Bush is a hero

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#159619
Feb 27, 2013
 

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bad bob wrote:
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Deflective humor. Kudos.
Just tryin' to help out a pal.

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#159620
Feb 27, 2013
 
lisw wrote:
<quoted text>I suppose it's beyond your scope of understanding to think that people aren't sore losers for that long. It is beyond you to look at how strange the actions of this president are. Example would be charging people for meetings with him. Another is his swearing he'd have transparency and he is so opaque. I suppose it will take a history book ten years from now to see any truth about this president. In the present you are absolutely myopic. I can accept that, but you need to realize that people's criticism of Barack Obama is out of real concern. Romney (and it took a few seconds to remember his name) is not even a blip on "my" radar screen.
Well, you can expand it as you please but let's please stay focused for a moment. How much mileage you think there is on that "low-information voter" clinker?

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#159621
Feb 27, 2013
 

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lisw wrote:
<quoted text>BB, without his ideology, Willie would not be able to support this president. Have you noticed that he does not attempt to defend Obama? He merely attacks is detractors. Seems to me there was a similar occurence about 1861. Remember Willie?
I'd say there's where you're wrong. There are some serious deficiencies in this admin, the worst of which (IMO) conservatives can't bring themselves to admit is even a problem. Conservatives would rather spend their time talking about subjective vagaries like "transparency", birtherism, creeping socialism, death panels, paling around with terrorists, and such blather. So there's little room for anything to talk about in criticism.
lisw

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#159622
Feb 27, 2013
 
HipGnosis wrote:
<quoted text>I'd say there's where you're wrong. There are some serious deficiencies in this admin, the worst of which (IMO) conservatives can't bring themselves to admit is even a problem. Conservatives would rather spend their time talking about subjective vagaries like "transparency", birtherism, creeping socialism, death panels, paling around with terrorists, and such blather. So there's little room for anything to talk about in criticism.
Can you admit the deficiencies?

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#159623
Feb 27, 2013
 
lisw wrote:
<quoted text>BB, without his ideology, Willie would not be able to support this president. Have you noticed that he does not attempt to defend Obama? He merely attacks is detractors. Seems to me there was a similar occurence about 1861. Remember Willie?
It has sometimes occurred to me that the rage at President Obama is similar to that expressed toward Lincoln in 1861, but somehow I don't think that's what you're talking about.

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#159624
Feb 27, 2013
 
lisw wrote:
<quoted text>Can you admit the deficiencies?
uhhh, yeah, that's kinda why I got bored. As the Prophet Simon said, "Still a man hears what he wants to hear / And disregards the rest."

Your biggest slam, or most consistent slam anyway, is this ""transparency" thing. Could there be anything more subjective? Other people prattle on about similar vagaries. So, I say so, because that's what's being posted, yaknow, and there ya go, I'm "defending Obama". I'm "in the tank", and all like that. Any possible conversation is rendered moot. People don't want to talk about substantial deficiencies, they just want to glower and grumble about "low-information voters" and whatnot. So, yeah, I think it's fair to say the grapes are still out of season.

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#159625
Feb 27, 2013
 
lisw wrote:
<quoted text>I suppose it's beyond your scope of understanding to think that people aren't sore losers for that long. It is beyond you to look at how strange the actions of this president are. Example would be charging people for meetings with him. Another is his swearing he'd have transparency and he is so opaque. I suppose it will take a history book ten years from now to see any truth about this president. In the present you are absolutely myopic. I can accept that, but you need to realize that people's criticism of Barack Obama is out of real concern. Romney (and it took a few seconds to remember his name) is not even a blip on "my" radar screen.
Beyond the scope of my understanding, huh?

Gimme a break. Myopic is not a synonym for 'disagree', lisw.

I think it's interesting that you undertake this crusade over the 'low information voter' comment, which is pretty much the kind of brain dead nonsense I've been 'attacking' since this thread started no matter who puts it out there. If you'll recall, I was less than warm and fuzzy to the morons who came in here babbling on about evangelicals or barfing up generalizations that labeled all conservatives as neo-cons, screaming about how Bush was going to end America.

A lot of those people - ETC and Prof. Veritas come to mind - had concerns about President Bush of the same quality as most of the concerns about President Obama I read expressed here. That's my assessment of their validity.

Those concerns HAVE NO VALIDITY. They are no more valid today than they were 8 years ago, when the people thrashing around looking for an excuse for their defeat were over here on my side of the aisle.

You lost the stinking election. The bad guy won in spite of your best efforts. You could not sell your ideas to a majority of the American people. Accept it and move on - or be a loser and claim that it must be because the opposition is less than.

“Mean People Suck”

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#159627
Feb 27, 2013
 
bad bob wrote:
<quoted text>
There is NO desperation about it. Without the young people who don't follow politics and couldn't name pictures of the vice president, house speaker, and many more, and without the minority vote, also low info voters, Obama goes back to Chicago.
And I know for certain both you and HipGnosis are well aware of this block of voters who got Barry reelected.
You can tell yourself what I'm aware of as long, as loud, and as often as makes you feel better, bobby - but I'm telling you straight up if you think there were more 'low information voters' for Obama than Romney, I think you're dead wrong.

As far as the assumption that minority voters are low information ... that's just sad.
lisw

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#159628
Feb 27, 2013
 
HipGnosis wrote:
<quoted text>uhhh, yeah, that's kinda why I got bored. As the Prophet Simon said, "Still a man hears what he wants to hear / And disregards the rest."
Your biggest slam, or most consistent slam anyway, is this ""transparency" thing. Could there be anything more subjective? Other people prattle on about similar vagaries. So, I say so, because that's what's being posted, yaknow, and there ya go, I'm "defending Obama". I'm "in the tank", and all like that. Any possible conversation is rendered moot. People don't want to talk about substantial deficiencies, they just want to glower and grumble about "low-information voters" and whatnot. So, yeah, I think it's fair to say the grapes are still out of season.
Hip there is nothing vague at all about this transparency thing. it is extremely clear that Obama has not been transparent about many things, Benghazi, his health care bill, and more recently sequestration. he has been aided by the media in his double talk, I admit, but there is proof that he was the one for sequestration and now he is crying wolf.
lisw

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#159629
Feb 27, 2013
 
WildWeirdWillie wrote:
<quoted text>Beyond the scope of my understanding, huh?
Gimme a break. Myopic is not a synonym for 'disagree', lisw.
I think it's interesting that you undertake this crusade over the 'low information voter' comment, which is pretty much the kind of brain dead nonsense I've been 'attacking' since this thread started no matter who puts it out there. If you'll recall, I was less than warm and fuzzy to the morons who came in here babbling on about evangelicals or barfing up generalizations that labeled all conservatives as neo-cons, screaming about how Bush was going to end America.
A lot of those people - ETC and Prof. Veritas come to mind - had concerns about President Bush of the same quality as most of the concerns about President Obama I read expressed here. That's my assessment of their validity.
Those concerns HAVE NO VALIDITY. They are no more valid today than they were 8 years ago, when the people thrashing around looking for an excuse for their defeat were over here on my side of the aisle.
You lost the stinking election. The bad guy won in spite of your best efforts. You could not sell your ideas to a majority of the American people. Accept it and move on - or be a loser and claim that it must be because the opposition is less than.
I know what myopic is and I ain't talking disagree. give me a defense of the actions of Barack Obama. Just one, Willie. Forget what you think of me, let's talk Obama.
I find it interesting you term Obama as a "bad guy" Is that what you really think? I wouldn't know because I have heard nothing in his defense from you or Hip or anyone else who supposedly supports him. All I hear is criticism of those who feel he is bad news and a bad guy.

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#159630
Feb 27, 2013
 
lisw wrote:
<quoted text>BB, without his ideology, Willie would not be able to support this president. Have you noticed that he does not attempt to defend Obama? He merely attacks is detractors. Seems to me there was a similar occurence about 1861. Remember Willie?
Lis I'm not too surprised at the manner in which the left backs Obama. It got down to 2 choices. But I am surprised at the way
they give Obama a pass on numerous key issues. The direction we're headed, the stale economy, staggering debt, unemployment, nanny entitlements, AHC, all of which were to be fixed by Barack.

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#159631
Feb 27, 2013
 
lisw wrote:
<quoted text>Hip there is nothing vague at all about this transparency thing. it is extremely clear that Obama has not been transparent about many things, Benghazi, his health care bill, and more recently sequestration. he has been aided by the media in his double talk, I admit, but there is proof that he was the one for sequestration and now he is crying wolf.
Really? He went down to the House and forced Golden John and the other 174 Republicans (and 95 Democrats) to vote it in. Is that it?

You know there is a public record, for ready reference. The intent was a gun to Congress' head, so yes, dang right Obama should be crying foul now that the Republicans have instead used it as just another destabilizing tool for political gain. Boehner in 2011 giddily told 60 Minutes he "got 98% of what I wanted." So, now you're trying to say that sequestration was in the 2% he didn't want? Why didn't he say so, then?

This is what I mean. There's reality, and there's the news that fits. Yup, it does go both ways, no question about that. The real question is, who cares enough to chase as close to the truth as one can stand?

You know what I think about the Benghazi spectacle. Death on parade, grapes mixed with herring for lunch. You did watch the Clinton "hearing", right?'Nuff said....

All of this pales (IMO) in comparison with the most opaque, most egregious, most far-reaching deficiency in this administration, and like I said, conservatives can't even admit it's a problem, much less whether something ought to be done. And that's the way it was....

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#159632
Feb 27, 2013
 
lisw wrote:
<quoted text>I know what myopic is and I ain't talking disagree. give me a defense of the actions of Barack Obama. Just one, Willie. Forget what you think of me, let's talk Obama.
I find it interesting you term Obama as a "bad guy" Is that what you really think? I wouldn't know because I have heard nothing in his defense from you or Hip or anyone else who supposedly supports him. All I hear is criticism of those who feel he is bad news and a bad guy.
The bad guy is whoever you didn't want to win the election, lisw - and I kinda thought that would be clear when I wrote it.

What is it that Obama has done or is doing do you want to talk about? We've done health care to death, but there's immigration (I agree with him), gun control (so far I agree), national defense (not so sure), foreign policy (good in some respects, not so good in others), and a host of other things.

I think I've been pretty consistent since this thread started about one thing - Obama ain't nothing but a President, just like the one before him. I was pretty critical of the actions of the one before him, but when people came on just bashing Bush I was pretty damned harsh with them.

Why should I act any differently now? If I skewered the folks who claimed Bush was a bad guy, why should I not equally skewer the folks who are singing the same tune now?

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#159633
Feb 27, 2013
 
WildWeirdWillie wrote:
<quoted text>It has sometimes occurred to me that the rage at President Obama is similar to that expressed toward Lincoln in 1861, but somehow I don't think that's what you're talking about.
Currently reading about the 1st decade of the 19th century. Hairy times for a young republic, and yeah the politicized vitriol does seem tame today in comparison. The closest I can think of might be McCain's "inter-racial bastard child". It's hard-wired into the democratic process, I guess.....
lisw

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#159634
Feb 27, 2013
 

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bad bob wrote:
<quoted text>
Lis I'm not too surprised at the manner in which the left backs Obama. It got down to 2 choices. But I am surprised at the way
they give Obama a pass on numerous key issues. The direction we're headed, the stale economy, staggering debt, unemployment, nanny entitlements, AHC, all of which were to be fixed by Barack.
There is a small percentage of people on the left that hail Obama as a hero. That is NOT Willie. I'd just like to hear his defense of Obama. I'm not hearing "Obama did this and Obama did that" all I'm hearing is "sore loser". It would do my heart good if someone could truly point out something good this man has done.
lisw

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#159635
Feb 27, 2013
 
WildWeirdWillie wrote:
<quoted text>The bad guy is whoever you didn't want to win the election, lisw - and I kinda thought that would be clear when I wrote it.
What is it that Obama has done or is doing do you want to talk about? We've done health care to death, but there's immigration (I agree with him), gun control (so far I agree), national defense (not so sure), foreign policy (good in some respects, not so good in others), and a host of other things.
I think I've been pretty consistent since this thread started about one thing - Obama ain't nothing but a President, just like the one before him. I was pretty critical of the actions of the one before him, but when people came on just bashing Bush I was pretty damned harsh with them.
Why should I act any differently now? If I skewered the folks who claimed Bush was a bad guy, why should I not equally skewer the folks who are singing the same tune now?
Yes we've done health care to death and I could accept it if it weren't for the fact that he totally misrepresented it. You know I tried to read it and failed because it kept changing and as it turns out we know less about it now than we did when it was up for the vote I agree about immigration too but it bothers me how Obama goes about it. Executive orders have no place in immigration reform and he clearly doesn't want an agreement as that would mess up the image that the right is just unreasonable. A bipartisan committee came up with a good plan and he ignored it though most of it is what he says he wants. Guns? I can't believe you really are with him on his handling of this. I'm sorry but I also can't forget that in the primaries you supported Biden. What were you thinking? I know you are proud of your skewering skills but you just said it. You had plenty to say what was wrong with Bush. We had plenty to say what was right. The views on Obama are just as hazy as his administration is.
As for his foreign policy. Do you have any idea what Obama's stance is on Israel? Do you mind sharing what it is if you do?
lisw

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#159636
Feb 27, 2013
 
HipGnosis wrote:
<quoted text>Really? He went down to the House and forced Golden John and the other 174 Republicans (and 95 Democrats) to vote it in. Is that it?
You know there is a public record, for ready reference. The intent was a gun to Congress' head, so yes, dang right Obama should be crying foul now that the Republicans have instead used it as just another destabilizing tool for political gain. Boehner in 2011 giddily told 60 Minutes he "got 98% of what I wanted." So, now you're trying to say that sequestration was in the 2% he didn't want? Why didn't he say so, then?
This is what I mean. There's reality, and there's the news that fits. Yup, it does go both ways, no question about that. The real question is, who cares enough to chase as close to the truth as one can stand?
You know what I think about the Benghazi spectacle. Death on parade, grapes mixed with herring for lunch. You did watch the Clinton "hearing", right?'Nuff said....
All of this pales (IMO) in comparison with the most opaque, most egregious, most far-reaching deficiency in this administration, and like I said, conservatives can't even admit it's a problem, much less whether something ought to be done. And that's the way it was....
If you are going to operate under such pretense, there's nothing I can say. You have been duped.
Benghazi is no spectacle. Hillary was all over the place and anyone who saw that knows it. Tell me where you have seen the logic in reporting that this was due to a video. Why did that happen? If you can i will listen.

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#159638
Feb 27, 2013
 
lisw wrote:
<quoted text>If you are going to operate under such pretense, there's nothing I can say. You have been duped.
Benghazi is no spectacle. Hillary was all over the place and anyone who saw that knows it. Tell me where you have seen the logic in reporting that this was due to a video. Why did that happen? If you can i will listen.
What is there to say to people who want to make a political issue out of the chaos inherent in dealing with those people? Why did Bush insist that Huseein was in league with Al Qaeda? Why did Bush make vague references to a mushroom cloud? When have you demanded that investigation? You're acting all verklempt over four people killed in a riotous attack, and able somehow to rationalize the 30,000 casualties resulting from Bush (& Company)'s erroneous "information" sold over the course of months.

I'm not changing the focus. The question has direct bearing. How much do we hold responsible those trying to make sense out of that flea-bitten region in a crisis situation? How consistent are you in your expectations?

They were asked a reason for the attack. Their initial response, as provided by intelligence, was plausible, because these people are crazy about their icons. They've rioted over freeking cartoons, much less a blatantly inflammatory movie. But intelligence got it wrong. They corrected. The error saved no one, it killed no one. >No one< lib or con, mentions that over 40 personnel were rescued from the chaos. The "investigation" is political flummery.

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#159639
Feb 27, 2013
 
WildWeirdWillie wrote:
<quoted text>So I'm a low information voter because I won't play your little games?
Of course not, you're a "low information" voter because you only listen to barry's BS. And, sad to say, obama lies to us.

I listen to obama too, but the difference is, you believe him.

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#159640
Feb 27, 2013
 
lisw wrote:
<quoted text>If you are going to operate under such pretense, there's nothing I can say. You have been duped.
I assume this applies to the budget issue. Which fact cited is "pretense"? Which do you dispute?

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