Why Should Jesus Love Me?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#597620 Oct 2, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
I know. But the study God & Jesus are also ancient.
You mean the study of the bible, archeological artifacts, and a handful of ancient historians, all of which argue against the existence of this "God" fellow and that Jesus was a god. Your god eludes detection and hence cannot be studied,just like Zeus and Quetzalcoatl did.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Humans have been trying to figure out God for over three millennia. The big difference between the study of God and the study of DNA is that God can't be scrutinized under a microscope.
Nor by a telescope. Nor by a thermometer. Nor by radar or sonar. Nor any other artificial device. Nor any exteroceptor.

“The invisible and the nonexistent look very much alike”- Delos B. McKown

There are many things that cannot be seen even with our best machines, but have been identified indirectly nevertheless by their effects on the observable - things like dark matter, dark energy, black holes, neutron stars, stellar nucleosynthesis, electrons, magnetic fields, and more. Even gravity is discernible only indirectly through its effects on matter.

Your god would be discernible if it existed and acted on reality like any of the above - if it answered prayer, for example.

But alas, it doesn't have any observable effect, and is detectable only by objects like Trifecta and Dr. Shrink. You don't have much of a case there.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#597621 Oct 2, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
Quite the opposite of Christians who rarely read the Bible, know nothing about the history of their religion, can't agree on a single doctrine, claim to have perfect knowledge of God and call anyone who disagrees with them liars and evil.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
You've just labeled an incredibly small number of Christians.
What a remarkable coincidence then that most of them ended up posting on this thread.

Of course, we don't know how much time the average Christian spends reading his bibles, but neither do you. Was that the loophole you were using to justify your comment?

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597622 Oct 2, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
.. for me, there's a fallacy in your analogy because Libya is just like America - it has oxygen and sustains different lifeforms. You just happen to think America is better. This also applies to your choice of religion; you believe it's better than ancient religions ..
Fail. You're talking about geological and biological similarities, I'm not.

Just because America and Libya have oxygen speaks nothing to their national differences. That's like saying the Babylonian religions and Christianity are the same because they both use words...
.. the Babylonians believed their faith was real; you believe your faith is real. I have no problem with either. I do have a problem with the damage religion causes ..
I have no problem with that, either.

And I don't know what "damage" you're referring to.
.. in your case, it created a misogynist who is somewhat bigoted and anti-gay.
Woah there!! I am not at all anti-gay. Why do you have to say that?!

Also, why do you assume Christianity "made" me misogynistic? Why don't you factor in other possibilities?
Religion has shaped you into the person you have become and it would require a great deal of therapy to erase the tapes in your brain that continually re-wind and play ..
Bullshit.

Or horse shit.

I can't decide.
.. like Bongo, I do not blame you because you're the sum total of your experience which has been highly influenced by a religion with teaches misogyny and bigotry. No religion, no person, is better than another. It's really that simple for me ..
The sum total of me comes from more influence than just Christianity. I don't live in a little Christian bubble and go around thumping Bibles all day long.

I'm more than that.

I thought you knew...

Since: May 11

Maidstone, UK

#597623 Oct 2, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
I'm not sure I totally agree with this, because it really depends upon the perception one has towards the evidence.[...]
http://www.topix.com/forum/topstories/T0N0LOR...
[...]Our senses dictate what we believe.
Self.
again...

What one side considers evidence another considers nonsense. The parting of the Red Sea was once a miracle now miracles are reduced to polarised reflections in office windows and mildew stains in old fountains, yet the 'religious' have no problem accepting these things as irrefutable proof of supernature.

There is no proof in existence of an afterlife or supernature or gods. If there were it would be a cause celebre and the churches would be full. I don't care if someone picked up something on a tape recorder which sounded vaguely like someone talking because the chances are it was someone talking. I own an IR reflective suit from my time in the army looking at me in it through a thermal imager would make me appear 'spectral'. No one has yet 'come through' from the spirit world to tell us what a mind numbingly boring time they're having worshipping god.

You're telling me that just because something is picked up on a 'mechanism' it becomes scientific evidence? Really.....? I’d be very interested to see where I said that. There are issues like calibration, anti tamper seals, controls and tempest monitoring where electronic equipment are concerned. Sticking a video camera in a dark room or a tape recorder left running in an empty house do not a valid experiment make.

If you want to tell me what happens to my immortal soul then insist for the sake of your argument that I must believe in such a thing as a soul before you can continue then you have already lost. Your opening gambit is a requirement that I lower the standard of proof which is required to convince me.

What you are attempting to do once again is shift the burden of proof. You are saying there is an afterlife and I should behave a certain way to have a good one. I say it has not been proven to my satisfaction on the preponderance of evidence so it is up to you to rebut. The default position is that there is no afterlife the positive assertion that such a thing exists is yours.

When one goes into court for example the task is to determine whether an act took place. Guilt v No-guilt....did an act or omission take place which caused a particular outcome. i.e. Did it happen?(something happened - positive assertion).

There is a presumption of innocence(nothing happened) the default position, which can be rebutted with adequate evidence of the correct type. Effective rebuttal attracts a verdict of guilty(there is a demonstrable result of the act(or ommission)). There is no verdict of innocent; there is a verdict of not guilty if the rebuttal of the default negative position was unsuccessful.

Am I agnostic? No I'm an atheist, we may not know everything about reality but we know enough to say that a god/gods/supernature are not represented anywhere in reality which would by default make them unreal and highly unlikely to the degree that they can be disregarded.

Atheism isn’t a worldview btw, atheism is a single position on a single issue. Atheism requires no faith, belief, worship, ritual or veneration.

You do not honestly believe that you have no proof of anything if you haven’t experienced it first hand. That is a juvenile tactic which looks juvenile. If that’s the case then the Napoleonic Wars never happened.

There is nothing of your mental 'self' which projects beyond your 'self',(rather like god/gods/the faerie folk) or has any affect beyond what goes on in your ‘self’. What you're describing is wilful subscription to comfortable and cosy thoughts, not reality.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597624 Oct 2, 2013
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
You posted that you punched through a guy's windshield with an iron tool, and were charged with assault with a deadly weapon.
Do you now want to deny that?
I won't be surprised if you do.
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you wrote this post before you saw mine where I said I smashed a windshield with "The Club".

You know? The red thing that locks the steering wheel?

Since: May 11

Maidstone, UK

#597625 Oct 2, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Yep - Bill Gates is mentally ill.
Steve Jobs, was also.
Your position has flaws.
Maybe it is because you haven't stepped into reality to see what one's perception can achieve.
<quoted text>
Then your definition is not one of Christianity, that's for sure, as many of those "beliefs" - for you, truths through facts and evidence - have been achieved.
I disagree.
Belief is learned.
One uses their brain to learn. Which ultimately requires an action by one'self to begin learning.
You really don't know much on how the brain operates, huh?
<quoted text>
Okay, sure.
I was forced to believe in Christianity, but I then forced myself to look outside the religion for the truths presented, and now I don't believe Christianity is truthful.
<quoted text>
No, I believe sweating is a chemical reaction, that resulted in heat being applied to our bodies and since our body's normal average temperature is approx 98 degrees, our bodies control our inner temperatures by sweating on the outside - similar to a cold can of soda pop sitting in a room of 75 degrees - condensation occurs and the can "sweats".
Using natural laws to present an argument of something intangible is not going to get you to the right answer.
But believe as you may, as you seem to be doing it already.
Self.
One article where Bill Gates mentions 'god' and the religious go nuts, Bill Gates now sells vaccines not software, he needs an angle.

Steve Jobs died from a completely treatable form of cancer prefering to treat it...'holistically'. Steve Jobs was and is a guru to many however sadly for him he became his own guru. He should have studied oncology rather than eastern mysticism and he'd probably still be here.

Tell me how you demonstrate the intangible?

I think I can sum up your belief system in 6 words;

"WOULDN'T IT BE COOL IF..."
Lost In Transition

New York, NY

#597626 Oct 2, 2013
MisterCharrington wrote:
<quoted text>
You (the religious) are the simply the equivalent of the bearded lady in a freak show.
I come to laugh at you and marvel that I was once in your club.
Congratulations on your....uhh....advancement.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597627 Oct 2, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
.. I see it that way because the word "buckwheat" has racial connotations and is a slur ..
So does "redneck", but I don't see it that way.

Capisce?

“Romans 8:1.”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#597628 Oct 2, 2013
Go figure. Another day off of school for the students in PA.
Lost In Transition

New York, NY

#597629 Oct 2, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
.. do you agree with Skom or Catcher ??..
No.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#597630 Oct 2, 2013
trifecta1 wrote:
But you credentials not line up with your attitude towards death.

You don't know my thoughts on death. You only know my thoughts on your unhealthy preoccupation with it, and the central place you give it in your worldview.
trifecta1 wrote:
Since you were so closely associated with the terminally being a doctor---then you know how painful and with extreme suffering and emotional stress >>dying<< can be. So how can you know that and compare death to "the greasy dump you take at the end"?? that not compute doctor.
If you still don't know, I don't think I can explain it to you.
trifecta1 wrote:
Euthanasia is quite common legally practiced in some sort of way in many 1st world nations ie: the Netherlands. Belgium. Switzerland even South America Colombia and to a less extent right here in the U.S in Oregon. Many of those people don't see death as "greasy dump". Many of them see it as a ethical professional and legal way to end their physical pain and suffering on their terms and not the terms of their terminal disease.
A dump is also ethical, can be painful, and sometimes needs help with its passage. You don't understand the simple,so you won't understand this however much I expand on it.
trifecta1 wrote:
They can legally end their life before whatever disease ravages and destroys their body with gruesome excruciating pain. As a Doctor as you say that deals with the terminal ill--I'm rather surprised at your views on end of life options and your views on Death.
As I said, you don't know my philosophy of death and dying, just my opinion of yours.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597631 Oct 2, 2013
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
You told us the guy was in the car.
That's an assault with a deadly weapon.
You lucked out.
Remember not to use a tire iron on your wife.
The court dropped it to vandalism.

You can't lethally assault a car, dude.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597632 Oct 2, 2013
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
So now you admit what I posted.
You were charged with assault with a deadly weapon.
And you went to court.
That's all I said, Mr. Racist.
Nope.

Let's see if I can make this a basic as possible, so that you can comprehend.

Arrested on assault with a deadly weapon.

Charged with vandalism.

Got it, "counselor"?

Since: May 11

Maidstone, UK

#597633 Oct 2, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
I guess this was the best you could do as related to this forum and my original post.
Carry on.
So when are we going to see you demonstrate the intangible?

I await this with great anticipation!

“Romans 8:1.”

Since: Aug 09

Location hidden

#597634 Oct 2, 2013
Epiphany2 wrote:
<quoted text>
"Don't let others pull you into their fights.....Pull them into your Peace"
Hope you have a peaceful and loving day HL.....
Hi Epi.

The Moody Blues concert lastnight was awesome. Better then they were the last time I saw them 2 years ago. They played for 3 hours. All of their hits plus many that I'd forgotten that they even did.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597635 Oct 2, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. there is no right or wrong. In the past, you admitted that, as a child, you were bombarded by hate messages found in the OT ..
.. do you deny that such messages influence your thought process ??..
.. sometimes I still think I knew God before my birth because I was raised Mormon. Such ideas never vanish entirely but I'm now able to recognize the fallacy of such frolic. If you want to stay in denial, that's your choice but my contention remains: you are the sum total of your experiences, especially childhood experiences and they influence your thought process ..
Yes, as a child I heard some OT, irrelevant shit that I didn't need to hear.

But I'm all growd up now and make my own decisions.

I cannot agree with the "especially" in your last sentence. I'd say "partly".

Are you especially influenced by your childhood experiences? I'm not.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597637 Oct 2, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
You watched the video! That was unexpected.
I did not. What was it?

I know the ACA is Obamacare.

I was born during the day...

...but it wasn't yesterday.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#597638 Oct 2, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
Phase changes of matter (liquid to gas or the reverse) are physical changes, not chemical changes.
<quoted text>
Those are pretty much opposites. If you're interested, I can elaborate:
Physiological sweating is an active process (meaning that it requires the expenditure of energy) by which heat is transferred from the body to the ambient environment by the evaporation of liquid from the surface of the body (meaning it becomes water vapor).
The other is a passive process in which the beads of liquid condense onto the can from water vapor in the atmosphere as heat is transferred from the ambient environment into it.
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
I guess I should've paid more attention in Science class. Thanks for setting me straight. Best regards,
My pleasure. We cover a diverse group of topics here.

There is no sin in being scientifically naïve unless you are using science to make a point, especially if your point is in trying to discredit science - a criticism that doesn't necessarily apply to you, at least not based on that post.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597639 Oct 2, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
I know. But the study God & Jesus are also ancient.
It aint necessarily so wrote:

You mean the study of the bible, archeological artifacts, and a handful of ancient historians, all of which argue against the existence of this "God" fellow and that Jesus was a god.
No.

I mean the study of God & Jesus.

Which is why I said the study of God & Jesus.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#597640 Oct 2, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
No, no, no. You made a derogatory comment about me putting cock in my mouth all say in reference to my rooster, Earl.
You got that problem, not me bucko.
You are still proving yourself to be a liar and fraud.

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