses you share with them so in time they will get very frustrated and confused because they just cannot explain any of your verses, your heart just goes out to them and you pray that God will give them understanding as Jesus said to Paul it is hard to kick against the pricks meaning it is hard to go against my truth Jesus said my word is truth, John 17:17.

The true believer will show patiance, longsuffering, meekness, gentleness, love, and faith for the person that he to may come to see truth only by the work and grace of God alone. To God be all the glory great things He has done. Again, thank yu for your input. Gary
Hell Sucks wrote:
<quoted text>
Thanks for the shout back!! Well, it hasn't been easy but then there would be no challenge in that.
Yes, the grace of our Lord is what we need. Any works are the effects of God's grace through His Spirit of those that are born again.
John 1 3:
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Titus 3:
5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Not by works of righteousness which we have done - The plan was not based on our own good works, nor are our own good works now the cause of our salvation. If people could have been saved by their own good works, there would have been no need of salvation by the Redeemer; if our own deeds were now the basis of our title to eternal life, the work of Christ would be equally unnecessary.
It is a great and fundamental principle of the gospel that the good works of men come in for no share in the justification of the soul. They are in no sense a consideration on account of which God pardons a man, and receives him to favor. The only basis of justification is the merit of the Lord Jesus Christ, and in the matter of justification before God, all the race is on a level; see the notes at Ephesians 2:8-9.
http://barnes.biblecommenter.com/titus/3.htm
I plan to check in more often now that there is some true debating exchanges between my dear friends!! God bless you and yours ....
;*:*;

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#30454 Mar 22, 2013
Brother Lee wrote:

"Yes. Now, I ask, are we made alive by the word of "God"? "
- This is actually a topic that many refuse to acknowledge as an action of Self.

We, our being, Self, does these things, in order for you to form this question:
- Self - chooses to read or not read the Bible
- Self - chooases to accept or reject what is read
- Self - chooses to be enlightened to the words in the Bible

Now if you accept that these actions occurs, your question should reflect a more pointed assertion:

Do we become alive by the "word of God"?

That answer would be applied to what the word "alive" actually means.

Are we "aware"?
Are we "awake"?
Are we "not dead"?
Are we "understanding"?

All products of Self.

Jesus promoted it, why do you refute it?

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#30455 Mar 22, 2013
evoL eeL rehtorB wrote:
Actually, there are exceptions with the people you mentioned being among them. People that can't understand and/or make such a decision are exempt from judgment. Instead, they'll be healed, if need be, and allowed entrance into the kingdom.

New Age wrote:
Is this another unfounded claim?

Where does "God" specifically state this?

FYI - Since "God" only spoke to certain individuals in the OT texts, I will presume that will be your source, right?

Remember - please make sure you are quoting the specific text(s) that state the specific process you mentioned above.
Brother Lee Love wrote:
<quoted text>My assertions are based on quite a few verses. The following are the ones I can remember at the top of my head and at this time.
Hebrews 5:14
1Kings 3:9
Isaiah 7:16
Luke 12:47-48

As I see it, it seems (to me) that "God" is most concerned about having discernment and being capable of making a choice. Then, it's written, "Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons." Therefore, I can't imagine these verses not applying to all men, especially those that are incapable of discernment.
"My assertions are based on quite a few verses."

So.

You put a lot of references to "non-God" persons.

Please provide something speicifically from "God". Meaning, not "Paul", Luke, etc.

You can do this, right?

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