There is Everything Wrong with Abortion
Life is Precious

South Bend, IN

#231976 Feb 21, 2014
mamma-san wrote:
<quoted text>
1. I told you my work hours; look them up. I wasn't posting on company time.
2. I didn't report you when you posted lies about me; I reported you when you said you wanted to bury me like a bone and defecate on me.
3. You have just shown that I was right all along and you were lying about me lying.
4. I haven't talked with Moon since the last time she was in my state. She reads this forum and sees your idiocy. Unlike you, I am capable of responding without having to whine to someone else first.
5. Why are you so obsessed with my sex life? First you accuse me of having sex with dogs, then with a non existent stepfather, now you are thinking about when I orgasm? If you're gay, come out of the closet for pete's sake. It's nothing to be ashamed of. But I'm sorry, I'm heterosexual and even if I were, you are not my type. I'd told you that before, just as I told you then to stop humping my leg.
You are one sick person,get some help.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231977 Feb 21, 2014
Life is Precious wrote:
<quoted text>You are one sick person,get some help.
The above is not an answer to even one of my questions.

I'm not the sick one. Your web of lies has officially caught up with you.

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#231978 Feb 21, 2014
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm pretty sure that the life expectancy of anyone has no bearing on what qualifications they have for being deserving of human rights. Besides, it's only a matter of time before you bring the soul into it as the premise for your entire argument. I have to admit it's kinda cute, but is still probably the most illogical argument I've ever seen on here. I can't prove or disprove when the soul might enter the body, therefore I can't make my own argument concerning it. I choose to stick only with known facts and pure logic.
But you are not being logical. If you were, you would be agreeing with me. One does not need to be able to prove the time of the soul's entry into the corporeal shell to see that IF such a thing as a "soul" exists, then it makes absolutely no sense to think that it enters when the likelihood of survival to live birth is so small.

And without the distinction of the soul, then the disposal of a small wad of goo is even less of a problem. Remember: ALL pregnancies carry some degree of risk for the woman, not to mention the fact that a nontrivial percentage of children are born with various handicaps, some of them quite severe. As the father of a special needs child, I know that it is NOT something that every person is capable of dealing with.

Indeed, going back to that postulated soul, it could logically be said that forcing a severely handicapped fetus to carry to term, the soul is trapped in a body that denies it the fullest potential for development. That is unbelievably cruel.
goodwife

San Antonio, TX

#231979 Feb 21, 2014
Life s Precious wrote:
<quoted text>You are so predictable it's really pathetic. You really get off on when I post don't you?
Of course probably the only time you get off. LOL.
You know you reported me years ago when I put your lies out there.
This haunts you doesn't it?
You are obsessed with this.
Get a fuc*ing life.
Now go feed your fat a$$ and go to work and remember do NOT steal your bosses time or money.
Now go talk to your little friend so she can respond, you sorry piece of sh*t.
Bye Bye
This is how you respond to people and then in other posts you claim to be a Christian. WWJD? Think about it.
Life is Precious

South Bend, IN

#231980 Feb 24, 2014
mamma-san wrote:
<quoted text>
The above is not an answer to even one of my questions.
I'm not the sick one. Your web of lies has officially caught up with you.
Karma is a bi*tch and you will get yours.
You have lied since day one and you know it.
You know what you did and more importantly God knows.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231981 Feb 24, 2014
Life is Precious wrote:
<quoted text>Karma is a bi*tch and you will get yours.
You have lied since day one and you know it.
You know what you did and more importantly God knows.
Nope. Still doesn't work. You keep accusing me of lying, but refuse to say what I lied about. It's all on you.

And there is no god. What's more important, is that you KNOW there's no god. You just like to throw that out there to make yourself seem like you might be a decent person. But we all know better.
Life is Precious

South Bend, IN

#231982 Feb 25, 2014
mamma-san wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope. Still doesn't work. You keep accusing me of lying, but refuse to say what I lied about. It's all on you.
And there is no god. What's more important, is that you KNOW there's no god. You just like to throw that out there to make yourself seem like you might be a decent person. But we all know better.
And we all know you aren't. You are the lowest if for no other reason because you murdered your child.
You are a selfish b*tch who would rather feed her fat face than give a child a chance at life.
You disgust me you ignorant piece fo sh*t.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231983 Feb 25, 2014
Life is Precious wrote:
<quoted text>And we all know you aren't. You are the lowest if for no other reason because you murdered your child.
You are a selfish b*tch who would rather feed her fat face than give a child a chance at life.
You disgust me you ignorant piece fo sh*t.
Nope. Still doesn't work. You keep accusing me of lying, but refuse to say what I lied about. It's all on you.

And there is no god. What's more important, is that you KNOW there's no god. You just like to throw that out there to make yourself seem like you might be a decent person. But we all know better.

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

#231985 Feb 25, 2014
Life is Precious wrote:
<quoted text>And we all know you aren't. You are the lowest if for no other reason because you murdered your child.
You are a selfish b*tch who would rather feed her fat face than give a child a chance at life.
You disgust me you ignorant piece fo sh*t.
Exactly.

That "fetus" is not turning into a table at the end of nine months, and you are ending its life. You can mince words and get the gold medal at a mental gymnastics event, but at the end of the day its still a dead baby.

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#231986 Feb 25, 2014
Grunt56 wrote:
<quoted text>
Exactly.
That "fetus" is not turning into a table at the end of nine months, and you are ending its life. You can mince words and get the gold medal at a mental gymnastics event, but at the end of the day its still a dead baby.
Wrong. It would have to be a LIVE BABY before it could be a dead baby. It isn't.
It is a parasitic, insensate, wad of goo, and nobody's business but the woman whose body it is in. WAD OF GOO, there are NO babies involved.
Don't like abortion? Don't have one. It is just that easy.
goodwife

San Antonio, TX

#231987 Feb 25, 2014
same stuff, different day.......I would have thought that people on this thread would have grown tired of saying the same thing over and over and over and..........yawn

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

#231988 Feb 25, 2014
NWmoon wrote:
<quoted text>Wrong. It would have to be a LIVE BABY before it could be a dead baby. It isn't.
It is a parasitic, insensate, wad of goo, and nobody's business but the woman whose body it is in. WAD OF GOO, there are NO babies involved.
Don't like abortion? Don't have one. It is just that easy.
That "fetus" is not turning into a table at the end of nine months, and you are ending its life. You can mince words and get the gold medal at a mental gymnastics event, but at the end of the day its still a dead baby.
Life is Precious

South Bend, IN

#231989 Feb 26, 2014
Grunt56 wrote:
<quoted text>
Exactly.
That "fetus" is not turning into a table at the end of nine months, and you are ending its life. You can mince words and get the gold medal at a mental gymnastics event, but at the end of the day its still a dead baby.
I agree Grunt,that baby has a heartbeat,it's own DNA and depends on it's mother for the next 9 months to grow.
A woman who would end this precious baby's life in the womb is the lowest of the lows.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231990 Feb 26, 2014
Grunt56 wrote:
<quoted text>
That "fetus" is not turning into a table at the end of nine months, and you are ending its life. You can mince words and get the gold medal at a mental gymnastics event, but at the end of the day its still a dead baby.
Seriously? You believe any of the garbage that spews out of LIP's piehole??? Tell of any person in the WORLD who can spend and eat the amount of money it would take to raise a child on food. Please use at least SOME common sense here.

My existing children were more important than the six week gestational fetus I aborted. I had to make a decision as to the direction of my life for the next few years. I made the best decision I could with the facts and data at hand.

You may not agree, but you weren't there and you weren't walking in my shoes.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231991 Feb 26, 2014
Life is Precious wrote:
<quoted text>I agree Grunt,that baby has a heartbeat,it's own DNA and depends on it's mother for the next 9 months to grow.
A woman who would end this precious baby's life in the womb is the lowest of the lows.
Our born children depend on us too. Too bad you weren't emotionally there for your children.I can only wonder at the damage your emotional tantrums had on them.
LightForce

Rockford, MI

#231992 Feb 27, 2014
mamma-san wrote:
<quoted text>
All your opinion. Like an anal orfice, everyone has one and they all stink.
Nothing changes my opinion. The rights of a sentient human being supercede those of a fetus that cannot possibly survive outside her uterus.
That it is a human being makes no difference. The pregnant woman is a human and she is of more value than the contents of her uterus.
Path to Evil:

#1 - Deindividuation
#2 - Anonymity
#3 - Dehumanization
#4 - Social Modeling
#5 - Moral Disengagement
#6 – Emergent Norms
#7 – Power Differentials
#8 – Passivity of Good

Your argument utilizes all eight steps.
LightForce

Rockford, MI

#231993 Feb 27, 2014
Liam R wrote:
<quoted text>
But you are not being logical. If you were, you would be agreeing with me. One does not need to be able to prove the time of the soul's entry into the corporeal shell to see that IF such a thing as a "soul" exists, then it makes absolutely no sense to think that it enters when the likelihood of survival to live birth is so small.
And without the distinction of the soul, then the disposal of a small wad of goo is even less of a problem. Remember: ALL pregnancies carry some degree of risk for the woman, not to mention the fact that a nontrivial percentage of children are born with various handicaps, some of them quite severe. As the father of a special needs child, I know that it is NOT something that every person is capable of dealing with.
Indeed, going back to that postulated soul, it could logically be said that forcing a severely handicapped fetus to carry to term, the soul is trapped in a body that denies it the fullest potential for development. That is unbelievably cruel.
Your comparison of pre and post birth survival rates is relative. What about the times when infant mortality rates were/are very high – do you think the soul in this case waited until the child got a little older to join the body? I don't think so. What I do think is that some people in those cases(past and present) may have used the same excuse that you are using here to justify abortion, to justify infanticide. If you look closely at the varying stages of development, it is apparent that conception is the most distinct point of demarcation, but in your model it would be questionable whether or not the soul would even want to enter the body of any“defective” person at all, if it had the choice.

Of course, most of us don't want anybody to suffer, but your definition of severely handicapped might be different from the person's that you are considering killing. We all suffer at some time in our lives, but we usually don't think that killing ourselves is the better alternative. Usually only when it involves killing somebody else – in this case the prenatal child, does killing become an acceptable alternative for some.

Additionally, why would we even try to change our behavior if we could just mask the evidence of it? Answer -“Cause and effect”. Why does anybody suffer from cancer, so many birth defects, etc.? Maybe it's a sign that something else is wrong. Can we continue to kill the earth and not expect ourselves to die with it? If you don't want a child to cry, then don't steal their piggy bank. But no, instead we want everything fast, easy, and without any responsibilities.

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#231994 Feb 27, 2014
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text>
Path to Evil:
#1 - Deindividuation
#2 - Anonymity
#3 - Dehumanization
#4 - Social Modeling
#5 - Moral Disengagement
#6 – Emergent Norms
#7 – Power Differentials
#8 – Passivity of Good
Your argument utilizes all eight steps.
So does yours. Difference being she is talking about a wad of goo, and you apply it to living breathing women.
Mind your own business. Not YOUR body? Not YOUR uterus? NONE of YOUR business.
Wads of goo are not people, they have no rights, and a MAJORITY of fertilized eggs won't ever come to term regardless.
It is NOT a BABY, it is NOT a person, it is a WAD OF GOO.
That's the truth, and if you don't like it, too bad.
Don't like abortion? Don't have one. Easy.

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#231995 Feb 27, 2014
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text>
Your comparison of pre and post birth survival rates is relative. What about the times when infant mortality rates were/are very high – do you think the soul in this case waited until the child got a little older to join the body? I don't think so. What I do think is that some people in those cases(past and present) may have used the same excuse that you are using here to justify abortion, to justify infanticide. If you look closely at the varying stages of development, it is apparent that conception is the most distinct point of demarcation, but in your model it would be questionable whether or not the soul would even want to enter the body of any“defective” person at all, if it had the choice.
Well, if you look at the Bible as representative of long ago, they did not even name a baby until it was 8 days old. However, I do not believe that the soul waited pasted the time of birth to enter, even if there was a huge risk of dying during the 1st year of live.

No, conception is NOT the most distinct point , not by a long shot. Indeed, that first indrawn breath is the ONLY clearly marked point throughout the entire process. The process of conception takes many hours. In spite of what you may have seen in high school biology videos, it takes a long time for the sperm cell to penetrate the egg, and more time to reach the nucleus, time for the DNAs to split and reform, and time for division to begin.
LightForce wrote:
Of course, most of us don't want anybody to suffer, but your definition of severely handicapped might be different from the person's that you are considering killing. We all suffer at some time in our lives, but we usually don't think that killing ourselves is the better alternative.
Depends on how rational the person is at the time. A rational person would choose to end extreme suffering if there was no other possibility of ending it. However, I was referring more to the parents who would be forced to raise the severely handicapped child. I understand just how difficult that can be, and my son is not severely handicapped, he is actually high functioning.

Just as some people are not able to accept the responsibility of parenthood, some people who might otherwise be good parents just cannot handle the added requirements of raising a child that is severely handicapped.

Of course, even then, I am not advocating the killing of anyone. I merely say that in such cases, abortion MUST be an option for the parents.
LightForce wrote:
Usually only when it involves killing somebody else – in this case the prenatal child, does killing become an acceptable alternative for some.
Additionally, why would we even try to change our behavior if we could just mask the evidence of it? Answer -“Cause and effect”. Why does anybody suffer from cancer, so many birth defects, etc.? Maybe it's a sign that something else is wrong. Can we continue to kill the earth and not expect ourselves to die with it? If you don't want a child to cry, then don't steal their piggy bank. But no, instead we want everything fast, easy, and without any responsibilities.
Ah, now here you say things that I can agree with. We (as a race) have a responsibility to do everything that we can to ensure that this world is in good shape when we hand it over to our children and grandchildren. "No harm unto the seventh generation" was a phrase that I remember seeing somewhere...

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231996 Feb 27, 2014
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text>
Path to Evil:
#1 - Deindividuation
#2 - Anonymity
#3 - Dehumanization
#4 - Social Modeling
#5 - Moral Disengagement
#6 – Emergent Norms
#7 – Power Differentials
#8 – Passivity of Good
Your argument utilizes all eight steps.
"emergent norms?" Really??? LOL...whatever gets you through the day.

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