Bush is a hero
miner49er

Lerona, WV

#164525 Jul 8, 2013
"If all of us civilized folks can't get along for more than a day or two how do you propose to get the leaders of the world to do it? "

I'm an optimist, I think things are better than they've ever been.
Sure, ME unrest, conflicts hither and yon, nuke proliferation, etc.
But overall, the average human's lot in life has improved consistently over history.

"You may dislike and distrust the CIA but there are very good men and women who are risking their lives to go into other countries and gather intel "

Yes, I know some myself who gather and analyze intel... BUT they also understand the Rule of Law and insure that their activities conform to Constitutional limits.

It seems many at Langley may be a bit challenged in that regard...

Pernrider, thanks for you son's service, EOD is a demanding trade.

Of course the flag officers always blame the NCOs and butterbars... they're never willing to own their mistakes.

It's usually the senior NCOs that keep the unit functional and make the officers look good.

“Help Cecil Help!”

Since: Dec 06

Lafayette IN

#164526 Jul 8, 2013
miner49er wrote:
WWW, you may note the common thread of CIA involvement... Iran, Vietnam, Cuba, Afghanistan....
What's your point, exactly?
miner49er

Lerona, WV

#164528 Jul 8, 2013
Given their poor performance in Iran ('53), the Bay of Pigs ('61), Vietnam ('61) and even as recent as 9/11 and Benghazi the CIA has proven to be a poor instrument of American foreign policy.

“Unemployed Bush 5.3 obama 8.7”

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#164529 Jul 8, 2013
miner49er wrote:
Bobin, thanks for the response.
"The big difference, of course, in Benghazi, he should have acted to defend American lives,"
What action should Obama have taken during the Benghazi attacks to "defend American lives"?
We've discussed that ad nauseaum. If you still don't understand whay barry's options were, me repeating them won't help your reading comprehension either.
miner49er wrote:
"In Egypt, he shouldn't have acted to support Mohamed Morsi, Sharia Law and the Muslim Brotherhood, and he did, when it was none of our business."
What specific action did Obama take that you think was "none of our business"?
Ask an Egyptian why they're demonstrating against obama, or read the headlines. I'm not the media.

http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/egypt-obama-...

http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/...

“Unemployed Bush 5.3 obama 8.7”

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#164530 Jul 8, 2013
Pernrider wrote:
<quoted text>
That was my line not Miner's. Once again, because of the way Miner does things, it is almost impossible to discern who says what.
Silly me, I should have realized that no post, or idea, of Miner's would contain any common sense.

And yes, the boy does make it easy to confuse his statements with other's. I guess I just proved that.

“zero nuclear weapons”

Since: Sep 08

Perryville

#164531 Jul 8, 2013
miner49er wrote:
"Our "boy king" screws up again... for the whole world to see."
Ewww, Bobin, do you want the US to intervene in Egypt?
Do you want the US to support the military coup that deposed the denodraticly elected leader of Egypt?
Just like we did in Iran in 1953?
"The 1953 Iranian coup d'état (known in Iran as the 28 Mordad coup[3]) was the overthrow of the democratically elected government of Iran, and its head of government Prime Minister Mohammad Mosaddegh on 19 August 1953, orchestrated by the United Kingdom (under the name 'Operation Boot') and the United States (under the name TPAJAX Project).[4][5] The coup saw the formation of a military government under Mohammad-Rez&#257; Sh&#257;h Pahlavi, who progressed from a constitutional monarch to an authoritarian one who relied heavily on United States support to hold on to power until his own overthrow in February 1979."
That turned out really well...
Bobin, what do you have against democracy and freedom?
Or do you just have an unreasoning hatred of Obama?
Do you know why it was done Iran's oil industry was nationalized and America and the British did not want it.

“Unemployed Bush 5.3 obama 8.7”

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#164532 Jul 8, 2013
miner49er wrote:
Given their poor performance in Iran ('53), the Bay of Pigs ('61), Vietnam ('61) and even as recent as 9/11 and Benghazi the CIA has proven to be a poor instrument of American foreign policy.
The CIA didn't blow it in Benghazi, those four American deaths were all directly attributable to pResident obama, and his incompetent appointees.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/201...

http://www.conservativeactionalerts.com/2013/...

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/05/...
miner49er

Lerona, WV

#164533 Jul 8, 2013
Bobin, it appears you have no answers...

From the link you posted:

"Four years later, Egyptians increasingly assail the U.S. for backing Islamist President Mohamed Morsi, the nation’s first democratically elected leader,"

Bobin, do you think it's wrong for the US to support "first democratically elected leader"?

From the link you posted:

"In Egypt, the president welcomed in 2009 with a cry of “Barack Obama, we love you,” is now seen by many as just another leader who puts American interests above Egypt’s needs."

Bobin, do you think it's wrong for the American President to "put American interests above Egypt’s needs"?

“Unemployed Bush 5.3 obama 8.7”

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#164534 Jul 8, 2013
miner49er wrote:
Bobin, it appears you have no answers...
Obviously, no answers that you were capable of understanding.
miner49er wrote:
From the link you posted:
"Four years later, Egyptians increasingly assail the U.S. for backing Islamist President Mohamed Morsi, the nation’s first democratically elected leader,"
Bobin, do you think it's wrong for the US to support "first democratically elected leader"?
Do I think it's wrong... ABSOLUTELY!!! Sharia Law and the Muslim Brotherhood are not in our best interests... or Egypts. That's why the Egyptians removed Morsi from office. Besides, it's none of our business who the Egyptian's want as their leader. It's not like barry isn't having enough of his own problems leading our government.

Egyptians did not accept a President that trashed their elected government, their Constitution and was attempting to transform the country into something they did not want... ie: an Egyptian obama.
miner49er wrote:
From the link you posted:
"In Egypt, the president welcomed in 2009 with a cry of “Barack Obama, we love you,” is now seen by many as just another leader who puts American interests above Egypt’s needs."
Bobin, do you think it's wrong for the American President to "put American interests above Egypt’s needs"?
If that were the case, obama should have stuck with Hosni Mubarak, a proven U.S. ally. Instead barry supported the Muslim Brotherhood's man, Mohamed Morsi and Sharia Law.

Obviously you don't comprehend what I keep telling you, when it comes to Egypt and most of the M.E., "Let Allah sort it out".
miner49er

Camp Creek, WV

#164535 Jul 9, 2013
"That's why the Egyptians removed Morsi from office"

You mean the military coup that imprisoned the democratically elected leader of Egypt?

You say: "when it comes to Egypt and most of the M.E., "Let Allah sort it out"." so you agree with me that the CIA was wrong to overthrow the democratically elected leader of Iran?

"In 1953, the United States CIA led by one of President Theodore Roosevelt’s grandsons, initiated a coup in Iran (Operation Ajax)[8] to remove the democratically elected Prime Minister Mohammed Mossadegh. The Iranian government was understandably dissatisfied with the terms of its contract with the Anglo-Persian Oil Company that allowed British interests to claim 85% of the oil profit from Iran.[9] Iran voted to nationalize the oil industry in 1951 after the British declined to renegotiate the terms. The US-led coup was successful, and the royal monarch, Shah Mohammad Reza Pahlavi,[10] became virtual dictator. Fearing popular reprisal, Pahlavi’s government was supported by the CIA in creating the Iranian SAVAK, a vicious secret police for the Shah’s dictatorial government."

Bobin, given your statement can we also belive you think President Eisenhower and Ford were wrong to develop Irans nuclear program?

"Under the Eisenhower administration, the US cooperated with the Shah’s government for the development of Iranian nuclear energy through the “Atoms for Peace” program.[12] President Ford agreed to US full cooperation to help Iran build about two dozen nuclear energy plants. When the Iranian people overthrew the Shah’s government in 1979, the US stopped cooperating. The US backed Iraq in their invasion of Iran in 1980 and throughout the war until 1988, seeking a more US-friendly Iranian government. The US provided Saddam Hussein with the chemical and biological weapons the W. Bush administration later used as justification for invading Iraq.[13] Since 1979, the US has worked to prevent Iran having a nuclear energy program, even under the legal provisions of the NPT, and reneged on a multi-billion dollar contract to deliver nuclear fuel to Iran without refunding Iran’s money."

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2012/01/us-ove...
UidiotRaceMAkEWO RLDPEACE

United States

#164536 Jul 9, 2013
Pernrider wrote:
<quoted text>
Thank you for your service and a long overdue, "Welcome Home."
You gonna be incensed what i'm gonna say! I don't have respect for Most soldiers of ANY NATION , as most are corrupted to serve and only protect the interests of corrupted /greedy elitish warring leaders agendas ; as world history throughout the many millenium had shown most Soldiers are brainwashed and rarely serve the world masses interest - those freedom, Human rights, labor rights, civil liberties.... Pick up history book stupid, Read up on Fall of Empires through history. And Bill Maher ,, political commenter is correct in his astute assessment - pronounced us Americans as dumb and stupid. Any Question! When Soldiers of any nation do right , yea i give them respect, till then our dimwit right wing warring AmeriCONs. BEHAHAHAHAHAAAA

Any Question , afraid of intellectual challenge. Come On, let rock and roll!
BWHHAHAHAA Sister !
miner49er

Crawley, WV

#164538 Jul 9, 2013
So let's take a look at America's secret Wars, just a selection after WWII...

These first two are examples of Big Oil's control over the CIA.

Syria 1949
Syria became an independent republic in 1946, but the March 1949 Syrian coup d'état, led by Army Chief of Staff Husni al-Za'im, ended the initial period of civilian rule. Za'im met at least six times with CIA operatives in the months prior to the coup to discuss his plan to seize power. Za'im requested American funding or personnel, but it is not known whether this assistance was provided. Once in power, Za'im made several key decisions that benefitted the United States.

Iran 1953
In 1953, the CIA worked with the United Kingdom to overthrow the democratically elected government of Iran led by Prime Minister Mohammad Mossadegh who had attempted to nationalize Iran's petroleum industry, threatening the profits of the Anglo-Iranian Oil Company.[15] Declassified CIA documents show that Britain was fearful of Iran's plans to nationalize its oil industry and pressed the U.S. to mount a joint operation to depose the prime minister and install a puppet regime.[16] In 1951 the Iranian parliament voted to nationalize the petroleum fields of the country.[16][17]
The coup was led by CIA operative Kermit Roosevelt, Jr.(grandson of President Theodore Roosevelt).

So America's tax dollars being used to ensure Big Oil's profits by overthrowing civilian governments and supporting dictators.

But wait, there's more!

Guatemala 1954

Tibet 1955–70s

Indonesia 1958

Cuba 1959

Democratic Republic of the Congo 1960–65

Iraq 1960–63

Dominican Republic 1961

South Vietnam 1961

Brazil 1964

Ghana 1966

Chile 1970–73

Afghanistan 1979–89

Turkey 1980

Poland 1980–81

Nicaragua 1981–90

Cambodia 1980–95

Angola 1980s

Philippines 1986

Venezuela 2002

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_United_St...
UidiotRaceMAkEWO RLDPEACE

United States

#164539 Jul 9, 2013
miner49er wrote:
So let's take a look at America's secret Wars, just a selection after WWII...
These first two are examples of Big Oil's control over the CIA.
Syria 1949
Syria became an independent republic in 1946, but the March 1949 Syrian coup d'état, led by Army Chief of Staff Husni al-Za'im, ended the initial period of civilian rule. Za'im met at least six times with CIA operatives in the months prior to the coup to discuss his plan to seize power. Za'im requested American funding or personnel, but it is not known whether this assistance was provided. Once in power, Za'im made several key decisions that benefitted the United States.
Iran 1953
In 1953, the CIA worked with the United Kingdom to overthrow the democratically elected government of Iran led by Prime Minister Mohammad Mossadegh who had attempted to nationalize Iran's petroleum industry, threatening the profits of the Anglo-Iranian Oil Company.[15] Declassified CIA documents show that Britain was fearful of Iran's plans to nationalize its oil industry and pressed the U.S. to mount a joint operation to depose the prime minister and install a puppet regime.[16] In 1951 the Iranian parliament voted to nationalize the petroleum fields of the country.[16][17]
The coup was led by CIA operative Kermit Roosevelt, Jr.(grandson of President Theodore Roosevelt).
So America's tax dollars being used to ensure Big Oil's profits by overthrowing civilian governments and supporting dictators.
But wait, there's more!
Guatemala 1954
Tibet 1955–70s
Indonesia 1958
Cuba 1959
Democratic Republic of the Congo 1960–65
Iraq 1960–63
Dominican Republic 1961
South Vietnam 1961
Brazil 1964
Ghana 1966
Chile 1970–73
Afghanistan 1979–89
Turkey 1980
Poland 1980–81
Nicaragua 1981–90
Cambodia 1980–95
Angola 1980s
Philippines 1986
Venezuela 2002
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_United_St...
Excellent, expalined to our dumbed down Amercan Sheeoples! You above list historical Wars is just tip of the ice berg ,our US militaristic Imperialist Interventions been at war and war and wars Since Inception of a nation, i mean a US war mongering Empire! Hope our Sheeeoples will wake up1

No wonder US is Morally and Financially Bankrupted because all wars at home and around the world.
UidiotRaceMAKEWO RLDPEACE

United States

#164540 Jul 9, 2013
Pernrider wrote:
<quoted text>
Miner
You need to check your dates for Jimmy Carter's Presidency. Reagan became President on Jan 20, 1981.
This thread is a good reminder of human nature. If you could get everyone here to get along and decide amongst themselves that they were going to operate the Bush is a Hero thread in a certain way there will still be squabbles and downright nastiness hashed round about. Throw in the trolls who come in or crazy leaders like Idiot (I secretly think he is the ruler of N. Korea) and you can see why there are no easy solutions. Humans are messy. We can be agreeable one day and disagreeable the next. Some are sociopaths and some are just mean because they believe that folks don't understand them and they have something to prove. Some want to control every little thing and want everyone to think their way and do things their way.
If all of us civilized folks can't get along for more than a day or two how do you propose to get the leaders of the world to do it? And even here, we get involved in each other's arguments. Do you think that is any less a problem in world affairs?
As long as there are humans you will have conflicts. As long as there are humans you will have wars and evil deeds, confusion and chaos. Not all humans can be reasoned with, as evidenced by Idiot. The world is an ugly messed up place and way too often the most evil people come to power. When they do, nothing and no one is safe.
Our world has become smaller and smaller with world travel. We all have ties to other countries either though business or friendships or even chat rooms on the internet. With those relationships comes the desire to help those that we know when they're in trouble. What would you do if you were a world leader and a friend of yours in another country asked for your help, told you that whole villages were being wiped out and they needed your countrymen to come save the day? Could you really turn your back? Even if it was to save some corporation in that country, those countries depend on the jobs and the $$ that come in from those corporations. Yes, corporate money is involved but so are the livelihoods of people in villages and cities and the economy in those countries.
You may dislike and distrust the CIA but there are very good men and women who are risking their lives to go into other countries and gather intel that keep you and I safe.
I don't know how to fix people meddling in each other's affairs let alone preventing countries from doing it.
U mean save those greedy corrupted war mongering/ Predatory US corporations/multiconglomerate s... who plunders other nations resources and divide human race to wars, use them as slaves and provide little or no benefits ... amd Add insult to injury our American Corporations that is outsources American jobs and leave American jobless and with a big tax bill payout of Superfund Bill ... Know wonder Bill MAher Pronounced as Most us Americans Are dumb and Stupid! You are clueless and right wing nitwit Sheeeople! Wake up stupid! You have brain of housewife ... WBHAHAHAHAAA Did i incense you to blow-yor-top-off! BWHAHHAHAHAHAHA You lack critical reasoning skills and much more! WBHAHHAAA
UidiotRaceMAKEWO RLDPEACE

United States

#164541 Jul 9, 2013
Add! Note : not against Capitalism but Predatory Capitalism and its Corporatism! Pornrider you are pinheAD! wbhahahaaaaa oUR dUMB and unthinking American sOLDIERS RISK thier very stupid lives for US Fascism/Corporatism and US militaristic Imperailism agendas that don't benefit Americans nor the world peoples livelihoods! Waje up time stupidos!
XYZ you Zipper IS OPEN

United States

#164542 Jul 9, 2013
To prove my point Dumb dumd Pornrider! BWHAHHAAA

"I spent 33 years in the Marines, most of my time being a high-class muscle man for big business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer for Capitalism... The general public shoulders the bill. This bill renders a horrible accounting. Newly placed gravestones, Mangled bodies. Shattered minds. Broken hearts and homes. Economic instability. Back-breaking taxation for generations and generations."
Brigadier General Smedley D. Butler

Note: he is not Again Capitalism but Predatory capitalism and its interrelation between Corporatism - Fascism!
UidiotRaceMAKEWO RLDPEACE

United States

#164545 Jul 9, 2013
"Since the Bush-Cheney Administration took office in January 2001, controlling the major oil and natural gas fields of the world had been the primary, though undeclared, priority of US foreign policy... Not only the invasion of Iraq, but also the toppling of the Taliban in Afghanistan, had nothing to do with 'democracy,' and everything to do with pipeline control across Central Asia and the militarization of the Middle East."
F. William Engdahl , American German freelance journalist, historian and economic researcher.
UidiotRaceMAKEWO RLDPEACE

United States

#164546 Jul 9, 2013
"Africa is extremely rich in many resources, from agriculture to oil, minerals, and a huge variety of other resources used all around the world. If African nations were able to develop their own economies, use their own resources, and create their own industries and businesses, they could become self-sufficient at first, and then may become a force of great competition for the established industries and elites around the world. After all, Europe does not have much to offer in terms of resources, as the continent's wealth has largely come from plundering the resources of regions like Africa, and in becoming captains of monetary manipulation. A revitalized, vibrant, economically independent and successful Africa could spell the end of Western financial dominance. "
Andrew Gavin Marshall, an Canadian independent researcher and writer
UidiotRaceMAKEWO RLDPEACE

United States

#164547 Jul 9, 2013
Nunu Kidane, network coordinator for Priority Africa Network (PAN)
Somalia: The Other (Hidden) War for Oil
by Carl Bloice, Black Commentator

US political and military alliance with Ethiopia, which openly violated international law in its aggression towards Somalia, is destabilizing the Horn region and begins a new shift in the way the US plans to have permanent and active military presence in Africa.

===

One of the many , as many of our American are clueless ... Bill MAHER HIT HOME , pRONOUNING most Americans as dumb, stupid... Yea he sure hit home with that!
UidiotRaceMAKEWO RLDPEACE

United States

#164548 Jul 9, 2013
"Our real heroes are those who have tried to tell us the truth."
Robert Fearn in his book "Amoral America"

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