There is Everything Wrong with Abortion
Life s Precious

South Bend, IN

#231924 Feb 3, 2014
NWmoon wrote:
<quoted text> Why don't you ever finish what you've started?
You claim Mama lies, but won't say what that was about.
Why are you so cowardly? You aren't even woman enough to register an account.
You throw shit around like an ape, but with less grace.
I don't put in here what she said because the last time I did she had me kicked off Topix.. I couldn't care less about registering. This place is not my whole life. idiot,unlike you.
Hardly a coward,just smart enough to know better. Again unlike you.
Now STFU.

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#231925 Feb 3, 2014
Life s Precious wrote:
<quoted text>I don't put in here what she said because the last time I did she had me kicked off Topix.. I couldn't care less about registering. This place is not my whole life. idiot,unlike you.
Hardly a coward,just smart enough to know better. Again unlike you.
Now STFU.
Oh what a pile of crap!!
When did that happen>? NEVER, that's when.
No, you're a coward, a liar and a hypocrite.
You come on here and make vague accusations, false claims and spread lies and misinformation. You are no Christian, you barely qualify as a human being.
Either say what she has lied about, or YOU STFU.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231926 Feb 3, 2014
Life s Precious wrote:
<quoted text>I don't put in here what she said because the last time I did she had me kicked off Topix.. I couldn't care less about registering. This place is not my whole life. idiot,unlike you.
Hardly a coward,just smart enough to know better. Again unlike you.
Now STFU.
Take responsibility for your own actions.

*I* can't get you kicked off Topix. I don't have that power. Someone reported your postings which violated Topix Terms of Service.

It was your filthy language and name calling that got you booted; NOT the context of your post.

Now, stop making excuses and come forth with what I supposedly lied about. Just keep your language clean and don't call names.

And for the record. I'm on my 40 minute lunch break. I have a REAL job and therefore have a lunch break.
Life s Precious

South Bend, IN

#231927 Feb 4, 2014
mamma-san wrote:
<quoted text>
Take responsibility for your own actions.
*I* can't get you kicked off Topix. I don't have that power. Someone reported your postings which violated Topix Terms of Service.
It was your filthy language and name calling that got you booted; NOT the context of your post.
Now, stop making excuses and come forth with what I supposedly lied about. Just keep your language clean and don't call names.
And for the record. I'm on my 40 minute lunch break. I have a REAL job and therefore have a lunch break.
You are a liar. In the There is nothing wrong with abortion room a couple years ago I posted everything you told me on the phone and you reported me.
How about you take responsibility for YOUR actions?
B*tch

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231928 Feb 4, 2014
Life s Precious wrote:
<quoted text>You are a liar. In the There is nothing wrong with abortion room a couple years ago I posted everything you told me on the phone and you reported me.
How about you take responsibility for YOUR actions?
B*tch
Topix wouldn't delete your profile UNLESS you violated Topix Terms of Service. I could report you all day long, but unless you did something to violate the TOS, it wouldn't do any good. YOU should know that from your experience whining about people.

I did not and have not lied about ANYTHING. If I were going to lie, wouldn't it be about having an abortion? I've taken incredible flak for that decision.

Now STOP making flimsy excuses and tell the world what I supposedly lied about.

“IMAGINE no religion!”

Since: Feb 09

usa

#231929 Feb 4, 2014
lilaclady wrote:
If nothing else -- take a look at my profile picture.
is it a pic of the child you abandoned 30+ years ago????

“IMAGINE no religion!”

Since: Feb 09

usa

#231930 Feb 4, 2014
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text>
Nothing personal, but It could it be that your senses have become dulled to the point that killing doesn't bother you anymore. Or you might have developed a scheme of justification in which you are now the “good guy”. Again, nothing personal, but I'm sure that in your delusional mind a pre-born child is seen as no different or better than a piece of plastic, but to most people they are a fellow human being. You are just contributing to more pain and suffering in the world by spreading lies, and I don't know how you can sleep at night.
nothing personal, but you are so indoctrinated to believe pro choicers are the enemy. what you seem to forget is alot of us on this thread, that are PRO choice, are in the medical field. That we have worked Labor and Deliver and have seen 12 week old fetuses when a woman miscarries. So the pics that anti choice sites post are well, fakes! A little education never hurt anyone!

“IMAGINE no religion!”

Since: Feb 09

usa

#231931 Feb 4, 2014
*Delivery
LightForce

Rockford, MI

#231932 Feb 5, 2014
mamma-san wrote:
<quoted text>
You didn't show diddly squat. You shared your OPINIONS. They are not facts.
Depending upon which state you are in, fetuses do NOT have any rights.
And you deliberately ignored the difference between a fetus which is incapable of sustaining life even with extraordinary means versus a human being that can be kept alive with extraordinary means.
THAT makes all the difference in the world. You talk about killing a human taking an afternoon nap. That is murder. Aborting an 9 week fetus that cannot possibly live outside the woman's uterus is NOT murder. No matter how many times you scream it.
There are a lot of inaccuracies and misleading innuendos in your comment.

Since when did a human right become an opinion? It either exists or it does not. And whether it is legal or not does not change that fact.

Your insinuation that a fetus is not a human being, is scientifically and ethically false. Subjective opinions like yours can only hinder the rights of an individual, but can't change what is, and always will be THE TRUTH.

You said:“And you deliberately ignored the difference between a fetus which is incapable of sustaining life even with extraordinary means versus a human being that can be kept alive with extraordinary means.” This is what I mean by excuses, and proven to be an illogical one at that when you are able to so easily unmask the deceptive lie behind it. Example: Obviously a fetus is able to survive by some means, otherwise they would die soon after conception. Adults are often taken off of life support when it is judged that there is no hope of meaningful life left in them, but only at the time when it is deemed the end of their life, not at the beginning when they have the expectation of a long life ahead of them as in the case of a prenatal child. You are only underscoring your own selfish view that human life in general is unimportant.

You are demonstrating a perfect example of the manipulative coercion that's practiced by the pro-death movement in order to deceive the innocent and vulnerable. Excuses instead of truth in order to serve their own selfish desires.

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#231933 Feb 5, 2014
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text>
There are a lot of inaccuracies and misleading innuendos in your comment.
Since when did a human right become an opinion? It either exists or it does not. And whether it is legal or not does not change that fact.
Your insinuation that a fetus is not a human being, is scientifically and ethically false. Subjective opinions like yours can only hinder the rights of an individual, but can't change what is, and always will be THE TRUTH.
You said:“And you deliberately ignored the difference between a fetus which is incapable of sustaining life even with extraordinary means versus a human being that can be kept alive with extraordinary means.” This is what I mean by excuses, and proven to be an illogical one at that when you are able to so easily unmask the deceptive lie behind it. Example: Obviously a fetus is able to survive by some means, otherwise they would die soon after conception. Adults are often taken off of life support when it is judged that there is no hope of meaningful life left in them, but only at the time when it is deemed the end of their life, not at the beginning when they have the expectation of a long life ahead of them as in the case of a prenatal child. You are only underscoring your own selfish view that human life in general is unimportant.
You are demonstrating a perfect example of the manipulative coercion that's practiced by the pro-death movement in order to deceive the innocent and vulnerable. Excuses instead of truth in order to serve their own selfish desires.
Talk about manipulative coercion!! That's all your post is!
Wads of goo are not human beings with rights. THAT is a fact.
The decisions any woman makes about her health are hers, and none of your business,
or anyone else's, save those SHE decides to involve, and her physician.
So, not your uterus? None of your business.
Try not to be the reason for anyone to need to consider the decision.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231934 Feb 6, 2014
Let's take this one point at a time.
Since when did a human right become an opinion? It either exists or it does not. And whether it is legal or not does not change that fact.
The United Nations says humans have rights that they shouldn't starve. Yet, they do. Humans have rights saying they shouldn't be raped or mutilated. Yet, they are.

Show me where it says a fetus less than 16 weeks old has a "right" to anything, in every state. I'll wait.

You are entitled to your own opinions; you are not entitled to your own facts.
Your insinuation that a fetus is not a human being, is scientifically and ethically false. Subjective opinions like yours can only hinder the rights of an individual, but can't change what is, and always will be THE TRUTH.
That is your take on it. I didn't say that, nor did I mean it. I have stated repeatedly that a fetus IS a human being. You are being ethically dishonest in order to attempt to malign me. Sorry, doesn't work.
You said:“And you deliberately ignored the difference between a fetus which is incapable of sustaining life even with extraordinary means versus a human being that can be kept alive with extraordinary means.” This is what I mean by excuses, and proven to be an illogical one at that when you are able to so easily unmask the deceptive lie behind it. Example: Obviously a fetus is able to survive by some means, otherwise they would die soon after conception. Adults are often taken off of life support when it is judged that there is no hope of meaningful life left in them, but only at the time when it is deemed the end of their life, not at the beginning when they have the expectation of a long life ahead of them as in the case of a prenatal child. You are only underscoring your own selfish view that human life in general is unimportant.
Again, your attempt to deliberately misinterpret my words to malign me fails. I do not believe human life to be unimportant.

If you remove a fetus of less than 12 weeks from a woman's uterus, even with extraordinary means, it will die. There is a difference between that less than 12 week fetus and a human being on a respirator. The respirator is keeping that human alive. Even with a respirator, a 12 week fetus cannot live outside that specific woman's uterus.

If I did believe human life to be unimportant, I would be pro-choice...believing that a living, breathing, sentient woman is less important than an 8 week fetus that cannot possibly survive outside her uterus. I believe HER life is more important and that her needs take precedence.

Forcing a woman to remain pregnant and give birth against her will devalues her and all women. It makes women nothing more than brood mares. Each woman is worth far more than her ability to bring life into the world.

By insisting that something the size of a raisin has more importance than that living, breathing, sentient human being, YOU are devaluing life.
You are demonstrating a perfect example of the manipulative coercion that's practiced by the pro-death movement in order to deceive the innocent and vulnerable. Excuses instead of truth in order to serve their own selfish desires.
No one is pro-death. That is an emotionally laden statement hurled to fuel emotions, not careful consideration.

Having a child is a decision to be made with a great deal of careful consideration and forethought; not because a condom broke. It's far more than 9 months of gestation, it's a life long commitment.

Each child deserves to be loved and wanted, not forced into existence because some busybody who will never know or meet them insisted that she knows what is right or wrong for someone else.

Having a child should be a joyful choice, not a punishment or a consequence of being female.
LightForce

Rockford, MI

#231936 Feb 8, 2014
mamma-san wrote:
Let's take this one point at a time.
<quoted text>
The United Nations says humans have rights that they shouldn't starve. Yet, they do. Humans have rights saying they shouldn't be raped or mutilated. Yet, they are.
Show me where it says a fetus less than 16 weeks old has a "right" to anything, in every state. I'll wait.
You are entitled to your own opinions; you are not entitled to your own facts.
EDITED FOR SPACE

This might point out to you some basic flaws in your argument, and help you to put some things in perspective.

You point to arbitrary laws, and authoritative statements as an example to show what one's individual rights are. But that type of right is subject to change from one day to the next. True rights like the right to life does not change. The right to life is a basic right which we all possess, and have the right and responsibility to protect for ourselves and others. Yes, people's rights are denied/abused every minute of the day because of double-standards, and selfish motives, and that's one of my points here. There is a big difference between rights and the violation of rights though. You already had the right to make your stupid choices before you got pregnant. Now there is a child because of that freedom that you had, who now deserves the same right to live that you have. Instead, because of your so-called “mistake”, you would rather selfishly extend your rights to deny the rights of that child to life.

If you believe that a fetus is a human being, then it would be a contradiction/double-standard to deny that human being the right to live under any normal circumstance. So you can only deny a fetus/human being/person the right to live based on your own self-interest, or in other words selfishness. That would be applying your own subjective opinion rather than an objective opinion with equal justice in mind rather than bigotry. Even if one right seems to be more important to you than the other, why can't they both be applied equally to all?

If it serves your purpose, you will use an under twelve-week-old fetus as an example of being unable to survive without it's mother. Of course a child needs it's mother at that early stage of development. Saying that they are unable to survive without their mother is only an excuse, and another example of a selfish motive. Additionally, based on previous statements you've made, we all know that you don't care whether that child is twelve-weeks-old, or even postnatal. You're only concerned about your legal right to terminate/kill that child. I'm not saying that a woman's life is less important than her child's. I'm saying that the child also has a right to live. If we say anything less, we are putting human beings into categories. And that's exactly what you are doing by only being concerned about what you perceive as your own rights, or even women's rights.

Nobody wants to force anybody to have a child, but once that child is conceived it's already there, and killing that child is murder. When we set a precedence that is contradictory to our moral or ethical standards for “those people”, we will also see a slow, steady decline in our standards for other people that will ultimately have a boomerang effect back on “us”. If we want to have our rights, we have to extend those same rights to all people whether or not we might consider them to be in our own “category” of people like us, or if we perceive them to be “real” people. We are all weak and vulnerable in some ways, that others try to use to their advantage over us. The real question is how to avoid this from happening. But you use their weaknesses to gain strength for yourself, their vulnerabilities to gain power over them. Fetus = human being, human being = person.
LightForce

Rockford, MI

#231937 Feb 8, 2014
NWmoon wrote:
<quoted text>Talk about manipulative coercion!! That's all your post is!
Wads of goo are not human beings with rights. THAT is a fact.
The decisions any woman makes about her health are hers, and none of your business,
or anyone else's, save those SHE decides to involve, and her physician.
So, not your uterus? None of your business.
Try not to be the reason for anyone to need to consider the decision.
Human beings are not wads of goo.“P”eriod.

You're trying to equate your own illogical fantasizm with actual facts. By calling them “wads of goo” you are misrepresenting a whole group of human beings/people simply to suit your own selfish desires. Don't you think it's a little odd that your arguments apply exclusively to the rights of women only, while putting another group of human beings in a whole separate category as being “unimportant”, or non-human?

It's always possible to find some positive aspect in any otherwise totally degenerate thought or behavior. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. But you only need to uncover the contradictions and double-standards in your arguments to find the real motives behind them that resolve in unequal justice instead of equality.

Nobody wants to force anybody to have a child, but once that child is conceived it's already there, and killing that child is murder. Denial of this to yourself and to others about it is not the answer, and only compounds the problem.

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#231938 Feb 8, 2014
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text>
Human beings are not wads of goo.“P”eriod.
You're trying to equate your own illogical fantasizm with actual facts. By calling them “wads of goo” you are misrepresenting a whole group of human beings/people simply to suit your own selfish desires. Don't you think it's a little odd that your arguments apply exclusively to the rights of women only, while putting another group of human beings in a whole separate category as being “unimportant”, or non-human?
It's always possible to find some positive aspect in any otherwise totally degenerate thought or behavior. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. But you only need to uncover the contradictions and double-standards in your arguments to find the real motives behind them that resolve in unequal justice instead of equality.
Nobody wants to force anybody to have a child, but once that child is conceived it's already there, and killing that child is murder. Denial of this to yourself and to others about it is not the answer, and only compounds the problem.
Wads of goo are not human beings WITH RIGHTS. They are human, but not beings yet, no rights no thoughts, no awareness.
If what you imagine were true, then the last conception in my body was an evil and murderous person intent on killing me and leaving my sons motherless.
There is no person there during the period of time an elective abortion takes place. NOTHING you've posted proves otherwise.
Not your uterus? None of your business. That's really all there is to it.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231939 Feb 10, 2014
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text> EDITED FOR SPACE
Fetus = human being, human being = person.
You are very articulate. Wordy as all get out, but articulate. However, the above is all YOUR OPINION. You are absolutely entitled to have an opinion on this subject. You are absolutely entitled to have your beliefs.

Other people are not required to adhere to your opinions or beliefs. I will never change my opinion on Choice. A woman, when pregnant has THREE choices.

1. To have the child and raise it
2. To have the child and give it up for adoption
3. To have an abortion

I don't disagree that a fetus has human DNA. Is it a person? Maybe.

But it makes no difference whether it is or isn't.

The bottom line is that no woman can be or should be forced to remain pregnant and to give birth against her will. Because she is existing and has a will, she is allowed to determine whether or not she wishes to continue the pregnancy. You may not agree with her decision. But it's not yours to agree or disagree with. Nor is it mine. It's hers and hers alone.
Life s Precious

South Bend, IN

#231940 Feb 10, 2014
NWmoon wrote:
<quoted text>Wads of goo are not human beings WITH RIGHTS. They are human, but not beings yet, no rights no thoughts, no awareness.
If what you imagine were true, then the last conception in my body was an evil and murderous person intent on killing me and leaving my sons motherless.
There is no person there during the period of time an elective abortion takes place. NOTHING you've posted proves otherwise.
Not your uterus? None of your business. That's really all there is to it.
No that is not all there is to it.
Once in a womans body that unborn human has a right to be born and the mother to be should take care of that little unborn baby.
To do otherwise and kill that baby in he womb is so selfish and murder.
The fact that you think this is okay makes you a very sick and a disturbed human being.
You had a tubal pregnancy,there is no way medically that unborn baby would have lived,and I understand that.
But we are talking about women who have abortions out of convenience.
This is wrong and selfish.
There are so many places that will help women in pregnancy and life changes everyday. Mammasans a perfect example of this. She killed her unborn out of selfishness but then years later had the money to adopt a child.
Like I said life changes everyday.
There are way too many women who do this.
We as prolifers not only care about the woman who is pregnant but also the baby,many of us have helped women during a pregnancy and after.
All you prodeathers care about is the woman and when you say you are prochoice,that only means you are in favor of the woman to have the choice to kill her unborn baby.
That's really all there is to it!!
Life s Precious

South Bend, IN

#231941 Feb 10, 2014
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text> EDITED FOR SPACE
This might point out to you some basic flaws in your argument, and help you to put some things in perspective.
You point to arbitrary laws, and authoritative statements as an example to show what one's individual rights are. But that type of right is subject to change from one day to the next. True rights like the right to life does not change. The right to life is a basic right which we all possess, and have the right and responsibility to protect for ourselves and others. Yes, people's rights are denied/abused every minute of the day because of double-standards, and selfish motives, and that's one of my points here. There is a big difference between rights and the violation of rights though. You already had the right to make your stupid choices before you got pregnant. Now there is a child because of that freedom that you had, who now deserves the same right to live that you have. Instead, because of your so-called “mistake”, you would rather selfishly extend your rights to deny the rights of that child to life.
If you believe that a fetus is a human being, then it would be a contradiction/double-standard to deny that human being the right to live under any normal circumstance. So you can only deny a fetus/human being/person the right to live based on your own self-interest, or in other words selfishness. That would be applying your own subjective opinion rather than an objective opinion with equal justice in mind rather than bigotry. Even if one right seems to be more important to you than the other, why can't they both be applied equally to all?
If it serves your purpose, you will use an under twelve-week-old fetus as an example of being unable to survive without it's mother. Of course a child needs it's mother at that early stage of development. Saying that they are unable to survive without their mother is only an excuse, and another example of a selfish motive. Additionally, based on previous statements you've made, we all know that you don't care whether that child is twelve-weeks-old, or even postnatal. You're only concerned about your legal right to terminate/kill that child. I'm not saying that a woman's life is less important than her child's. I'm saying that the child also has a right to live. If we say anything less, we are putting human beings into categories. And that's exactly what you are doing by only being concerned about what you perceive as your own rights, or even women's rights.
Nobody wants to force anybody to have a child, but once that child is conceived it's already there, and killing that child is murder. When we set a precedence that is contradictory to our moral or ethical standards for “those people”, we will also see a slow, steady decline in our standards for other people that will ultimately have a boomerang effect back on “us”. If we want to have our rights, we have to extend those same rights to all people whether or not we might consider them to be in our own “category” of people like us, or if we perceive them to be “real” people. We are all weak and vulnerable in some ways, that others try to use to their advantage over us. The real question is how to avoid this from happening. But you use their weaknesses to gain strength for yourself, their vulnerabilities to gain power over them. Fetus = human being, human being = person.
GREAT POST!!!!!
Thank you
APPLAUSE!!!

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231942 Feb 10, 2014
Life s Precious wrote:
<quoted text>No that is not all there is to it.
Once in a womans body that unborn human has a right to be born and the mother to be should take care of that little unborn baby.
To do otherwise and kill that baby in he womb is so selfish and murder.
The fact that you think this is okay makes you a very sick and a disturbed human being.
You had a tubal pregnancy,there is no way medically that unborn baby would have lived,and I understand that.
But we are talking about women who have abortions out of convenience.
This is wrong and selfish.
There are so many places that will help women in pregnancy and life changes everyday. Mammasans a perfect example of this. She killed her unborn out of selfishness but then years later had the money to adopt a child.
Like I said life changes everyday.
There are way too many women who do this.
We as prolifers not only care about the woman who is pregnant but also the baby,many of us have helped women during a pregnancy and after.
All you prodeathers care about is the woman and when you say you are prochoice,that only means you are in favor of the woman to have the choice to kill her unborn baby.
That's really all there is to it!!
You are the only idiot in the world who would call a woman wanting to be the best mother she can be "selfish." You're also the only idiot in the world who can't comprehend the cost of adopting a 16 year old daughter (sixteen years after having an abortion) is minimal. I so wish it hurt to be stupid; you'd be writing in agony.

Tell us LIPpy, was it "convenient" to try to commit suicide and leave your sons without a mother? Was it "convenient" to allow them to see you abused? Was it "convenient" to make every death in your family about YOU? That's why you failed in your suicide attempts. Then you wouldn't be there to make everything about YOU.

Still waiting to hear what I "lied" about.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231943 Feb 10, 2014
er...writhing in agony

Since: Mar 11

The Patch, Australia

#231944 Feb 10, 2014
Australia has 80 -100,000 abortions every year. Yes this is far too many when we have contraception that actually works. What would we do with all these unwanted pregnancies if we didn't have abortion rights. Would they be loved when they weren't wanted? How about we give these babies to the Father's how many of them would want that? I know people that have had 3 and 5 abortions, this is using abortion as a contraception; hasn't anyone heard of the morning after pill?
The teenagers I know don't even know they have a cycle, have know idea. We are still sending them out into the world with no knowledge. We can only get pregnant a few days a month. Maybe we should plan things a bit better.

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