Why Should Jesus Love Me?

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#609291 Nov 23, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. sorry RR, that makes no sense to me ..
.. we are shaped by our thoughts. If fear is planted in the mind, what is the harvest? Everything a human desires, real freedom, depends on the ability to release fear and bravely go forward and experience the unknown ..
"Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering." Yoda
<quoted text>
.. fear doesn't create terrorism, terrorism creates fear (think 9-11)..
.. when someone says, "You're going to hell if you don't change your ways and believe in my god," it's religious propaganda intended to promote fear ..
.. to champion the worship of any god, terror has become a useful tool, a way to galvanize mass fear ..
.. both Christians and Muslims claim the world must be purified. While their methods differ, they know terrorism will create fear ..
.. the weapon of religious fear is a contagious monster that prevents humans from experiencing true freedom ..
.. do you fear the absence of fear ??..
Do you live in fear every day of going to prison for the rest of your life? If not, how come? The government tells you that if you don't abide by the rules that have been set up then you will go to jail

Could it be you don't fear prison because you know you are living the correct way and therefore you have no reason to fear it?

Are you saying the only reason you aren't killing people is because you don't want to go to jail or do you refrain from killing people because you would want to live the right way regardless of whether or not you would go to prison?

Do you fear what would happen if you weren't aware there are consequences to your actions

These questions are silly. Believers understand what things could lead to the condemnation of a soul. They also know if they are under the sacrifice that it is not something that will happen to them. They don't live their faith because they are afraid of hell but rather because they believe and feel it is the right thing to do and they obey out of love.

“John 3:seventeen”

Since: Feb 07

God BELIEVES in YOU~

#609292 Nov 23, 2013
Ephesians 3:16 I pray that out of his glorious riches he may strengthen you with power through his Spirit in your inner being, 17 so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith. And I pray that you, being rooted and established in love, 18 may have power, together with all the Lord’s holy people, to grasp how wide and long and high and deep is the love of Christ, 19 and to know this love that surpasses knowledge—that you may be filled to the measure of all the fullness of God.
20 Now to him who is able to do immeasurably more than all we ask or imagine, according to his power that is at work within us, 21 to him be glory in the church and in Christ Jesus throughout all generations, for ever and ever! Amen.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#609295 Nov 23, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. just send silver or gold ..
Don't forget the Frankincense and Myrrh.

LOL

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#609296 Nov 23, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you live in fear every day of going to prison for the rest of your life? If not, how come? The government tells you that if you don't abide by the rules that have been set up then you will go to jail
Could it be you don't fear prison because you know you are living the correct way and therefore you have no reason to fear it?...
1. The Justice system is real and tangible. We can prove prisons exist.(Point to atheists)
2. There is no "Believe in Geo. Washington and you will never go to prison for committing crimes, even murder" clause in the constitution.(point to atheists)
3. By your argument, laws and punishments do nothing to change anyone. Further, most people know the difference between right and wrong without any "Laws of Deities" to tell them so.(point to atheists).

You kinda shot yourself in the foot here. Maybe rethink or reword it ?

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#609297 Nov 23, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
1. The Justice system is real and tangible. We can prove prisons exist.(Point to atheists)
2. There is no "Believe in Geo. Washington and you will never go to prison for committing crimes, even murder" clause in the constitution.(point to atheists)
3. By your argument, laws and punishments do nothing to change anyone. Further, most people know the difference between right and wrong without any "Laws of Deities" to tell them so.(point to atheists).
You kinda shot yourself in the foot here. Maybe rethink or reword it ?
1) Fear is relative

If the person believes the threat is real, that is all that matters

Unless you are saying HL thinks hell is real?

2) Again, we are talking about fear influencing someone's life and how they act. And by not committing crimes you get the continued reward of freedom. By not going to hell you get the continued reward of life

3) Not true. Some people may not commit crimes because they don't want to go to prison and the morality has nothing to do with it. But for those that wouldn't do it regardless of the punishment because they don't want to commit crimes, they don't need the threat of punishment for deterrence

Nothing to change or re-word IMO. It is spot-on

“MEET KIKI -She Seeks Home”

Since: Oct 10

With Established Harem

#609298 Nov 23, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>**PORTIONS SNIPPED BECAUSE I DON'T ANSWER PERSONAL QUESTIONS**They also know if they are under the sacrifice that it is not something that will happen to them.
.. how do believers 'KNOW' that ??..
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>They don't live their faith because they are afraid of hell but rather because they believe and feel it is the right thing to do and they obey out of love.
.. then why do believers threaten non-believers with hell? Does that not qualify as terrorism ??..

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#609299 Nov 23, 2013
Adam wrote:
Get the facts straight you poor gay lovers. Homosexuality is nowhere supported or tolerated in any scripts of the bible. If you got the bible you will know it.Everything else the deal with human rights and equality and that god loves all of his creatures is a fraud a fake.

You act like we care what YHWH the brutal god of barbarism and war thinks about us, after all we aren't the sons and daughters of the mud pie Jew boy Adam or of the rib bone woman Eve.
Maybe you're a mud pie/rib bone Jewish mythology follower , so start the gay bashing's without us.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#609300 Nov 23, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. how do believers 'KNOW' that ??..
It doesn't matter so long as they believe it

You are talking about whether the threat of hell is something that instills fear in believers and affects how they act. But if a believer feels he/she will be saved, then hell is not a threat to them.
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. then why do believers threaten non-believers with hell?
A believer can't threaten someone with something they have no authority to impose. Anymore than I could threaten you with a state-sanctioned death penalty. What people can do is let others know the rules as they believe them to be so someone can avoid a potential punishment
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>

Does that not qualify as terrorism ??..
Seriously?

Yeah that's pretty similar. Telling someone the Christian belief is that people who die in unbelief and unrepentant in their sins will not be saved is the same as flying planes into a building and killing 3000 people

By that logic telling someone how they interpret the law in capital offenses that can result in the death penalty is terrorism too

“MEET KIKI -She Seeks Home”

Since: Oct 10

With Established Harem

#609301 Nov 23, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
If the person believes the threat is real, that is all that matters
.. exactly! It's an act of terrorism ..
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
Unless you are saying HL thinks hell is real?
.. why do you make Ben accountable for my beliefs or non-beliefs ??..
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text> And by not committing crimes you get the continued reward of freedom.
.. if you're not caught committing a crime, your freedom is still ensured ..
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>By not going to hell you get the continued reward of life
.. veiled terrorism ??..
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>Some people may not commit crimes because they don't want to go to prison and the morality has nothing to do with it.
.. keeping a violent criminal void of morals incarcerated protects society ..

.. conversely, prison does not deter desperate crimes anymore than chopping someone's hand off because they stole a loaf of bread for their child ..

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#609302 Nov 23, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
1) Fear is relative
If the person believes the threat is real, that is all that matters
Unless you are saying HL thinks hell is real?
2) Again, we are talking about fear influencing someone's life and how they act. And by not committing crimes you get the continued reward of freedom. By not going to hell you get the continued reward of life
3) Not true. Some people may not commit crimes because they don't want to go to prison and the morality has nothing to do with it. But for those that wouldn't do it regardless of the punishment because they don't want to commit crimes, they don't need the threat of punishment for deterrence
Nothing to change or re-word IMO. It is spot-on
1. People do little out of fear other than figure out how not to get punished, thus the "Get out of Hell " pass of Christianity.
Viking, Wassuup and RR are examples of that "I can do anything a get to heaven" mentality.
So the "fear" factor doesn't exist for Christians any more than Atheists.
2. See above
3. See above

Christians have no fear of God. They think no matter what they do they are going to Heaven.

Atheists have no fear of God, Heaven or Hell because they have no evidence that either exists.

Thus, no difference between Christians and atheists as far as fear of God goes.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#609303 Nov 23, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
..... chopping someone's hand off because they stole a loaf of bread for their child ..
According to Judaism the merchant sinned for not helping a starving child.
According to Jesus the merchant is the sinner.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#609304 Nov 23, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. exactly! It's an act of terrorism ..
You are insane. How is it terrorism? Consequences for actions is terrorism? And a punishment for an act someone isn't committing is a threat to them?
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. why do you make Ben accountable for my beliefs or non-beliefs ?
I don't. But whether something technically can be proven to exist clearly wasn't the point or you wouldn't have been asking. You asked RR because you know he believes it is real, therefore you want to know the impact a threat of hell would have on him
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. if you're not caught committing a crime, your freedom is still ensured ..
So? What does that have to do with some people will obey the law regardless if there is punishments for not? And what does that have to do with the fact that some people don't commit crimes simply because they want to continue enjoying their freedom. They don't commit crimes because it is the right thing to do. Just like believers obey God not just so they can continue enjoying life but do so because they want to out of love
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. veiled terrorism ??..
Insanity?
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. keeping a violent criminal void of morals incarcerated protects society ..
So what? The conversation is about fear and deterrence and how people will react to it. In that regard, the two are parallels.
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. conversely, prison does not deter desperate crimes anymore than chopping someone's hand off because they stole a loaf of bread for their child ..
Ridiculous example

For starters, there are people that are poor and hungry that never resort to crime

And the comparison makes no sense because nobody refuses to believe in Jesus out of necessity to survive. And if someone had to do something out of necessity they could still feel bad it came to that and be repentant

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#609305 Nov 23, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
1. People do little out of fear other than figure out how not to get punished, thus the "Get out of Hell " pass of Christianity.
Viking, Wassuup and RR are examples of that "I can do anything a get to heaven" mentality.
So the "fear" factor doesn't exist for Christians any more than Atheists.
2. See above
3. See above
Christians have no fear of God. They think no matter what they do they are going to Heaven.
Atheists have no fear of God, Heaven or Hell because they have no evidence that either exists.
Thus, no difference between Christians and atheists as far as fear of God goes.
If that is how you feel then you would agree it is silly for HL to consider the 'threat' of hell to be terrorism to either group

“MEET KIKI -She Seeks Home”

Since: Oct 10

With Established Harem

#609306 Nov 23, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
It doesn't matter so long as they believe it
You are talking about whether the threat of hell is something that instills fear in believers and affects how they act. But if a believer feels he/she will be saved, then hell is not a threat to them.
.. no, I'm asserting the threat of hell is an act of terrorism made to invoke fear ..
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
A believer can't threaten someone with something they have no authority to impose. Anymore than I could threaten you with a state-sanctioned death penalty. What people can do is let others know the rules as they believe them to be so someone can avoid a potential punishment
.. nonsense. Believers threaten non-believers with The Lake Of Fire on a regular basis. It's an act of terrorism ..
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>Seriously?
Yeah that's pretty similar. Telling someone the Christian belief is that people who die in unbelief and unrepentant in their sins will not be saved is the same as flying planes into a building and killing 3000 people
.. the correlation exists. Telling someone they're going to hell and flying planes into buildings are both acts of terrorism that spawn fear ..
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>Seriously?By that logic telling someone how they interpret the law in capital offenses that can result in the death penalty is terrorism too.
.. to a degree, you are correct. When driving, you spot a squad car and check your odometer because you're terrified that you may be exceeding the legal speed limit; which, in turn begets fear..

.. if so desired, you may have the final rebuttal. I'm done explaining this simple philosophical principle ..

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#609308 Nov 23, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
According to Judaism the merchant sinned for not helping a starving child.
According to Jesus the merchant is the sinner.
I agree. But that's not the same thing as a child stealing because he is hungry

In that case, the merchant didn't cause the boy to sin. The merchant is simply who the boy stole from.

However if a merchant sees a boy is hungry and doe snot help him then yes, one could point to verses anywhere from

Matthew 25:43-46
"They also will answer,'Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?' He will reply,'I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least among you, you did not do for me.' Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.

to verses such as

1 John 3:17-18
If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has no pity on him, how can the love of God be in him? Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#609309 Nov 23, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
If that is how you feel then you would agree it is silly for HL to consider the 'threat' of hell to be terrorism to either group
I can't speak for HL.

I don't fear God. I don't believe in Hell or Heaven. I simply try to be a decent human being.

I fear religious people trying to force their "Laws" on everyone and fear even more so, them doing it with violence and politics.

I don't care what people believe. I do care what they do to others.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#609312 Nov 23, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
...
.. to a degree, you are correct. When driving, you spot a squad car and check your odometer because you're terrified that you may be exceeding the legal speed limit; which, in turn begets fear.....
Unless you have diplomatic plates. In which case you can shoot the cop.

Christianity promises Divine Diplomatic immunity.

Even child rapist Warren Jeffs gets to go to Heaven because "He Believes". But if his victims leave the church then they go to Hell.

Such is the Love of Bible God!

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#609313 Nov 23, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. no, I'm asserting the threat of hell is an act of terrorism made to invoke fear ..
<quoted text>.
Anything that causes fear is not terrorism! How did you even get started on that? So if I tell someone committing crimes can get them put in jail and cost you your freedom I committed a terrorist act if that idea frightens someone? Just silly

And like it has been pointed out, the vast, vast majority of people do not even see it as a threat because for one reason or another they don't think it applies to them
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. nonsense. Believers threaten non-believers with The Lake Of Fire on a regular basis. It's an act of terrorism ..
<quoted text>.
Total insanity

By your own definition of "terrorism" there is no threat that can instill fear because unbelievers don't believer in hell. That is what makes them unbelievers.

And if you are afraid of a "threat" you don't believe is real from a person that couldn't enforce it if it were, then you are simply aren't too bright. You certainly are not the victim of a terrorist act
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. the correlation exists. Telling someone they're going to hell and flying planes into buildings are both acts of terrorism that spawn fear ..
<quoted text>.
I repeat, you are insane
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. to a degree, you are correct. When driving, you spot a squad car and check your odometer because you're terrified that you may be exceeding the legal speed limit; which, in turn begets fear..
.. if so desired, you may have the final rebuttal. I'm done explaining this simple philosophical principle ..
The only thing simple is the realization that you are insane

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#609315 Nov 23, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
I can't speak for HL.
I'm not asking you to. I am saying if you don't believe hell poses a threat to either believers or unbelievers than there is no way you could agree within opinion claiming telling people about hell is a terrorist threat. You opted in the discussion so I think it is only fair to point out by your own admission you would not agree with that position.
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't fear God. I don't believe in Hell or Heaven. I simply try to be a decent human being. I fear religious people trying to force their "Laws" on everyone and fear even more so, them doing it with violence and politics. I don't care what people believe. I do care what they do to others.
Well this is a completely different subject but ok.

What laws in this country have religious people forced on others thus far with violence and politics that causes you to have such fears for it happening in the future?

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#609316 Nov 23, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>I agree. But that's not the same thing as a child stealing because he is hungry
In that case, the merchant didn't cause the boy to sin. The merchant is simply who the boy stole from....
The mother and child committed no sin. They took what was rightfully theirs.
That was the Law for thousands of years until the Medieval Church changed it.

Now, if the mother stole more than she needed to feed herself and family for that day, that would be theft.

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