Why Should Jesus Love Me?

“BE BRAVE ENOUGH ”

Since: Oct 09

TO STEP IN MUD PUDDLES

#597331 Oct 1, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
But why credit faith for the things that you see and like? If faith made people better, it would make them all at least a little better, and none worse. Trifecta has enough faith for an army. It just makes him worse.
Some Christians are good people. I simply don't believe that their faith in Christian dogma makes them better people. We know that disposition is in large part inherited. We see that in the different types of animals. And we know that disposition is in large part related to how a person is treated.

*** shortened for space...sorry!
IANS...I know that you don't understand where I stand on religion...I approach it differently...maybe we are searching for two different outcomes.

I heard the same sermons preached from "the church" that all of these people did...I read the same Bible...said the same prayers. In the end it was my choice what I took away from that and how I used it.

Let's take for example the word "pervert" that some Christians use to describe homosexuals. They use that word because they choose to...they don't have to. Epi...Senecus...OYE...Al Garcia...heard the same messages preached by "the church"...they choose to not use those words.

They all heard the message that we "unbelievers" will burn in hell...some brandish that phrase around as often as they use "God Bless"...yet many would never dream of wearing that t-shirt.

I heard those messages over and over...I never bought in to that...maybe I didn't make a very good Christian because I didn't...I don't know.

Do I think that "the church" plays a role in all of this...yes...but only for those that would condemn another with or without religion...IMO...they use "faith" to justify their assholiness.

I could list many factors that came in to play in my decision to leave the church but the main one is...I could not look at my fellow man and see him in the terms that "the church" wanted me to see him as. I could not believe in a God that would want me to.

Even while I was a practicing Christian...I never saw God in the words printed in a book...the god that it spoke of was alien to me. I did however experience God as I walked through open fields...wandered down paths through the woods...cool breezes on my face...the kindness of a stranger...and even water droplets hitting the surface of a mud puddle...this was the God that I knew...not some monster that would torture someone because they happened to think differently. Like I said...not sure that I made a good Christian.

I won't say that the Bible (in part) wasn't a guide in my life...it was...even now I refer back to some of those verses...maybe paraphrased a bit now...but the meaning stays the same.

I came to this thread to hopefully share what we have in common and to better understand our differences...it hasn't worked out real well to be honest with you. I keep hoping...I think I need to re-assess my thinking.

What I don't get is why they don't understand...at one time...they were all "unbelievers"...they heard the hateful words...they felt the sting of those words...yet here some of them are...using those same ugly words on others...I wonder...did they forget...or are they convinced those hate filled messages are what frightened them in to becoming "believers".

So IMO...Christianity doesn't have to die...it just needs to become a little kinder...more compassionate...show more empathy...most of all realize that what they have chosen is not what I chose...and with my choice that does not make me any less worthy and any less valuable as a human being.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597332 Oct 1, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. my garbage disposal died last week so I PM'ed Catcher for help. He referred me to AINS who told me to PM Ben who asked me if I meant my computer recycle bin. After numerous PM's, Ben referred me to Trifecta who told me to pray ..
.. when it comes to home maintenance, these intellectuals are dense. Catcher thinks drywall is for large legal briefs, AIN says they're for billing statements, Ben thinks they're for computer monitors and Trifecta says they're good for stacks of bibles. And, they know absolutely nothing about garbage disposals ..
.. anyway, that's why I missed you ..
At least I'm good for something. I'll take it.

Are you sure it died? Sometimes a garbage disposer gets overworked or clogged. There's a red "reset" button on the bottom you could try before just deciding to replace it. Also, at the bottom, in the center, there's an Alan screw that you can manually turn the disposer to try & free it up.

(imagines the intellectuals googling that to verify lol)

What was the outcome for you?

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#597333 Oct 1, 2013
MisterCharrington wrote:
<quoted text>
"We have no proof of the fairy folk...yet"
"We have no proof that bigfoot doesn't like a nice steaming pot of dandelion coffee in the morning...yet"
"We have no proof that I am god...yet"
spot the weasel word.
You're arguing using something akin to the fallacy of "when did you stop beating your wife".
There is nothing to refute, your argument should be based on what you know and can justifiably prove, not something which has not been proven..."yet".
It's the usual bunch of fallacies which can be condensed into, "everything is true until it isn't" and "everything exists until it doesnt" or more specifically 'shifting the burden'.
Fair enough MC.

I'll ask you the same questions I asked AuraMyth - who chose not to answer them.

How much evidence is needed to prove that an after-life exists?

What evidence is considered "authenticated" and which are not?

Thanks for reading my post.

BTW - I am past the "yet" point....I'm now just waiting for people to accept the evidence that has been accumulated, so your angle on this is actually -well, just a personal perception/opinion.

Proof has been presented, people are the ones who choose to accept or deny it.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597334 Oct 1, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
I dare you to come here and say that!
LOL
This isn't a dating site, dude.

“BE BRAVE ENOUGH ”

Since: Oct 09

TO STEP IN MUD PUDDLES

#597335 Oct 1, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
At least I'm good for something. I'll take it.
Are you sure it died? Sometimes a garbage disposer gets overworked or clogged. There's a red "reset" button on the bottom you could try before just deciding to replace it. Also, at the bottom, in the center, there's an Alan screw that you can manually turn the disposer to try & free it up.
(imagines the intellectuals googling that to verify lol)
What was the outcome for you?
Though I am a woman...I knew all that...I don't have to google.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#597336 Oct 1, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
[...]
Interpretation is perception.
Perception is Self.
MisterCharrington wrote:
<quoted text>
...and reality is that which does not simply 'go away' when you stop believing in it.
Reality is not subjective and it exists independntly of what is in your head, you cannot change the colour of my tie which exists in reality; by an act of 'belief'(which is not an act of will anyway), it remains red even if you prefer it to be blue.
The stuff you choose to believe has no bearing on reality which exists regardless.
Perception is...self? LOL
"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent full of doubt".
Many use perception to make a reality of their own.

Others, use reality to create a perception, although it may or may not become true.

You wrote:
"by an act of 'belief'(which is not an act of will anyway)"
- belief is learned, which would also mean that the brain learned a process. To make the belief complete, one must put forth what they learned - which is ultimately - the will - of one's mind.

Yes MC - Self. Do you know what the Self is?
- If not, consider "Self" as any action or ability that a person actually makes or does. Yes anything.

If you dispute this, then please state an action that is taken by the human body that does not require the person to do something.
- FYI - I don't beleive any god can control me - without ME taking up an action to either do his/her bidding or not.

That is Self.

Learn it, live it, love it. We only get one life to express it the way we choose.

No religion or "God" required.

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#597337 Oct 1, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
"God is imaginary" is YOUR reality, son. Not mine. That's YOUR manufactured belief.
Since neither you nor I can show positive proof of our belief, it proves the both of us have "manufactured" our belief.
The only difference I haven't "manufactured" something you cannot see, but you have. When it comes time to "prove" the claim, I don't have to do anything. But you will be there making up some excuses.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#597338 Oct 1, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
Prove it!
:o)

Wrong forum - that would be the "Prove There's a God" forum down the hall.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#597339 Oct 1, 2013
Hey MC - this is a good starting point for information related to the Self.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self

Simplified for all.

Cheers!

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597340 Oct 1, 2013
AnnieJ wrote:
<quoted text>
Though I am a woman...I knew all that...I don't have to google.
You're a one-of-a-kind kinda gal.

Kudos.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597341 Oct 1, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
Since neither you nor I can show positive proof of our belief, it proves the both of us have "manufactured" our belief.
The only difference I haven't "manufactured" something you cannot see, but you have. When it comes time to "prove" the claim, I don't have to do anything. But you will be there making up some excuses.
Aura Mytha wrote:
I haven't "manufactured" something you cannot see
"God is imaginary" is your manufactured belief.

And now you claim that's something I can see like you do, too.

Show me.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#597342 Oct 1, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
:o)
Wrong forum - that would be the "Prove There's a God" forum down the hall.
That's been overrun by the Reverend Anal virus.

It constantly posts mistranslations and misquotes of the Bible.

It's hard to get around.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#597343 Oct 1, 2013
AnnieJ wrote:
<quoted text>
preached by "the church"...they choose to not use those words.

I could list many factors that came in to play in my decision to leave the church but the main one is...I could not look at my fellow man and see him in the terms that "the church" wanted me to see him as. I could not believe in a God that would want me to.
Even while I was a practicing Christian...I never saw God in the words printed in a book...the god that it spoke of was alien to me. I did however experience God as I walked through open fields...wandered down paths through the woods...cool breezes on my face...the kindness of a stranger...and even water droplets hitting the surface of a mud puddle...this was the God that I knew...not some monster that would torture someone because they happened to think differently. Like I said...not sure that I made a good Christian.
I won't say that the Bible (in part) wasn't a guide in my life...it was...even now I refer back to some of those verses...maybe paraphrased a bit now...but the meaning stays the same.

in to becoming "believers".
So IMO...Christianity doesn't have to die...it just needs to become a little kinder...more compassionate...show more empathy...most of all realize that what they have chosen is not what I chose...and with my choice that does not make me any less worthy and any less valuable as a human being.
Topix IMO is not exactly the most accurate microcosm to real life

While some of the situations may be found in real life, they are found in the extremes. When is the last time anybody was ever told they were going to hell by a Christian in real life. For that matter, when is the last time an unbeliever went up to a Christian in real life and told them their God is evil and the religion sucks?

What you are talking about applies to less probably 1% of Christians. I personally have never heard a Christian tell someone else they are going to hell in real life. And while their are cases where people say it or preach hate from the pulpit, it is hardly the norm

What you are really saying IMHO is you want to see less than 1% of the Christian extremists change for the better for you to have a better view of Christianity overall. How realistic do you think that is?

Why not instead take comfort in people like Epi...Senecus...OYE...Al Garcia, etc and know any group filled with milliosn of people is inevitably going to have extremes to both sides and everything in-between?

If you need Christianity to produce all Epi and Als for you to see it in a better light then what chance does it have? And if that standard is applied to unbelievers, what hope is there for middle ground? If we judge all unbelievers by their worst examples, who would bother with trying to find a middle ground

What you say sounds nice but it isn't very realistic or even fair IMO. There are millions of people made better through their faith. If you need every member to understand things as you seem them and to act in a way that you think is right then of course you will be disappointed. Its never going to happen. But you could take solace in the fact you have plenty of examples of people that do

There is a saying in NA/AA that says stick with the winners. Don't be around those who are negative or can't work the program and will fail. The same should be true of your faith. Why you let people not working their faith have any effect on you is what I don't understand. What they say in NA/AA is people who don't stick with the winners want an excuse to go back to using. Is it possible, in any way, you wanted an excuse to leave? You had people who you would have fit in with and followed your faith that way or even by yourself. Yet you allowed the people who didn't represent how you think to play a role in your faith. I don't understand why

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#597344 Oct 1, 2013
AnnieJ wrote:
<quoted text>
Though I am a woman...I knew all that...I don't have to google.
I am confused by this comment

You know he has been attacked for misogynistic

This would give the impression he suggested a woman would need to Google it but he didn't say anything about women

HL actually made what I thought was a nice and funny post to him in which she said

" when it comes to home maintenance, these intellectuals are dense."

RR was simply playing off that comment

Whether you meant it or not, that post read like you felt the need to clarify to him that you don't need to look it up despite being a woman even though he didn't say anything to suggest that

IDK, maybe its just me. I know it will probably be explained as totally innocuous but given how common knowledge it is that he has been gone after for his views on women, it just seemed like a strange thing to say to me under the circumstances

Since: May 11

Ashford, UK

#597345 Oct 1, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Fair enough MC.
I'll ask you the same questions I asked AuraMyth - who chose not to answer them.
How much evidence is needed to prove that an after-life exists?
What evidence is considered "authenticated" and which are not?
Thanks for reading my post.
BTW - I am past the "yet" point....I'm now just waiting for people to accept the evidence that has been accumulated, so your angle on this is actually -well, just a personal perception/opinion.
Proof has been presented, people are the ones who choose to accept or deny it.
once again....

What the religious and the irreligious consider to be 'evidence' differs wildly.

There are two possible positions. there is an afterlife, or there is no afterlife. The positive position that "there is an afterlife" attracts the burden.

The one bearing the burden has to meet the standard of those they are trying to convince(to change their mind) if those items which they consider evidence are not to the required standard then no mind will be changed.

How does one falsify the afterlife? How does one repeatably test something for which there is no evidence anyway other than anacdotal?

I have a pathway to a frozen wilderness inhabited by fantastic creatures at the back of my wardrobe...which only I can see. You cannot prove otherwise, and I dare you to try.

“"None shall pass"”

Since: Jul 11

There

#597346 Oct 1, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
This isn't a dating site, dude.
Just because you are impotent doesn't mean the rest of us are.

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#597347 Oct 1, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>

:)
"If that was the case,
do you think you are helping the problem or making it worse?"

No impact nor is it relevant.

"So it would seem it is you that it judging right?"

Not at all, we all make our own decisions mostly we do not share them.

" Unless you deem otherwise, it is the norm"

Absolutely, yes it my decision to use the comment button doofus.

"you will simply respond with a childish comment?"

I might, after all it's a free country and this IS for my entertainment.

" While I appreciate the attempt at honesty here
I am confused as to the standard you apply."

You're confused if you thought there was a standard in topix.

"Most people tend to insult posts that are meant to be
insulting to others. On a regular basis you take posts not insulting to anyone, where people are simply
trying to express themselves about something and reply with a childish insult. What is the point exactly of
doing that even to non-confrontational posts?"

I rarely insult people, I may insult an idea or make attempts to humor people but...
It's apparent you take this forum far far too seriously and indeed hold grudges, that's not healthy. I'll try not to bother you anymore, you have issues and are way to serious about everything.
You should see a doctor to get a script for Valium or something.
Don't go away mad ...just go away.
Bongo

United States

#597348 Oct 1, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. my garbage disposal died last week so I PM'ed Catcher for help. He referred me to AINS who told me to PM Ben who asked me if I meant my computer recycle bin. After numerous PM's, Ben referred me to Trifecta who told me to pray ..
.. when it comes to home maintenance, these intellectuals are dense. Catcher thinks drywall is for large legal briefs, AIN says they're for billing statements, Ben thinks they're for computer monitors and Trifecta says they're good for stacks of bibles. And, they know absolutely nothing about garbage disposals ..
.. anyway, that's why I missed you ..
You could be the new rosie odonnel

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#597349 Oct 1, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>

Don't go away mad ...just go away.
You don't have the ability to make me do either

You have zero ability to effect my mood negatively

I find you funny...in a useless sort of way

:)

Since: May 11

Ashford, UK

#597350 Oct 1, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
[...]
Interpretation is perception.
Perception is Self.
<quoted text>
Many use perception to make a reality of their own.
Others, use reality to create a perception, although it may or may not become true.
You wrote:
"by an act of 'belief'(which is not an act of will anyway)"
- belief is learned, which would also mean that the brain learned a process. To make the belief complete, one must put forth what they learned - which is ultimately - the will - of one's mind.
Yes MC - Self. Do you know what the Self is?
- If not, consider "Self" as any action or ability that a person actually makes or does. Yes anything.
If you dispute this, then please state an action that is taken by the human body that does not require the person to do something.
- FYI - I don't beleive any god can control me - without ME taking up an action to either do his/her bidding or not.
That is Self.
Learn it, live it, love it. We only get one life to express it the way we choose.
No religion or "God" required.
Many use perception to make a reality of their own? They're known as THE MENTALLY ILL.

No...belief occurs when enough facts and evidence have coalesced to cause somone to accept something to be true. Belief is not an act of will.

Force yourself to believe something which you currently do not believe and tell me how it worked for you.

Do you believe that sweating is an act of will? I have no sweat switch.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Top Stories Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
News Plurality of Americans think Trump is failing 10 min 07 Mustang 7,161
The Christian Atheist debate (Jun '15) 19 min Aura Mytha 123,327
Poll Was 9/11 a conspiracy?? (Oct '07) 2 hr onemale 286,526
Prove there's a god. (Mar '08) 5 hr Huh 982,215
_ VATICAN to get 'Legal Right' to TEMPLE MOUNT _ 5 hr NewsJune2017 YTube 1
america needs more TRUTH AND JUSTICE 5 hr hacksaw 1
News Roman Catholic church only true church, says Va... (Jul '07) 6 hr Born Again Holy C... 681,739
More from around the web