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557,181 - 557,200 of 599,883 Comments Last updated 7 min ago

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#582970 Sep 1, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually they are. Under Free Speech. Acting illegally based on their beliefs is NOT protected.
Even the KKK and NAMBLA have rights. Their members have the same rights as every other citizen.
Well we agree on that anyway

Which is basically my entire point

The range of what people could get forced to do is limitless as it literally will include all groups of citizens and all groups of ideologies

We will not be able to refuse a job based on anything that has been protected from class, to religion, to ideology, to anything

And for what? To try to force someone to take their wedding pictures

I don't get it my friend

Sorry if my patience was on the short side but I jsut find this whole thing baffling

Got some stuff to do but will be checking in still probably

“Love much, trust none”

Since: Jul 11

There

#582971 Sep 1, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
If people can tell me with a straight face they would be arguing the same on defense of NAZIs or the KKK or NAMBLA ....
The courts already have. They have the same rights and limitations your church does.

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#582972 Sep 1, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. stinking homes are a protected class ??..
The people in the home are.

They could just as easily claim discrimination just like the lesbians did to that photographer.

“MEET ROSEMARY-She Seeks Home”

Since: Oct 10

With Established Harem

#582973 Sep 1, 2013
River Tam wrote:
<quoted text>
Don't lie.
Break the law.
It's the Christian way.
.. and, after you break the law, contact the Alliance Defense Fund for free legal help on your civil right to discriminate based on religious beliefs ..

BIG SMOOCH & MORE PROMISED

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#582974 Sep 1, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
The business in question was NOT an independent contractor:
"A person is independent if they enter into a contract to perform a service and that person providing the service is free from direction and control."
^^^^ From your link.
All "independent contractors" do is remove much of the liability of the contractor. Had the photographer been an "independent contractor" then the Photography studio would have been held harmless and the photographer would have been the subject of the court case.
<quoted text>
No independent contractor is free from direction and control in the sense of what work they do

Someone can't hire my brother to build a wall and instead he paves over the lawn

Direction and control means they are their own boss

Part of that direction and control comes from deciding what contracts to enter into

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#582975 Sep 1, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
What law states independent contractors can not refuse to accept a job for any reason? Look at third one down
Independent contractor information for employers
"Chooses the work to accept and has capacity to refuse an assignment"
http://www.cbs.state.or.us/wcd/compliance/ic_...
Do take note of the last paragraph....

"Can someone become an independent contractor by simply forming a business entity, such as a corporation, partnership or limited liability company?
No. The creation of a business entity does not, by itself, establish that the entity provides services as an independent contractor. The entity must still meet all of the requirements under the law to be considered independent contractors."
There are also restrictions and provisions concerning "federal" and/or "state" regulations.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#582976 Sep 1, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes.
Just like a business run by a KKK member has to serve blacks.
My lord! Don't you guys get that it is a two way street ?
But the situation is not

You are comparing apples to oranges

Nobody can tell someone, you must take a job at a restaurant that serves blacks

But now you want it to be legal to tell a contractor what job they can take

Nobody, for any reason, is supposed to be forced to take a job

Which is why an independent contractor has always reserved the right of refusal

Until now

Buckle your seat-belts

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#582977 Sep 1, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
The courts already have. They have the same rights and limitations your church does.
And those rights have never included being able to force independent contractors to work for them

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's Teapot

#582978 Sep 1, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, shit. It's that easy??
Just lie.
Then you're not discriminating.
O_o
The atheist morals abound....
Has nothing to do with lying. The person has the right to decline the job, they can't decline the job based upon the protected persons as defined by anti-discrimination laws.

“Love much, trust none”

Since: Jul 11

There

#582979 Sep 1, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
No not like a Sear's catalog
And its not a straw man
That's what is so scary is that you don't get that
No business can be forced into illegal activities.

No photographer has to work in child pornography.

“Love much, trust none”

Since: Jul 11

There

#582980 Sep 1, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
You already accepted the job based on the condition you would teach students
If someone came to you and said I want you to work at NAMBLA and you said, what time do you want me there, I say shame on you
And I think that you would take that right to refuse from someone is ridiculous and so short-sighted
If my school contracted to provided classes to NAMBLA I would either have to teach them or quit my job. End of conversation.

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's Teapot

#582981 Sep 1, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
You CAN turn them down, you said so yourself.
You taught us that all you gotta do is lie about it and no one knows it's discrimination.
It isn't lying to say you are not accepting jobs, new clients, etc...

It is, however, bigotry and discrimination to say you won't do something for someone based upon a protected status.

“MEET ROSEMARY-She Seeks Home”

Since: Oct 10

With Established Harem

#582982 Sep 1, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually they are. Under Free Speech. Acting illegally based on their beliefs is NOT protected.
Even the KKK and NAMBLA have rights. Their members have the same rights as every other citizen.
.. yes, their free speech is protected but I do not think they are protected classes. I've asked Catch to clarify ..

“Love much, trust none”

Since: Jul 11

There

#582983 Sep 1, 2013
lil whispers wrote:
Storm coming in closing down too much lightning. laters.
Be safe!
Doctor REALITY

Hot Springs Village, AR

#582984 Sep 1, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
No business can be forced into illegal activities.
No photographer has to work in child pornography.
Do you not do ANYTHING else with your life??!!

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#582985 Sep 1, 2013
Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text>
Do take note of the last paragraph....
"Can someone become an independent contractor by simply forming a business entity, such as a corporation, partnership or limited liability company?
No. The creation of a business entity does not, by itself, establish that the entity provides services as an independent contractor. The entity must still meet all of the requirements under the law to be considered independent contractors."
There are also restrictions and provisions concerning "federal" and/or "state" regulations.
Yeah it normally has to do with how they file taxes, if their business is legalized, do they have employees, if so so are they licensed and bonded, are they covered under workman's comp and unemployment, etc, etc

Someone can't just say "I'm an independent contractor" because they do the work themselves. But if they are set up properly, both tax-wise and licensed or bonded or whatever else they need, then they are good to go
Doctor REALITY

Hot Springs Village, AR

#582986 Sep 1, 2013
Skombolis wrote:
<quoted text>
And those rights have never included being able to force independent contractors to work for them
Hello, Skombolis. How's your life 'in Christ' these days? Hey, you never did tell me what that 'GF...I' or whatever it was, meant. Explain.

“Love much, trust none”

Since: Jul 11

There

#582987 Sep 1, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. stinking homes are a protected class ??..
From the sublime to the ridiculous.
Such antics would get them contempt of court charges in a real courtroom.

I have watched the Supreme Courts in action.
This is just 'barroom lawyering'.

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#582988 Sep 1, 2013
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
Has nothing to do with lying. The person has the right to decline the job, they can't decline the job based upon the protected persons as defined by anti-discrimination laws.
You're too smart to backpedal. Don't start now.

You wrote:

"You know none of this would have ever happened if the photographer had simply said something to the effect:

"I'm sorry, I'm not taking any jobs at the moment"

---

Which is a lie.

To hide the fact that the photographer doesn't find it moral for gays to wed and chooses not to take on that job.

I really don't see the big deal here.

If a photographer refused device to me, for whatever reason, I'd simply hire a different photographer and move on.

Since: Mar 09

Location hidden

#582989 Sep 1, 2013
BenAdam wrote:
<quoted text>
No business can be forced into illegal activities.
No photographer has to work in child pornography.
I know, which is why I never said illegal

There are plenty of pictures that could be suggestive with children that are still legal

And NAMBLA and everything it stands for disgusts me

And my disgust doesn't count any more than someone else's or vice versa. So the people cheering this on are also making sure contractors would have to accept jobs from NAMBLA and the KKK and gay-hate groups and so on

A contractor or an artist can no longer say, I don't want them job based on moral objections and you can't force me to take the job. Apparently New Mexico says they can

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