There is Everything Wrong with Abortion

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#231489 Nov 18, 2013
That Geek 5410 wrote:
Maybe it's a guy thing (as in I'm not a woman so I'll never understand it) or maybe it's a legal issue I'm not aware of but why would she not be able to place the child for adoption. Forgive my ignorance here but I really don't understand the scenario you're presenting.
<quoted text>
Oh yeah, I forgot the legal angle. In many states (if not all) BOTH parents must sign off on adoption. Another reason it cannot be a gender thing, because MANY women who wanted to give up a child for adoption have found themselves blocked by the man that got them pregnant. So really, perhaps you should make more of an effort to empathize with the situation, since you obviously don't get the "can't give it up" and it's NOT just the mothers who feel that way.
That Geek 5410

Fairmont, WV

#231490 Nov 18, 2013
NWmoon wrote:
<quoted text>Oh yeah, I forgot the legal angle. In many states (if not all) BOTH parents must sign off on adoption. Another reason it cannot be a gender thing, because MANY women who wanted to give up a child for adoption have found themselves blocked by the man that got them pregnant. So really, perhaps you should make more of an effort to empathize with the situation, since you obviously don't get the "can't give it up" and it's NOT just the mothers who feel that way.
In that scenario couldn't the mother make use of the safe haven laws of the given state?
That Geek 5410

Fairmont, WV

#231491 Nov 18, 2013
I don't believe it's foolish or wrong sir. The 4th amendment is a shall not clause governing the states interaction with the citizen in that it protects them from unreasonable searches and seizures. Now if some state or the federal government tried to pass a law mandating an abortion then it very well become a 4th amendment issue (as well as other civil liberties) however this does not appear to be one if those cases.
Liam R wrote:
Apparently, I need to repeat myself...
<quoted text>
What a foolsih and wrong thing to say.
Behold the right to privacy:
Amendment IV
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
"Secure in their persons..."
What a foolsih and wrong thing to say.
Behold the right to privacy:
Amendment IV
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
"Secure in their persons..."
What a foolsih and wrong thing to say.
Behold the right to privacy:
Amendment IV
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
"Secure in their persons..."
What a foolsih and wrong thing to say.
Behold the right to privacy:
Amendment IV
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
"Secure in their persons..."
Catch it that time?

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#231492 Nov 18, 2013
That Geek 5410 wrote:
<quoted text>
In that scenario couldn't the mother make use of the safe haven laws of the given state?
Only if she could be absolutely sure that the male wouldn't seek out and make a claim on the baby. You really haven't thought this through, have you? Those of us who have faced this problem DO THINK IT THROUGH. All of the possibilities and problems.
Some choose to attempt to bring the pregnancy to term. Of those, some succeed, some do not.
Of those that do, some choose to relinquish the child, as my mother did.
Some choose to keep and raise the child, as I did.
Some choose to terminate the pregnancy, as many do. When they do, it's THEIR choice, and THEIR decision, and nobody's business if they do.
Then there are those who find themselves pregnant, or plan a pregnancy, only to be told by their doctor that to continue the pregnancy could kill them, or that it WILL kill them, or that they will deliver a dead body or one that cannot survive or live any sort of normal life off of mechanical support.
They don't really have a choice.
Or those who tell the man they're pregnant, and the man takes the choice away by either beating them until they're not pregnant, or they're dead. Murder is a leading cause of death for pregnant women.

“Ignorance is bliss.”

Since: May 11

Pickerington, OH

#231493 Nov 18, 2013
lilaclady wrote:
We as people/humans do not have the right to make that decision.
We are owned by God and we should obey him.
If not, we get a good whipping when we meet him in heaven.
If of course you don't believe in him --- You too will meet him one day but your whipping will be a bit more intense and lasting through eternity.
How long is eternity you ask? It never ends.
I don't have to see him, I know he's there. Faith! That's all I need.
<quoted text>
Lawd, the crazy never stops with you.

“Ignorance is bliss.”

Since: May 11

Pickerington, OH

#231494 Nov 18, 2013
Life s Precious wrote:
<quoted text>You may have never aborted a child but the fact that you support it is just as bad,IDIOT!
And no I do not want them to do what I want,all I want is for them to be educated on the long term effects of killing their baby in the womb.It's a trickle down affect that involves their whole family and friends. I will NEVER mind my own business when it comes to the life of an unborn baby.
Since you're apparently so omniscient about the effects of all abortions, please tell me about the long-term effects of having an abortion. Please also tell me how a woman having an abortion, perhaps an abortion she tells no one else about, has an effect on the entire family.

“Ignorance is bliss.”

Since: May 11

Pickerington, OH

#231495 Nov 18, 2013
Life s Precious wrote:
<quoted text>Sorry but you are wrong This leads me to believe you have killed a life in the womb. That's what you prodeathers do best. In order to ease your guilt you call it a "wad of goo". You disgust me.Talk about ignorance. You take he cake on that one sweetie.
It seems to me that you are more outraged by a woman's choice to end her pregnancy than you are about child abuse, child rape, child pornography, child neglect, etc. How much effort and faux passion do you put into these tragedies?
That Geek 5410

Fairmont, WV

#231496 Nov 18, 2013
I would imagine if the boy (real men don't treat their significant others like that) is that violent then the woman in question should be seeking government assistance such as domestic violence shelters and probably seek a emergency protective restraining order. The pregnancy isn't the issue there it's the boy that needs to grow up or get out.
NWmoon wrote:
<quoted text>Only if she could be absolutely sure that the male wouldn't seek out and make a claim on the baby. You really haven't thought this through, have you? Those of us who have faced this problem DO THINK IT THROUGH. All of the possibilities and problems.
Some choose to attempt to bring the pregnancy to term. Of those, some succeed, some do not.
Of those that do, some choose to relinquish the child, as my mother did.
Some choose to keep and raise the child, as I did.
Some choose to terminate the pregnancy, as many do. When they do, it's THEIR choice, and THEIR decision, and nobody's business if they do.
Then there are those who find themselves pregnant, or plan a pregnancy, only to be told by their doctor that to continue the pregnancy could kill them, or that it WILL kill them, or that they will deliver a dead body or one that cannot survive or live any sort of normal life off of mechanical support.
They don't really have a choice.
Or those who tell the man they're pregnant, and the man takes the choice away by either beating them until they're not pregnant, or they're dead. Murder is a leading cause of death for pregnant women.
That Geek 5410

Saint Albans, WV

#231497 Nov 18, 2013
I got curious on the statement you made about murder being the leading cause of death for pregnant women. After looking at statistics from the CDC it appears they came to a different conclusion:

http://www.cdc.gov/reproductivehealth/materna...

http://www.cdc.gov/reproductivehealth/violenc...

I'll admit they use some older statistics however I haven't been able to find anything to the level you alluded to. CDC is giving a rate of 1.7 per 100,000 or 0.00017%
NWmoon wrote:
<quoted text>Only if she could be absolutely sure that the male wouldn't seek out and make a claim on the baby. You really haven't thought this through, have you? Those of us who have faced this problem DO THINK IT THROUGH. All of the possibilities and problems.
Some choose to attempt to bring the pregnancy to term. Of those, some succeed, some do not.
Of those that do, some choose to relinquish the child, as my mother did.
Some choose to keep and raise the child, as I did.
Some choose to terminate the pregnancy, as many do. When they do, it's THEIR choice, and THEIR decision, and nobody's business if they do.
Then there are those who find themselves pregnant, or plan a pregnancy, only to be told by their doctor that to continue the pregnancy could kill them, or that it WILL kill them, or that they will deliver a dead body or one that cannot survive or live any sort of normal life off of mechanical support.
They don't really have a choice.
Or those who tell the man they're pregnant, and the man takes the choice away by either beating them until they're not pregnant, or they're dead. Murder is a leading cause of death for pregnant women.

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#231498 Nov 18, 2013
That Geek 5410 wrote:
I would imagine if the boy (real men don't treat their significant others like that) is that violent then the woman in question should be seeking government assistance such as domestic violence shelters and probably seek a emergency protective restraining order. The pregnancy isn't the issue there it's the boy that needs to grow up or get out.
<quoted text>
Of course real men don't do that.
Real men don't interfere in a woman's choice at all.
Not your body, not your pregnancy, not your business.
How would you feel if there were laws regulating YOUR reproductive rights? Hmm? Forced sterilization after you've turned 15 and make a deposit in the sperm bank? Not allowed to make use of it unless you qualify? Terms of qualification to be determined by a group of women only.
Sound good to you? No? Then butt out of OUR rights.

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#231499 Nov 18, 2013
That Geek 5410 wrote:
I got curious on the statement you made about murder being the leading cause of death for pregnant women.
<quoted text>
Reading comprehension fail on your part. I did not say 'the', I said a.
I got it from experience and the training I had when working in a domestic abuse shelter.
A woman is more likely to be murdered when she is pregnant than any other time.
Perhaps the stats have changed since then, but I doubt it could be by much.
Oh, and restraining orders? Too often not worth the paper they're printed on. Respect for the law is often even less than they have for women.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231500 Nov 19, 2013
That Geek 5410 wrote:
Maybe it's a guy thing (as in I'm not a woman so I'll never understand it) or maybe it's a legal issue I'm not aware of but why would she not be able to place the child for adoption. Forgive my ignorance here but I really don't understand the scenario you're presenting.
<quoted text>
When you carry a child in your body for 9 months, you bond with it, more deeply than you can possibly understand. It's a part of you. Giving that child away for adoption is like severing a limb, only worse. That limb doesn't isn't living and you don't worry if it's hungry, cold, being loved, or being appropriately taken care of.

Hormones play a BIG part in this. Every instinct in your body is screaming to hold on to that baby, to nurse it, love it, and keep it safe.

That said, these hormones generally don't kick in 'til maybe 5-6 months.

For many women, it's far easier to have an abortion and end the pregnancy BEFORE those hormones begin and before you fall irretrievably in love with that child.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#231501 Nov 19, 2013
That Geek 5410 wrote:
I would imagine if the boy (real men don't treat their significant others like that) is that violent then the woman in question should be seeking government assistance such as domestic violence shelters and probably seek a emergency protective restraining order. The pregnancy isn't the issue there it's the boy that needs to grow up or get out.
<quoted text>
I have two words for you:

Scott Peterson

Domestic Violence Shelters only protect for a limited period of time and never have enough funding to last long enough or for enough women.

Restraining orders are only as good as the paper they're written on. THOUSANDS of women are killed each year by the men they have a restraining order against.

Now let's add a helpless infant into the equation. She's not only protecting herself, she's got an infant to take care of and to worry about, and he has another tool with which to torture her.

Have you seen the stories of children stolen by their biological fathers?

I agree that the men need to grow up; but do you really want someone who would physically hurt a woman raising an innocent child?

You see, that's what's lost in this entire argument - the continued well-being of the child. It's not just a 9 month gig. A woman is a mother for life. They can be in their 30s and 40s and mom still worries about them, and still mothers them, but in a different way.

When you have a child, you don't get a day off. You can be deathly sick with a cold, and now you have to weight going to work to get paid or staying home to get well, but going without the pay. Same scenario with the child. Let's add in a minimum wage job with no benefits. And having to take public transportation everywhere you go. Ever had to take a puking baby on a bus? I have.

It's so incredibly complex, that there's not enough room to discuss even a tenth of the scenarios.

Bottom line. If you cannot be the mother that child deserves (financially, physically, emotionally, mentally) and know you cannot give the child up for adoption, an abortion is a responsible, loving choice.
That Geek 5410

Saint Albans, WV

#231502 Nov 19, 2013
I truely believe there is always going to be a better way. I guess we'll agree to disagree.
mamma-san wrote:
<quoted text>
I have two words for you:
Scott Peterson
Domestic Violence Shelters only protect for a limited period of time and never have enough funding to last long enough or for enough women.
Restraining orders are only as good as the paper they're written on. THOUSANDS of women are killed each year by the men they have a restraining order against.
Now let's add a helpless infant into the equation. She's not only protecting herself, she's got an infant to take care of and to worry about, and he has another tool with which to torture her.
Have you seen the stories of children stolen by their biological fathers?
I agree that the men need to grow up; but do you really want someone who would physically hurt a woman raising an innocent child?
You see, that's what's lost in this entire argument - the continued well-being of the child. It's not just a 9 month gig. A woman is a mother for life. They can be in their 30s and 40s and mom still worries about them, and still mothers them, but in a different way.
When you have a child, you don't get a day off. You can be deathly sick with a cold, and now you have to weight going to work to get paid or staying home to get well, but going without the pay. Same scenario with the child. Let's add in a minimum wage job with no benefits. And having to take public transportation everywhere you go. Ever had to take a puking baby on a bus? I have.
It's so incredibly complex, that there's not enough room to discuss even a tenth of the scenarios.
Bottom line. If you cannot be the mother that child deserves (financially, physically, emotionally, mentally) and know you cannot give the child up for adoption, an abortion is a responsible, loving choice.

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#231503 Nov 19, 2013
That Geek 5410 wrote:
I truely believe there is always going to be a better way. I guess we'll agree to disagree.
<quoted text>
Well, you can believe what you please. You are wrong, and regardless, it is NONE of your business. Ever.
That Geek 5410

Saint Albans, WV

#231504 Nov 19, 2013
NWmoon wrote:
<quoted text>Well, you can believe what you please. You are wrong, and regardless, it is NONE of your business. Ever.
As I said before, I'm passive pro life. Meaning if I was a woman I'd never have an abortion and I will never advocate it. If people ask me about my views I'm more than happy to discuss them but that's the extent of it.

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#231505 Nov 19, 2013
That Geek 5410 wrote:
<quoted text>
As I said before, I'm passive pro life. Meaning if I was a woman I'd never have an abortion and I will never advocate it. If people ask me about my views I'm more than happy to discuss them but that's the extent of it.
As I said, your views, your opinions are irrelevant. It isn't your problem, and since you have no uterus, it never will be.
sallygal

Donora, PA

#231506 Nov 19, 2013
youtube.com/watch... …
Ban sex and abortion is cured
That Geek 5410

Bridgeport, WV

#231507 Nov 19, 2013
NWmoon wrote:
<quoted text>As I said, your views, your opinions are irrelevant. It isn't your problem, and since you have no uterus, it never will be.
All views may be irrelevant except to the individual and possibly those with similar interests.

Since: Oct 13

Sweden

#231508 Nov 19, 2013
sallygal wrote:
youtube.com/watch?v=Ygy0eLVMlG g …
Ban sex and abortion is cured
oh?:) NO flame tags on that one. Guess you must have said something right xD

Religion sure is BORING x)

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