Ocean56

AOL

#227643 Mar 14, 2013
MoonLitSnow wrote:
I'd really a women get an abortion, then abuse and neglect a child. Our world is fulled with people who's mother's didn't want them. And not all but A good amount of unwanted children grow up to be maladjusted adults who can't even function in society. Have you seen a child with an attachment disorder that, because their mothers ignored them from infancy...it's sad..abortion is sad too, not as sad as child that grows up feeling unloved...
Agreed. A woman can't neglect or abuse what she doesn't have. Not all women want children, and not all children get adopted. Abortion must remain what it is; a woman's PERSONAL medical decision, and an option that all women in the U.S. have access to. Provided they live in a state where they can get access to it, of course.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#227644 Mar 14, 2013
Life is Precious wrote:
<quoted text>I am happy you are amused,it speaks volumes on who and what you are.Gee didn't you say once you were a Christian?(Laughable). You don't know the first thing about Christianity. You are the most disrespectable person on this thread. Why don't you tell the real reason you left the church? Be truthful for once in your life. Hypocrite!
It's "disrespectful" you cretin.

As for the rest of it...I've said why, many times. go look it up.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#227645 Mar 14, 2013
Life is Precious wrote:
<quoted text>Typical!You are so busy trying to justify ending the life of your unborn child,you just put anything on this thread.
ROFL.

You are really grasping at straws LIPpy.

Go puke your breakfast up.

“I'm here with bells on.”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#227646 Mar 14, 2013
Life is Precious wrote:
<quoted text>My fiance is totally against abortion, by the way you are crazy. Just saying.
Have a wonderful day.
Well that's not too surprising, since he'll never need one.

You do the same, honey.

“Ignorance is bliss.”

Since: May 11

Westerville, OH

#227647 Mar 14, 2013
Life is Precious wrote:
<quoted text>I am happy you are amused,it speaks volumes on who and what you are.Gee didn't you say once you were a Christian?(Laughable). You don't know the first thing about Christianity. You are the most disrespectable person on this thread. Why don't you tell the real reason you left the church? Be truthful for once in your life. Hypocrite!
Hypocrite. Yet you constantly disobey the basic rules of your religion. Pot meet kettle.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#227648 Mar 14, 2013
Life is Precious wrote:
<quoted text>Typical!You are so busy trying to justify ending the life of your unborn child,you just put anything on this thread.
Side note: I don't justify my abortion to anyone but my conscience. Y

Your fascination with the events of MY body and MY uterus 27 YEARS ago show just exactly how dull and empty your life is.

Now you'll try some incomprehensible phrases telling us your life is not dull nor empty.

If that is true, then why do you keep harping on decisions I made for my life 27 years ago?

STOP humping my leg like the bitch in heat you are.
LightForce

Rockford, MI

#227649 Mar 14, 2013
Mpnf1979 wrote:
<quoted text>
When I make a choice concerning what is happening in my body, I'm the only one whose business it is. That will forever be the truth. You can TRY to make it your business, but it never has been, is not now and never will be any of your business.
(PART 1 of 2)

How do you even know that you are really a person – do you check your drivers liscense? Making a choice based on opinions is like making a choice based on what shadows you see on the wall, but in the end, what you don't know really CAN hurt you sometimes. It might seem like a good idea to pee in the pool until you find out that everybody else is doing it too. Until you see all of the evidence you can't always come to the right conclusion. By the way, I'm personally opposed to using nuclear weapons, but if you want to use them in your own home it's none of my business.

Did the Thirteenth Amendment make a slave a “person”, with the same rights as other people? Did the defeat of the Nazi's suddenly make Jews and others that were deemed a lower class of people,“real” people? Just what does make a person a “person” considered to have the same inherent rights of all other people? In a just society we always consider the rights of others when we consider our own rights, so why are some people often excluded in that plan? We know that when we protect the rights of others, we are ultimately protecting our own rights, but does that mean we have to believe that there must be some personal benefit to us? If you look back in history at those who's rights are violated, it seems that there is always a certain defining physical attribute that differentiates the one's who's rights are being violated from the violator of those rights. Did they take a poll one day to see who's rights they would violate, or was it a slower process that occurred little by little over a long period of time? Why did so many people accept slavery in this country, and why did so many people accept the persecution of Jews? German historian Hans Buchheim wrote in his 1965 essay “Command and Compliance” that there was no coercion to murder Jews and others, and all who committed such actions did so out of free will, or their own CHOICE. Why do we today so easily accept the killing of innocent unborn children?
LightForce

Rockford, MI

#227650 Mar 14, 2013
Mpnf1979 wrote:
<quoted text>
When I make a choice concerning what is happening in my body, I'm the only one whose business it is. That will forever be the truth. You can TRY to make it your business, but it never has been, is
not now and never will be any of your business.
(PART 2 of 2)

The choices that we make can be based on opinion, or preference, but in a just world we must base our choices on moral and ethical foundations to ensure the inherent rights of everybody. The people who justified slavery out of their own “opinion” or “preference” were those who in their minds had no chance of ever becoming a slave themselves. The people who justified the persecution of Jews were not Jews themselves and reasoned in their own minds that they were not in danger of ever being persecuted or killed themselves. The one's who today justify the killing of innocent unborn children, are in fact already born, so they feel that they are not in any danger themselves. Our laws are often metered out, not on the basis of moral equality but only on the basis of how likely we are to be victims ourselves. So does one person deserve the inherent right to life, while another does not because of what opinions we might have? We also need to consider what class of citizen the next victims might be if we continue to simply base our choices on personal, or collective opinions, or preferences. When we set a precedence that is contradictory to moral or ethical standards, we tend to see a slow, steady decline in those standards. Eugenist Allen Roper, in a book published in 1913 called Ancient Eugenics wrote,“compulsion, or guidance, however veiled, is foredoomed to failure in the case of an institution which can only rest on inclination or an innate sense of duty. Moreover,“custom is lord of all,” and custom can only be modified gradually and in the course of centuries”“Modern Eugenists”, he goes on to say,“have recognized that, if there is to be Eugenics by Act of Parliament, the Eugenic ideal must first be absorbed into the conscience of the nation.” It's no coincidence that pro-abortionists rationalize abortion by calling it “pro-choice”. Everybody is for free choice, but that term ignores the fact that you are unjustly using that choice to force injury onto an innocent unborn child. Pro-abortioninsts use that deceptive term to achieve their goals of making abortion not only acceptable, but to make it a custom. We need to base our decisions on ALL of the evidence and not just shadows that we see on the wall.

You are right, we can never change the hearts of men by FORCING morality on them, it has to be by their own free will, because only then will real, lasting equal justice ever occur.
LightForce

Rockford, MI

#227651 Mar 14, 2013
mamma-san wrote:
<quoted text>
There is not a person on this forum who would deny help or defend the existing life of a human being who can live outside the uterus.
You keep trying to argue for living, breathing human beings.
There is a HUGE difference between a 12 year old child, and a 12 day old embryo.
One is a living, breathing, independent-of-its-mother's uterus being, and the other is 100% dependent upon it's mother's unique uterine conditions.
One is already born. One cannot possibly live outside the mother's uterus for even a nanosecond.
THAT is the difference. Your refusal to take that into consideration only makes your arguments ridiculous and unworthy of consideration.
There is no denying the differences between a 12-year-old and a 12-day-old, but while you choose to focus on the differences of the two, shouldn't we be focusing on the similarities? The obvious similarities of a 12-day-old and a 12-year-old is that they are both human beings at different stages of their lives. Why do we always tend to direct attention on our differences?

It can never be an easy decision for a parent to voluntarily end the life of their child. I once had a stuffed elephant that I didn't even have the heart to just throw away when it got ragged - it even lost an eye. But just like some people don't want to know the truth because then they might have to do something about it, some people don't want to know about their unborn child, or even know that it is a child if they decide that they don't want them. They want to believe anything that might prevent them from having to take any responsibility for what happens to that child.

“Ignorance is bliss.”

Since: May 11

Westerville, OH

#227652 Mar 14, 2013
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text>
(PART 1 of 2)
How do you even know that you are really a person – do you check your drivers liscense? Making a choice based on opinions is like making a choice based on what shadows you see on the wall, but in the end, what you don't know really CAN hurt you sometimes. It might seem like a good idea to pee in the pool until you find out that everybody else is doing it too. Until you see all of the evidence you can't always come to the right conclusion. By the way, I'm personally opposed to using nuclear weapons, but if you want to use them in your own home it's none of my business.
Did the Thirteenth Amendment make a slave a “person”, with the same rights as other people? Did the defeat of the Nazi's suddenly make Jews and others that were deemed a lower class of people,“real” people? Just what does make a person a “person” considered to have the same inherent rights of all other people? In a just society we always consider the rights of others when we consider our own rights, so why are some people often excluded in that plan? We know that when we protect the rights of others, we are ultimately protecting our own rights, but does that mean we have to believe that there must be some personal benefit to us? If you look back in history at those who's rights are violated, it seems that there is always a certain defining physical attribute that differentiates the one's who's rights are being violated from the violator of those rights. Did they take a poll one day to see who's rights they would violate, or was it a slower process that occurred little by little over a long period of time? Why did so many people accept slavery in this country, and why did so many people accept the persecution of Jews? German historian Hans Buchheim wrote in his 1965 essay “Command and Compliance” that there was no coercion to murder Jews and others, and all who committed such actions did so out of free will, or their own CHOICE. Why do we today so easily accept the killing of innocent unborn children?
For starters, all the people you mentioned had one thing in common - they were born. Anything in my body is not born. It is a part of my body. It was not a child. It was a fetus, at best. And it doesn't have the ability to be innocent or not innocent.

Why do we accept abortion? Because it isn't killing of children. It's the termination of a pregnancy that would ultimately lead to the production of a child.

“Ignorance is bliss.”

Since: May 11

Westerville, OH

#227653 Mar 14, 2013
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text>
(PART 2 of 2)
The choices that we make can be based on opinion, or preference, but in a just world we must base our choices on moral and ethical foundations to ensure the inherent rights of everybody. The people who justified slavery out of their own “opinion” or “preference” were those who in their minds had no chance of ever becoming a slave themselves. The people who justified the persecution of Jews were not Jews themselves and reasoned in their own minds that they were not in danger of ever being persecuted or killed themselves. The one's who today justify the killing of innocent unborn children, are in fact already born, so they feel that they are not in any danger themselves. Our laws are often metered out, not on the basis of moral equality but only on the basis of how likely we are to be victims ourselves. So does one person deserve the inherent right to life, while another does not because of what opinions we might have? We also need to consider what class of citizen the next victims might be if we continue to simply base our choices on personal, or collective opinions, or preferences. When we set a precedence that is contradictory to moral or ethical standards, we tend to see a slow, steady decline in those standards. Eugenist Allen Roper, in a book published in 1913 called Ancient Eugenics wrote,“compulsion, or guidance, however veiled, is foredoomed to failure in the case of an institution which can only rest on inclination or an innate sense of duty. Moreover,“custom is lord of all,” and custom can only be modified gradually and in the course of centuries”“Modern Eugenists”, he goes on to say,“have recognized that, if there is to be Eugenics by Act of Parliament, the Eugenic ideal must first be absorbed into the conscience of the nation.” It's no coincidence that pro-abortionists rationalize abortion by calling it “pro-choice”. Everybody is for free choice, but that term ignores the fact that you are unjustly using that choice to force injury onto an innocent unborn child. Pro-abortioninsts use that deceptive term to achieve their goals of making abortion not only acceptable, but to make it a custom. We need to base our decisions on ALL of the evidence and not just shadows that we see on the wall.
You are right, we can never change the hearts of men by FORCING morality on them, it has to be by their own free will, because only then will real, lasting equal justice ever occur.
See previous statement. Until you can prove that a 6-week-old fetus is an actual person, you have no argument. Comparing abortion to the enslavement and murder of born, live, breathing, thinking, feeling sentient beings is a stretch.

And again - morality is not defined by you or me. Abortion is not immoral. In fact, in many cases, I would say it is VERY moral.

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#227654 Mar 14, 2013
Sister Kathryn Lust wrote:
<quoted text>My son is an excellent baker, and knows what clean means. Fortunately, however, he is his own man, and you'd have to work the employment and financial details out with him. I'll give him a link to your post, and we'll see how it goes from there.
")
But I'm not interested in owning a male, I am only interested in buying a female.

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

#227655 Mar 14, 2013
Mpnf1979 wrote:
<quoted text>
See previous statement. Until you can prove that a 6-week-old fetus is an actual person, you have no argument. Comparing abortion to the enslavement and murder of born, live, breathing, thinking, feeling sentient beings is a stretch.
And again - morality is not defined by you or me. Abortion is not immoral. In fact, in many cases, I would say it is VERY moral.
Without a soul, it is not a person. That is real simple, simple enough that even the anti-choicers should be able to understand it.

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#227656 Mar 14, 2013
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text>
There is no denying the differences between a 12-year-old and a 12-day-old, but while you choose to focus on the differences of the two, shouldn't we be focusing on the similarities? The obvious similarities of a 12-day-old and a 12-year-old is that they are both human beings at different stages of their lives. Why do we always tend to direct attention on our differences?
It can never be an easy decision for a parent to voluntarily end the life of their child. I once had a stuffed elephant that I didn't even have the heart to just throw away when it got ragged - it even lost an eye. But just like some people don't want to know the truth because then they might have to do something about it, some people don't want to know about their unborn child, or even know that it is a child if they decide that they don't want them. They want to believe anything that might prevent them from having to take any responsibility for what happens to that child.
What is "truth" for you may not be for someone else.

A "truth" for me is that it's wrong for anyone who has had even one drink to drive a car. That's definitely not a truth for very many people. I know why I feel that way. But even telling someone why I do doesn't make it truth for them.

You continue to ignore the fact that a pregnancy involves far more than 9 months. It's a life long commitment. It's not something to take lightly. Having a child should be a decision made with a great deal of forethought and consideration. Not made simply because the condom broke or birth control failed.

Doesn't a child deserve MORE than that? Doesn't every child deserve to be born because his or her parents WANTED them?

You are only focusing on the embryo or the fetus. You are not thinking of a colicky infant, or a two year old with an ear infection who keeps you up all night, or a smart-mouthed six year old or the teenager who is rebelling. It's FAR MORE than you are even looking at.

If a woman knows she cannot be the mother a child deserves, and knows she cannot give the child up for adoption once born, she is making the responsible decision by having an abortion.
Candice

Colorado Springs, CO

#227657 Mar 14, 2013
She loves aborting babies.

“I'm here with bells on.”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#227658 Mar 14, 2013
Liam R wrote:
<quoted text>
But I'm not interested in owning a male, I am only interested in buying a female.
There are lots of them for sale in Iran. You could probably get three for the price of one in China, if you were willing to take on at least one with a physical disability.

“Ignore the trolls”

Since: Oct 08

Poole, UK

#227660 Mar 15, 2013
LightForce wrote:
<quoted text>
There is no denying the differences between a 12-year-old and a 12-day-old, but while you choose to focus on the differences of the two, shouldn't we be focusing on the similarities? The obvious similarities of a 12-day-old and a 12-year-old is that they are both human beings at different stages of their lives. Why do we always tend to direct attention on our differences?
It can never be an easy decision for a parent to voluntarily end the life of their child. I once had a stuffed elephant that I didn't even have the heart to just throw away when it got ragged - it even lost an eye. But just like some people don't want to know the truth because then they might have to do something about it, some people don't want to know about their unborn child, or even know that it is a child if they decide that they don't want them. They want to believe anything that might prevent them from having to take any responsibility for what happens to that child.
There is no difference between a 12-day-old and a 12-year-old in the fact that both are living, sentient beings. They become children at birth. There is a huge difference between both of them and an embryo, zygote or foetus. If you know of someone "voluntarily end[ing] the life of their child", it is your responsibility to report it to the authorities immediately, for that is murder, pure and simple. No doubt you are aware abortion is not murder under the law? As for your sad parallel with a favourite toy - words fail me: shows how much you think of human life if you make that sort of comparison.

Since: Feb 08

Location hidden

#227662 Mar 15, 2013
mamma-san wrote:
<quoted text>
I apologize to everyone for posting that story. I didn't follow through and research it more carefully. Moon, thanks for being far more thorough that I was.
Sorry I got so emotional, but that shit hits home for me.

“I'm here with bells on.”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#227663 Mar 15, 2013
Candice wrote:
She loves aborting babies.
And you love the idea of forced gestation.

See how that works?

“Becoming a better me!”

Since: Jul 09

Location hidden

#227664 Mar 16, 2013
NWmoon wrote:
<quoted text>Sorry I got so emotional, but that shit hits home for me.
No need to apologize. I understand :)

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