There is Everything Wrong with Abortion

“Still not convinced”

Since: Jan 12

Funchal, Portugal

#230069 May 8, 2013
Liam R wrote:
<quoted text>
No, it is an embryo or a fetus. It is not a baby until birth has occurred.
still dont make it right. its barbaric and painful for the unborn.

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#230070 May 8, 2013
Kullid wrote:
<quoted text>
A woman has a right to do with her body what she wishes...
You should have just stopped there.
Kullid wrote:
i don't care. but when she does what she wants to do, and this results in a pregnancy, she had done what she wanted to do with her body. However when she goes for an abortion, she is doing something to someone else's body.
It never stopped being her body.
Kullid wrote:
your 'wad of goo' statement is cold...ice cold. What has the unborn done to deserve death? NOTHING!
Okay, what has it done to "deserve" life?
Kullid wrote:
It is not at fault for any thing including it's on existence, and yet it is expected to pay with it's life, no trial, no jury, and no say in what happens to them.
Mom and dad dont pay with their lives, why should the innocent unborn?
EVERY pregnancy puts the woman at risk for death or permanent injury. The risk is usually not very high, but it is never zero. And that is assuming that the woman has the best prenatal care available.
Kullid wrote:
What dont ppl know in this day and age that unprotected sex in most cases results in a pregnancy?
The religious right is constantly attacking sex-ed for the children that are most in need of such education. And I am talking about REAL sex-ed, that includes FULL information on birth control (INCLUDING both proper use AND risk of failure).
Kullid wrote:
So sexually active ppl should be responsible for their own actions. Responsibility comes with freedom. Everyone has to be responsible for their own actions.
EVERY form of birth control can and does fail. Some, including the forms that are most likely to be used by those that are NOT in a position to properly raise a child, are more likely to fail than others.
Kullid wrote:
Abortions go against the notion of freedom and justice. Freedom to choose for ones self, and justice is when you get what you deserved.
Ah... you might want to go back and look at the real definitions of those words...
Kullid wrote:
<quoted text>
and how does that statement justify an abortion. Because nature may cause a woman to lose a pregnancy whether wanted or not, got nothing to do with one's deliberate action.
Well, if you believe in a God that has any concern for the events of this world, then it clearly shows that that God does not place any value on those wads of goo.
Kullid wrote:
Abortion is a deliberate action to end a life. And most woman aborting in abortion clinics are not the ones in the situation of having to choose between their life and continuing a dangerous pregnancy.
A woman is risking her life by HAVING THE ABORTION.
And if there were fewer lack wits fighting against a woman's right to choose, then most abortion clinics would be properly funded and properly regulated, the same as any other outpatient clinic.
Kullid wrote:
Yes it may be none of my business, but it does not make it right.
Run on sentence. You should have stopped after saying that it is none of your business..
Kullid wrote:
Abortion is not contraception!
<quoted text>
You just changed my mind, I think I'll apply that to the rest of my philosophy and change my opinions about every thing else too......
Slavery " not my slave, not my business".
Murder " not my murder, not my business"
Rape " i didn't get raped, not my business"
Theft "I didn't steal/and nothing was stolen from me, not my business"
Abuse "not me being abused, not my business"
Racism "not be, not my business"
As you can see this type of thinking is anarchy, at it's worst. Basically it says: shut up and let me do what I want, I don't care how it affects anyone else, I just want to do what I want to do. It is narcissistic and evil.
That drivel would be true only if there was anything wrong with abortion. All those other things harm real human beings. Abortion does not.

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#230071 May 8, 2013
Kullid wrote:
<quoted text>
no you support the extermination of life. dont bluff yourself. Having a baby is not the end of the world.
But it CAN be the end of a woman's chances for making a decent life for herself. A teen pregnancy can end a girl's chances to continue school - even just getting a high school diploma can become impossible.
Kullid wrote:
there are life options for a child. most ppl who decide not to abort end up keeping their babies and are better for it.
Good for them. Seriously, for every person that CHOOSES to continue the pregnancy, I wish them all of the best, a successful gestation, an easy delivery, no complications, a healthy baby, and a long and happy life as the parents of this brand new child.
Kullid wrote:
Abortion is dangerous for woman...physically, mentally and psychologically.
No more so than any other outpatient surgical procedure. Any psychological harm is merely the result of brainwashing by the forced birther crowd.
Kullid wrote:
having a baby is not the end of the world. most woman are pressured into abortions and not provided with options.
Bull. Show proof or admit you lied.

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#230072 May 8, 2013
Kullid wrote:
<quoted text>
still dont make it right. its barbaric and painful for the unborn.
Most abortions are performed long before the wad of goo has enough of a neural network to feel "pain".

“Calling Out The Hermits”

Since: Apr 13

At Ricky Dicky land

#230073 May 8, 2013
Mpnf1979 wrote:
<quoted text>
If it mattered what your opinion was on the matter, I'd care, but since it doesn't, I don't.
Yet you replied ya selfish cretin.
Mpnf1979 wrote:
<quoted text> Yes, I'm selfish.
No, ya think?~sarcasm intended~

“Calling Out The Hermits”

Since: Apr 13

At Ricky Dicky land

#230074 May 8, 2013
Liam R wrote:
<quoted text>
Most abortions are performed long before the wad of goo has enough of a neural network to feel "pain".
The only wad of goo present here is encased under your thick skull.
LightForce

Warren, MI

#230075 May 8, 2013
WAS GOSNELL CLINIC JUST TYPICAL, RUN-OF-THE-MILL ABORTION MILL?
Pro-abortion media is ignoring the story while women and children suffer.

The argument of legalizing abortion to protect women from back-alley abortions is a joke. Abortion just moved from the back alley to main street, as women and children are killed and injured over and over again.

A National Review investigation revealed the troubling history of three Florida abortion clinics, located in Miami, Hialeah, and Miramar, that have had several run-ins with the law. After a 2004 tip proved accurate, two owners and two staff members were successfully prosecuted for unlicensed medical practice; and, although there was no conviction, it appears that Sycloria Williams’s baby was born alive and murdered at the Hialeah clinic in 2006. Furthermore, some of the clinics’ doctors have records best described as routine medical violence against women. Yet despite their fraught past, the three clinics remain fully operational today. And they are a critical but often-neglected part of the picture of abortion in America.

It took investigators one week and three separate searches to find the corpse of Sycloria Williams’s infant, which was hidden away in the abortion clinic in Hialeah, Fla. It was a tiny black girl, only 25.5 centimeters from head to toe, born prematurely on July 20. Her body was badly decomposed, discolored and infested with maggots, but the autopsy report and an expert physician’s review both suggested she had drawn breath on her own before she died.

MORE TROUBLING NEWS THAT "PRO-CHOICERS" DON”T WANT YOU TO KNOW: http://www.lifenews.com/2013/05/08/clinic-tha...

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#230076 May 8, 2013
Kullid wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope im not God. Are you that you think you can decide who and when to kill
Idiot. I have never told anyone what decision they should make about a pregnancy. One way or the other.
I personally have attempted to bring every pregnancy to term. Just how does that make me deciding on death for people? Oh, and a foetus is not a person. It's not a baby, it's not a child.

YOU are the one who thinks they know what your imaginary sky daddy wants.
Isn't that much more presumptuous than saying it's not my choice to make?
Control freaks, that's all you anti choicers are, you just want to control and punish others for not doing what you want them to do.
It is NONE of your business unless it is YOUR body that is pregnant, then YOU get to make the choice, and it's nobody's business what choice you make.
Just as it was MY choice to attempt to carry each of my pregnancies to term.

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#230077 May 8, 2013
Kullid wrote:
<quoted text>
no you support the extermination of life. dont bluff yourself. Having a baby is not the end of the world. there are life options for a child. most ppl who decide not to abort end up keeping their babies and are better for it.
Abortion is dangerous for woman...physically, mentally and psychologically. having a baby is not the end of the world. most woman are pressured into abortions and not provided with options.
You are too ignorant of reality.
EVERY pregnancy has the potential to kill or disable the woman.
NO pregnancy is guaranteed to come to term, no matter how much the woman may want that result, no matter how well she cares for herself.
The USA has a HIGH mortality rate for mothers and babies.
Oh, and Casey Anthony was such a good mom, wasn't she? She's not even the worst of them.
Adoption isn't a happily ever after solution either, although some work out well. Far too many who adopt are control freaks like you, who only want a little slave or punching bag. Or who adopt for the wrong reasons, and when the baby doesn't solve their problems they take it out on the child for the rest of their lives.
I'm done with you troll, you're far too ignorant to even debate.
LightForce

Warren, MI

#230078 May 8, 2013
Liam R wrote:
<quoted text>
No matter how hard you pretend, that is NOT the meaning of that verse. PREEMIES DO NO SURVIVE WITHOUT MODERN MEDICAL INTERVENTION. Certainly not preemies that were abruptly aborted as a result of men fighting. Quite lying about this.
<quoted text>
The actual word used was < 'adam > man or mankind.
<quoted text>
No, child comes from the Germanic < cild >.
<quoted text>
Actually, < yalad > has more to do with giving birth, bringing forth...
<quoted text>
< 'ishshah > = woman
< hareh > = pregnant
< yeled > = child, offspring
< yatsa' > = go out
You could at least TRY to get the words correct...
Not that it actually helps you. It is ridiculous to try and claim that a preemie had any chance at all abck then. The verse is acknowledging the fact that pregnancy is uncertain, and that men should be more careful around a pregnant woman, but accidents will happen. Miscarriages happen all the time, before modern medical care they would have been far more common than they are today, and even today, many women have to put up with multiple miscarriages even when they WANT to carry to term.
<quoted text>
And the part that you left out was that that penalty applied IF the woman sought the abortion AGAINST her husband's wishes. It was NOT a law against abortions, it was a law about property management.
In the case where a premature birth resulted in death of the child, then it would also result in death for the killer of the child.

The English of “adam” is “human”. This was simply the result of a lack of basic research on your part. But no harm done.

“Yeled” means “pregnant”, but more than that it means a “woman who is pregnant”.

This whole matter is unclear as to whether the trouble that follows is to the mother, child, or both. Or even if the child’s death is regarded as accidental in this case, which would not have resulted in any punishment at all for that death if God had also allowed it to happen.

I didn’t find any evidence that backs up your statement. But I would add that the woman was often considered property in those days, although the law did not specify any particular person who could bring charges against the woman.

Please take a day or two doing some more research, then come back and let me know what you have found.
LightForce

Warren, MI

#230079 May 8, 2013
Liam R wrote:
<quoted text>
No matter how hard you pretend, that is NOT the meaning of that verse. PREEMIES DO NO SURVIVE WITHOUT MODERN MEDICAL INTERVENTION. Certainly not preemies that were abruptly aborted as a result of men fighting. Quite lying about this.
<quoted text>
The actual word used was < 'adam > man or mankind.
<quoted text>
No, child comes from the Germanic < cild >.
<quoted text>
Actually, < yalad > has more to do with giving birth, bringing forth...
<quoted text>
< 'ishshah > = woman
< hareh > = pregnant
< yeled > = child, offspring
< yatsa' > = go out
You could at least TRY to get the words correct...
Not that it actually helps you. It is ridiculous to try and claim that a preemie had any chance at all abck then. The verse is acknowledging the fact that pregnancy is uncertain, and that men should be more careful around a pregnant woman, but accidents will happen. Miscarriages happen all the time, before modern medical care they would have been far more common than they are today, and even today, many women have to put up with multiple miscarriages even when they WANT to carry to term.
<quoted text>
And the part that you left out was that that penalty applied IF the woman sought the abortion AGAINST her husband's wishes. It was NOT a law against abortions, it was a law about property management.
CORRECTION!

"hareh" mean "pregnant", or "woman being pregnant".
LightForce

Warren, MI

#230080 May 8, 2013
mamma-san wrote:
<quoted text>
What I said has no resemblance whatsoever to what you've stated above.
Drama much?
And what you AREN'T addressing is that child AFTER birth.
Why not?
Or are you only posting on here for your daily drama fix and you really don't give a good goddamn.
So your view is that life is so horrible that me must kill all of those that are unwanted, poor, or less important? Just some of them to keep the population of undesirables down? How about we care about each other at every stage of life? Your views are shades of Nazism.

Next you’re going to tell me that I misinterpreted your comments.
LightForce

Warren, MI

#230081 May 8, 2013
NWmoon wrote:
<quoted text>No, that's not what I'm saying, but you're not interested in facts, just in wanting control over the uteri of women worldwide.
Not going to happen lightfarce. Not your body? Not your uterus? None of your business, at all.
Ahah! So you're a control freak. Hitler also wanted worldwide control.

You're so easy to figure out. First it's a "wad of goo", then it "not my body, not my business". You need a bit more fill in material to at least make it a little harder to find the flaws in your argument.

“I'm here with bells on.”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#230082 May 8, 2013
Kullid wrote:
<quoted text>
cancer cells do not have human DNA. The very structure of the human-cells mutate; their DNA mutates, and in most cases mutates the DNA to such a respect as to deviate from the genetic deviation of the human. It will never become a human being. Therefore they are not human, they are a Cancer...best you get rid of it.
Cancer cells have the same human DNA, as the human in which they grow. It's not the DNA that mutates - it is the proteins which control the function of the cells.

Any cell in a human is a human cell - cancerous or not.

Best you respect that life, and let it do what it will to your body - as you expect women to do with a fertilized ovum.
LightForce

Warren, MI

#230083 May 8, 2013
Sister Kathryn Lust wrote:
<quoted text>Cancer cells have the same human DNA, as the human in which they grow. It's not the DNA that mutates - it is the proteins which control the function of the cells.
Any cell in a human is a human cell - cancerous or not.
Best you respect that life, and let it do what it will to your body - as you expect women to do with a fertilized ovum.
Cancer cells do not, nor will they ever develop into a human being. You're just being stupid on purpose now.

First it's ant rights, now it's cancer rights.

By the way, I'm in no way in favor of impaling or crucifying women who kill their child.

“I'm here with bells on.”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#230084 May 8, 2013
Kullid wrote:
<quoted text>
except we not talking about the legality and illegality of abortion.
Well, we were, until you thought a subject change was in order.
Kullid wrote:
we are talking about the immorality of it...
The morality of abortion is subjective...and the morals of the woman who conceives, is the only morality that matters.
Kullid wrote:
<which we pro life people are trying to get people to understand and be educated on what abortion truly is
Abortion truly is a medical procedure which results in the termination of a medical condition. That said medical condition only naturally occurs in women, is immaterial.
Kullid wrote:
<so that society can grow a conscience
Society already has a conscience - and abortion is legal, because society has deemed abortion the province of the individual woman regarding her pregnancy. You'd love to be able to prove that the majority of people are against the right to choose - but you cannot, because that simply isn't true.
Kullid wrote:
<and become moral.
You mean, adopt YOUR morality. No thanks - it completely conflicts with my own.
Kullid wrote:
<Then those moral people will CALL for Abortion to be made illegal
You've been 'calling' for forty years. You can 'call' for four hundred more. The right to make ones own medical choices, and practice self defense, has already been recognized for both genders.
Kullid wrote:
<Abortion is a moral issue.
I agree - and my moral code dictates that since every pregnancy carries the risk of death, damage to the body, and potentially permanent changes in the body's structure, the disposition of a pregnancy, whether gestation or abortion, should be the responsibility of the woman who conceives it. No other person risks life and health as a result of her pregnancy - obliging her to do so is immoral, in my view, and should not be codified in a free society.

Those who worship the fetus, and think of pregnancy as a 'consequence' of sexual activity, even though it only applies to one of the parties, are, in my view, completely immoral.
LightForce

Warren, MI

#230085 May 8, 2013
Sister Kathryn Lust wrote:
<quoted text> Well, we were, until you thought a subject change was in order.
<quoted text>The morality of abortion is subjective...and the morals of the woman who conceives, is the only morality that matters.
<quoted text>Abortion truly is a medical procedure which results in the termination of a medical condition. That said medical condition only naturally occurs in women, is immaterial.
<quoted text>
Society already has a conscience - and abortion is legal, because society has deemed abortion the province of the individual woman regarding her pregnancy. You'd love to be able to prove that the majority of people are against the right to choose - but you cannot, because that simply isn't true.
<quoted text>You mean, adopt YOUR morality. No thanks - it completely conflicts with my own.
<quoted text>You've been 'calling' for forty years. You can 'call' for four hundred more. The right to make ones own medical choices, and practice self defense, has already been recognized for both genders.
<quoted text>
I agree - and my moral code dictates that since every pregnancy carries the risk of death, damage to the body, and potentially permanent changes in the body's structure, the disposition of a pregnancy, whether gestation or abortion, should be the responsibility of the woman who conceives it. No other person risks life and health as a result of her pregnancy - obliging her to do so is immoral, in my view, and should not be codified in a free society.
Those who worship the fetus, and think of pregnancy as a 'consequence' of sexual activity, even though it only applies to one of the parties, are, in my view, completely immoral.
I’m sorry, but please stop before the ignorance meter goes through the ceiling.

You are confusing the term “opinions” with “morals”. Opinions are subjective, and can be in the self-interest of that individual. While morality is objective, and refers to what is in the best interest of others.

Abortion is in most cases a subjective, selfish action by the parent regardless of whether it may be legal or not.

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#230086 May 8, 2013
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text>
Ahah! So you're a control freak. Hitler also wanted worldwide control.
You're so easy to figure out. First it's a "wad of goo", then it "not my body, not my business". You need a bit more fill in material to at least make it a little harder to find the flaws in your argument.
There are no flaws. You and yours want worldwide control. I want all to have control over themselves, not control them. You were wrong the first day you posted here, long ago, and you're still wrong.

“Ignorance is bliss.”

Since: May 11

Columbus, OH

#230087 May 8, 2013
Kullid wrote:
<quoted text>
and it does not deserve to be disposed of, having its body torn apart so the parents can get off scott free. with freedom comes responsibility. the thing is you ppl wanna choose when to be responsible for you action.
Abortion is bad for foetuses and their mothers
We aren't talking about late-term abortions. Early term abortions take two seconds when the cells are sucked out. I've looked at what has come out. No baby there.

“Ignorance is bliss.”

Since: May 11

Columbus, OH

#230088 May 8, 2013
Kullid wrote:
<quoted text>
no you support the extermination of life. dont bluff yourself. Having a baby is not the end of the world. there are life options for a child. most ppl who decide not to abort end up keeping their babies and are better for it.
Abortion is dangerous for woman...physically, mentally and psychologically. having a baby is not the end of the world. most woman are pressured into abortions and not provided with options.
And a lot of women - and children - are not better for it. Most women who seek abortions know exactly what they want to do about their pregnancies. Of my abortions, I was not physically, mentally or emotionally endangered.

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