There is Everything Wrong with Abortion

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Ocean56

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#226760
Dec 10, 2012
 

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MoonWind Dancer wrote:
Wonderful post!
may I add to this, most women, especially young ones, don't think about the fact that the child could be born with handicaps.
As the Mom of a mentally handicapped son, let me tell you, life has not been a piece of cake. True, I wouldn't trade my son for anything in the world NOW, but, there have been times I sincerely thought that, had I known, I would have terminated the pregnancy.
Most regulars here know me, and my son, yet this is the first time I have posted this. I'm not a horrible person, I'm a human, with all the faults and foibles that go with the job.
I do not judge others for their choices. It is none of my business.
Agreed. A lot of girls/women never think for a second about a child's having any kind of handicap, whether it's a physical or mental one, and some are actively DIScouraged from doing so. I've actually read lines like "if you think TOO much, you'll never have kids" or words to that effect, from posters on other boards. The appropriate response to such a statement is, "and a person deciding NOT to have kids would be a bad thing...WHY, exactly?"

When a woman has one or more children because she truly wants and loves kids despite all the hardships and challenges motherhood brings, that's a good reason. When a woman has children because she is PRESSURED into doing so, even if she may have been undecided or unwilling to have them but caved to the pressure, that's NOT a good reason.

Yes, there's a 50% chance she MAY "fall in love with the child" later on, but there's also the 50% chance she may NOT, and the results in the latter case would be tragic. My feeling has always been that if a girl/woman has ANY doubts about motherhood, then DON'T do it. It's too important a decision to "roll the dice" about, and as I said, the choice NOT to be a mother is just as valid and responsible as the choice to be one.
Nanack Kenden

Racine, WI

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#226761
Dec 10, 2012
 
"In fact, making abortions difficult to get results in the murder of born children. Google "Gosnell Clinic" and do all the reading. You will see the future if Roe v. Wade and abortion access are done away with. "

Gosnell was an abortionist, and his clinic was an abortion clinic. What you're saying is that if Roe is done away with, horrible crimes will be committed by... pro-choicers.

I do have to respect your moxy. You actually tried to pin an abortionist's atrocities on pro-lifers.

" Numbers 5:21 Bible Gateway refers to it as the Trial for Jealousy."

Actually, in that passage, the abortifacient only works if the woman was unfaithful, and she has every opportunity to back out and admit wrongdoing, so...

Since: Feb 08

Philadelphia, PA

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#226762
Dec 10, 2012
 

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Nanack Kenden wrote:
"In fact, making abortions difficult to get results in the murder of born children. Google "Gosnell Clinic" and do all the reading. You will see the future if Roe v. Wade and abortion access are done away with. "
Gosnell was an abortionist, and his clinic was an abortion clinic. What you're saying is that if Roe is done away with, horrible crimes will be committed by... pro-choicers.
I do have to respect your moxy. You actually tried to pin an abortionist's atrocities on pro-lifers.
" Numbers 5:21 Bible Gateway refers to it as the Trial for Jealousy."
Actually, in that passage, the abortifacient only works if the woman was unfaithful, and she has every opportunity to back out and admit wrongdoing, so...
You did not read the material on Gosnell. I knew you would not as you are intellectually dishonest. None of you fruitbats is honest or sane.

Since: Feb 08

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#226763
Dec 10, 2012
 

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Nanack Kenden wrote:
"In fact, making abortions difficult to get results in the murder of born children. Google "Gosnell Clinic" and do all the reading. You will see the future if Roe v. Wade and abortion access are done away with. "
Gosnell was an abortionist, and his clinic was an abortion clinic. What you're saying is that if Roe is done away with, horrible crimes will be committed by... pro-choicers.
I do have to respect your moxy. You actually tried to pin an abortionist's atrocities on pro-lifers.
" Numbers 5:21 Bible Gateway refers to it as the Trial for Jealousy."
Actually, in that passage, the abortifacient only works if the woman was unfaithful, and she has every opportunity to back out and admit wrongdoing, so...
So let us talk about how dishonest you are. I did not say "What you're saying is that if Roe is done away with, horrible crimes will be committed by... pro-choicers." You said that. You are into pejorative blaming instead of rational information and policy.

I say that the murders committed at the Gosnell Clinic and women going to Mexico for abortions are both happening now when abortion is legal and somewhat available. If abortion is illegal, it will all be a charnel house.
Warren J

United States

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#226764
Dec 10, 2012
 

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CherryTheTart wrote:
<quoted text>
There is an abortion in the Bible. God is kool with abortion. Don't you read the book you thump? The Bible is an abortion!
The Bible is an abortion!
Doctor REALITY

Little Rock, AR

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#226766
Dec 10, 2012
 

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the Poster Child for Condom Usage wrote:
<quoted text>
There is an abortion in the Bible performed by a priest of the Temple. Read the book you thump, Moron.
Be quiet.

Since: Feb 08

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#226767
Dec 10, 2012
 

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Doctor REALITY wrote:
<quoted text>Be quiet.
Highly unlikely.

Since: Feb 08

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#226768
Dec 10, 2012
 

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Warren J wrote:
<quoted text>The Bible is an abortion!
Why did you type that? Why do you lie?
Nanack Kenden

Racine, WI

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#226769
Dec 10, 2012
 
" You did not read the material on Gosnell. I knew you would not as you are intellectually dishonest. None of you fruitbats is honest or sane. "

Did I not go to some shrill feminist blog for their interpretation of things? Is intellectual dishonesty now merely not taking your side in a debate? I knew about Gosnell well before this conversation. Perhaps you can give me your view of Gosnell instead of whining that I'm not reading your mind. The whole problem with him was that he provided illegal abortions, not that those abortions weren't legal.

"So let us talk about how dishonest you are. I did not say 'What you're saying is that if Roe is done away with, horrible crimes will be committed by... pro-choicers.' You said that. You are into pejorative blaming instead of rational information and policy."

Actually, if abortions is criminalized and illegal abortions pop up, every single one of those abortion doctors will be pro-choice. Complaints about "back-alley" abortions must tacitly admit that.

"I say that the murders committed at the Gosnell Clinic and women going to Mexico for abortions are both happening now when abortion is legal and somewhat available. If abortion is illegal, it will all be a charnel house."

Before Roe, roughly 100 women each year died from back-alley abortion. More people die each year from falling off of latters.

Since: Feb 08

Philadelphia, PA

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#226770
Dec 10, 2012
 

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Nanack Kenden wrote:
" You did not read the material on Gosnell. I knew you would not as you are intellectually dishonest. None of you fruitbats is honest or sane. "
Did I not go to some shrill feminist blog for their interpretation of things? Is intellectual dishonesty now merely not taking your side in a debate? I knew about Gosnell well before this conversation. Perhaps you can give me your view of Gosnell instead of whining that I'm not reading your mind. The whole problem with him was that he provided illegal abortions, not that those abortions weren't legal.
"So let us talk about how dishonest you are. I did not say 'What you're saying is that if Roe is done away with, horrible crimes will be committed by... pro-choicers.' You said that. You are into pejorative blaming instead of rational information and policy."
Actually, if abortions is criminalized and illegal abortions pop up, every single one of those abortion doctors will be pro-choice. Complaints about "back-alley" abortions must tacitly admit that.
"I say that the murders committed at the Gosnell Clinic and women going to Mexico for abortions are both happening now when abortion is legal and somewhat available. If abortion is illegal, it will all be a charnel house."
Before Roe, roughly 100 women each year died from back-alley abortion. More people die each year from falling off of latters.
Go to the New York Times or the Philadelphia Inquirer. It is a very public and famous case. You are making excuses for not doing the reading or the thinking this issue involves.

You are ignorant and uninformed about this public health issue but that does not keep you from having an opinion, does it? And you know what they say about opinions ...
Ocean56

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#226771
Dec 11, 2012
 

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Nanack Kenden wrote:
I was ignoring everyone other than the guy I just replied to on the grounds that their posts somehow found a way to be sub-par for an internet chat board, but this I think merits a response.
"Thank goodness it's not for YOU to decide on the abortion issue. That has already been done, by the SCOTUS."
Just like the SCOTUS deemed slavery and Japanese internment okay?
Those were also repugnant rulings wholly endorsed by the same party and philosophy that supports Roe.
Yes, there have been some repugnant rulings by the Supreme Court in the past. I DON'T include Roe v. Wade in that group.

I simply said it wasn't for YOU -- and other anti-choicers like you -- to decide on the abortion issue. Thanks to the Roe v. Wade decision, it is for EACH woman to decide whether or not to continue a pregnancy. Some women will decide to continue a pregnancy, others will not. The ONLY person who makes the decision is the WOMAN who is pregnant, and if it isn't YOUR pregnancy, it isn't your decision.

Motherhood is still OPTIONAL, not required. That means a woman can cheerfully REJECT that option if she doesn't want the hardships and responsibilities that motherhood involves. Don't like the idea of a woman rejecting motherhood? Too bad. As I said before, it ISN'T up to you. Deal with it.
ronone

Pittsburgh, PA

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#226772
Dec 11, 2012
 
youtube.com/watch... …Abortion at Work?

Since: Feb 08

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#226773
Dec 11, 2012
 

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Nanack Kenden wrote:
" You did not read the material on Gosnell. I knew you would not as you are intellectually dishonest. None of you fruitbats is honest or sane. "
Did I not go to some shrill feminist blog for their interpretation of things? Is intellectual dishonesty now merely not taking your side in a debate? I knew about Gosnell well before this conversation. Perhaps you can give me your view of Gosnell instead of whining that I'm not reading your mind. The whole problem with him was that he provided illegal abortions, not that those abortions weren't legal.
"So let us talk about how dishonest you are. I did not say 'What you're saying is that if Roe is done away with, horrible crimes will be committed by... pro-choicers.' You said that. You are into pejorative blaming instead of rational information and policy."
Actually, if abortions is criminalized and illegal abortions pop up, every single one of those abortion doctors will be pro-choice. Complaints about "back-alley" abortions must tacitly admit that.
"I say that the murders committed at the Gosnell Clinic and women going to Mexico for abortions are both happening now when abortion is legal and somewhat available. If abortion is illegal, it will all be a charnel house."
Before Roe, roughly 100 women each year died from back-alley abortion. More people die each year from falling off of latters.
Nobody needs abide by your ridiculous categories. You lack reason. I am PRO LIFE and therefore I am adamantly PRO CHOICE. Health issues cannot be reduced to binary categories. Black/White is not all there is. There is Gray.

We will not continue to discuss this because you refuse to acquire the information required to discuss this issue competently. Sneering and shaming does not an argument make. When you have actually acquired the information, I will know and THEN we can continue. Right now it is like trying to have a discussion about Proust with a 5 year old.
Nanack Kenden

Racine, WI

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#226774
Dec 11, 2012
 
"We will not continue to discuss this because you refuse to acquire the information required to discuss this issue competently. Sneering and shaming does not an argument make. When you have actually acquired the information, I will know and THEN we can continue. Right now it is like trying to have a discussion about Proust with a 5 year old."

I asked you what your interpretation of the Gosnell case was, and you didn't answer. I honestly have no clue what you're trying to imply.

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#226775
Dec 11, 2012
 

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Nanack Kenden wrote:
"We will not continue to discuss this because you refuse to acquire the information required to discuss this issue competently. Sneering and shaming does not an argument make. When you have actually acquired the information, I will know and THEN we can continue. Right now it is like trying to have a discussion about Proust with a 5 year old."
I asked you what your interpretation of the Gosnell case was, and you didn't answer. I honestly have no clue what you're trying to imply.
You finally said something honest. How was the Gosnell Clinic different that all other abortion clinics? When you can tell me, I will know you did the reading necessary. And tell me then why it was different. You have said so many rude shaming inaccurate things, I see no reason to give you the benefit of the doubt and continue to act as though you are sentient. Got it?
Nanack Kenden

Racine, WI

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#226776
Dec 11, 2012
 

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" You finally said something honest. How was the Gosnell Clinic different that all other abortion clinics? When you can tell me, I will know you did the reading necessary. And tell me then why it was different. You have said so many rude shaming inaccurate things, I see no reason to give you the benefit of the doubt and continue to act as though you are sentient. Got it? "

You're getting a little worked up. How about before typing, you count to fifty or something?

Also, "rude shaming inaccurate"? Someone needs to ground up some St John's wort is your coffee.

I just rechecked his Wikipedia page. Gosnell is responsible for a botched abortion leading to a death of a woman, as well as seven infanticides.

So what? Doesn't that make him a super-abortionist?

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

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#226777
Dec 11, 2012
 

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Doctor REALITY wrote:
Abortion is MURDER!...and Holy Almighty God SEES IT ALL!! And He will AVENGE the MURDER of His defensless babies!!
Silly, ignorant child. The God of the Bible is just fine with abortion, nor does He think of it as murder.

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

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#226778
Dec 11, 2012
 

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mamma-san wrote:
<quoted text>
And the Flying Spaghetti Monster has a special vat of boiling water for people like you. Watch out! Or HE will BOIL you with a huge package of spaghetti and smother you in Ragu.
Eeew. Not even a good sauce? How cruel.

“No Allah: know peace”

Since: Jun 07

A sacred grove in Tujunga, CA

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#226779
Dec 11, 2012
 

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Nanack Kenden wrote:
...
Before Roe, roughly 100 women each year died from back-alley abortion. More people die each year from falling off of latters.
So, you are okay with a hundred preventable deaths each year?

Since: Feb 08

Philadelphia, PA

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#226780
Dec 12, 2012
 

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Nanack Kenden wrote:
" You finally said something honest. How was the Gosnell Clinic different that all other abortion clinics? When you can tell me, I will know you did the reading necessary. And tell me then why it was different. You have said so many rude shaming inaccurate things, I see no reason to give you the benefit of the doubt and continue to act as though you are sentient. Got it? "
You're getting a little worked up. How about before typing, you count to fifty or something?
Also, "rude shaming inaccurate"? Someone needs to ground up some St John's wort is your coffee.
I just rechecked his Wikipedia page. Gosnell is responsible for a botched abortion leading to a death of a woman, as well as seven infanticides.
So what? Doesn't that make him a super-abortionist?
That is what I asked you. Go back and look. If you cannot tell me "so what," then you are incapable of analysis and/or reading comprehension and not worth discussing this with.

You are probably just here to moan and foam. Have at it. Some people just need to have somebody to look down on, I guess. Your act is lame.

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