Bush is a hero
common sense

Eden Prairie, MN

#178531 Jun 19, 2014
Strength and Honor wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't believe anyone was wrong about Iraq, Hip. Saddam had used chemical munitions on the Kurds, he had a weapons program, and he was in the process of building a strong weapons infrastructure where he could produce anything he wanted. Proof of that is in the intercepted transmissions from his own field commanders asking him when he was going to use his chemical munitions on us when we overran his front-line forces. Even they thought he had them.
All of a sudden, after using them on his people everything disappeared without a trace. There were no more chemical weapons. What happened to them? And how were we going to find out if they were there or not if we didn't go in? Most experts believe he transferred his weapons to Syria.
Actually, the IAEA weapons inspectors along with David Kay believed Saddam destroyed them after the first gulf war but continued to let his enemies believe he still had them to avoid looking weak and capable of being easily invaded. Looks like his plan was successful.... to a point. There IS no credible evidence of a transfer of chemical or bio weapons cache to Syria.....just as there was no credible evidence of chem and bio weapons caches in Iraq.

“Custer @ LBH - Ooops”

Since: Nov 07

Bakersfield, CA

#178532 Jun 19, 2014
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Bad Bob doesn't do humor.
Things are tough in Bakersfield.
And your reading comprehension is just slightly better than Global Idiot. Millions are struggling in this economy right now, funnyman!

But I wouldn't EXPECT you to care, worthless freakin' troll!
common sense

Eden Prairie, MN

#178533 Jun 19, 2014
Strength and Honor wrote:
<quoted text>
Then how do you explain Saudi Arabia? They don't have an overly large Taliban presence yet they still practice draconian punishment for just about any crime.
Oil trumps women's rights when it comes to American interest abroad....I mean over seas.

“Custer @ LBH - Ooops”

Since: Nov 07

Bakersfield, CA

#178534 Jun 19, 2014
HipGnozizzz wrote:
<quoted text>How about this for a baseline rule for "What To Do About Iraq" - All those who were so utterly wrong about Iraq don't get to give advice on what to do about Iraq.
As I told the ambulance chaser yesterday, I have little use for Obama-enablers.

So grab a hammer, go find a nearby playground and pound sand for a few hours.

“Help Cecil Help!”

Since: Dec 06

Lafayette IN

#178535 Jun 19, 2014
lisw wrote:
<quoted text>I can't believe you are saying this. The Taliban is not a culture. They swooped in like vultures after the Ussr and warlords tore Afghanistan apart. To say that murder and rape and abuse are part of the culture is one of the most racist things I've ever heard. It's like believing that everyone but the fundamentalists are going to hell is part of our culture. I thought we thought that there were good muslims.
As far as making assumptions, perhaps I did but I hear it all the time, "I want what I want as a woman and I'm not worried about other women."
I'm racist now?

That's horsehockey, lisw.

I have no idea where the hell this 'I thought there were good Muslims' bullsh*t came from, because I wasn't talking about Muslims in general. How you made that leap is beyond me.

The Taliban are a lot of things, one of the principal things being extreme religious fundamentalists. The emphasis is on extreme, but just how much difference there is between the average tribal Afghan attitude toward women and the attitude of the Taliban is open for debate. It's going to vary from place to place and tribe to tribe, and the more rural and isolated it is (particularly out there in the twilight zone on the border with Pakistan among other areas) the less distance between them.

As I said the Taliban are an extreme - but in general there are similarities to their attitude toward women and what's been happening in the Ayatollah's Iran since the fall of the Shah, for what's been happening in Iraq since Saddam's defeat in the Gulf War made him cozy up to certain clerics (something that's accelerated since Saddam fell), etc etc etc.

That's neither 'racist' nor religious bigotry, lisw - that's just a statement of fact.
uidiotRaceMakeWo rldpeace

United States

#178536 Jun 19, 2014
Strength and Honor wrote:
<quoted text>
If Saddam was a US puppet, why did he refuse to allow the weapons inspectors in when we told him to? A puppet does whatever they are told to do.
He disobey our US command and he got it, hanged! Saddam no longer want to be a US puppet, so decided to go his own way to sell Oil for Gold not for US petrodollar , this got our US in rage , so it begins and decided to use US exported chemicals/biological dual use to make Warfare materials for war to be free from our American neo-imperialist agendas !

“Help Cecil Help!”

Since: Dec 06

Lafayette IN

#178537 Jun 19, 2014
Strength and Honor wrote:
<quoted text>
If Saddam was a US puppet, why did he refuse to allow the weapons inspectors in when we told him to? A puppet does whatever they are told to do.
Please don't waste your time trying to engage the idiot - he gets enough encouragement from his entourage (NFL and Eightball).

You're not going to have an intelligible (let alone intelligent) conversation with him, and I'm not talking about the gibberEnglish language. Many before you have tried.

“Custer @ LBH - Ooops”

Since: Nov 07

Bakersfield, CA

#178538 Jun 19, 2014
Strength and Honor wrote:
<quoted text>
If Saddam was a US puppet, why did he refuse to allow the weapons inspectors in when we told him to? A puppet does whatever they are told to do.
Feed the trolls at your own peril SH.
common sense

Eden Prairie, MN

#178539 Jun 19, 2014
bad bob wrote:
<quoted text>
That milquetoast horse's adze in the WH is to blame (IMO). It reared up when Barry backed off the "Red Line" in Syria. Now with the impending elections and him sinking deeper & deeper in the domestic do-do, he'll do just about ANYthing to keep from riling up his left wing base.
IINM, ISIS is made up mostly of former very angry Ba'athist Sunnis, who are so savagely ruthless, even members of al Qaeda are turning into shrinking violets. These goons have brutally murdered 1000's of Iraqi military, police, and anyone else they don't like. They've stolen half a billion $$ from Iraqi banks from Mosul to Khalis, amassed high-tech weapons left behind for the Iraqis by the US, threatened major Iraqi oil fields, and are about to take over Bagdad Airport.
After his golf & fund-raising hitch here in CA, Obama is "holding meetings" to see what options are available to him.
The ISI.....now joined by Syrian sunni militants forming ISIS, are funded by Saudi's no less. Our addiction to mideast oil is costing us face, blood and treasure.

Since: Sep 10

Manhattan Beach, CA

#178540 Jun 19, 2014
bad bob wrote:
<quoted text>
And your reading comprehension is just slightly better than Global Idiot. Millions are struggling in this economy right now, funnyman!
But I wouldn't EXPECT you to care, worthless freakin' troll!
Agreed, millions are struggling.

That's why I favor an immediate, substantial increase in the minimum wage.

How about you?
uidiotRaceMakeWo rldpeace

United States

#178541 Jun 19, 2014
WildWeirdWillie wrote:
<quoted text>Please don't waste your time trying to engage the idiot - he gets enough encouragement from his entourage (NFL and Eightball).
You're not going to have an intelligible (let alone intelligent) conversation with him, and I'm not talking about the gibberEnglish language. Many before you have tried.
Because you don't have and intelligent counter /facts to oppose ... AS some of intelligent posters agree and some disagree with me on the debates.

Since: Nov 08

Chicago, IL

#178542 Jun 19, 2014
common sense wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually, the IAEA weapons inspectors along with David Kay believed Saddam destroyed them after the first gulf war but continued to let his enemies believe he still had them to avoid looking weak and capable of being easily invaded. Looks like his plan was successful.... to a point. There IS no credible evidence of a transfer of chemical or bio weapons cache to Syria.....just as there was no credible evidence of chem and bio weapons caches in Iraq.
Here's a good article from the Wall Street Journal, CS. It shows a picture of a chemical weapons factory. If he had no weapons cache why would he need a factory that produced them?

http://online.wsj.com/articles/sunni-extremis...

I like your point about him not having the weapons but him acting like he did. That's exactly what he did do.

Since: Nov 08

Chicago, IL

#178543 Jun 19, 2014
WildWeirdWillie wrote:
<quoted text>Please don't waste your time trying to engage the idiot - he gets enough encouragement from his entourage (NFL and Eightball).
You're not going to have an intelligible (let alone intelligent) conversation with him, and I'm not talking about the gibberEnglish language. Many before you have tried.
Understood.

Since: Nov 08

Chicago, IL

#178544 Jun 19, 2014
bad bob wrote:
<quoted text>
Feed the trolls at your own peril SH.
Understood.
HipGnozizzz

Dahinda, IL

#178545 Jun 19, 2014
Strength and Honor wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't believe anyone was wrong about Iraq, Hip. Saddam had used chemical munitions on the Kurds, he had a weapons program, and he was in the process of building a strong weapons infrastructure where he could produce anything he wanted. Proof of that is in the intercepted transmissions from his own field commanders asking him when he was going to use his chemical munitions on us when we overran his front-line forces. Even they thought he had them.
All of a sudden, after using them on his people everything disappeared without a trace. There were no more chemical weapons. What happened to them? And how were we going to find out if they were there or not if we didn't go in? Most experts believe he transferred his weapons to Syria.
Like I said before, I sure don't have any inside information. But it was mighty telling to me that the Bush admin closed-door full-court global press couldn't convince other nations that invading Iraq and unseating Hussein was a necessity, and in fact was a mistake. You're talking about chem weapons that were used over a decade before. How did we know they had them then? Because we facilitated Hussein getting them, a decade before that, you know, back when he was a good guy in the fight against extremism. There is no mystery about what happened to them outside of conspiracy circles - they deteriorated with age and nobody was giving him new.

On the other hand, Rumsfeld said he knew right where they were.

But they weren't. He was wrong.

And let's don't forget - the Bush admin talking points briefly raised the specter of a "mushroom cloud". That ain't chemical, that's nuclear.

So that kinda pokes a hole in the idea that it was about chemical weapons. It was about utilizing terminology designed to "shock and awe" a skeptical populace into supporting a predetermined filibuster campaign.

Finally, if we're going to read between the lines and speculate thereon - if it was about WMD, then why, oh why, on Invasion Day, with months spent selling, planning, and build-up, WHY was there about a dozen personnel specifically tasked with finding the depots? I mean, this would be a commander's nightmare, wouldn't it? To have a desperate tyrant unleash his WMD on his forces? Almost 200 "identified" depots, or possibilities, and you have a dozen troops tasked to find them? Check back and see what Maj Gen Spider Marks had to say about that, since he believed what he was told (sold), and as a conscientious commander, was mighty stressed about it, since he really did "support the troops" and all that.

It looks more to me like his dirty dozen was a Rumsfeld/Cheney afterthought, as in, "Oh yeah, we have to have somebody look like they're looking for WMD, don't we?"

It ain't nothin' wrong with being wrong. What's wrong is when in our hubris we fail to face it and learn from it. The short lesson is, don't follow "leaders", and watch the parking meters.

Since: Nov 08

Chicago, IL

#178546 Jun 19, 2014
Sorry CS. I went back to check the link to the Wall Street article and it said you had to subscribe or log in. It didn't say that the first time.
uidiotRaceMakeWo rldpeace

United States

#178547 Jun 19, 2014
bad bob wrote:
<quoted text>
Feed the trolls at your own peril SH.
it like calling kettle the black! And most of your posts are filled with rhetorics, ad hominems... illogical, ignorant... Bahahhaaa you world biggesgt Idiot troll, a war mongering grunt who support evil, corrupted men in power... Go look in the mirror and ruminate about human rights, for peace .agendas, civil liberty... no wonder you left your brain with hitler! ABahahahaaa.
uidiotRaceMakeWo rldpeace

United States

#178548 Jun 19, 2014
Strength and Honor wrote:
<quoted text>
Understood.
So you another " YES man! " no/little brains but more brawns, obedient and lackey! Bhahahaaaaaa
uidiotRaceMakeWo rldpeace

United States

#178549 Jun 19, 2014
HipGnozizzz wrote:
<quoted text>Like I said before, I sure don't have any inside information. But it was mighty telling to me that the Bush admin closed-door full-court global press couldn't convince other nations that invading Iraq and unseating Hussein was a necessity, and in fact was a mistake. You're talking about chem weapons that were used over a decade before. How did we know they had them then? Because we facilitated Hussein getting them, a decade before that, you know, back when he was a good guy in the fight against extremism. There is no mystery about what happened to them outside of conspiracy circles - they deteriorated with age and nobody was giving him new.
On the other hand, Rumsfeld said he knew right where they were.
But they weren't. He was wrong.
And let's don't forget - the Bush admin talking points briefly raised the specter of a "mushroom cloud". That ain't chemical, that's nuclear.
So that kinda pokes a hole in the idea that it was about chemical weapons. It was about utilizing terminology designed to "shock and awe" a skeptical populace into supporting a predetermined filibuster campaign.
Finally, if we're going to read between the lines and speculate thereon - if it was about WMD, then why, oh why, on Invasion Day, with months spent selling, planning, and build-up, WHY was there about a dozen personnel specifically tasked with finding the depots? I mean, this would be a commander's nightmare, wouldn't it? To have a desperate tyrant unleash his WMD on his forces? Almost 200 "identified" depots, or possibilities, and you have a dozen troops tasked to find them? Check back and see what Maj Gen Spider Marks had to say about that, since he believed what he was told (sold), and as a conscientious commander, was mighty stressed about it, since he really did "support the troops" and all that.
It looks more to me like his dirty dozen was a Rumsfeld/Cheney afterthought, as in, "Oh yeah, we have to have somebody look like they're looking for WMD, don't we?"
It ain't nothin' wrong with being wrong. What's wrong is when in our hubris we fail to face it and learn from it. The short lesson is, don't follow "leaders", and watch the parking meters.
U.S. Chemical and Biological Warfare-Related Dual Use Exports to Iraq and their Possible Impact on the Health Consequences of the Gulf War - known as the Riegle Report, May 25,1994:

Records available from the supplier for the period from 1985 until the present show that during this time, pathogenic (meaning disease producing), toxigenic (meaning poisonous), and other biological research materials were exported to Iraq pursuant to application and licensing by the U.S. Department of Commerce.

Since: Jun 08

Location hidden

#178550 Jun 19, 2014
WildWeirdWillie wrote:
<quoted text>I'm racist now?
That's horsehockey, lisw.
I have no idea where the hell this 'I thought there were good Muslims' bullsh*t came from, because I wasn't talking about Muslims in general. How you made that leap is beyond me.
The Taliban are a lot of things, one of the principal things being extreme religious fundamentalists. The emphasis is on extreme, but just how much difference there is between the average tribal Afghan attitude toward women and the attitude of the Taliban is open for debate. It's going to vary from place to place and tribe to tribe, and the more rural and isolated it is (particularly out there in the twilight zone on the border with Pakistan among other areas) the less distance between them.
As I said the Taliban are an extreme - but in general there are similarities to their attitude toward women and what's been happening in the Ayatollah's Iran since the fall of the Shah, for what's been happening in Iraq since Saddam's defeat in the Gulf War made him cozy up to certain clerics (something that's accelerated since Saddam fell), etc etc etc.
That's neither 'racist' nor religious bigotry, lisw - that's just a statement of fact.
Don't even try it. You know dam well I did not call you a racist I said it was a racist thing to say that abuse is a part of their culture. It's as bad as saying that criminality is part of the African american culture. the good muslims has to do with Obama's insistence that radical is not the norm and I believe that too, but now all of the sudden several of you are saying that's just who they are in the Arab countries. Well I don't believe that. I spoke with a man in New Mexico who left Afghanistan many years ago. It sure wasn't who he was. You are so set on knowing it all you just don't hear what you sound like. Now you're trying to alter what you said.
I do have a suggestion for you. Along with all the books you read, I might give you a list that I believe will enlighten you as to what I'm talking about. You can't just stick with one kind of book.

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