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Since: Oct 12

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#556024
Jul 11, 2013
 

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Black Thunder 42 wrote:
<quoted text>
OK LW.
I am serious about the hail. I was going to ask you to do some tests...and I could probably tell you how and why you had the "episode". I think I already know, but would just like to verify it with actual evidence.
G-NITE.
Sorry BT I just thought you were missin with me and did not believe what I wrote you about this storm and what goes on out here. I pretty thicked skinned about being fluffed off really quit use to it. But if test is what you want the next one comes thru I will grab some hailstones.You might share what you already know with me.

“Michin yeoja”

Since: Oct 10

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#556025
Jul 11, 2013
 

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lil whispers wrote:
<quoted text>
Well When you can walk in my shoes and carry my load of responsibilities then you can question the person who cities those scriptures. But until then I owe you nothing as a response.
You're kidding, right?

When you walk in my shoe, then you can dismiss me.

Until then, I will question your scriptures.

Would you like another Simpson quote?

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

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#556026
Jul 11, 2013
 

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Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey! I met with a brother of mine last night and he disturbingly spoke of how he used to break into houses and treat people bad, etc., but that belief in God and Jesus turned him around. So we have this lost kid, becomes criminal, gives that up b/c of religious experience. I began wondering that, if religions were removed tomorrow, what kind of social institution could fulfill that role - clearly the emotional and spiritual experiences motivated this young man to adjust his life (filled him with guilt and horror at his actions). It's hard for me to imagine an atheist institution being so compelling.
I remember a guy whose brother was an alcoholic. He wanted to bring back prohibition, because it might have helped his brother. He wasn't concerned with the devastation that that policy had created.

I'll bet that we can find ways to deal with people like your brother without having to suffer the other effects of the church. And maybe with a predominantly humanist culture embodying humanist principles and values, we will see less crime than we do in a Christian culture. Statistics support that optimism. Have you seen how the murder rate has fallen by almost half in the US during the same period that irreligiosity doubled?

According to http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/uscrime.h... , the murder total in America peaked in 1991 at 24,700,and fell to a modern minimum of 14,612 in 2011. There were 252 million Americans in 1991 compared to 311 million in 2011 making the respective murder rates 9.8 per 100,000 in 1991, and 4.7 per 100,000 in 2011 - less than half.

At the same time, according to the American Religious Identification Survey at http://www.dawahskills.com/skills-tools/ameri... , the total number of adults identifying as Christian fell from 151 million out of 175 million adults (86.2%) in 1990 to 173 million out out of 228 million adults (76.0%) in 2008. During the same period, "nones" and "no religion" rose from 14 million (8.2%) to 34 million (15.0%)-almost double.

I think that we will likely all benefit by the further dimunition of the church.

Since: Oct 12

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#556027
Jul 11, 2013
 

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River Tam wrote:
<quoted text>
You're kidding, right?
When you walk in my shoe, then you can dismiss me.
Until then, I will question your scriptures.
Would you like another Simpson quote?
Your simpson quotes is a waste of time.
Yep your dismissed Susie Q.

“Michin yeoja”

Since: Oct 10

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#556028
Jul 11, 2013
 

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lil whispers wrote:
<quoted text>
Your simpson quotes is a waste of time.
Yep your dismissed Susie Q.
Suit your self.

I was being nice.

Have you met Alice?

Since: Oct 12

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#556029
Jul 11, 2013
 

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Good night BT look for you tomorrow.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

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#556030
Jul 11, 2013
 

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RiversideRedneck wrote:
That [Googling "decline in Christianity"] was "About 10,600,000" [hits], not 14 million. Type in "rise of Christianity", you get "About 17,900,000 results". huh...
"Huh" is right.

The rise of Christianity is a historical matter, and is not the same thing as Christianity being on the rise today. Type "rise IN Christianity" with quote marks (Google changes it to "rise of Christianity" if you don't) and you get about 185,000 hits, about 2% of 10.6 million.

And these were the first five hits, still mostly on the "rise OF Christianity," and none about any alleged present rise IN Christianity. All were about the history of Christianity:

Search Results - About 185,000 results (0.34 seconds)

[1] Chapter 10: The Rise of Christianity
www.rc255.will.k12.il.us/rcms255/textbooks/do... ;

[2] Rise in Christianity Era - YouTube
www.youtube.com/watch...

[3] Factors for the rise of Christianity - WikiAnswers
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Factors_for_the_ris...
The two biggest factors for the rise of Christianity were the work of important early missionaries and the simple appeal of Christianity. The one biggest early ...

[4] Ancient rome rise christianity study sets and study tools | Quizlet
http://quizlet.com/subject/ancient-rome-rise-...
A list of free Ancient rome rise christianity study sets. Use our

[5] The Rise In Christianity Free Essays 1 - 20
http://www.studymode.com/subjects/the-rise-in... ;
Free Essays on The Rise In Christianity for students. Use our ...

“ Ah see's lanlubbers Cap'n BT!”

Since: Oct 10

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#556031
Jul 11, 2013
 

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lil whispers wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry BT I just thought you were missin with me and did not believe what I wrote you about this storm and what goes on out here. I pretty thicked skinned about being fluffed off really quit use to it. But if test is what you want the next one comes thru I will grab some hailstones.You might share what you already know with me.
UM...long story... If you have a "wild one" with all the fireworks, hail and extreme rain etc. Note the date and time.
I would like for you to slice a few of them in half, and count the "layers" it will be like an onion. Then check if there is any distinct coloring or dark coloration between those layers. Finally, "taste", with your tongue, the sliced stone and let me know if it tastes like bitters, alum or magnesia. Save the one's you have not opened or contaminated in a "freezer" bag. If you tell me what I want(expect) to hear,(I) will pay to have the uncontaminated sample(s) analysed at a "real" lab....they must remain frozen though.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

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#556032
Jul 11, 2013
 

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RiversideRedneck wrote:
That was "About 10,600,000", not 14 million. Type in "rise of Christianity", you get "About 17,900,000 results". huh...
G_O_D wrote:
The problem is I read both sides. You don't read a damn thing... not even the Bible. You are such clown.
I think you'll like my reply to that post. It was sleight of hand - switching the "rise IN Christianity" to the "rise OF Christianity" and comparing the number of hits to "decline in Christianity"

“You have blue shoes”

Since: Mar 11

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#556033
Jul 11, 2013
 

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Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
Christianity has already been "hopelessly corrupted" by humanism. It could not have survived in America without it.
It is ironic though, that the influence of humanism has created an enabling force of moderate Christians. I'd estimate that more than half of the moderates are only casual believers or culturally identifying themselves as Christian. They'll jump ship as soon as they see the winds changing. That is happening now.
With the internet, people are now having their beliefs openly challenged. When I was a Christian, I never experienced this. For the most part, a believer or professed believer will either shy away from such conversations, or dig in. Either way, this environment of free competition produces the expected result. Good ideas flourish, while bad ideas get flushed down the toilet.
As far as replacing the social institutions of religion, I would hope that we don't fall into the trap of trying to create a one-to-one replacement. I'd rather see moral and ethical systems separate from social systems. It's alright for us to be divided by common interests, but tying morality into that creates an environment where ideas cannot compete freely. People need to learn how to compartmentalize their ideas from their identity.
Boobies.
Breasts for Tide! Breasts for Tide!

Take care, Tide. I'm going to run away for now. Maybe back in a couple of months - miss you lots!

“You have blue shoes”

Since: Mar 11

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#556034
Jul 11, 2013
 

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Serah wrote:
<quoted text>
You brought to mind solitude and prisoners here;
***The jail cell conversion from “sinner to saint” or from nonbeliever to true believer is
awell-known,indeed almost clichéd character arch in feel-good fiction,history, and media accounts. Yet this dramatic example of a “quantum change”— a sudden identity transformation qualitatively different from the more common, incremental
changes in human development (see Miller & C’deBaca, 1994)—has received relatively little systematic attention in the social science literature (Clear et al., 1992).
http://johnjayresearch.org/cje/files/2012/10/... ***
Maybe some people end up in prison to find GOD?
I'm an atheist, ma'am, I wouldn't give credit to your last line. Rather, I believe religion accesses powerful human emotions through spiritual experience and metaphorical, ideal moralistic guidance. That jives with those who honestly feel guilty about how they hurt people.

I'm going to go for a few months, so I'm not going to work this out, but I think humanism could also teach morals.

“You have blue shoes”

Since: Mar 11

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#556035
Jul 11, 2013
 

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It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
I remember a guy whose brother was an alcoholic. He wanted to bring back prohibition, because it might have helped his brother. He wasn't concerned with the devastation that that policy had created.
I'll bet that we can find ways to deal with people like your brother without having to suffer the other effects of the church. And maybe with a predominantly humanist culture embodying humanist principles and values, we will see less crime than we do in a Christian culture. Statistics support that optimism. Have you seen how the murder rate has fallen by almost half in the US during the same period that irreligiosity doubled?
According to http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/uscrime.h... , the murder total in America peaked in 1991 at 24,700,and fell to a modern minimum of 14,612 in 2011. There were 252 million Americans in 1991 compared to 311 million in 2011 making the respective murder rates 9.8 per 100,000 in 1991, and 4.7 per 100,000 in 2011 - less than half.
At the same time, according to the American Religious Identification Survey at http://www.dawahskills.com/skills-tools/ameri... , the total number of adults identifying as Christian fell from 151 million out of 175 million adults (86.2%) in 1990 to 173 million out out of 228 million adults (76.0%) in 2008. During the same period, "nones" and "no religion" rose from 14 million (8.2%) to 34 million (15.0%)-almost double.
I think that we will likely all benefit by the further dimunition of the church.
That's interesting! If those were the only two variables, that would be fantastic.

I kind of thought you'd argue a society free from organized religion would not produce people like my brother.

I was thinking he was swayed via the spiritual and emotional experiences. Will think on this, and get back to you :)

“You have blue shoes”

Since: Mar 11

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#556036
Jul 11, 2013
 

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Alright, bye-bye for now everyone. I hope you keep learning and keep enjoying!

Kisses and hugs,
Hiding

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

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#556037
Jul 11, 2013
 

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RiversideRedneck wrote:
Neither of you have demonstrated any dishonesty on my part.
The word I used was deception.

What was that stunt with the mother-in-law bill from a Catholic hospital being free to her husband. You posted that while arguing that Catholic hospitals gave medical care away charitably. The implications were that this was an example of that.

Then it turned out that the bill wasn't voluntarily written off as an act of charity by the church, but was paid by an insurer, and you knew it all along. Was that honest?

“Michin yeoja”

Since: Oct 10

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#556038
Jul 11, 2013
 

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Hidingfromyou wrote:
Alright, bye-bye for now everyone. I hope you keep learning and keep enjoying!
Kisses and hugs,
Hiding
Otay.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

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#556039
Jul 11, 2013
 

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Hidingfromyou wrote:
Wow, that's terrible. Clearly a different system needs to be in place. At least you took moral actions to benefit your patients.
Thanks.

It was just another reason to retire as soon as possible.

I'll give you a follow-up anecdote on the case of the diabetic preacher's wife who lost the leg.(River Tam: please forgive me for this)

I was quite pissed off at being sued by these treacherous ingrates whom I had informed had been wronged and harmed by their podiatrists negligence and the hospital's comedy of errors, and who got an attorney at my suggestion only to sued me as well in case there were a few more bucks in it for them.

My malpractice attorney called me to tell me that the plaintiff wanted to settle for 25 grand, and the insurer wanted to pay it to be done with them. He also told me that she had lost her other leg since.

I told him that I thought that they had decided to settle because they realized that she didn't have a leg to stand on. The lawyer released a combined groan of pain and howl of laughter over the telephone, then told me I was his new favorite client. I'll bet he still tells the story, too.

He also told me that the preacher left the patient after the lawsuit was settled. Another beautiful story from the heartland.

“Michin yeoja”

Since: Oct 10

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#556040
Jul 11, 2013
 

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lil whispers wrote:
Good night BT look for you tomorrow.
http://www.youtube.com/watch...

Now you know me, LW.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

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#556041
Jul 11, 2013
 

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blind man n the bleachers wrote:
Hello IANS :) Hmm I don't find that information to be sufficient to come to that conclusion.
Neither do I. I just offered it as a speculation.
blind man n the bleachers wrote:
I just have no problem talking about suicide and a person of faith. These are just some of my thoughts on the matter. I appreciate your sharing yours. Have a great day :)
You, too.

What I was referring to is that Andrew's friends didn't seem to have much to say or ask about the cause of his death, which made me think that it was suicide.

The quick dissemination of the heart attack story a few hours later was a little suspicious as well. If he didn't die in an ambulance, ER or ICU on a cardiac monitor, that would be difficult or impossible to determine before an autopsy.

I don't blame people for trying to cover up embarrassing deaths as from suicide, AIDS, recreational drug overdoses, drunk driving and the like when such things happen, especially in a devout Christian. That's what I was referring to.

And if that happened in this case, and his friends and family don't want to discuss it on Facebook, that's fine.

“squuuze me”

Since: Feb 09

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#556042
Jul 11, 2013
 

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Hidingfromyou wrote:
Alright, bye-bye for now everyone. I hope you keep learning and keep enjoying!
Kisses and hugs,
Hiding
...and handjobs.
You forgot the handjobs.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

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#556043
Jul 11, 2013
 

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Tide with Beach wrote:
Christianity has already been "hopelessly corrupted" by humanism.
Agreed. And in a real sense, it was right from its inception. The idea of perfection had involved between the invention of Jehovah and the invention of Jesus. When Jehovah was created, perfection was personified as a powerful, angry, dangerous force. The upgrade was to a gentle. Who did that? Centuries of rational ethicists revising the picture of perfection.

Sure, they were religious people. But they were the reformed religious. They would always be opposed by the more orthodox ones. Religion doesn't evolve. People do. Religion would keep them static if it could.

One of the most dramatic instances of a person applying reason to religious ethics was Paul, who as I understand it, simply contradicted Jesus' and nullified the old law by fiat. He made an executive decision.

And today, you see many Christians simply rejecting the ethical implications of eternal torture for failing to worship, torture that is unnecessary and serves nobody but a sadist. Christians that reject that now reject hell. Hell has been redefined as a metaphor for separation from god by people allowing reason and compassion into their ethical decisions. That's humanism, even if done by a pope.
Tide with Beach wrote:
With the internet, people are now having their beliefs openly challenged.
That is one of the greatest blessings of the Internet.
Tide with Beach wrote:
When I was a Christian, I never experienced this. For the most part, a believer or professed believer will either shy away from such conversations, or dig in. Either way, this environment of free competition produces the expected result.Good ideas flourish, while bad ideas get flushed down the toilet.
Perfect. It's a win-lose. The world wins at the church's expense.
Tide with Beach wrote:
As far as replacing the social institutions of religion, I would hope that we don't fall into the trap of trying to create a one-to-one replacement. I'd rather see moral and ethical systems separate from social systems. It's alright for us to be divided by common interests, but tying morality into that creates an environment where ideas cannot compete freely. People need to learn how to compartmentalize their ideas from their identity. Boobies.
You said boobies.

[Chris Griffin meets Stuart Dooley

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