Why Should Jesus Love Me?

“~ Prince of Peace~”

Since: Apr 08

~ And the greatest is LOVE~

#560271 Jul 20, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
I find nothing objectionable in that, Le-Le, and am very happy for you that your faith edifies you rather than the alternative. People like you, Grace Walker, and Al Garcia help clarify for me the full spectrum of what's out there, and which parts of it I should despise, and which parts I should not. It is clear to me that my target should be the church, not the individual believer.
And to you Christians that defend the church, it is not your Christianity per se that I object to. If I don't mind that in some of you, I don't mind it in any of you. It's the hive mentality, and individuals with other ethical deficiencies. And for that, I blame your church. The religious people that distance themselves from the collective are better, healthier people, whereas you zealous defenders of "the body" are the worst.
Okay.....Group Hug?????

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“~ Prince of Peace~”

Since: Apr 08

~ And the greatest is LOVE~

#560272 Jul 20, 2013
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
I think they should switch the old style light bulbs for the new LED kind. Then there would be very few dim bulbs, because LEDs last a lot longer.
Very true Tide....But they are more expensive

I like the Lips.....

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“~ Prince of Peace~”

Since: Apr 08

~ And the greatest is LOVE~

#560273 Jul 20, 2013
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
Threeway hug!
LOL.....

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Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#560274 Jul 20, 2013
Epiphany2 wrote:
Very true Tide....But they are more expensive
I like the Lips.....
They like you.

:)

“~ Prince of Peace~”

Since: Apr 08

~ And the greatest is LOVE~

#560275 Jul 20, 2013
Epiphany2 wrote:
<quoted text>
Very true Tide....But they are more expensive
I like the Lips.....
Thanks Tide.....

:-)

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RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#560276 Jul 20, 2013
Tide with Beach wrote:
I consider everything that exists, and everything that happens, natural.
So then you also find homophobia to be natural.

THAT is my only point in this debate.
Homophobia is unique to humans, but is not a human universal. Same sex sexual attraction is not unique to humans, and is a human universal.
Agreed.
To understand that disgust is a product of cultural conditioning, and use that as justification for a prejudice against a group, is first irrational, and second, unethical. Usually, when a good person figures out that they didn't actually have good reason for something they did or something they believe, they reevaluate their position.
Also agreed. So how do we help people along? Specifically for me, how can I get my pops to change his mind and quit saying "f*ggot" all the time?
I gave a list of other things that are also observed in nature.
We would have to define what normal would mean for the expression of homophobia either in the entire human population or in one specific society. Is a 51% majority normal? I don't know. We don't see any expression of homophobia outside of humanity, and we don't see it in all societies.
There are several ways to look at it. Same sex sexual relations occur in many species, but opposition to that behavior is only found in some specific humans, from specific cultures. In that way, it's not normal at all.
I get ya there, but like I said, some societies eat dog for lunch, other societies fined that repulsive and make it illegal. Would you say that either society is 'right' or 'normal'?
Middle ground? No.
There's the higher ground, and there's the gutter where homophobes live. They can stay there, or become better. There will be no compromise from those who are in the right.
That's pretty harsh, man.

Because a person, or group of people don't agree with you, you label them as scumbags?

Different doesn't necessarily mean better or worse. That's what we need to teach.
I LIKE THAT!
You're in the wrong head space if you are thinking of these two things as equal.
What? Why? I think a homophobic person is as natural as a heterophobic person....
I make myself an authority on it. If I'm not, who can be? When I express my views on the issue, I try to support them with evidence and argument, hoping that others who value evidence and argument do the work too.
Granted, but I don't think one can make themselves an authority.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#560277 Jul 20, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
.. yes, marriage for humans (one partner) is unnatural and a relatively new concept that was implemented to extend certain legal privileges ..
So.... It's unnatural but still ok.
.. no. It's because our society demands it. Do you need clothes in CA this time of year? No. Wouldn't you like to bask outside stark naked on a mild Sunday morning? I certainly would. If you were born in God's image, why is nudity unnatural ??..
I think you're on to something. Our society has been conditioned to be ashamed, embarrassed, and offended by nudity.

I know when my kids were young, they had no problem running around butt naked. They weren't conditioned yet...

huh...
.. because you don't see nude women everyday, do you tie naked boobs to sex? Go to a nudist camp and within 10 minutes, you won't be staring at boobs ..
More wisdom that is HL.

*bows*
.. in some middle eastern countries, men greet each other by kissing on the lips. In Western culture, it's taboo. You have your mindset because of culture and religion ..
Ya, you're probably right. When I see people do the kissing greeting, where they kiss one cheek, then the other, I'm like O_o

I'm getting it, HL. I appreciate your feedback.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#560278 Jul 20, 2013
Tide with Beach wrote:
I was never talking about rights. This is becoming an RRism.
Oh. Sorry, when you said "Will you tolerate it to go unchallenged?", I assumed that. My bad.

But "RRism"? I dig that. lol
Do you think there are only two options? Do you think you have to either keep quiet or take away rights?
No, they can also learn tolerance or we can wait for them to die out....
I disagree.
I also need you to tell me that you do not equate legality with morality. Please.
No sir, I do not equate the two. I see your point. I concede that.
"They" can close their eyes, or look the other way, or stay out of gay bars.
It still grosses me out to see two guys kissing, but I understand why. That response does not say anything about the act of two guys kissing. It says I grew up in a culture that stigmatizes male homosexuality. I have NO problem seeing two girls kissing.
So it grosses you out to see two guys kissing? Is that religious indoctrination or societal (for you)?

Why no problem seeing two girls kiss? It's just as gay... What's the deal with that?(and I don't mean just with you, that does seem to be a 'norm' nowadays)

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#560279 Jul 20, 2013
Epiphany2 wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh....RR is ornery.....That's for sure (IMO)
Hey, I provide a valuable public service.

RRism.

RiversideRedneck

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#560280 Jul 20, 2013
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
Retaliating with anti-gay insults isn't helping matters.
And if they aren't anti-gay, they aren't insulting, are they?
And if they aren't insulting, what's the point of making the statements?
I understand that it's hard to let of old habits.
You can leave it as a disagreement, or you can contribute to escalation. See how free your will is.
I read that three times.

Then again.

Damn you and your logic.

RR needs this to sink in.

I'll be back...
simplyput

Aurora, CO

#560281 Jul 20, 2013
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. yes, marriage for humans (one partner) is unnatural and a relatively new concept that was implemented to extend certain legal privileges ..
<quoted text>
.. no. It's because our society demands it. Do you need clothes in CA this time of year? No. Wouldn't you like to bask outside stark naked on a mild Sunday morning? I certainly would. If you were born in God's image, why is nudity unnatural ??..
.. because you don't see nude women everyday, do you tie naked boobs to sex? Go to a nudist camp and within 10 minutes, you won't be staring at boobs ..
<quoted text>

.. in some middle eastern countries, men greet each other by kissing on the lips. In Western culture, it's taboo. You have your mindset because of culture and religion ..
That was a silly question HL--Nudity is not unatural and has nothing to do with made in God's image. Going NUDE would be disrespectful to the public and to children onlookers.

Just because we don't need our clothes on in certain areas , doesn't mean that the nudity under the clothes is unatural. That too was a silly analogy.

Our "Mindset" is what is within us that tells us what is right or wrong to do---it would be wrong and disrespectable to go around nude , even in your own home when children or company is around.

I personally think 'nudist colonies are wrong to go to also, and disrespectable place.

Respect is what is missing in the world today.

“MEET KIKI -She Seeks Home”

Since: Oct 10

With Established Harem

#560282 Jul 20, 2013
Epiphany2 wrote:
<quoted text>
Okay.....Group Hug?????
.. are you suggesting a group orgy ??..

.. by chance do you have a hot tub ??..

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#560283 Jul 20, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
So then you also find homophobia to be natural.
THAT is my only point in this debate.
I find everything that exists to be natural.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Also agreed. So how do we help people along? Specifically for me, how can I get my pops to change his mind and quit saying "f*ggot" all the time?
I don't know your pops, so I couldn't tell you.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
I get ya there, but like I said, some societies eat dog for lunch, other societies fined that repulsive and make it illegal. Would you say that either society is 'right' or 'normal'?
If you kill the dog to eat it, and you have alternative sources for food, that would be morally inferior to utilizing other sources of food that you don't have to kill. I recognize Veganism as the morally superior diet, even though I'm not a Vegan.

I would really like it if scientists could come up with a good method for creating inexpensive synthetic meat products.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
That's pretty harsh, man.
Because a person, or group of people don't agree with you, you label them as scumbags?
No, people can disagree with me and still posit something respectable. Homophobia is unjustifiable, once you get past the cultural conditioning. It's understandable that people are homophobic, it's just not respectable for them to remain that way in the face of education.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Granted, but I don't think one can make themselves an authority.
Most of what we consider authority is imaginary to begin with. I make myself an authority by being convincing.

The authority of our government is predicated by the will of the people to give it. If enough people disagree, they can take that authority away.

“MEET KIKI -She Seeks Home”

Since: Oct 10

With Established Harem

#560284 Jul 20, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
So.... It's unnatural but still ok.
<quoted text>
I think you're on to something. Our society has been conditioned to be ashamed, embarrassed, and offended by nudity.
I know when my kids were young, they had no problem running around butt naked. They weren't conditioned yet...
huh...
<quoted text>
More wisdom that is HL.
*bows*
<quoted text>
Ya, you're probably right. When I see people do the kissing greeting, where they kiss one cheek, then the other, I'm like O_o
I'm getting it, HL. I appreciate your feedback.
.. I'm impressed ..
Ol Salt

Windermere, FL

#560285 Jul 20, 2013
Excerpt,
Happy Lesbo wrote:
.. because you don't see nude women everyday, do you tie naked boobs to sex? Go to a nudist camp and within 10 minutes, you won't be staring at boobs ..
Wrong!
And I'll make it even easier ...
If what you say is correct; why don't titty bars have revolving doors?
Playalinda Beach, Canaveral National Seashore, Fl.
Staring at naked people doesn't wear off in a matter of minutes ...for the men or the women.

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#560286 Jul 20, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Oh. Sorry, when you said "Will you tolerate it to go unchallenged?", I assumed that. My bad.
But "RRism"? I dig that. lol
I'm only talking about opposing homophobia whenever it rears its ugly head, not chopping that head off.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
No, they can also learn tolerance or we can wait for them to die out....
I'm gonna use several tools. Ridicule is the most effective. I don't like waiting.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
No sir, I do not equate the two. I see your point. I concede that.
Thank you sir.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
So it grosses you out to see two guys kissing? Is that religious indoctrination or societal (for you)?
Why no problem seeing two girls kiss? It's just as gay... What's the deal with that?(and I don't mean just with you, that does seem to be a 'norm' nowadays)
Christianity has been influencing American culture since there was an America. That's where homophobia in American came from, in the largest part. I piked up the disgust from cultural conditioning, being inside American culture, which includes Christianity as a source.

It's interesting to note the cultural differences between male and female homosexuality. It's very complex. I can think of a few reasons why, historically, the two variations evolved separately as cultural concepts. It's beyond my scope right now though.

“MEET KIKI -She Seeks Home”

Since: Oct 10

With Established Harem

#560287 Jul 20, 2013
simplyput wrote:
<quoted text>
That was a silly question HL--Nudity is not unatural and has nothing to do with made in God's image. Going NUDE would be disrespectful to the public and to children onlookers.
.. if nudity is natural, in what way is it disrespectful to the public and children ??..
simplyput wrote:
<quoted text>Just because we don't need our clothes on in certain areas , doesn't mean that the nudity under the clothes is unatural. That too was a silly analogy.
.. oh, ok ..
simplyput wrote:
<quoted text>Our "Mindset" is what is within us that tells us what is right or wrong to do---it would be wrong and disrespectable to go around nude , even in your own home when children or company is around.
.. our culture has made nudity unacceptable. There is nothing inherently wrong with nudity since the human body is beautiful ..

.. men can walk around shirtless, women cannot. To me, that's somewhat unfair. Somewhere along the line, a woman's breasts were sexualized. Do you know how that happened ??..
simplyput wrote:
<quoted text>
Respect is what is missing in the world today.
.. it begins with you. Can you respect my thoughts on nudity? I can respect yours because I understand your mindset ..

Since: Jan 11

Location hidden

#560290 Jul 20, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
I read that three times.
Then again.
Damn you and your logic.
RR needs this to sink in.
I'll be back...
River says that sometimes learning sucks.

“MEET KIKI -She Seeks Home”

Since: Oct 10

With Established Harem

#560292 Jul 20, 2013
Ol Salt wrote:
Excerpt,
<quoted text>Wrong!
And I'll make it even easier ...
If what you say is correct; why don't titty bars have revolving doors?
Playalinda Beach, Canaveral National Seashore, Fl.
Staring at naked people doesn't wear off in a matter of minutes ...for the men or the women.
.. maybe for you but not the nudist ..

“MEET KIKI -She Seeks Home”

Since: Oct 10

With Established Harem

#560295 Jul 20, 2013
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>**PORTIONS SNIPPED**It's interesting to note the cultural differences between male and female homosexuality. It's very complex. I can think of a few reasons why, historically, the two variations evolved separately as cultural concepts. It's beyond my scope right now though.
.. you are sooooooo on target today ..

.. the difference between male/female homosexual acceptance? A harem comes to mind ..

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